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I know, I know, another "help me pick an army thread". Sorry guys.

I am ready to start a new WFB project, and quite eager to do so, actually. I have two ideas that I might want to do, and I would like to see what you guys think of them. Both of them appeal to me pretty much equally. I'm going to post the whole hobby shebang here, by the way- modelling, playstyle, theme.

So, option 1, Brettonians.
I love Knights, I love the Men at Arms, I love Song of Ice and Fire, and I'm developing a bit of an interest in heraldry. I had an idea to make a Brettonian army based around the heraldry of my own family and those of my friends, as well as some of the cooler characters from Song of Ice and Fire. I decided I wanted to go an all plastic route (or as close as possible) so my Knights Errant will all be bareheaded, my Knights of the Realm will all have helms (without crests) and my Grail Knights will all have crested helms.
The Knights of the Realm and Errant knights will have similar heraldry, representing fathers and sons and related clans of knights.
My own heraldry is alright, as it goes:

(we have a cool motto too- "Consider the End" )

I could do the full on heraldry for the general and then simplify it for his sons/nephews. Black/Red/Silver is pretty badass.

My mam's side of the family has one too, but it's much more complex:

(And another cool motto- "Victory or Death!" )
I was thinking I could split the elements up a bit amongst some of them- the red hand of ulster is a pretty easy one, and striking too, the lion is good too, and hey, who doesn't love fish? The boot, maybe less so
Blue/Red/white and White/Yellow are alright choices. I thought I might nick a couple of the characters from the Hedge Knight as fillers for when the family stuff is all done.

The Grail Knights I was going to do as having forsaken their heraldry in favour of pure white/red with grail iconography. I thought about leaving in some monochrome heraldric devices but decided that I would limit thier individuality to the crests on their heads. I also very much want to paint them as sort of glowing. I want the rest of the army to look gritty and trailworn, with weathering and dirt splatters and so on (pushing myself), so it'd be cool to have them stand out.

Tactically, I like the idea of a cav based force. I don't play with much cav at the moment (I play O&G and Dwarves) and I would like the change. The list I'm looking at is something like:
Lord, Prophettess, Banner Bearing Paladin
12 KoTR
12 KE
30 Men At Arms
20ish Peasant Bowmen
5 Pegasus Knights
7 Grail Knights
2 Trebuchet
So a fairly balanced force.
Theme wise, I am attracted to the idea of humans slugging it out in fantasy land. I want to get across some of the feel of GRRM's series while still incorporating the WFB high fantasy elements. I am enthusiastic about playing "good guys".


Now, the Ogres. Again with them, it's a change of playstyle to a completely aggressive wreck face army. I love the ogre plastics, and I want to work with them. In the same way that I am interested in pushing my painting with the Bretts, I want to push my modelling with the Ogres. I'd like to convert all my characters out of the plastics. I do like Gnoblars, but having painted a bajillion gobbos in my time I want to keep their levels down. In my head, these are Ogres from the same region as my Orc Tribe, and they will be based so that they will look the part as a combined force. I like that idea from a generic fantasy "horde of nasty brutes" standpoint.
Mechanically, I am interested in the new lease of life Ogres have with the monstrous infantry buffs in 8th. I'd like to give it a whirl as it seems pretty unique.
The list I'm looking at is:
Tyrant, Hunter + Tusks, Butcher, BSB Bruiser
18 Bulls
2x6 Ironguts
20-30 Gnoblars
4 Leadbelchers

I am pretty happy with my planned conversions too (River Trolls as Ice Troll Yehtees?!). So I'm quite torn!

Which army do you think is cooler? What do you think about the in game effectiveness of each(I do play in tournaments)? Which would you do, given the option.
Oh, observant posters may have noticed that both armies are based on a core of two battalion boxes. This is not a co-incidence. I want some plastic army lovin' after working on my Trollbloods recently
Thanks for reading.

