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Yeah My friends offered to allow me to play D&D at their house, of course there is going to be 8 of us and I have no idea how to play it. I have played other RPGS, it will be very confusing to me....

I have no idea what is going on. But all I know is I want to be a dual wielding Dwarf Sorcerer with a Abraham Lincoln beard.

They said they will allow that. Thats all i know about D&D.

Help would be much appreciated.

Which edition of D&D?

8 players? Ewww. Your DM better be top notch or you're in for a very slow and boring game.

Maybe borrow a players handbook from one of them and read up on it?

Necroshea wrote:8 players? Ewww. Your DM better be top notch or you're in for a very slow and boring game.

4-6 players usually works best.

I agree with everyone else. 8 is a lot of players. Most of my games tend to fall apart if I get more than 4 or so.

As far as playing D&D goes, it depends on what edition.

Assuming 3/3.5, you'll probably want to find a good way of organizing yourself however, because there's volumes of information, spell choices, and other options you'll have available to you, and if you don't practice good information management, you'll drive yourself crazy trying to keep everything straight. The spell sheets here are a pretty good start: http://www.irossco.com/dnd/index.htm. I'd also consider looking for a decent character sheet also. Don't use the two page one. Your friends might have a couple templates that would make life easier.

I can't comment too much on 4th edition because new things are scary to me, but from what I understand you get a spell that you can use as many times in a day as you want, so it would probably be a good idea to use that on as many enemies as you can.

daedalus wrote:I agree with everyone else. 8 is a lot of players. Most of my games tend to fall apart if I get more than 4 or so.

I'd say the top 'sane' limit is around 6+ GM, but it depends on t eh group. If necessary, the GM may have to start enforcing a 'shot clock' in combat and everyone will need to announce their action within a reasonable time or they pass their action.

daedalus wrote:
Assuming 3/3.5, you'll probably want to find a good way of organizing yourself however, because there's volumes of information, spell choices, and other options you'll have available to you, and if you don't practice good information management, you'll drive yourself crazy trying to keep everything straight. The spell sheets here are a pretty good start: http://www.irossco.com/dnd/index.htm. I'd also consider looking for a decent character sheet also. Don't use the two page one. Your friends might have a couple templates that would make life easier.

I used the SRD to make custom spell reference sheets (with check boxes) for 3.0 games years ago. I've heard that 'optimal' builds avoid this (defaulting to 'stacking' spellcasting levels instead) but a lot of 3.0 builds might get spells from multiple sources, so you'd have to track multiple spell lists. Making a "spell book" is a huge time-saver over multiple rule look-ups.

daedalus wrote:
I can't comment too much on 4th edition because new things are scary to me, but from what I understand you get a spell that you can use as many times in a day as you want, so it would probably be a good idea to use that on as many enemies as you can.

Not quite. Powers in 4th (Everyone gets Powers of some sort) are generally either 'At-Will', 'Encounter', or 'Daily.' At-Wills are reusable, as you mention, but tend to be underwhelming. Magic Missile is an at-will power for wizards, but doesn't scale any more. Encounter powers refresh every 'scene' or encounter, but are more impressive. Daily powers refresh every 'long rest' and tend to be the 'big guns' that you save for boss fights or similar. Many Daily powers are either 'Reliable' (if you miss, you keep the power and can use it on another action if you want) or have a 'Miss' clause where they do half damage, apply a weaker negative status effect, etc.

There's a lot of depth with this, but it is a bit tricky to balance. As a player, you can spam at-wills, but your performance will be uninspiring. Encounter and Daily powers are such that you really want to craft the situation to take best advantage of them: lure a monster into a specific square so you can do a smash attack on him and a few of his friends. Set up a 'zone' power such that enemies have an incentive to go through it, or even use a power to force them through it.

It drew a lot of Magic the Gathering comparisons, but the 'Power Cards' available for 4th (including blanks, I believe, or printable via DDI. Also, make your own with Index cards if you like) do work well as you can easily sort through them in play, discard when you've used the power, etc.

