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As a table-top gamer since the 80s I somehow missed-out on playing Warhammer Fantasy. I entered high-school as WH 1st Ed came out, so my interests suddenly veered in non-tabletop directions! I returned in the early 90s to historicals, and when I finally started playing GW I went the 40K route. I built a small Dwarf army in 2001 (read Felix and Gotrek) and played two intro games of 8th Ed with a borrowed army, but when the Old World was destroyed while I was on a year-long tour I figured I had missed-out on WH Fantasy. That made me kinda sad, but I was busy gaming other systems and I figured I had dodged a bullet watching my friends of played Fantasy go through their grief arcs.

As an eventual AOS player I noted the return of The Old World but didn't dip my toes. I had kept my Dwarves, but I was annoyed to learn about the base-size change...Then, over Christmas holidays I read one of the End Times anthologies involving mostly the Empire. Their aesthetic and lore had appealed to me as a Fantasy observer, and now I was eyeing boxs of Empire minis. I have since learned that discussing the End Times with Old World players can be triggering, and I apologize if I hurt anyone mentioning those books and that time.

Some old work friends had formed a gaming group that focused on Old World, and I dusted my Dwarves, put them in adapters and had a small game. Then I was assembling an Empire army and over two months I has amassed a 2000 point army of combined-arms ineffectiveness. I was rocking a 1-9 record (my mages and cannons had a great game on one occasion), but I was enjoying myself. I had heard about anemia, a feeling of nostalgia for something we missed or never experienced. Its like the shade of FOMO? Regret of having missed out (ROHMO)? Anyway, learning the Old World was like when I learned to drive stick in the Middle East. Just getting the rules straight was a victory, and while I wasn't the best driver out there at least I could manage after a while without causing an accident.

The recent 1.5 update has improved the strength of my baseline force, and my record has improved slightly. I even attended a doubles tournament which was lots of fun. I am not in a position to offer tactics or list-building advice, but here are my impressions of The Old World.

The Old World (TOW) initially struck me as a low-effort labour of love intended to hoover-up some of the money GW has left on the tabletop. I don't mean low-effort on the part of the game design/development team - for them this was a labour of love. But the company was taking a low-risk approach with old sculpts. The team also missed, likely on purpose, the opportunity to make the rules experience a little more modern. So the barriers to entry that plagued Fantasy are still there. I do understand, though, that the old design is the point.

The relative success of The Old World, though, seems to have galvanized the company to actually invest some resources which we are seeing with Cathay. The team has also made some real updates with the recent 1.5 FAQ and Matched Play Guide. This has made the game a little more "combined arms" in my limited experience. They are tracking balance to some extent. I do hope they keep a light touch, but I appreciate their efforts. I think they saw the risk of the community taking matters into their own hands.

The modeling aspect has been nostalgic in several senses. Some of the Empire kits were released just before the Old World was destroyed, and they are fun to build. They are a refreshing change from the computer assisted design paradigm of today, but the stress of building rank and flank models with long weapons still exists! That is part of the nostalgia!

I wouldn't say that I have dropped 40K and AOS for Old World, but my hobby and tabletop time is certainly skewed to TOW! I am even contemplating building a High Elf army to try and capture the experience that I missed from the 1992 big-box that I did not buy...

I like your post, a nice read on your perspective. I'm not sure what you're trying to get out of this thread but I'll give you some of my own musings anyway:

My introduction to the world of GW actually started with Warhammer Fantasy, it was a bit later that I got into 40K. I really enjoyed the world of Warhammer Fantasy, was happy enough with my Dwarf army. Never felt the need (or had the budget...) to expand into other armies.

Having said that when I did get into 40K my focus tended to be more on that than Fantasy. The 40K universe just feels more.... unique, insofar as a setting that has ripped off loads of other settings can be considered unique. Fantasy just felt more Tolkienesque to me. Not to take anything away from Warhammer Fantasy, I think that developers, designers, etc... did a lot over the years to build on the setting and set it apart from Tolkien.

Even so, while I didn't feel the same nerd rage as some when the Old World exploded (remember the guy who torched his whole Dark Elf army?) I still think it was a big mistake on the part of GW and they would regret it in the long run.

It's great that the Old World is back. I still have my Dwarf army so might take it for a spin some day. I think it's going to take a lot to pull me away from the 40K setting though and get back into the setting that was once destroyed.

