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Chaos Marines are apparently the NEW SoB!

Oh well, at least we still have Daemons for now... Right?

 Kanluwen wrote:

 namiel wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Brometheus wrote:
I take a lot of stock in what Sad Panda said, but didn't someone on Warseer with a good record say that the LOC is done? Sorry, that ALL 4 demons are done?

Also, thanks again Sad Panda. We know that you don't have to post anything at all.

I could do without Tzeentch Daemonkin but I am praying for some sort of 40k TS goodness as I am sure plenty other people are.

To be fair to Sad Panda, the models and molds could be done but they just haven't started producing the actual stock.

Just a possible explanation.

Generally they are 1-2 years ahead. So stuff coming out was 100% done 1-2 years ago. I even found one when the last warriors of chaos book was released the Throgg model had a 2010 date on the sprue for the copyright info

No, I understand that.

But what I'm saying is that the masters and molds? They could be finished. They might simply not have produced the actual stock yet that they would then start shipping to stores.

It's also worth noting that they seem to be doing a lot more with CAD now. Nobody had any real clue about the two new clamshells that just got released, or the two character models for the Tau campaign stuff.

They very well could have started and finished the design process in a manner of months.

I was just adding to the validity of your statement not trying to take away from it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Experiment 626 wrote:
Chaos Marines are apparently the NEW SoB!

Oh well, at least we still have Daemons for now... Right?

I want my summoned lesser demons back..........

 Brometheus wrote:
I sure will, ill edit this post after coffee.

Here: http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/316968-sad-panda-replies-to-csm-talk-on-dakka/page-2

Thank you! I hadn't looked in that subforum. Very much appreciated

Experiment 626 wrote:
Chaos Marines are apparently the NEW SoB!

Oh well, at least we still have Daemons for now... Right?

They really messed up by not making Daemonkin have rules for the World Eaters in it. It really should have had Khârn in it so people could use it to run a WE army. They could then make a new book for each of the god-dedicated legions (Daemonkin books for Tzeentch Thousand Sons, Slaanesh Emperor's Children, and Juggle Death Guard). Release updates to the god-specific kits (possibly with legion upgrade sprues). They could then make a Chaos Undivided book last for the other legions. Instead GW is just leaving money on the table because stupid.

Chikout wrote:
So Sad Panda said that next year will have some 40k Tzeentch stuff, but not a codex or a Daemonkin. Atia said Rubric Marines are done. space wolves are due in February. So space wolves vs Thousands campaign then?

Link to Atia's post?

edit: Oh, I see it now. Never comes out and says it though.

Isn't it possible she's talking about the hh thousand sons we saw a picture of awhile back, rather than gw ones?

That would be a shame, as I'm hoping for some formation or something to make them relevant again, and if she was just speaking of the hh tsons that's not gonna happen.

I won't buy the models with their gak rules the way they are and I'm sure most won't. I want to, but I just can't do it.

yes the hints are vague

http://war-of-sigmar.herokuapp.com/bloggings/383#disqus_thread

joking about it would be cruel. hopefully she can shed more light.

 Talys wrote:

 Ghaz wrote:

 mechanicalhorizon wrote:
Does their output seem a but "random" these days?

I remember they used to release multiple kits for factions all at the same time, I guess so customers can field them at once in their armies.

Now it seems like they release 1 or 2 kits for a faction, then wait a while and release another kit, then wait a while for another.

Are they just releasing less product and spreading out the releases?

You seem to misremember how GW used to release product. Yes, they did drop multiple kits at a time but they only did that once a month instead of the one or two a week that they do now. If there was too much for a single release, then you had to wait a month for the next release. Then you'd be lucky to see anything for your army at all for a few years until the army got a new codex. I don't see how GW's past release plan was better than what they have now.

Yeah, I totally agree.

Incidentally, GW releases WAY, WAY more product now than they used to. The number of plastic models produced far outstrips the ability of most people to actually buy, build, and paint everything, even if they were so inclined, had no monetary constraints, and had nothing else to do with their lives And, this wasn't always the case.

It often feels like GW isn't producing stuff, just because they're not producing stuff for the factions we care about. And, look at how many factions there are now -- 23 for 40k and 21 for AoS. Even if you strip away all of the factions that haven't had anything new forever (like Sisters, Inquisition, Brettonians, etc.) and the ones that have almost no models... there are still like, 30+. That's a lot of time between things for the faction you want them to do stuff for!

Except it seems everything is about space marines, and only certain ones at that.
I mean you got Khorne Berzerkers, which are so old, some I am not even sure have models anymore (Iron Hands) and models who aren't space marines who were in popular armies and haven't got new models (High and Dark elf spearmen).
Ranges that haven't been touched but a rehashing of the same stuff over and over. Or just new stuff for those ranges and a neglecting of the older ranges (Marauders are still pretty ugly, the chaos warriors are alright but still pretty damn old, but fantasy is a whole other piece of insanity).
Maybe if they put energy and effort into the neglected armies people would buy them, vs instead throwing out more useless garbage, giant ugly monsters and another space marine or space marine looking army.
Space Marines aren't that cool, they don't look that cool, and they have no personality (as an army or as characters in stories).
Remember that movie?

Beastmen to be discontinued by the end of 2016? Sounds like bs... i mean how often do we hear about rumors a year in advance that are actualy true?

 namiel wrote:


I want my summoned lesser demons back..........

Yeah, its sad. Perhaps you could try to... summon lesser daemons?
Or any kinds of daemons, for the cost of a cheap sorcerer.

Anyway, chaos is busy in the Age of Sigmar ;why die horribly from xeno shooting when you can rule the world as lords of the end time?


Is there still a topic for this thread, or is it just general new hope and dreams due to the coming new year?

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Nicky J wrote:
Krom Dragongaze in clampack, methinks.

"Space Wolves Wolf Lord" is likely what it will be labeled as.
Krom Dragongaze's rules only exist in the "Stormclaw" booklet, and they haven't reprinted Karlaen(the recent Blood Angels Terminator Captain) anywhere that I'm aware of.

I'd also suggest that we might see an Iron, Rune, or Wolf Priest clamshell.
We COULD potentially see a plastic Techmarine and Servitors box that could accept the various "Chapter Upgrade" sprues we've seen lately so people can make an Iron Priest.

Karlaen received a Dataslate that had his rules in it recently. They will likely do the same for Krom. Release the model as a generic plastic Wolf Lord, then release a Dataslate so it can be used as Krom. It is actually not a terrible thing that they are doing this, it gives people that missed these miniatures a chance to get them. I get that there will be some sour grapes from the people that bought them thinking they were exclusive (the wording actually makes it pretty obvious they would be released later), but it is hardly the end of the world.

That explains it. I don't pay attention to Dataslates.

I am hoping they release the Strike Force Ultra Captain in Clampack form, I never got him.

Hardly anyone got him. Strike Force Ultra was produced in really small numbers, and most of the local copies I saw that got sold? They were able to flog the Captain on eBay to cover the costs pretty quick.

As for a generic...thing that people could use the Chapter Upgrades to make, I don't think that will happen. Look at the Blood Angels exclusive Terminator Librarian and Chaplain, why make a single universal model when you can make two models? GW Logic.

By that logic, there was no reason for them to release the Terminator Librarian with Dark Angels as "generic" when they could have slathered him in iconography.
When it suits their purposes? They'll release generics even in the midst of a specific book's release.

For whatever reason though, they keep making Blood Angels specific models. The Terminator Librarian you're referring to was a CAD resculpt of the Space Hulk Librarian, released alongside the Blood Angels book because...well, who knows.

Techmarines though? Techmarines are pretty aged kits, same with the Servitors. We just saw Guard get a plastic Techpriest model with no Servitors(which was kinda surprising to be honest), but if Techmarines are to get a plastic kit I would be VERY surprised to see them not include plastic Servitors.

I am still hoping that they will release upgrade sprue for some of the other Codex Space Marines armies. Wouldn't mind a Super Formation for each of the other Chapter Tactics in C:SM (and SW and BA) as well.

There aren't really many "upgrade sprues" that need to be done for other Codex: Space Marines armies.
Iron Hands and Raven Guard are the only ones who really might "need" them(and STILL don't have their own set of transfers from GW proper, instead having to buy from Forge World). Iron Hands though can skirt around that by creative use of the cybernetics bits from the various Space Marine kits and Raven Guard can also kinda/sorta skirt around it by using the "eagle" iconography in the Vanguard/Sternguard kits and as many Corvus helmets as you can get your hands on.

Unless TS get a total and complete overhaul on rules its a waste of time releasing them.

GW should squat chaos marines, its a pointless mess. Between FW and the loyalist books you can run any legion better than gw will ever let it be

It is hard to say why BA keep getting unique models. Perhaps GW thinks that they aren't selling because they don't have enough cool product out there, not because their rules are awful and they are basically unplayable in the current state of the game. Watch, the next model that gets updated into plastic, such as the Techmarine, will be a BA-branded version and be covered with all sorts of blood drops and wings. Even the servitude will have blood drops all over them.

I wouldn't mind seeing the existing upgrade sets get transitioned into plastic. Self-servingly, I would like to see Imperial Fists, but I want all the other First Founding Chapters to have upgrade sets as well. It can't take much work to put a small sprue together.

Plastic Rubrics.... too little too late to keep my interest. Reckon they will be no different to the current line of available pieces and no doubt more expensive.

Not even holding onto hope that the chaos codex will in any way be good. I expect it'll be a slight shuffling around of points and fluff without any real meaningful contribution - a la Dark Eldar - another army I shelved.

Edit: I tell an untruth. The Dark Eldar are not shelved... they're boxed and ready to sell. The same is true for my Plague Marine force with Typhus and the small Dark Angel force won't be far behind I reckon.

That leaves me with the Thousand Sons (who I simply just like the models of and the fluff), Deathwatch and Orks - we'll see where we go from there.

I'd comment on how little the Chaos Space Marines recieved in their last update, but I'd rather waste my time on something slightly more important. Games Workshop seems to only be interested in promoting armies that make money, even though these armies only make money because of how much they're being promoted. It's a cycle that Games Workshop has made and continues to make. Maybe if they decided to flesh out the traitor legions in the tabletop game the way they've chosen to flesh out the loyalists... We'd see CSM players everywhere and new codex releases every 2 years guaranteed. Their lack of interest causes ours. They have never understood this. I know I'm being captain obvious here, and this has horse has been beaten to death, but whenever I become interested in 40k again this becomes an issue.

 Quarterdime wrote:
Games Workshop seems to only be interested in promoting armies that make money, even though these armies only make money because of how much they're being promoted.

The idea that GW (or any company) can influence the demand-side of things is pretty stupid.

Up until 2013 or so, GW released exactly the same amount of stuff (army books, miniatures, etc..) for both Fantasy and 40K, yet "demand" certainly wasn't equal.

The most promoted army of 2015 were Stormcast, but they clearly aren't the most sought-after and played.

Dreadfleet and Space Hulk got exactly the same amount of support and promotion (arguably, Dreadfleet got more), but demand was very different.

Hell, even other companies. Star Trek Attack Wing gets a lot more releases than X-Wing, but that doesn't seem to be carry into the demand-side of things.

GW has no influence over what people buy. Hell, if GW actually did market research, they'd probably be pushing Marines even harder than they do now and would never have done things like the Dark Eldar re-boot.

It's of course not enough just promoting things if at the end of the day the product isn't what people want. (Case in point AoS Sigmaines).

But if there is interest among the fanbase that isn't cultivated by releasing stuff matching the interest, eventually the interest vanes.

Dark Eldar is a prime example of how different the interest in a faction is if it's neglected for years, compared to when it receives some attention and quality product is released.

 Zywus wrote:
It's of course not enough just promoting things if at the end of the day the product isn't what people want. (Case in point AoS Sigmaines).

You say "of course", but that is not what has been said. To quote it again, it was a monocausal argument.

 Quarterdime wrote:
even though these armies only make money because of how much they're being promoted.

Once you have a multi-causal model, where not only GW-promotion but also a certain threshold of pre-existing demand (or lack thereof), independent of GW's promotion, is factored in, things immediately look different.

And there are people who like Sigmarines. Plenty pictures of painted Sigmarine armies, even on Dakka.

If GW squats Sigmarines again, because there weren't enough people buying Sigmarine to justify them sticking around, some people will get angry/sad/disillusioned/etc.., Doesn't mean there're enough of them to justify keeping the range.

The same might be true for Sisters or possibly even for CSMs. Not likely, but we don't have the numbers, so it might (!) be the case.

They rerelease codex space marines again, because they need another cash boost.

Wonderwolf wrote:

 Zywus wrote:
It's of course not enough just promoting things if at the end of the day the product isn't what people want. (Case in point AoS Sigmaines).

You say "of course", but that is not what has been said. To quote it again, it was a monocausal argument.

 Quarterdime wrote:
even though these armies only make money because of how much they're being promoted.

Once you have a multi-causal model, where not only GW-promotion but also a certain threshold of pre-existing demand (or lack thereof), independent of GW's promotion, is factored in, things immediately look different.

Which also isn't what you said, and I quote:

Wonderwolf wrote:
GW has no influence over what people buy.

Emphasis mine. You argue that a monocausal argument is incorrect, and reply with an equally incorrect monocausal argument. I mean what are you trying to say, people have inbuilt, genetic desires for models with huge pauldrons, and the quality and variety of GW's offerings are irrelevant except where they happen to line up with this already-present, unchanging need? (actually the way kids buy space marines, there might be something to that...)

You were attacking a bit of a straw man anyway, the gist of the original post was that GW misses opportunities because they think things aren't popular, when at least sometimes factions aren't popular specifically because GW fails to support them. There's evidence for this (Dark Eldar are the poster children, but also Necrons and Grey Knights, even the Raging Heroes SoB kickstarter) and trying to say otherwise is foolish.

 CalgarsPimpHand wrote:

Emphasis mine. You argue that a monocausal argument is incorrect, and reply with an equally incorrect monocausal argument. I mean what are you trying to say, people have inbuilt, genetic desires for models with huge pauldrons, and the quality and variety of GW's offerings are irrelevant except where they happen to line up with this already-present, unchanging need? (actually the way kids buy space marines, there might be something to that...)

You were attacking a bit of a straw man anyway, the gist of the original post was that GW misses opportunities because they think things aren't popular, when at least sometimes factions aren't popular specifically because GW fails to support them. There's evidence for this (Dark Eldar are the poster children, but also Necrons and Grey Knights, even the Raging Heroes SoB kickstarter) and trying to say otherwise is foolish.

Yes. Space Marines were successful and GW ran with it. Just like Corvus Belli ran in Infinity and dropped their historical, etc..

If 7 out of 10 customers buy Space Marines, you'll make 7 out of 10 books/miniatures/etc.. a Space Marine.

GW probably still underserves the Space Marines, measured to their relative popularity, rather than giving them the same share in their release as their popularity would warrant. Part of the reason FW is making so much money with the excess demand for Space Marines stuff while their seems to be no excess demand for Dark Eldar stuff.

And for everyone of your examples, there are 20 examples of stuff that didn't sell despite "equal promotion", even assuming the Dark Eldar thing was a success. They aren't exactly a popular army and it's not unlikely, GW might've fared better squatting them. Same for the more recent Harlequins-reboot.

Saying GW neglects or outright discontinues some armies out of simple spite, not out of economic reasons, seems silly. A vocal online-presence doesn't equate to a broad customer base and armies simply might not have sold sufficiently in the first place, even if a few (too few) hobbyists loved them.

Both Beastmen and Bretonnia have become unpopular over the years - with a lack of customers who continuously purchase the products from the 2 armies, I staunchly believe that the current models will be discontinued.

However, this does not indicate that they will be gone forever. It could be probable that they might receive a reboot.

LOC is confirmed. Yes, GW designs and makes models a year or 2 before the actual "release" of the product. All 4 greater demons were made before the end times. But GW postponed their releases because
a) the end times
b) other product releases (Nagash etc.)
c) possibility of rebooting Fantasy

Like my previous statements, GW can abruptly make changes to their original planning - the Glottkin was supposed to be a GUO. Now it's a character model.
LOC and KOS are not yet released. BT was released because the final end times mainly focused on Khorne, ergo BT was thrown into the list of releases during the end times.

Because 2016 will focus on Tzeentch, it is confirmed that LOC will be released. KOS is debatable, but LOC is confirmed

Let's calm it down a bit please folks.

Thank you.

the Glottkin was supposed to be a GUO.

Nope it wasn't ^^

Wonderwolf wrote:

 Quarterdime wrote:
Games Workshop seems to only be interested in promoting armies that make money, even though these armies only make money because of how much they're being promoted.

The idea that GW (or any company) can influence the demand-side of things is pretty stupid.

But not as stupid as trying to argue that a producer of an item can do nothing to stimuate demand for that item.

You're essentialy saying that advertising is irrelevant (and not just to GW.) When anyone who knows what they're talking about is aware that only half of it is.

There are literally so many things wrong just with this statement I could write an essay, but hey, it'd be off topic and you'd probably just wilfully (or otherwise) misunderstand it.

Let's just put it down to it being a Saturday and Zwei saying something controversial to make a thread all about him because he's bored and leave it at that?

 BlaxicanX wrote:

 mjl7atlas wrote:
Any real theory as to why they refuse to release the SoB's? There is a huge demand for new model SoB's, I believe raging heroes raised half a million for their version of them. Why does GW constantly neglect them? Would make for a massive codex too if they did the Inquisition with them.

GW doesn't do market research and people tend to forget that the internet is a vocal minority.

The combination of those two factors means that GW is likely completely unaware of the demand for SoB, if it truly even exists. Maybe it doesn't- maybe Sisters aren't actually even all that popular compared to the other factions. Again, since GW doesn't do any research it's not like we have any statistics, and personal anecdotes are generally meaningless.

Oh please. The old "vocal minority" schtick is about a decade out of date. Just about everyone in this hobby in the western world has a mini pc in their pocket.

I will be forever on the watch for any news of Rubric marines on Atia's new home:

http://war-of-sigmar.herokuapp.com/

I'll be creepin fierce

and relentlessly asking for more info. Poor Atia.

not sorry

: ]

 Brometheus wrote:
I will be forever on the watch for any news of Rubric marines on Atia's new home:

http://war-of-sigmar.herokuapp.com/

I'll be creepin fierce

and relentlessly asking for more info. Poor Atia.

not sorry

: ]

Feel free to enjoy the summer of '16 before checking back. Minimum. We're talking the long game.

Sad Panda wrote:

 Brometheus wrote:
I will be forever on the watch for any news of Rubric marines on Atia's new home:

http://war-of-sigmar.herokuapp.com/

I'll be creepin fierce

and relentlessly asking for more info. Poor Atia.

not sorry

: ]

Feel free to enjoy the summer of '16 before checking back. Minimum. We're talking the long game.

Boo! It's almost Christmas! Can't you just lie or something!?

BOLS, when are Rubrics coming?

Sad Panda wrote:


Feel free to enjoy the summer of '16 before checking back. Minimum. We're talking the long game.

That's ok. We appreciate you chiming in