All classes use this basic structure, but many tweak it (especially the Essentials classes). The Wizard, for example, has a 'Spellbook' special rule where a wizard may have multiple spell Power choices for a particular level and has to choose between them. My Druid has two sets of powers, essentially: One set when in human form, another when in beast form. The Essentials classes really modify this, replacing certain levels with special benefits like 'Stances' instead of the standard power framework.

It's a bit "game-y" in feel, but it works... And combat doesn't bog down to players saying "I hit it with my sword" for twenty rounds like previous editions could have. (Althoguh badly written scenarios can get a bit tedious if the environment isn't cluttered up enough. The main thing is everyone has some cool stuff to do.

You'll need some dice (d4, d6, d8, d10, d12, d20), scrap paper, pencil (never pen), eraser, character sheet and a mini, also player handbook 1 is optional but recommended.

For what it's worth, I knew a DM that basically tried to get as many people as possible in the game. That or he just let anyone who wanted in just jump right in. I think we got up to 9 players. I could explain everything we did in the 8 hours of playtime with a few sentences.

I don't play with him anymore, and whenever I see a DM catering to a crowd larger than 4 I generally refuse to play. It's just not worth it.

We are playing fourth ed. And the guy has done it a bunch of times and they are having two DMs so that we can have more people.
I am getting help but thats about it.

Asherian Command wrote:We are playing fourth ed. And the guy has done it a bunch of times and they are having two DMs so that we can have more people.
I am getting help but thats about it.

I don't think I've heard of D&D with two DM's going.

Cheesecat wrote:

Asherian Command wrote:We are playing fourth ed. And the guy has done it a bunch of times and they are having two DMs so that we can have more people.
I am getting help but thats about it.

I don't think I've heard of D&D with two DM's going.

It's two games at once just different peeps moving to the other part
The good force then the evil group plus sorry it's seven people all with experience with dnd and alot more
Also funny thing is there is alot of people going dragon born I choose a half elf
I am a fire specialist sorcerer. With a scythe just because.

Asherian Command wrote:

Cheesecat wrote:

Asherian Command wrote:We are playing fourth ed. And the guy has done it a bunch of times and they are having two DMs so that we can have more people.
I am getting help but thats about it.

I don't think I've heard of D&D with two DM's going.

It's two games at once just different peeps moving to the other part
The good force then the evil group plus sorry it's seven people all with experience with dnd and alot more
Also funny thing is there is alot of people going dragon born I choose a half elf
I am a fire specialist sorcerer. With a scythe just because.

Sounds like it could get messy real quick.

A dual wielding Dwarf Sorcerer will tough to do since Sorcerer is CHA primary and Dwarfs have no bonus to that so you will have to sink most of your points to get that to 18. That really isn't the problem though, as you can be a good Dragon sorcerer running around breathing fire and blowing things up since STR is the secondary for that and Dwarves get a bonus to STR. The problem is you won't be able to get Dual Implement casting becuase you won't be able to get your DEX high enough until 11 at best, or never. You can still dual wield, it just won't do anything. Do you care if they are daggers, which Sorcerer uses as implements or do you want to have something else?

Edit: Did some digging around and apparently there is no Arcane Implement Training (allow you to use other weapons as implements) for hammers or axes, but I think if this is a homegame you should be able to get your DM to allow it, and if your CHA is high enough, give it to you as part of your class build to save you a feat. Explain that it makes more sense for a dwarf to use an axe or hammer so you should be able to use those instead of daggers if you want to go that route.

Are you a dual wielding dwarf or a scythe wielding half elf? The original post says one thing but later another.

Ahtman wrote:A dual wielding Dwarf Sorcerer will tough to do since Sorcerer is CHA primary and Dwarfs have no bonus to that so you will have to sink most of your points to get that to 18. That really isn't the problem though, as you can be a good Dragon sorcerer running around breathing fire and blowing things up since STR is the secondary for that and Dwarves get a bonus to STR. The problem is you won't be able to get Dual Implement casting becuase you won't be able to get your DEX high enough until 11 at best, or never. You can still dual wield, it just won't do anything. Do you care if they are daggers, which Sorcerer uses as implements or do you want to have something else?

