Switch Theme:

Mantic Games - Warpath Universe News and Rumours  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
»
Author Message
Advert


Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
  • No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
  • Times and dates in your local timezone.
  • Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
  • Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
  • Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.




Made in us
Rogue Daemonhunter fueled by Chaos






Toledo, OH

 Alpharius wrote:

Anyone who pledged and is now upset over the bait and switch 'funding and development' "system" that Mantic's using - vote with your wallet and/or by taking advantage of the Refund Policy!

Maybe the 'few boring accountants' will then take notice?


I know I have been. I only pledged $1 for Warpath, and I had forgotten even about that until I was looking up another kickstarter. I've had enough of it for the time being.

That said, I think accusations of "bait and switch" are a bit much, as that implies a level of malice there simply isn't any evidence of. The problem, alas, is that Mantic remains unprofessional and inept, not malicious. They lag significantly behind other companies in terms of customer service, reliability, and quality assurance. But lets not overstate the problem.
   
Made in us
Legendary Master of the Chapter





SoCal

I guess I'll see what they include with JetBlaine. Hope it's a paperback adventure book.

   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka






 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
I guess I'll see what they include with JetBlaine. Hope it's a paperback adventure book.


I think they'll just reverse their decision to manufacture Blaine and provide us with the file to print our own.

"The Omnissiah is my Moderati" 
   
Made in us
Haughty Harad Serpent Rider





Richmond, VA

Ah, I understand the situation.

So, the company supplying the resin has been doing extraordinarily shoddy work. Mantic should just send the shoddy resin casts to the people who would prefer that Mantic not be agile during the development process, so that they can get a poorly produced resin model with which to wave the "Mantic. Almost." flag about.

However, count me among those content to not receive shittily produced resin or DB/DZ restic. Wrath of Kings models are pretty awesome.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/11/30 18:25:46


"...and special thanks to Judgedoug!" - Alessio Cavatore "Now you've gone too far Doug! ... Too far... " - Rick Priestley "I've decided that I'd rather not have you as a member of TMP." - Editor, The Miniatures Page "I'd rather put my testicles through a mangle than spend any time gaming with you." - Richard, TooFatLardies "We need a Doug Craig in every store." - Warlord Games "Thank you for being here, Judge Doug!" - Adam Troke 
   
Made in se
Executing Exarch






Or just get a non-shoddy resin caster! WoK minis look awesome in pictures but I'm pretty sure they don't have the detail of resin models.
   
Made in us
Rogue Daemonhunter fueled by Chaos






Toledo, OH

The problem isn't finding a resin caster that can do thousands of high quality castings. that's simple: they don't exist.

The problem was Mantic ever thinking they could crack the code and get good, cheap, on time resin.
   
Made in us
Legendary Master of the Chapter





SoCal

 Alex C wrote:
 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
I guess I'll see what they include with JetBlaine. Hope it's a paperback adventure book.


I think they'll just reverse their decision to manufacture Blaine and provide us with the file to print our own.



Zing!



I wish Mantic would put the accountants on the front line of customer service. Maybe then, I'd get a response to my emails.

   
Made in us
Is 'Eavy Metal Calling?





Affton, MO. USA

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
Wow. I don't think the world has ever seen the Germans so angry.


Mantic has struck dark deals with Prodos, Dust Studios, and mysterious Chinese factories, a true trio of terror, a brotherhood of badness, a convocation of conniving cons. Signs and portents all point to one thing:
Mantic is paving the way for Tony Reidy's triumphant return.

This time, no backer will be spared.


The true test will be if Tony Reidy is running the show or not

LOL, Theo your mind is an amazing place, never change.-camkierhi 9/19/13
I cant believe theo is right.. damn. -comradepanda 9/26/13
None of the strange ideas we had about you involved your sexual orientation..........-Monkeytroll 12/10/13

I'd put you on ignore for that comment, if I could...Alpharius 2/11/14 
   
Made in au
Unstoppable Bloodthirster of Khorne





Melbourne .au

Isn't WoK a type of restic?

