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Hi,
Can you give me your views?
After contemplating selling my Chaos Marine force,and then having a
rethink,I was thinking of activating them.I've never used a chaos force
before and was looking at buying the codex.However, after reading a very
negative review of it on amazon,I've got my doubts.The review was negative in
the extreme,at the end I think the reviewer would happily burn Gav Thorpe
at the stake!So CSM players,what's your view?

Ignore them. Seriously.

The previous Chaos Marine Codex was horrendous. Stupid amount of options, exceedingly beardy etc. The current one cut out a lot of the chaff and tightened things up.

As an army, there is absolutely nothing wrong with the Book. It's as good as the next one anyways. What people dislike about it is that they cannot run Cult armies, or at least, can't get silly little bonuses for doing so.

Buy it.

Thanks for the info,looks like another
Black Legion is about to go on the rampage!
Cheers

Oh, and the rumour is the more dedicated Legions will be covered in seperate volumes.

Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:Ignore them. Seriously.

The previous Chaos Marine Codex was horrendous. Stupid amount of options, exceedingly beardy etc. The current one cut out a lot of the chaff and tightened things up.

As an army, there is absolutely nothing wrong with the Book. It's as good as the next one anyways. What people dislike about it is that they cannot run Cult armies, or at least, can't get silly little bonuses for doing so.

Buy it.

Oh, for heaven's sake, MDG.

The power level of the Chaos Codex did not drop from the last codex to this one. The available variety dropped significantly. And yes, it invalidated a whole bunch of armies, including my Emperor's Children force. (And no, I don't miss Siren.)

Slipstream wrote:Can you give me your views?
After contemplating selling my Chaos Marine force,and then having a
rethink,I was thinking of activating them.I've never used a chaos force
before and was looking at buying the codex.However, after reading a very
negative review of it on amazon,I've got my doubts.The review was negative in
the extreme,at the end I think the reviewer would happily burn Gav Thorpe
at the stake!So CSM players,what's your view?

I shelved my Chaos force after the current codex was released, and never did buy it. It would have required more work (and more purchases) to make it work under the new codex than I was willing to give it.

You can make a very competitive army under the new codex (although it is essentially certain that it will include Lash of Submission and Obliterators). For more general play, it's fine. If you want to include lesser daemons, daemon princes, or obliterators in your force, you should grab it. If you don't want any of those, you might consider running your Chaos marines under the Space Marines codex (although this can lead to marginal confusion for tournament play).

Slipstream - You're better off ignoring Mad Dok Grotsnik. He seems to think that people dislike the new 'Chaos' Codex because it isn't as powerful as the old one. This imply isn't true. The current 'Chaos' is plenty powerful, it's also plenty boring and plenty lifeless.

If you want an extensive review of the 'Chaos' Codex that sums up why we don't like it, you can go here.

I for one have AUD$1200 worth of Daemons that can't be used with my Chaos army any more. As a Word Bearer, Iron Warrior, Death Guard, World Eater and Alpha Legion player (not to mention Lost & The Damned, but that's a separate issue), I was not pleased with the bland and boring direction Jervis & Co. took with this Codex.

If you're thinking of selling your force based upon how interesting the army is to play and because you don't find the new Codex inspiring (as opposed to 'power', which is what Grotsnik might want you to believe) - then sell your army. There are plenty of other armies out there that are more interesting to play - even the new Marine Codex is more exciting than the current 'Chaos' Codex. Hell, you can do a better approximation of some old Chaos Legions using the Marine Codex than you can with the 'Chaos' Codex. What does that tell you...

As someone who built a chaos army after this version of the codex came out I'd suggest you give it a try. Depending on what you are aiming for there is some quality there, and it can still be fun to play.
That being said it is not as interesting an army as it was in previous editions, most of the builds that work well are designed around no particular god so if you want a Pure Khorne or Pure Slaanesh force for example this book doesn't do that well at all.

The army I have built for it, plague marine rhino horde + Vindicators, could just as easily be built from the current space marine codex and some of the options in there could probably make it stronger though the basic troops wouldn't be as survivable and wouldn't have 2 special weapons in each squad.

