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I've played a dozen or so games, now, and lost most of them, even when I was aiming for a nice easy demo game to show a complete newcomer how to play.

But you know what? Every time I lose, I can see exactly why I've lost -- what mistakes I've made.

At no point have I thought, "Oh, feth, the dice aren't with me today."

It's always, "Well. Moving that unit there without support was really daft", or "Oh -- I really should have dropped my parachutist in from the next board section along, rather than that one, just because he'd have more LOS-blocking cover options there", or "Well -- maybe a Speculative Shot when I only have a 5% chance to hit was a waste of an order."

I'm convinced that with another couple of hundred games, I might start winning, consistently!

Next project: learn to paint!

Something I like to say about Infinity: "I have more fun losing a game of Infinity than I sometimes do winning a game of 40k." And it's true. So far, never do I feel like I was totally pasted, without a chance to fight back. Sometimes I don't know exactly what I would have done differently, but so far a game hasn't passed that I didn't manage to screw up my opponent's plans, or kill one of his models, or do something epic.

I <3 Infinity for three main reasons.

First of all, the ARO systems keeps me engaged like no other game I've played. In Infinity, you are always on, always playing, never passively waiting for your opponent to hurry up and finish already.

Secondly, the models are so damned gorgeous. Seriously - this is the most beautiful line of minis I've ever worked with. Whoever runs CB's design department is a freaking genius. I have a spitfire Deva sitting in my pocket - and a Marut waiting for me in my mailbox at home - and I cannot wait to get to work on them. Good thing I'm off work tomorrow.

Finally - and this one is last, because I think it's related to the first two - Infinity is simply the most cinematic game I've ever played. It takes some work for me to imagine 40k as a movie, happening right in front of me. It takes a little less work for Warmahordes. It takes no work at all for Infinity. I can easily imagine a sci-fi action movie battle scene happening right there, in front of me, and I'm in charge. It's a lot of fun, and probably contributes to the fact that Infinity is the most fun to play of all the games I'm into.

I'm with you guys. I've had some great games loosing. Except for one A-hole who wanted to show how hot he was by bringing two TAGs against me. Including a Cutter! But even then I learned some. I had guys moving up that I should have kept back and guys in the back I should have been more aggressive with.

That you can thoroughly enjoy losing is, in many ways, the mark of a great game.

ElectricPaladin wrote:Finally - and this one is last, because I think it's related to the first two - Infinity is simply the most cinematic game I've ever played.

While I definitely agree on Infinity's cinematic nature - in fact, it was one of the reasons the game was recommended to me in the first place - it's not quite the most cinematic I've ever played, a title that still belongs to Inquisitor.

I've had my Inquisitor almost managing to use a pile of gravel to stop a Valkyrie taking off while two heavily bionic soldiers had a chainsword duel under its wing and the passenger compartment was playing host to a 4 way Mexican standoff - which, as per my above rule, I enjoyed immensely despite ultimately losing. Infinity hasn't displaced that just yet.

These days, those are the two things I look for in a game - losing being fun, and the sense of story. Which is largely why I'm slowly working on being able to characterise all of my Infinity miniatures.

I had a few very cinematic games of 40K when I first started -- but mostly because I was playing it incorrectly. These days, 40K feels like what it is -- a kind of kludged-together, vaguely science fantasy-themed variation of Napoleonic wargaming.

Infinity almost always feels cinematic, veering between SF, techno-thriller, war movie, and anime craziness, depending largely on the units involved!

I agree with you guys....it is cinematic.

And "AROs" and "face-to-face rolls" is how real combat happens. Anyone who has experienced a combat / gunfight or fought in a ring knows this....heck even airsoft or paintball players would know this.

You mean they don't stand there patiently while someone runs towards them and hits them on the head with a sword?

I agree though with even the losing being fun, I don't think I've had a game yet where there hasn't been a "did you see that bit when.. haha"

I love it because even the most mundane act can be amazingly fun - making the most amazing acts totally epic!

A Zanshi wriggling on his belly through the dirt as bullets snap through the canopy overhead (doding like a mofo in ARO as I take long-range combi-rifle fire) is mundane.

A ninja back-flipping off walls to evade fire while cuting down two heavies in a back-alley is just freaking cool!

One thing I love is that the figures can always stand a good chance of living no matter what is thrown at them. One thing I got tired with 40k is that I spent all that time painting my infantry only for them to die once they got out of their transports. With infinity my guys stay on the board longer so I get the satisfaction of seeing them on the board for more than one turn.