Edit: Did some digging around and apparently there is no Arcane Implement Training (allow you to use other weapons as implements) for hammers or axes, but I think if this is a homegame you should be able to get your DM to allow it, and if your CHA is high enough, give it to you as part of your class build to save you a feat. Explain that it makes more sense for a dwarf to use an axe or hammer so you should be able to use those instead of daggers if you want to go that route.

Are you a dual wielding dwarf or a scythe wielding half elf? The original post says one thing but later another.

I chose to become a Half-Elf after i found out there is more of a bonus to be an elf and a human.
So yes I am wielding a scythe.

There is an Arcane Implement Training for my half-elf
I have
Stats
Strength 12
Constitution 13
Dex 13
Int 16
Wis 13
Cha 12

HP 25

Abilities:
Dual Heritage: Take Feats as elf or human
Group Diplomacy: allies within 10 get +1 Diplomacy

Feats.
Alchemist
Make alchemical items of your level or lower

Surging Flame
Extra 5 fire damage against fire resistant enemies

Elven Arcane Precision
Use elven accuracy on multiple targets

Skill Power - Legend
Lore
Gain skill power

Action Surge
+3 to attacks when you spend an action point

Rising Spellfury
+1 att with area/close after hit 1 target

Implement Focus Orb
+1 to damage rolls w/ implement

Weapons Scythe - Two Handed
Off Hand Weapon - Mage Knife (small Knife)
Armor - Sorcerer Robes (Cloth)

Encounter Abilities
1 Familiar Fires
1 Explosive Pire
1 Teleporting Strike

ON command
1 Lightning Strike
1 Burning Spray
1 Blazing Starfall
1 Arcing Fire

Utility Powers (But can't use them till I am level 2)
2 Legend Lore
2 Reward the Obedient
2 Elemental Shift

Wait - are you still a sorcerer? Because that 12 Charisma is going to hurt.

And what level are you starting at? Because you should have, I believe, 2 at will, 1 encounter, and 1 daily if you're at first level. Your comment on your utility powers seems to hint that you're at 1st.

Duel wielding dwarf sorcerer? That's...unique.

infinite_array wrote:Wait - are you still a sorcerer? Because that 12 Charisma is going to hurt.

And what level are you starting at? Because you should have, I believe, 2 at will, 1 encounter, and 1 daily if you're at first level. Your comment on your utility powers seems to hint that you're at 1st.

yeah i am still level 1. Didn't know about the other thing till later. lol
so what should i do next?

At level 1 you should have:

1 Feat of your choosing
1 Daily of your choosing
1 encounter of your choosing
2 At-Will's of your choosing

Now as a Half-Elf you also get a racial encounter, whcih will either be Dilattante (pick an At-Will from another class that can be used as an Encounter power) or Knack for Success (I forget the name) that allows you to enhance a party members attack roll or saving throw once an encounter.

I'm uncertain of the stats since Sorcerers, being innate casters and not academic ones like Wizards, rely on CHA for all their spells; your ability to hit and do damage keys off that stat, and it is low. You also have to pick a type of Sorcerer, which confers different benefits from spells and other perks. For instance a Storm sorcerer gets resistance to lightning and once per encounter can trade the resistance for extra damage. The also add their DEX to their damage, which is where a Sorcerer gets their power. A Dragon sorcerer adds their STR to their spells.

4E isn't like 3e or 2e where you can have lower average stats and be okay. Your primary stat is your most important stat and should almost always start at 18 (at the lowest). Optimized races start at 20 typically, but I personally don't like dumping that much into one stat.

Elven Arcane Precision would be useless to you since you don't have the racial ability it modifies to begin with.

Here is a quick throw together of what it should look like:

level 1
Half-Elf, Sorcerer
Build: Cosmic Sorcerer
Spell Source: Cosmic Magic
Arcane Implement Proficiency: Arcane Implement Proficiency (heavy blade group)
Half-Elf Power Selection: Knack for Success

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 16, Con 13, Dex 10, Int 13, Wis 8, Cha 18.