   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

It's certainly PVC,

but I don't think CMON has called the WoK stuff restic so I guess Mantic is technically correct

 
   
Made in au
Unstoppable Bloodthirster of Khorne





Melbourne .au


   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






My 2 cents:

I'm glad to hear Judge Doug likes the WoK plastic. The Dungeon Saga dragon didn't look too spiffy to me in photos on line (not the design, which I always hated, I'm talking about close-ups showing the detail), and I've read negative things about it having shallow detail. I have no "seeing it in person experience" with either the dragon or WoK, though, so will reserve judgment based on points 1-6 below.

Deadzone Infestation didn't go over gangbusters as a KS campaign, so I do wonder what numbers Mantic were expecting to get. But overall, it's too bad that even at this point in the game they don't have a full handle on what they can promise vs. deliver in terms of materials used. "Too bad" isn't a crime - it isn't "bait and switch" and things do happen that surprise people. Just too bad. I really liked that 1st Gen resin figure from Deadzone 1, and have never seen a plastic mini that matched its quality and detail from Mantic or anyone else.

I feel no shame in having been disappointed at the material switch, and think Mantic should have anticipated the negative responses they got based on their past experience doing things like this. Late game material switches always get negative feedback.
But I'm tentatively pleased by Mantic's response today on a few points:

1. They recognize that the inclusion of resin figures influenced pledge level backers too, not just the people who bought the figures individually. It definitely influenced my decision to go in for Lockdown. Good for them.

2. They plan to add something to offset the value loss. If you don't care for resins, you have no value to lose. But resin holds detail better than anything else (the trade-off is that it is brittle, especially thin bits), so for some, it was definitely a value loss. What they add will determine whether I'm fully on board with this or not, since I do value resin. But the fact that they plan to add anything at all shows that they are still responsive to backers, even if economists have proven that backer opinions don't matter and don't ever change anything. Seriously, this is the responsive "Mantic formula" that I'm familiar with and that I admire.

3. The figures will not come pre-assembled! Fantastic. Love this, love this. Better for better quality assembly, better for modding, and more along the lines of what wargamers (rather than boardgamers) generally expect.

4. Dust studios still is / isn't doing these. No comment from Mantic on that yet. The mystery deepens!

5. Replacing metal with plastic was and still is still a win for me. I'd be happy to see them extend that to all metal figures included in Lockdown, but this aspect of the switch is a nice surprise rather than something promised, so no problem on that count.

6. Offering a refund to all those backers who are still unhappy - which might include me if they make up the value with extra dice, I dunno - basically eliminates any further complaints I might have on the subject regardless. Nothing fairer than that. Many companies wouldn't be bold enough to offer that - like, say, I don't know . . . Prodos games. Good show, Mantic.

7. I'm proud of myself for never over-reacting or going too far in any of my previous commentary. It would be nice if I could write that sentence with a straight face someday.

Color me cautiously optimistic.

On the subject of Dust Studios Dust figures, which may or may not even be relevant, one of the hard plastic vehicles I picked up from FFG is already broken (a running robot, leg broke off with minimal pressure applied. Not a problem for me as I bought it to use as parts rather than keep it whole anyway.) The rubbery power-armor guys I received, though, having looked more closely at them, actually look pretty good. Not top of the line, and the fact that they are bulky power armor guys certainly helps (simpler design, less fine details), but they're nice figures. Definitely worth the $4.00 for 3 price I paid. But seriously, not bad. And absolutely perfect for converting to Fallout-type post-apocalyptic power armor, as some have already done online.





This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2015/11/30 20:12:12


Dakkadakka: Bringing wargamers together, one smile at a time.™ 
   
Made in au
Unstoppable Bloodthirster of Khorne





Melbourne .au

A bit of a rush here - and this isn't piling on - but it's clear that they did not expect this kind of backlash. The only "extra value" that they were giving before Resingate (can we call it Resingate?) happened was that people were going to get two veermyn guys instead of one. No offers of refunds, extras for Blaine, and seemingly no understanding that when people pay for "premium resin" they don't expect to get PVC.

I think that attempting to say that WoK's PVC isn't "restic" is disingenuous, as is showing renders of several of the models. That's going to bite them on the bum a bit later.

Anyway, off to work!