The ARO is an incredible rule. Certainly makes the game an exciting rollercoaster of a time.
That coupled with the solid rules and tight line of mini`s make this one of the if not the best skirmish games out there, infact maybe even the best game

I certainly agree with that!

guardpiper wrote:One thing I love is that the figures can always stand a good chance of living no matter what is thrown at them. One thing I got tired with 40k is that I spent all that time painting my infantry only for them to die once they got out of their transports. With infinity my guys stay on the board longer so I get the satisfaction of seeing them on the board for more than one turn.

That's interesting because I find the game to be very lethal. A group of termies is pretty hardy but in infinity heavy infantry might die to 3 bursts of a Combi-Rifle. When you're dealing with a number range of 1-20 things like 4 armour aren't that helpful IMHO.

^That's why cover is important.

The A4 goes to A7 in cover. Much more survivable. A TAG in cover is nigh unstoppable (hence why AP is often a good option. You can't reduce the cover bonus, but you WILL halve his armour to start with.)

That's true but I feel like the cover system is a bit weird. Having to be in BtB contact with the terrain that is also blocking the enemy's LoF doesn't make sense to me.

From what I've experienced Infinity seems to be about getting as many heavy weapons on the table as effectively as possible. I don't like to put too much stock in guys with all sorts of gear or armour. I rather have a lot of regular troops and load em up with HMG's Spitfires, and the like.

The cover system does not mean to represent that it's harder to shoot at a miniature when something is in the LoF, but to represent that the miniature can hide behind the cover and shoot while taking cover. I think that's working nice

And that's why SWC exist, so that you cannot make a 10 order list with 5 HMG, 2 Sniper Rifles and 3 ML

You can have lots of heavy weapons, but there's always a way to put them down. TO camo, mines, guided missiles, monophilament, AP+EXP ammo... Putting a TAG down to sleep may be difficult sometimes, but I know from a couple guys who trust their TAGs too much and, once they loose them, their whole strategy falls apart. That's why it's better to pick "weaker" units in order to cover as many situations as possible.

PS: Seeing a Jotum sliced in half by an Oniwaban thanks to a crit is awesome... monophilament CC weapon+crit= epic win!

bou wrote:The cover system does not mean to represent that it's harder to shoot at a miniature when something is in the LoF, but to represent that the miniature can hide behind the cover and shoot while taking cover. I think that's working nice

Exactly.. even though Infinity does a pretty good job of representing combat in terms of the lethality of modern weaponry, some level of abstraction is necessary because of the nature of the models. Think of the 'cover mechanic' in games like Mass Effect - when behind cover, the unit will do everything it can to make itself as small as possible, just poking it's head or weapon around the corner to shoot. In the 'open', away from something to hide the body behind, it is much easier for the person shooting to draw a bead on that person even if say the target's feet might be obscured by some curb halfway in-between - in modern weaponry it would be very easy for the shooter to hit the target.

But, again you can 'flank' the target, and remove that bonus if you are able to.

Agreed. It sucks when you find you loaded up on HMG's and find you need a Hacker or Engineer to get into a door without destroying it. Again this is why you should play with missions. Just killing each other is not a good way to play.

Had an epic game tonight, which I'll write up in more detail tomorrow if I get a chance. Some highlights though:

4 players; no teams! Every army for itself. 250 pts each.

Overground complex consisting of a helipad, a bunker, some power generators, and some other bits and pieces of terrain, leading to....

Underground complex made form 4 Space Crusade boards.

We had Yu Jing defending from one of the SC boards, hunkered down around the computer room; Ariadna coming down a lift from the helipad onto another SC board; Combined Army cutting a hole through the power generator bunker to come out into the power room of another SC board; and Aleph heading through the main entrance bunker to come down another lift into the final SC board.

Much blood was spilled! Combined Army wiped out other than 2 repeater remotes; Ariadna losing 6 guys, so the last 2 had to retreat; Aleph down to 2 survivors, a Deva Lt and an Asura Hacker; and Yu Jing reduced from 14 soldiers (two combat groups) to four! Epic stuff.

what like about it is losing your H.Q. means somthing...i mean if a LT.jg got popped on a SEAL raid the team would be like WTF then "Jenkins its show"

40k crap my 150pt action hero just ate oh well hit'em with every op thing i spamed my list with.

Because my enemy spent his active turn shooting at my Jannisary who had taken cover behind a wall. And as they stopped to reload, he moved stealthily through the thick airborne debris, sneaked up behind them, and killed them mercilessly.

I love how "cinematic" Infinity is...
And I love the RPG feel that it has. When I remember my battles is like when I remember epic D&D games with my friends.

I would love to see more of the Infinity fluff, watching a cinematic intro like one of those videogame trailers.

How about an Infinity animation?

Who knows, if it becomes popular enough it might just happen!

+_+ Edit, if it does, I will lobby for the Daktari to be named 'Kanluwen' hohoho..