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
Str 16, Con 11, Dex 10, Int 13, Wis 8, Cha 16.


AC: 13 Fort: 13 Reflex: 11 Will: 16
HP: 25 Surges: 7 Surge Value: 6

TRAINED SKILLS
Arcana +6, Endurance +6, Diplomacy +11, Athletics +8

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics, Bluff +4, Dungeoneering -1, Heal -1, History +1, Insight +1, Intimidate +4, Nature -1, Perception -1, Religion +1, Stealth, Streetwise +4, Thievery

FEATS
Level 1: Arcane Implement Proficiency [Heavy Blade]

POWERS
Sorcerer at-will 1: Blazing Starfall
Sorcerer at-will 1: Energy Strobe*
Sorcerer encounter 1: Ray of the Moon
Sorcerer daily 1: Cosmos Call

ITEMS
Adventurer's Kit, Cloth Armor (Basic Clothing), Scythe

*Can be used as a basic ranged attack, very important if you have a Warlord or other commanding type leader.

With implement attacks (spells) you are at +4 to hit and +7 to damage. The stats you gave above would put you at +1 to hit and +2 to damage. At some point you may want to feat into Melee Training Charisma to increase your basic melee attack if you want to. An absolute must early on is either training in leather or Unarmored Agility. Both give a flat +2 to AC. It will depend on what kind of armor you want whether to stick with cloth or go leather.

wow thanks! Now i need to figure out which voice to use for him and what his name should be.
I have already worked out his story.

Minus all the nerd things from DND, it was alot of fun.

We have started a campagin with 9 players all of which come at different dates today we had 5 players and 2 DMs. we split off into two groups. One group of 3 and one group of 4. Then at the end we did a mega quest.

That Sorcerer is very powerful by the way.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Wait so I have +7 with the current list?

Necroshea wrote:8 players? Ewww. Your DM better be top notch or you're in for a very slow and boring game.

We use action scripting to move along games with more than 6 players. Everyone pays attention and plans their actions ahead of time and lay them out in front of them. They then get to do their actions as scripted. Actions can be aborted to something else if the table has dramatically changed since your scripted. Only people given leeway are those who might also be playing someone else's character.

It is frustrating when in every non-scripted encounter you get to the same people in the order and they never know what they want to do and have to look through all of their available power cards to pick the attack and then get whiny and waste more time when the GM and other players ask them to speed up a bit. Also frustrating when the first thing out of the next players mouth is "So what's happening?" Well if you hadn't been playing a game on your phone you would know what is happening and be ready to deal with it.

Skriker

Skriker wrote:Everyone pays attention

I don't think those kinds of game groups exist, like a unicorn.

Ahtman wrote:

Skriker wrote:Everyone pays attention

I don't think those kinds of game groups exist, like a unicorn.

Actually our Dm's are strict.
They both do not allow power gamers. And then a very powerful monster comes out and kills the hero unexpectly. And then the DM makes that player's character. They like my character because I do their job for them. By accident.....

My 2nd dm is more lenitent but alot more fun and has harder quests for you.

They made it so 10 races are illegal. There can only be 2 dragonborns, and they must not have the same stats or abilities or classes.
No Glass People. No races outside of the 1st, 2nd and 3rd handbooks. Classes that are considered to be overpowered will be depowered and a character sheet will be provided with a new character if you like it or not.
You must RP, no metastaissing (no power gamers basically).
Thus far we have not had these problems but everyone in our group loves dragonborns so there is alittle fight.

To ensure our group does not have too many people they split us up into two groups. All balanced parties.2 groups of four (including DM). Needless to say my group is the most powerful because we always go into combat without asking questions. Then the other group messes around in town. This week we are staying in the city we travel to. My party includes a Half-orc (Fighter), Half elf (me as a Cosmic Sorcerer), a Dwarf (Warlord), and a human (Sword Mage). The other group has an Eldarion (Mage), Dragonborn (Paladin), Human (fighter), Dragonborn (Fighter). Kinda of a balanced group we have 2 other members outside of the campagin that might get involved. but we will choice their class.