   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






 Azazelx wrote:
A bit of a rush here - and this isn't piling on - but it's clear that they did not expect this kind of backlash. The only "extra value" that they were giving before Resingate (can we call it Resingate?) happened was that people were going to get two veermyn guys instead of one. No offers of refunds, extras for Blaine, and seemingly no understanding that when people pay for "premium resin" they don't expect to get PVC.

I think that attempting to say that WoK's PVC isn't "restic" is disingenuous, as is showing renders of several of the models. That's going to bite them on the bum a bit later.

Anyway, off to work!


I wondered about that, but decided not to comment as I'm not familiar with the product and wasn't sure if the pictures were of renders or not. Some of the pictures certainly looked like renders rather than production shots. Using renders to illustrate production quality definitely doesn't work . . .

Dakkadakka: Bringing wargamers together, one smile at a time.™ 
   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

I've got WoK, the figures are nice and sharp and have limited mould lines, but those that they do have are just as much of a pain to clean up as any other PVC

It's also useful to point out that WoK figures have fine/narrow parts like swords/spears etc made out of yet another plastic, ABS (lego)

as CMON have realised that however good their PVC casting (and it's great) is it's not good enough for the stuff that needs real sharp edges and thin lines for wargaming figures (as opposed to boardgaming pieces like Bloodrage) so they need to use an alternative for them

I wonder if Mantic has taken that distinction on board too ?


 
   
Made in us
Experienced Saurus Scar-Veteran





California the Southern

I went in pretty heavy on Wrath of Kings.

I like the material they used. It's good stuff. Definitely a step up from Mantic's restic, that's for sure. A lot less to clean for starters. Pieces retain a lot of detail, although some of the smaller more delicate pieces were a bit soft- mostly stuff like the Vampire's faces.

The big huge chunky stuff like the octopus and dragon I thought really benefited from the material.

Is it the best? Of course not! Does it get the job done nicely? Certainly.

Hopefully Mantic makes sure that cuts are deep enough to retain detail- that is my biggest concern.

I think I'll be okay with this in the end. Especially if it results in me netting a few extra figures.

...now about those Deadzone rules.... did we ever hear one way or another if the mat size change was official?


Poorly lit photos of my ever- growing collection of completely unrelated models!

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/627383.page#7436324.html
Watch and listen to me ramble about these minis before ruining them with paint!
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCmCB2mWIxhYF8Q36d2Am_2A 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut





Should find out Wednesday, Ronnie is doing an update on the rules apparently.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Myrtle Creek, OR

So did Ronnie update things?

Thread Slayer 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka






privateer4hire wrote:
So did Ronnie update things?


Almost.

"The Omnissiah is my Moderati" 
   
Made in ie
Fixture of Dakka






Deadzone 2.0 Beat Rules

https://www.dropbox.com/s/fqof7f11d0brydb/Deadzone%202%20v1.3.pdf?dl=0

The new command dice - DZ:I backers get one regular set and 1 KS exclusive set with their pledge. If you backed the original DZ or bought it retail they will be available to buy in a standard retail set.



The full update

Spoiler:
Hi there, Ronnie here with an update for all things Deadzone, this time focusing on the rules.

I am really excited to talk about the updated rules and why we have chosen to do what we have done.

First off just a quick apology for the plastic vs. resin changes in the last update. While I think this issue is pretty much sorted (and hopefully today’s update will sweeten the pot even more!) I don’t think we handled the communication quite as well as we could. As well as extoling the greatness of the plastic, I should have given a bit more colour about the challenges we are having with resin – both because this is often causing significant delays to despatching Kickstarters (such as Blaine for KoW – great model – but the major reason for delays because of the quantities) and a few quality issues (such as the traps in DS). Anyway, we all know that any Kickstarter when it is still early in the creative process will experience a few changes – in fact that might be some of the fun – but I don’t ever want you to feel that you are getting less than we promised.

Which leads me on to today’s update. We knew people wanted to play Deadzone – great scenery, great models and cool background, but the rules were just a bit too tough to master. A steep learning curve and a few rules that always caught you out. That’s why we set about doing an updated set. We wanted to make it faster, slicker – more fun!

Jake and I spoke at length about what needed doing. I will let Jake himself talk you through the next bit….