Me like fat people... *gets distracted and leaves*

Seriously tho, Ogres are just awesome IMO, in fact if it wasn't for the damn dinosaurs i would have started them insted of lizardmen.
They do like to eat almost as much as i do after all

How many points are you planning on, Boss? I feel like both lists are relatively equal in hardness, though the lack of a slaughter master for the ogres is telling. And as you might find out, hunters, yhetees and leadbelchers are all fairly sub-standard choices in 8th. If you go the ogre route, I would take 1 or 2 of the 3, but not all 3 in one list, it's a bit too much concession IMO. The bret list seems to be missing a third real lance (7 grails aren't quite there for me) if it's above 2000, but double trebs usually means 2000+ to me so I can't quite judge.

On the army concepts, your bret one sounds much more convincing, with a functional build strategy and a pretty legit paint plan forming. Brets IMO also play a far more tactically interesting game than deathstar + friends ogres, though again I'm not sure based on your builds which is out and out better.

So I'm voting for the brets because of your family heraldry paint plan, less on the lists themselves or power levels or such.

- Salvage

I'm looking at 2500 points or there abouts. I think I left a unit of 30 men at arms out of my brettonian list.

Hrrrm. I don't really fancy a slaughtermaster in my ogres, it seems like a lot of points in Lords.
The Grails would have the prophetess and general in there, though tbh I was thinking it is a bit of a pointsink that could be nuked by those nasty number six spells going around these days. Chatting to some people about it, the heraldry idea is growing on me.
I also (thinking about it) think bretts are more interesting. Ogres have some bitchin' fluff. Hmmmm. Maybe I'll pick up a box of knights and bulls and see which I enjoy painting the most.
Thanks for the feedback guys. I feel I should do a P&M blog on what I decide anyhow (bout bloody time, I'm so lazy with these things).

7 GKs with a lord and a prophetess in there is begging for every tom dick and harry with a gun or bow to shoot at them. One good warp lightning cannon hit and that entire unit is down the drain as is your magic.

I like Ogres more. They're more lively and there's more room to develop them. Brettonnia is in dire need of an overhaul. Their fluff is underdeveloped and not really innovative. I just prefer the concept behind Ogres a lot more.

I like the Ogres because they get impact hits like chariots. Imagine an army of fat bastards that do half their damage by stomping and gut-butting their enemies! Priceless!!! If I were to do Ogres for WFB, I would most definitely invest in some rhinox cavalry, just for the coolness factor.

Cept rhinox cav isnt legal in 8th edtion unless you house rule it...

I too played brets, and since my Family has a scottish coat of arms (my Grandma has an authentic one on a preserved tapestry) they were really fun to paint.

Depends on what you like also, Ogres are a very brute force get in their face and crush them kind of army... While brets take A LOT of finesse, they are not a forgiving army in 8th edition.

I <3 ogres personally. i started out with a 2 battalion army... and then came across a 3rd battalion for 20 USD, so... yeah... I personally went with a 'sea ogre' theme, based around the supposed 'second maw' that exists off the coast of lustria (which I suppose means that my Ogres are thirsty rather than hungry, but whatever, damn water weight).

I too have strongly been considering river trolls, but considering that I already utilize non GW minis, I might just go with my original plan of gatormen.

It looks like would have quite a lot of fun painting the Bretonian heraldry and from your OP it seems a lot more thought has gone into the Bretonians than the Ogres. It sound to me that you would have a lot more fun with the Brets.

Heh heh, thanks for all the input guys! The poll is now deadlocked at 50/50.
I've decided to go for Brettonians, but that if I'm a good boy I can have a box of ogres to play with next november.
Thanks again!

Bwahahaha, broke the tie. I voted for the fatties, but I'm partial to them as they're just plain awesome. Your idea for the Brets sounds great through.

I voted for the chubby guys, too, but it was before reading your post. After, for what you want to do, I think brets will be cooler!

I'm just partial to the big boys

you can do both.

the 8th ed rules allow for multiple armies to be on the same side.

build up 2 legal forces for each side.


it is fluffy as ogres are THE original mercinaries.


Rhinox have a rule set from Forge world that MOST people will let you use and they were in a WD article untill some soreheads complained that Rhinox were OP in a book that, at the time, was THE worst book in existance.

and i can garuntee Rhinox will be in the new ogre book when it comes out sometime in the next couple years.