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What's the LOTR back page of White Dwarf about? It states in big bold letters "War is Coming" and then refers to "The War of the Ring". Is this a new summer campaign or a re-do of the rules? It's probably about time for the latter isn't it?

Hopefully not the summer campaign as I'd like to see a 40K one this year to put my growing horde of Orks to good use

Massed combat rules.

LotR will be to WotR as Mordheim is to Fantasy!

Kind of like the LOTR Apocalypse then?

yes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


lord of the apocalypse!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Nope. Technically a seperate game.

Don't know any more than that I'm afraid!

Sounds curious. Be interested to see what they come up with. My take has always been that LOTR was Fantasy for people who prefer a 40K style of game.

So if they start doing regiments, isn't that just Fantasy with different models? They may not do this of course, I'm just speculating...

Comes out next year, 1st half. Uses existing models but they fit into ranked larger bases that hold 8 figures ( 2 rows of 4 I believe, incidentally I think this might have been responsible for the round/square multibases rumour for demons ages back). Plays very similar to Warmaster I believe, especially with regards to heroes, their movement and their effects upon units. Think the rules are based more closely on the Wild West/Historical rules which are already a tweaked version of the LOTR engine I think but that's going off of hearsay. Anyone confirm or deny that >
Lots of new plastics to come out with it, including an entire plastic army of the dead. Heard rumour that there might be some other/more bigger kits akin to the mumakil or dragon but I'm unsure as to how certain this is.

Yeah. It's a (greatly) adapted version of The Alamo, which was the mass-battle adaptation of Legends of the Old West from a year or 2 back.

The figures are the same, but you (surprise, surprise) need more of them than the 50 or so per side that is pretty standard for points matches for the original game.

Its like Apocalypse in that regard, but unlike Apocalypse, it is more of a "serious" game and balanced, not about big explosions and an excuse to tip all of your models on the table.

Allegedly the games are intended to be 4 hours or so long, rather than the whole day that Apoc is expected to.

Its been kept pretty much under wraps, but rumours are starting to circulate now that store managers have been briefed about it. There should be more news drip-fed out about it over the next 3 months or so.

Allegedly there are a couple of linked model releases: plastic Ents, and plastic Army of the Dead. Also some repacked "big box" Apocalypse-style releases of existing models.

If the "The Alamo" heritage rumour is correct (and I believe it to be), then it will play quite differently - being more about units than individual models - while retaining much of the flavour of the original (stat lines etc.)

For those that think they might be interested, there's a fan-created set of rules that attempted something similar downloadable from scribd:

http://s3.amazonaws.com/word_secret_directory/docs/37027.pdf?Signature=Qan4MVxH/ZbnBR5V%2BI6HEKEuREo%3D&Expires=1227883814&AWSAccessKeyId=0QDQ3FGYV5Q7TY85W4R2

Its a 4MB download.

Sounds quite intriguing I must say....

And I'm sure I heard a rumour about the bigger plastic kits, but I am truly jiggered if I can remember what it was

It's a sensible direction for the LOTR line to go to, and I suspect it'll look great on the table. That being said, I don't know if there's a market for it.

Plastic ents eh?
*Rubs hands together*
All the pieces are in position. The board is set.

I'll definitely be buying this, LOTR is a great game.

The Market is there. IT's a logical progression for a popular game that has been out a number of years, especially given the rather loose nature of it's armies.

Most of the local LOTR players just argue for a few hours about whether or not the horse can jump the hedge. I find the game a great source of enjoyment as I listen and play 40k and Fantasy.

That's OK. I get a whole lot of amusement when 40k and Fantasy players argue about how unbalanced their various armies are...

It's quid pro quo really...

Exactly. That's why I didn't bash the system.

Personnally, I think it has been the best balanced game out of the major three that GW develops. Though that somewhat changed with the new Mordor supplement that I think was overpowered anyways. (Mostly due to the drummer that lest orcs move 7 inches, a horde army that can also outmanouver anything except Cavalry?)

About time as well... LotR rules were great for the skirmishes in the first film/book but when it comes to things like Helms Deep or Pellinnor Fields they are terrible...
Mick

Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:Sounds quite intriguing I must say....

And I'm sure I heard a rumour about the bigger plastic kits, but I am truly jiggered if I can remember what it was

I want a squad of Balrogs in a box...

Mattlov wrote:

Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:Sounds quite intriguing I must say....

And I'm sure I heard a rumour about the bigger plastic kits, but I am truly jiggered if I can remember what it was

I want a squad of Balrogs in a box...

Yeah! Let's recreate Melkor's assault on the Elven homeland! Die Elves, Die!

Agamemnon2 wrote:It's a sensible direction for the LOTR line to go to, and I suspect it'll look great on the table. That being said, I don't know if there's a market for it.

Heard rumors about this from the LotR get go. Was hoping for a WFB-esque expansion to the LotR system. Just gotta play out the whole Battle of Pelenor Field; it just has to be done.