First we tried small tweaks and general tidying up, but it simply wasn’t enough of a difference. What we needed was a step change in ease of use, so we came up with this version.

The intent is not to take away a popular game, but to replace it with a slicker and faster version of itself that retains the key elements whilst losing anything unnecessary. In doing this, many elements were moved from being separate rules to being integrated in other ways, so most of what seems to be missing is actually just hidden somewhere else. This process of integration has made the game play much faster and with a far greater body count.

When we started we intended to just upgrade the rulebook, but once we started working on it and saw what we could do – which is make a truly fantastic, quick skirmish game – we knew it was an opportunity we had to take.

He wrote a first pass, and I played it… and I played it again and again! I thought it was brilliant, but then perhaps it was just me. So I sent a very rough draft to the Deadzone rules committee and the guys in the USA and UK that I knew loved the 1st edition and were always playing, and the 3 Deadzone Tournament Champions from Adepticon 2015 – i.e. the people who were regularly playing the game as it was. And I honestly asked them if they preferred the new or the old version. There was only one answer – and it was the same from every single player. The liked the 1st edition, but they loved the second!

At this point Jake went away and worked the rules up into a more complete document. If you want to know more about his design thinking and the journey of the game pop over to his site, where he has been sharing his thoughts (www.quirkworthy.com). Since we got the script back it’s been edited and the army lists have been added. The rules committee have also developed the campaign system, which allows you to design your own force and see it improve over time.

And that’s what you have here!

- Just click the link and press download in the top right.

A new shiny version of Deadzone, and I hope it will get you to finish painting that squad (if you are like me they are based and undercoated!) and have a game on all that fantastic scenery and rubber-backed mat! The rules have been designed to allow quick and fast – but always tactical – play.

There are victory points to collect by grabbing key positions on the battlefield (and keeping them) – great for those fast armies that are looking for supplies – like the Rebs. There are loot counters – with a few booby traps, naturally – that give in-game buffs. And much less armour and fewer dice modifiers - so much more death!

We have also given far more choice in the basic army lists, so you pick troop types and then select any additional weapons & gear they are packing, over and above their standard equipment - giving you a high degree of customisation over your force.

And then there is the command dice – these really create the dramatic, heroic moments in the game. These are the buffs to allow you to do the impossible – but remember your opponent can do it too!

These replace the cards (which although a good idea, they were a little slow and cumbersome). During the KS we promised everyone an updated set of cards – and these will of course be replaced by a full set of the new command dice. (Before you ask we looked at making them the same as the Warpath dice – but ended up compromising both games doing that!).

This means that the only thing a backer from the last edition of DZ will need to buy is one pack of dice to validate his whole collection (I have already promised to give them a pdf download version of the new rulebook).

The plan is also to give another set of Kickstarter-exclusive special edition command dice to every backer on this campaign too, so you’ll get 2 sets – the standard retail set (for your friends) and a KS exclusive set (to show off with!).

We wanted to tell you about this with the plastic changes last week, but it made the blog too long (and too late because I have been slow writing it).

I am not going to tell you too much about the changes – hopefully you’ll discover these in the game play videos we have coming up, or better yet, by having a few games.

I will just mention this… on one face of the command dice there is a Mantic splat. This is the army special ability. This is the 6! It is what makes your force do something special – in keeping with their training/attributes but just that little bit unique, and it’s based on your commander. It might let you go on a frenzy and do another attack with a model (per splat dice!), or a horde rule that allows you to shuffle forward a previously moved model. This is a change on the surface that will make every game that bit different (just like the loot counters!!!).

Ok this is cool, I hear you say – but there are only 7 armies right – so how much different can it be? Wrong! Because starting with Infestation we will be creating a new army list for each Deadzone faction, based around a named character – and they will have their own unique splat (and sometimes even unique unit entries or upgrades). This will be an ongoing development so there will be new lists coming – meaning that although most of your force will use the same models from game to game you can radically change your force by changing your leader, and adding a new splat and some different upgrades - keeping every game fresh with only a little effort from you.

Ok, enough from me. Please have a read of the rules, hopefully a game or two, and let me know your thoughts!