To some extent it may just be a design philosophy on GW's part. They may look at Chaos as just another kind of space marine so you use their book to build an army that looks a certain way just as you would use the Dark Angels book to build an all terminator army or the Blood Angels PDF to build a jump pack horde and the Space Marine Codex for anything else. Unfortunately GW's development cycle changes so much that codices vary in design philosophy from many options to boring and lacking options based on whether they came out at the apex or nadir of GW design trends. This means that they can languish for years as being a completely different kind of army than other similar armies.

The current Chaos Codex is very strong and highly-playable. Yes, GW removed some options from the previous Codex (and added a few things), but for a new CSM player that doesn't matter.

Nothing wrong w/ the current CSM codex. Sure there are a lot of changes from the previous edition (my beloved Iron Warriors are gone ), but you can still make some great lists.
Deamon Prince, bunch of Plague Marines, some Oblits/vinnys, and you can wreck the majority of armies out thier.

Slipstream wrote:Hi,
Can you give me your views?
After contemplating selling my Chaos Marine force,and then having a
rethink,I was thinking of activating them.I've never used a chaos force
before and was looking at buying the codex.However, after reading a very
negative review of it on amazon,I've got my doubts.The review was negative in
the extreme,at the end I think the reviewer would happily burn Gav Thorpe
at the stake!So CSM players,what's your view?

The current CSM codex is quite lame and boring. We went from conquerors of planetary systems, to guys who get excited because they stole a Space Wolf ship intact. Meh.

If you want a powerful army, play your CSM force. If you want an interesting army ... look elsewhere.

If you are starting a Chaos armty with this book, I think you'll enjoy it. Most of the nerd rage seen online (and in here, Hi HBMC!) is due to the difference from the previous book to this one. If you never played the old one, it won't bother you at all.

I personally disliked the new book because it invalidated some things, and neutered others. I didn't play them for a long time. Then 5th edition came out and I started giving them a try. Now I play my Word Bearers and Legion of Brass (Khorne army) a lot and am very successful with them.

Hmm... I started playing CSM with the new dex and I have to say I kinda wish I had chosen a different army.

I play a lot of tournaments so I like competitve lists. Unlike the SM/Ork and even possibly Eldar, there are very few options for this type of list... You can make a good list, but it's likely to be the cookie-cutter of the 'dex...

My gripes are:

No cult legions (though I play them pretty much always now)
Generic Daemons
Lash is the single most stupid idea ever - I have no idea how it got through testing...
Lack of options for competitive lists
Rubbish fluff which, essentially, makes them naughty marines with a few friends
Marks need tweaking (why do my elite Khorne terminators /chaos lords not have FC???)

One thing I love about the SM and Ork dexes is that if you take certain characters it changes the troop focus of your army or gives them special rules and there is nothing like this in the codex

I've been playing Chaos for over 15 years. I've seen my Beast Men go from being a part of the list, to being "allies" to being nonexistent entirely. I've had models with converted mutations from when there weren't even any rules for the mutations, to having rules for the mutations, to not having rules for the mutations again.

I still have fun with my chaos. I still like my models and my conversions, and people still look at my dreadnought and say "wow" because it was modeled to have Daemonic Possession, even though that upgrade is not available any more.

I see my Black Legionnaires as a group of hardened nihilistic warriors, constantly fighting because it's the only thing they have left, and I think that's a neat concept that fits in with the universe well, and makes for some good stories played out on the table top.

If you like the minis, and the background go for it. But be aware that if you want to play "competitively" then you'll probably be funneled into the "lash/oblit/plague marine" list because it's the only list that covers all your bases in the current metagame.

Listen; if you want REAL Chaos, go play Fantasy Warriors of Chaos. They have the true-blue chaotic feel as well as spikes.

Cheese Elemental wrote:Listen; if you want REAL Chaos, go play Fantasy Warriors of Chaos. They have the true-blue chaotic feel as well as spikes.

You could always just, I dunno, ADD spikes.

And, AND, you can paint them blue!

Voila. Blue spiky marines.

The new codex actually got me to start plaing my chaos marines. Go for it, I say!!