The reason Lotr is so balanced is because all the armies are exactly the same! Every one has cavalry, a d7 unit, captains and uber-hero's...I'd like to see some variety, particularly with regards to wargear.

Myself can't wait. I want to be able to play 5000 points of Gondorian goodness without getting scary looks from people.

sdf boy wrote:The reason Lotr is so balanced is because all the armies are exactly the same! Every one has cavalry, a d7 unit, captains and uber-hero's...I'd like to see some variety, particularly with regards to wargear.

I have to partially agree with you there. In that the "filling out" of many factions with similar units provides a boring level of uniformity.

BUT I would disagree with you as to this being the reason for balance. LotR was pretty well balanced from the get go, back when there were many fewer options for armies. The reason is that the "Special Rules" are much more limited in number and scope than the Special Rules for 40k and WFB. This means that it is much easier to calulate points values for the likes of heroes and monsters. Sure it isn't perfect and there is the odd hiccough (*ahem* mutiple Spider Queens *ahem*), but there are many fewer whinges than with the other 2 core systems.

sdf boy wrote:The reason Lotr is so balanced is because all the armies are exactly the same! Every one has cavalry, a d7 unit, captains and uber-hero's...I'd like to see some variety, particularly with regards to wargear.

Seem to remember their original mission for LOTR was to keep it really simple like Chess. The variations between the armies are subtle, but not enough for any one unit to have tactical superiority. That way, it focuses on being a game of skill rather than devising killer combinations. It's for you to decide whether that's a good thing

i actually switched out of LOTR just for the variety 40k offers.

The variety for LotR tends to come from the missions and scenarios rather than from the army lists. For me I preferred the game in the early stages before it became fashionable to have "Points match armies". OK, so the LoME does give a goodly number of interesting scenarios for generic armies, more so than there are available (I think) for many other systems, but I preferred the "cinematic" kind sof scenarios - the Fellowship against the Black Riders at Weathertop, the Three Hunters vs. Uruk-hai, that sort of thing. Specific goal-orientated objective-based games where the forces may be "unbalanced" but its about doing something specific rather than just knocking the opponent down to 25% or just occupying table quarters. It feels more interesting to me.

Now, I think that approach appeals more to the "traditional"/"historical" gamer who's games tend to re-enact a particular battle or extract from a particular battle, than the whole "army list/points match" play.

Now I'm not saying that GW invented the points match - DBM and such have been around for a long time and historicals gamers do play points matches (look at Flames of War and Warhammer Ancient Battles for instance), BUT, I find that 40k and even more so WFB tends to be played by many with very simple scenarios (or just a straight-up pitched battle). At least nowadays this seems the case with the emphasis by many on tournament play. This makes a lot of sense if the point of the match is to determine rankings and have an "even playing field" (pardon the pun) but for me at least, it takes away some of the potential fun.

I'm a "cinematic" player - I'm all about being there with my troops. I'm not a detached meta-gamer.

Which perhaps goes some of the way to explain why LotR and 40k appeal to different types of people.

Of course, I am aware that many do play 40k in a "cinematic" way, and that it is possible to play LotR in a competitive environment. But I would say that LotR is not as appealing when there is no real scenario, as the whole "army list" thing is not there. While with 40k, putting in too complicated a scenario means that those with only limited army selections available to them cannot play them or will face an unappealing game if they don't have the right force with them.

Its not an absolute - merely an "observed tendency"

On a personal note, while I love the LotR models as a rule, and prefer the gameplay over 40k, the one thing that 40k has that LotR doesn't that I really, really want is sci-fi tanks! I want to play a game with sci-fi tanks, and aside from Hammers Slammers, and the excorable 5150 I'm pretty much only left with 40k as a viable option in 28mm.

I do agree that a lot of the variety in LOTR does come from varied missions. The battle at Amon Hen (or what ever its called where Boromir gets killed) is one my favorite games to play. Though the game itself can make decent points match battles as well, and there is a very noticable lack of over powered lists and units. The only annoying one that I have come up against is the Hobbit and Woodelf Archer spam. Too many 3+ BS Str 3 shots for comfort. Especially when they just use the hobbits as meatsheilds to relocate when my uruk Phalanx gets too close...

Ratbarf wrote: The only annoying one that I have come up against is the Hobbit and Woodelf Archer spam. Too many 3+ BS Str 3 shots for comfort. Especially when they just use the hobbits as meatsheilds to relocate when my uruk Phalanx gets too close...

If you are stuck playing a boring tosser who insists on playing the *yawn* Elvish/Hobbitish "Tau gunline", which can be boring in any game, then you may be forced to field the Shadow Lord which is a good answer.

Or put more covering Terrain on the table.

But to be honest this kind of cheesy mentality is why I like to stay away from points matches. However good they are some boring tosser always chooses to be boring rather than try for a fun game.

Then again, Warg Spam isn't all that nice either, though it still dies to Elf Hobbit Spam, you juest eat more tasty hobbits and thus die happy.