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Sony has updated the PSN, and have a new Terms of Service you have to agree to.

However, the new TOS includes a clause for you to waive your right to participate in a class action lawsuit against them! They're trying to cheat you out of what they owe you for the breach in their security and all of your personal info getting into the hands of hackers.

So, if you've got a PS3, beware of Sony's underhanded attempts to cheat you!

It's not really cheating if it's in the TOS.

Sneaky, yes. Cheating? No.

I do hope sony gets it's arse handed to it because of that serious mistake.

What a joke that PSN affair was/is.

http://playstationlifestyle.net/2011/09/15/new-psn-tos-blocks-your-right-to-sue-sony-ever/

Well the long and short of it is that if you use the PSN and were one of the ones affected adversely by their hack, and you agree to this ToS after the fact, you can no longer participate in any class action suit against them. Basically, they are hoping to catch people off guard and get them to agree to this in order to continue using the PSN so they can disqualify some people from filing suit against them and avoid paying out to those people.

I'd call that cheating.

This quite potentially can be ruled as illegal in court, depending on the nature of the law and the judge in question...

Very underhanded...but than again it's sony, I'm not shocked.

Melissia wrote:This quite potentially can be ruled as illegal in court, depending on the nature of the law and the judge in question...

Which is apparantly acknowledged in the terms and conditions. But I don't play my PS3 during the school years anyways so I'm okay, to tell the truth I haven't touched my PSN in half a year because I got a computer that can play games now. Sure I still play my PS3, just not online as often as I used to. But its not cheating, its them saying our way or the highway. If you don't like it, don't use PSN, if you really don't like it, don't get a PS3. Its capitalism, put your money where your mouth is.

The arbitration clause is probably enforceable. Not sure about the class action provision.

But I'm not a big fan of class action suits, because they tend to disadvantage the class members to the advantage of the named members and their attorneys.

If you don't like the terms: don't agree to them.

You need to learn some BASIC law. A clause such as the one you think you saw in the TOS is not possible.

Perkustin wrote:You need to learn some BASIC law. A clause such as the one you think you saw in the TOS is not possible.

Ah, that's funny.

I was referring to the quoted sections in this article.

Other than those matters listed in the Exclusions from Arbitration clause, you and the Sony Entity that you have a Dispute with agree to seek resolution of the Dispute only through arbitration of that Dispute in accordance with the terms of this Section 15, and not litigate any Dispute in court. Arbitration means that the Dispute will be resolved by a neutral arbitrator instead of in a court by a judge or jury.

Could you explain what is unenforcable about this term?

Once again, glad I'm with the xbox crowd.

This is one of the biggest Feth you's I've seen in a while.

"Ok, so our security was crap, and our customers suffered for it, so let's not trust any of them, and force them to never be able to sue us, ever, or lose the right to use PSN, even though they may have been loyal fans since the birth of the PS"

Awesome company is awesome.

Come to the dark side.... the PC master race.

Yep, this year has continued to prove I made the right choice in not getting a PS3.

I don't really care about this. If anyone should be getting sued, its the hackers, not Sony

Lord Rogukiel wrote:I don't really care about this. If anyone should be getting sued, its the hackers, not Sony

Sony did not make sure that they had adequate protection for all of their customer's billing info. That is their responsibility.

Platuan4th wrote:Yep, this year has continued to prove I made the right choice in not getting a PS3.

But the PS3 has so many awesome games, like Killzone 3 and..... Umm.......

GalacticDefender wrote:

Platuan4th wrote:Yep, this year has continued to prove I made the right choice in not getting a PS3.

But the PS3 has so many awesome games, like Killzone 3 and..... Umm.......

Don't worry, Microsoft is not any better.

Xbox TOS wrote:Any software or content (e.g., text, images, video, graphics, music, sound, or games) (for purposes of this Section 12, we refer to all of these, as applicable, as “Software”) we provide as part of the Service is licensed and not sold. We reserve all other rights not expressly granted in this contract. The Software license ends when your Service ends unless we notify you otherwise. You must then uninstall the Software, or we may disable it. You must not work around any technical limitations in the Software.

Xbox TOS wrote:You can recover from us for all successful claims only direct damages up to a total amount equal to your Service fee for one month.

But that's from July so they may make a new one if SONY can keep their clause in the TOS.

Yeah, this doesn't mean much. Sort of like the waivers you have to sign before you participate in some activities. If they truly do something that winds up hurting you then all that waiver is is sub par toiler paper.

IMO it's more about timing..

I used to be a Sony fanboy. Then MagicGate happened. Then this.

You know I don't even look at this as a Sony thing. From the looks of it, the gaming industry is changing. If it isn't consoles failing, EA, solo gamers getting the shaft, or sony hacks it will be something else.

I miss the days of slamming a cartridge into a console and enjoying a game. Nowadays, it seems like every aspect of the gaming industry is being designed to screw someone over. Every day, the idea of a next gen system is becoming more and more unappealing to me. TES:V and Mass Effect 3 are looking to be some of my final purchases.

Old consoles didn't randomly die nearly as often as newer ones. Just throwing it out there.

Cannerus_The_Unbearable wrote:Old consoles didn't randomly die nearly as often as newer ones. Just throwing it out there.

Damn, I miss those days.

Edit: We litterally dropped my SNES and it bounced a good four times, damn thing still works. It's an inspiring sight.

Cannerus_The_Unbearable wrote:Old consoles didn't randomly die nearly as often as newer ones. Just throwing it out there.

QFT. My PS2 only died once, and that was when it died for good.

Seems I am not the only one. They got us by the nads though. We want to play the games, but we keep getting screwed over a little at a time. I feel like the industry is trying to wring every cent out of me that they can.

That's uhhh, sort of the idea of any business.

Cannerus_The_Unbearable wrote:Old consoles didn't randomly die nearly as often as newer ones. Just throwing it out there.

They also weren't nearly as complex as modern consoles.

Cannerus_The_Unbearable wrote:I used to be a Sony fanboy. Then MagicGate happened. Then this.

So basically you were a SONY fanboy until they decided that it was wrong for people to file share music and movies? How dare they try to protect someone's copyright protected work!

As far as everything goes, people are just looking for ways to prevent the new form of theft. Back in the days if you wanted free music you stole it from a store and then stores found a way to protect their products, now if a person buys or steals a CD they can upload it to the internet and let everyone else get it as well. Most game/movie/music producers now have encryptions on their products to stop it. Then people started mucking about with the coding in the games and changed the way it works online, this is where things like Punkbuster and banning comes into play.

halonachos wrote:So basically you were a SONY fanboy until they decided that it was wrong for people to file share music and movies? How dare they try to protect someone's copyright protected work!

I'm against theft but that doesn't mean I want to let a policeman live in my house and rifle through my stuff all day and just stare at me to keep it from happening. One can be against piracy and against obtrusive measures to go about battling it.

Ahtman wrote:

halonachos wrote:So basically you were a SONY fanboy until they decided that it was wrong for people to file share music and movies? How dare they try to protect someone's copyright protected work!

I'm against theft but that doesn't mean I want to let a policeman live in my house and rifle through my stuff all day and just stare at me to keep it from happening. One can be against piracy and against obtrusive measures to go about battling it.

Except of course there is a bit of difference there. In one case we have a physical intrusion by a law enforcement official who goes through things that are completely unrelated to any case he may have, in the other we have a system that monitors electronic signatures being inputted into a console. Note that there is a huge difference.