Best wishes, thank you as always for supporting us through Kickstarter. It makes what we can do so much better.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/12/03 18:51:55


 
   
Made in us
Haughty Harad Serpent Rider





Richmond, VA

The extra free set is a nice touch, silver lining on those mushroom clouds

"...and special thanks to Judgedoug!" - Alessio Cavatore "Now you've gone too far Doug! ... Too far... " - Rick Priestley "I've decided that I'd rather not have you as a member of TMP." - Editor, The Miniatures Page "I'd rather put my testicles through a mangle than spend any time gaming with you." - Richard, TooFatLardies "We need a Doug Craig in every store." - Warlord Games "Thank you for being here, Judge Doug!" - Adam Troke 
   
Made in si
Foxy Wildborne







Looks like I'll stick to Mk1.

Posters on ignore list: 36

40k Potica Edition - 40k patch with reactions, suppression and all that good stuff. Feedback thread here.

Gangs of Nu Ork - Necromunda / Gorkamorka expansion supporting all faction. Feedback thread here
   
Made in ie
Fixture of Dakka






Only had a very quick scan but the game area is still 8 squares by 8 so it looks like the 3'x3' rumours were false.

Games range from 100 to 300 points with limits on Common, Rare and Unique troops depending on points value.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/12/03 19:01:14


 
   
Made in us
Badass "Sister Sin"






Camas, WA

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Looks like I'll stick to Mk1.

I would think you'd want to at least try a game before dismissing it.

Looking for great deals on miniatures or have a large pile you are looking to sell off? Checkout Mindtaker Miniatures.
Live in the Pacific NW? Check out http://ordofanaticus.com
 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





The Battle Barge Buffet Line

How many years was it in between editions? It feels like it lasted longer than the KOW version a year or two schedule. I'm curious to see what various Dakkites will think of the rules. It kind of sucks for folks that bought it at retail recently and will buy for xmas as they'll not find out they are buying/bought an outdated version until too late.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/12/03 19:18:16


We Munch for Macragge! FOR THE EMPRUH! Cheesesticks and Humus!
 
   
Made in us
Legendary Master of the Chapter





SoCal

Is it just me, or did Ronnie forget to add the resingate part of the update that he mentioned at the beginning?

   
Made in us
Experienced Saurus Scar-Veteran





California the Southern

I'll try and print them up and give them a try this weekend.

I'm a big fan of streamlined rules. Makes things go fast, and time is one of those commodities I seem to lack more and more of as I get older.

Poorly lit photos of my ever- growing collection of completely unrelated models!

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/627383.page#7436324.html
Watch and listen to me ramble about these minis before ruining them with paint!
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCmCB2mWIxhYF8Q36d2Am_2A 
   
Made in us
Badass "Sister Sin"






Camas, WA

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
Is it just me, or did Ronnie forget to add the resingate part of the update that he mentioned at the beginning?


First off just a quick apology for the plastic vs. resin changes in the last update. While I think this issue is pretty much sorted (and hopefully today’s update will sweeten the pot even more!) I don’t think we handled the communication quite as well as we could. As well as extoling the greatness of the plastic, I should have given a bit more colour about the challenges we are having with resin – both because this is often causing significant delays to despatching Kickstarters (such as Blaine for KoW – great model – but the major reason for delays because of the quantities) and a few quality issues (such as the traps in DS). Anyway, we all know that any Kickstarter when it is still early in the creative process will experience a few changes – in fact that might be some of the fun – but I don’t ever want you to feel that you are getting less than we promised.

Looking for great deals on miniatures or have a large pile you are looking to sell off? Checkout Mindtaker Miniatures.
Live in the Pacific NW? Check out http://ordofanaticus.com
 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka






I think the "sweetening of the pot" was the KS dice?

Right?

"The Omnissiah is my Moderati" 
   
Made in us
Experienced Saurus Scar-Veteran





California the Southern

Sweeter, but not sweet enough for my sugar- addled American blood.

Poorly lit photos of my ever- growing collection of completely unrelated models!

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/627383.page#7436324.html
Watch and listen to me ramble about these minis before ruining them with paint!
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCmCB2mWIxhYF8Q36d2Am_2A 
   
 
Forum Index » News & Rumors
Go to: