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Can you use super heavies, such as the baneblade or stompa, in normal games of 40k or are they limited to Apoc?

Thanks
Grimm

No you cannot. (well, you can do anything you want, but in normal games, no).

Short Answer: No
Long Answer: Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

Longer answer: Only in Apoc, as the rules for Superheavies are in the Apoc Book

And finally the wrong answers ... Yes if your a fool that plays IA (I personally find them over powered or not worth taking)

Grimm wrote:Can you use super heavies, such as the baneblade or stompa, in normal games of 40k or are they limited to Apoc?

Thanks
Grimm

Only if your opponent says, 'sure, that sounds like fun.'

Even so, using them precludes the game from being normal 40k.

Tri wrote:And finally the wrong answers ... Yes if your a fool that plays IA (I personally find them over powered or not worth taking)

I still wish I could take Chimeras with an Autocannon though...

Alas.

@ the OP: not only are all the other folks in here correct, but generally a super heavy will dominate a game and, despite taking up a huge chunk of your points, will still probably overpower your opponent.

Alternatively, if your opponent knows you're bringing it (since he will have agreed in the first place) he may just go ahead and tool his list towards killing the Super Heavy exclusively. Then you'll be stuck with a big chunk your points gone for the rest of the game.

Either way, it will probably end up being very one-sided and not that much fun.

DoW

I thought all IA units can be used in normal 40k.

That means stompa / bane blades if they have an entery in IA?

IA has rules for using super heavy vehicles (et al) via a secondary, tertiary, etc. Force Org chart.
But that would still fall outside of "normal" 40k (see page viii of the main rules).
Although, anything can be used with opponent's consent.

/shrug

DogOfWar wrote:Either way, it will probably end up being very one-sided and not that much fun.

Your theoryhammer falls flat on its face, FYI. Try actually playing something a time or two before trying to make pronouncements on it. Including a super heavy in an appropriately sized standard game works out just as well as any other selection. Yeah, it's going to figure prominently, but so what?

Bookwrack wrote:

DogOfWar wrote:Either way, it will probably end up being very one-sided and not that much fun.

Your theoryhammer falls flat on its face, FYI. Try actually playing something a time or two before trying to make pronouncements on it.

MUAHAHAHAAH! My Stompa iz gonna get ya!

Wait, are those Multimelta Longfangs? In a Drop Pod? With Relentless?

CREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEED!

No wait, they missed. Phew, now to crush these Blood Cl...

-Bloop-

LUKAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAS!

Bookwrack wrote:

DogOfWar wrote:Either way, it will probably end up being very one-sided and not that much fun.

Your theoryhammer falls flat on its face, FYI. Try actually playing something a time or two before trying to make pronouncements on it. Including a super heavy in an appropriately sized standard game works out just as well as any other selection. Yeah, it's going to figure prominently, but so what?

I think it's assumed in any opinionated post (of mine, anyway) that it should end with:

'YMMV'

That way no one gets hot and bothered about someone being wrong on the internets!

Oh and YMMV.

DoW

LunaHound wrote:I thought all IA units can be used in normal 40k.

That is a kinda strange assumption. What made you think that?

Gwar! wrote:

Bookwrack wrote:

DogOfWar wrote:Either way, it will probably end up being very one-sided and not that much fun.

Your theoryhammer falls flat on its face, FYI. Try actually playing something a time or two before trying to make pronouncements on it.

MUAHAHAHAAH! My Stompa iz gonna get ya!

Wait, are those Multimelta Longfangs? In a Drop Pod? With Relentless?

CREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEED!

No wait, they missed. Phew, now to crush these Blood Cl...

-Bloop-

LUKAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAS!

Gwar if i had to face Any of the real nastys I think Thunderwolves are a good shout. Also an IC (also on a wolf) with saga of the beast slayer (well it never limits the size of the walker) ^_^ Str10 with rerolls to hit for the win

Bookwrack wrote:

DogOfWar wrote:Either way, it will probably end up being very one-sided and not that much fun.

Your theoryhammer falls flat on its face, FYI. Try actually playing something a time or two before trying to make pronouncements on it. Including a super heavy in an appropriately sized standard game works out just as well as any other selection. Yeah, it's going to figure prominently, but so what?

Your intelligence falls flat on it's face. Bringing an Apoc-ruled Baneblade to an 1850 list brings outside of the norm items into 40k, and gives them an unfair advantage as all lists will be built assuming that you can't drop a paper plate on the board and kill stuff under the template with relative ease. Firing at multiple opponents with such template weapons as well....come on now. "But so what?" Oy, so you are THAT guy at your gaming shop.

At a point in the distant past, for those fo you with IA books going back to Imperial Armor 1 or any of the updates, they were allowed. The caveat was they weren't "allowed" in games 2k and under. God forbid you want a plane or a special tank. The advent of Apoc FW changed the wording in their IA books to "useable only in apoc games" when discussing super heavies.

Before anyone goes saying superheavies are OP, you do realize less than half a SHs points in Carnifexes does the job? That's not counting DPs, Greater Daemons, etc. When we play Apoc at my FLGS a couple old guys get all butt-hurt unless we play that MCs hit the facing they're hitting, not the rear armor :p

Cannerus_The_Unbearable wrote:Before anyone goes saying superheavies are OP, you do realize less than half a SHs points in Carnifexes does the job? That's not counting DPs, Greater Daemons, etc. When we play Apoc at my FLGS a couple old guys get all butt-hurt unless we play that MCs hit the facing they're hitting, not the rear armor :p

If they're playing superheavies, they just need to make sure they drop D-strength blasts on the carnifexes.

If they're not using D-weapons, that's their own fault.

Synapse ftw.

I played a 2500 point game where my friend used a superheavy. I completely ignored it, as in, never once shot at it. I "forced" him to set up on the other side of the board (I say "forced" because it was the only sensible tactical thing to do, he doesn't like broadsides ). I wiped to floor with him, and he is a good player, he just had 500 points tied up in a bane blade that's wasn't killing enough a turn.

Below the 2K mark, it does get a little one sided and not as much fun. The game is more praying to the dice gods then using strong tactical decision to make the game interesting.

Cannerus_The_Unbearable wrote:Before anyone goes saying superheavies are OP, you do realize less than half a SHs points in Carnifexes does the job? That's not counting DPs, Greater Daemons, etc. When we play Apoc at my FLGS a couple old guys get all butt-hurt unless we play that MCs hit the facing they're hitting, not the rear armor :p

If the MCs can get up there, is the real question.

DogOfWar wrote:

Bookwrack wrote:

DogOfWar wrote:Either way, it will probably end up being very one-sided and not that much fun.

Your theoryhammer falls flat on its face, FYI. Try actually playing something a time or two before trying to make pronouncements on it. Including a super heavy in an appropriately sized standard game works out just as well as any other selection. Yeah, it's going to figure prominently, but so what?

I think it's assumed in any opinionated post (of mine, anyway) that it should end with:

'YMMV'

That way no one gets hot and bothered about someone being wrong on the internets!

Oh and YMMV.

DoW

Don't mind him, it's Bookwrack. He's like Gwar! but without the subtle charm. Which yes, is saying a lot.

Neconilis wrote:Don't mind him, it's Bookwrack. He's like Gwar! but without the subtle charm. Which yes, is saying a lot.

=)

In all seriousness you really have become better as of late, so whatever it is you're doing keep it up.

I think it's due to the fact that his space puppies have finally received their due...

Steelmage99 wrote:

LunaHound wrote:I thought all IA units can be used in normal 40k.

That is a kinda strange assumption. What made you think that?

The statement in the IA books that it's fine to use the following units. Of course, super-heavies were always the exception since they required the use of a second FoC in order to field in the first place, which meant special arrangements needed to be made before hand to use them. Although even for the non-superheavies, if you're using the apocalypse rules for them instead of what was printed in the relvant IA, that's a condition that will require special mention.

Farseer Faenyin wrote:My intelligence falls flat on it's face.

You're right, it does. Fortunately, ignorance is a condition that gets better if you stop whining and actually play so that you have some idea of what you're talking about. Anyway, I was operating under the reasonable assumption that people would realize a standard game with a super-heavy or two thrown in would be at higher points, and involve a little discussion with the opponent beforehand. My mistake, and I apologize for making such an ass out of both you and mption.

Neconilis wrote:Don't mind him, it's Bookwrack. He's like Gwar! but without the subtle charm. Which yes, is saying a lot.

Given how infrequently I post, it's charming that you're butthurt enough to care.

I think the point is , most "average" army list dont bring enough weapons to deal with super heavies.

Sure its not impossible to beat them if you are prepared , but realistically , most people only bring enough AT to kill 1-2 Land Raiders.

Bookwrack wrote:Lots of stuff

I assumed that we were talking about the standard sized games of 1000-3000 points and I felt a super heavy would cause too much of an impact on games of that size. Any higher point games (3k+) I would probably (rightly or wrongly) consider somewhat of an Apocalypse game anyway, and then it would be less of an issue. I'm sorry if this confused you and I hope this post has made things clearer.

On a related note, you are obviously entitled to your opinion and I, for one, respect that. Could you please do the same for other people by respecting their opinions as well? Posting your opinion is one thing, but if you could refrain from unnecessary sarcasm and superciliousness I'm sure everyone would appreciate it and discussions would go a lot smoother.

Or at least try to do it with a little bit of wit. I don't mind when people burn me as long as they aren't doing it with an obvious malicious undertone. That's just no fun for anyone.

Thanks.

DoW

For the Stompa there is the special Stompa vs Army mission they published you can get here if you created an account to access the GW archive.

In general I don't think most of the IG Superheavy tanks are game breaking, I could see letting an IG army take them as a heavy support choice. Anyone prepared to kill a Land Raider can kill those.

Jack

Yanno, I was told by a guy at a store I usually buy my stuff at, that they played a cool game with a stompa. What they did was have a stompa on one side, and the opponent has like 1500 pts or something like that. Then the stompa has a small turn number to kill like 1000pts. I dont remember it exactly as he told me about it months ago (And I dont play APOC so didnt really pay attention)