Ahtman wrote:

Skriker wrote:Everyone pays attention

I don't think those kinds of game groups exist, like a unicorn.

It is a simple process. If you don't pay attention and you don't script then you don't get to do anything. That becomes a good motivator to actually pay attention the next go around so your character isn't left just standing there while an enemy beats them down.

Skriker

Skriker wrote:

Ahtman wrote:

Skriker wrote:Everyone pays attention

I don't think those kinds of game groups exist, like a unicorn.

It is a simple process. If you don't pay attention and you don't script then you don't get to do anything. That becomes a good motivator to actually pay attention the next go around so your character isn't left just standing there while an enemy beats them down.

Skriker

Its kinda funny because we had 8 players in one big group for a bit because we were doing an ending quest for the day, and we all got into a bar fight, I stood outside and burnt down the bar.

Asherian, that sounds pretty limiting! I wouldn't be particularly happy with a DM writing my character for me. Sounds like nervousness and a desire for control from your DM.

Da Boss wrote:Asherian, that sounds pretty limiting! I wouldn't be particularly happy with a DM writing my character for me. Sounds like nervousness and a desire for control from your DM.

Actually no, they just wrote the back story of the main story. But all the other stuff before then I wrote, everything else i have written, Just not why he is there. Plus mine is the antihero.

Asherian Command wrote:Actually our Dm's are strict.
They both do not allow power gamers. And then a very powerful monster comes out and kills the hero unexpectly. And then the DM makes that player's character. They like my character because I do their job for them. By accident.....

My 2nd dm is more lenitent but alot more fun and has harder quests for you.

They made it so 10 races are illegal. There can only be 2 dragonborns, and they must not have the same stats or abilities or classes.
No Glass People. No races outside of the 1st, 2nd and 3rd handbooks. Classes that are considered to be overpowered will be depowered and a character sheet will be provided with a new character if you like it or not.
You must RP, no metastaissing (no power gamers basically).
Thus far we have not had these problems but everyone in our group loves dragonborns so there is alittle fight.

To ensure our group does not have too many people they split us up into two groups. All balanced parties.2 groups of four (including DM). Needless to say my group is the most powerful because we always go into combat without asking questions. Then the other group messes around in town. This week we are staying in the city we travel to. My party includes a Half-orc (Fighter), Half elf (me as a Cosmic Sorcerer), a Dwarf (Warlord), and a human (Sword Mage). The other group has an Eldarion (Mage), Dragonborn (Paladin), Human (fighter), Dragonborn (Fighter). Kinda of a balanced group we have 2 other members outside of the campagin that might get involved. but we will choice their class.

Wow. DM Power trip?

pretre wrote:

Asherian Command wrote:Actually our Dm's are strict.
They both do not allow power gamers. And then a very powerful monster comes out and kills the hero unexpectly. And then the DM makes that player's character. They like my character because I do their job for them. By accident.....

My 2nd dm is more lenitent but alot more fun and has harder quests for you.

They made it so 10 races are illegal. There can only be 2 dragonborns, and they must not have the same stats or abilities or classes.
No Glass People. No races outside of the 1st, 2nd and 3rd handbooks. Classes that are considered to be overpowered will be depowered and a character sheet will be provided with a new character if you like it or not.
You must RP, no metastaissing (no power gamers basically).
Thus far we have not had these problems but everyone in our group loves dragonborns so there is alittle fight.

To ensure our group does not have too many people they split us up into two groups. All balanced parties.2 groups of four (including DM). Needless to say my group is the most powerful because we always go into combat without asking questions. Then the other group messes around in town. This week we are staying in the city we travel to. My party includes a Half-orc (Fighter), Half elf (me as a Cosmic Sorcerer), a Dwarf (Warlord), and a human (Sword Mage). The other group has an Eldarion (Mage), Dragonborn (Paladin), Human (fighter), Dragonborn (Fighter). Kinda of a balanced group we have 2 other members outside of the campagin that might get involved. but we will choice their class.

Wow. DM Power trip?

You should see our SC2 league.