El Torro wrote:
I like your post, a nice read on your perspective. I'm not sure what you're trying to get out of this thread but I'll give you some of my own musings anyway:

My introduction to the world of GW actually started with Warhammer Fantasy, it was a bit later that I got into 40K. I really enjoyed the world of Warhammer Fantasy, was happy enough with my Dwarf army. Never felt the need (or had the budget...) to expand into other armies.

Having said that when I did get into 40K my focus tended to be more on that than Fantasy. The 40K universe just feels more.... unique, insofar as a setting that has ripped off loads of other settings can be considered unique. Fantasy just felt more Tolkienesque to me. Not to take anything away from Warhammer Fantasy, I think that developers, designers, etc... did a lot over the years to build on the setting and set it apart from Tolkien.

Even so, while I didn't feel the same nerd rage as some when the Old World exploded (remember the guy who torched his whole Dark Elf army?) I still think it was a big mistake on the part of GW and they would regret it in the long run.

It's great that the Old World is back. I still have my Dwarf army so might take it for a spin some day. I think it's going to take a lot to pull me away from the 40K setting though and get back into the setting that was once destroyed.

Thanks for the comment and I appreciate your insights, not to mention your question about what I was tryint to get out of the thread! To be honest, I wasn't really sure what I wanted - I just had this novel experience of enjoying something that I had missed out. I left 40K for 7th Ed and while I was excited to get back into it with 8th I did not have that misplaced sense of nostalgia that I have with The Old World, not having played Fantasy. The rest of my play group and the people I met at the one tourney I attended all played Fantasy. I seem to be the only "new" player.

I am bemused by my enjoyment of The Old World despite myself and I've been trying to put my finger on it. I have been enjoying reading the rule books and army list book, despite the awkward rules layout.

While it might just be that I am playing with a good group, I think some of my enjoyment has come from the lore. Yes, the lore. I play Age of Sigmar but I don't care about the lore and I don't really care about my units in that game. With TOW, I am finding the lore engaging. I am remembering the fates of the units and characters - I am not writing stories about them but I find their table-top fates enjoyable in a way that I do not find with 40K and AOS.

Perhaps my enjoyment is just a honeymoon phase of collecting an army and playing a new system, but its been a fun time so far.

Well glad you decided to give it a go, I agree with you the 1.5 update was nice and really the only major update in 18 months which is a far cry from their other major game systems - namely AoS and 40k.

Personally I never switched to AoS from old fantasy (wasn't bitter just didn't enjoy the game) and haven't played 40k since August 2023 as I'm really enjoying ToW currently. The community, rules, and armies have kept it going for my friends and I.

Regarding the rules - look at it like chess. You didn't become a grand master after your first game of playing (assuming you've played lol) - it takes time to get good. It's a journey - I just try and enjoy it along with some really cool people I've met along the way.

My quest for nostalgia for things I did not experience has been continuing. As a 40K player from the 90s I had liked the look of some Warhammer Fantasy armies such as Dark Elves of all things. I have also recently read some old Warhammer novels with Malus Darkblade etc which got my imagination going. On a road trip in November I saw several units of used Dark Elves on sale in an FLGS and...came home with a box of used Dark Elves.

This has been an interesting side-quest. As a Legacy army they are not supported all that well and acquiring models has been a bit of a challenge. That has been part of the fun!

The AOS Cities of Sigmar Dark Aelf "range" has provided some models along with some purchases of portions of people's pile of shame from yesteryear. I now have a 2000+ point army and have taken it to two tournaments and several games at the club. The Cold One Knight models had always been appealing with their nonsensicalness (evil elves from the arctic riding dinosaurs?), and the sculpts available in the AOS range are really good in my opinion. They have been fun to build compared to modern GW kits but are not ancient either. The Dreadlord on Dragon, a Hydra and a Manticore conversion from the Chaos Lord kit are my centrepieces thus far.

They are on the struggle-bus as far as competitiveness goes. The Dragons are really the Dark Elf power in TOW, and the 1.5 changes hurt them as an army without really giving anything. I think they are at the bottom in terms of Win Rate (25%) over the last 90 days on Old World Stats. Whelp... GW says they aren't meant for tournaments as a Legacy army, but that hasn't stopped Vampire Counts from being near the top. Maybe we'll get some love? Or perhaps we are paying for some sins of the past?

I went 2-1 at one tournament and 1-1-1 at the other. If I can synch my Dragon and cavalry (or Manticore) to hit the same target then things go OK. Otherwise it can be rough! The Cold One Knights lack Countercharge and get Stupidity in exchange...Still, they've done some good work in several games and looked stylish while doing it. Stupidity is rough but you have to accept it and laugh when it happens.

Playing through a Path to Glory with them right now. Not very much glory to report unless getting tabled by Cathay is considered glory! I've added some Witches for style points at the 750 level.

I've enjoyed this side-quest, but I've also signed up for a teams event in May where I will be running a City State of Nuln list. Most of it is complete, but I have some Outriders to assemble and paint. These guys are on the other side of the win-rate spectrum from Dark Elves, so no excuses!

Enjoying these posts! I agree about the Dark Elves - the range refresh they got back in 8th edition still holds up really well. I recently bought a bunch of the kits to use in RPGs because GW dark elves are much cooler than drow.

They seem to often be underserved in rules though! Kings of War didn't know what to do with Dark Elves either. A real shame! They are the coolest elves.

Yeah the dark elves models that GW 'most recently' released are quite nice in my opinion

However some amazing 3rd party prints exist same for my beloved wood elves

 Da Boss wrote:
Enjoying these posts! I agree about the Dark Elves - the range refresh they got back in 8th edition still holds up really well. I recently bought a bunch of the kits to use in RPGs because GW dark elves are much cooler than drow.

They seem to often be underserved in rules though! Kings of War didn't know what to do with Dark Elves either. A real shame! They are the coolest elves.

Thanks! Some rumours out there about Dark Elves coming in from the cold, so to speak, and becoming a "real GW faction", but that might just be hopium.

I've kept on playing 40K (I run the local league) and AOS, but I am finding my hobby and gaming joy with Old World these days. I hope they can resist the urge to break the game with new untested stuff. I like the stately pace of rules updates (twice a year it seems) as opposed to the more frenetic pace of 40K and AOS.

Now for some gaming experience.

Tourney 1 - Trenton Ontario Jan

I was a night-before addition to a small but sold-out tournament an hour down the road that had had a player drop. I whipped together a Dark Elves list with my available models and posted it to BCP. I had a Dreadlord on a Black Dragon with the Pendant of Kaeleth and the Shield of Grond as my General. Tanky, but sacrificed some killiness. A Beastmaster on a Manticore was along to support as well as a Supreme Sorceress on a horse. A unit of City Guard with sword and shield, another unit of City Guard with crossbows and a unit of Dark Riders filled out my core. A large unit of Cold One Knights with the extra AP banner (Har Ganeth) were my third hammer.

Game 1 - Vampire Counts. This was a rough game. I misjudged his maximum charge range for his Blood Knights (he could boost it with a spell) and my Cold Ones went down on his first turn. My Dreadlord did kill one enemy wizard and my Manitore chased down some bats, but by the end the game I was tabled except for my Dragon and even he was wounded. A very one-sided defeat! Knowing my Cold One Knights lacked countercharge I should have screened them with the Dark Riders.

Game 2 - Empire in King of the Hill . My opponent had cannons, Greatswords, handgunners and Hellblaster Volleyguns supported by some Pistoliers led by a General on an Imperial Griffon. My very simple plan was to cover the distance and get stuck-in as quickly as possible. His Volleyguns shredded my infantry as the game went on, but my Cold One, Dragon and Manticore covered the distance and got to work. Low point was getting my Sorceress sniped out of the Dark Riders by a cannonball, but my Beastmaster avenged her. I lost my crossbowmen and Dark Riders but hung on to the hill while killing or chasing off most of the Empire army. A win, but a close fight.

Game 3 - Kingdom of Bretonnia with the Special Feature in the middle. He had six Pegasus Knights with a Baron on a Pegasus packing some anti-monster tech, so I needed to be wary. He also had two units of Knights of the Realm, some men-at-arms, a trebuchet, some archers and Lady Elise. My rough plan was to play keep-away from the Pegasus unit while hunting targets of opportunity. I had first turn, and my Sorceress made up for two tough games with some great spell-casting. Using Dark Magic, a Doombolt killed enough Knights of the Realm to cause the unit to flee off the table while also causing another unit to join them. I fed my infantry to the Pegasus Knights for the rest of the game while my Cold One Knight ground-down the Men-at-Arms. My Dreadlord on a Black Dragon stayed clear of danger (fitting really), but he did kill the small unit of archers.

So after a rough start I finished 2-1. I enjoyed the mobility of the army which was a switch from my more plodding Empire lists. My Dreadlord on a Dragon did fine, never dying and he did kill some stuff (the Greatswords in Game 2 a highlight). The Manticore was a fun piece, a "distraction Carnifex" for my list that I could risk and that my opponent couldn't really ignore.

More to follow for the next tourney!