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Black Templar Missile Spam vs. Mech Rjack Wolves.

Pitched Battle
Seize Ground with 5 Objectives.

Practice for the upcoming Caomicaze Tournament run by Reecius. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/394584.page



Last Turn and Closing Thoughts



Thanks for watching!

That was a hell of a game, however I realized after watching that report that I made a mistake.

When I originally designed the list I had two packs of 5 Long Fangs and 4 Missile Launchers in each, and all of the Wolf Guard had Power Fists. I revised the list to get more ranged firepower by dropping the Power Fists on the Wolf Guard with the 5 Man packs in Razorbacks, and replacing them with another Long Fang in each pack. As a result, my 5 man pack that killed the Marshall should not have had the Power Fist that did the finishing blow.

That said, with what I rolled it should not have mattered that much. I only scored 1 hit and I rolled a 6 to wound, and I believe you failed the save on a 1, so the same result could have happened with standard attacks, but it was certainly a mistake on my part and that comes from not having my list typed out for a practice game like this, and the fact that the models I was using have Power Fists represented on the model. My win definitely has an asterisk next to it anyway, considering I was losing pretty solidly through turns 5 and 6, and was only able to pull it off in turn 7, and a mistake like that might have changed the way the game played out, especially if the Marshall survived while killing off the unit.

Sorry about that! I'll have the list typed out clearly next time we play, so that shouldn't happen again.

Saved at the last minute! What a barn burner. Space Wolves lucked out, but luck is all you need sometimes.

Well played by both players.

Yeah Dave had me solidly beat by the end of turn 5 and turn 6. Had it ended on either of those turns he would have won 1-0. Turn 7, combined with his inability to wreck my Land Raider which killed off his last scoring unit saved me. I learned a lot that game though, and it was good fun as usual.

Did you figure out the ATSKNF and heavy weapon bit?

I did not. I haven't had a whole lot of time to post today. I'll put that thread up tomorrow or Sunday, depending on when I have time.

Space Wolves for the win.

As much as I like Dave's list, it doesn't really have a solid foundation. 3x5 troops makes it a liability in multiple objectives-based missions, especially when it's going up against an army with good firepower as well but better troop resiliency. Now usually the extraordinary amount of firepower can overcome this weakness, but that is not always the case.

Oh, and cover saves for the win!

ATSKNF allows marines to fire heavy weapons when they rally, IIRC.

I posted that as a question in YMDC, so I am interested in seeing what people say. After having read over both of the rules in question again, I think you are right, but Mackie seems to have a different view of the situation and adamantly defends it. Yet another example vague rules writing that GW needs to fix in 6th edition.....as if we needed any more.

Marines with ATSKNF get super speed the turn they rally. They can move 3" and fire heavy weapons or they can move 3" then move 6" for their normal move and do terrible thing to your troops...

But that's not really what the rule says. If you read my thread in YMDC, it's basically come down to two sides.

One side says that the wording is clear, and that Space Marines get a free 3" move when they regroup, then can act as normal.

The other side has a bit more of a complex argument. The exact wording is this:

Usually troops that regroup cannot move normally and always count as moving whether they do or not, but these restrictions do not apply to models subject to this special rule

They believe that the wording essentially says "Space Marines do not ALWAYS count as having moved when they regroup," which is NOT the same as "Space Marines NEVER count as having moved when they regroup." It's a subtle difference, but it has a huge impact on how the rule is interpreted, and I think they have a point. The wording DOES appear to exclude the "always" but it does NOT appear to insert a "never."

In other words, if a normal model regroups, it ALWAYS counts as having moved whether it does or not, and it can only move 3". If a Space Marine regroups, it DOES NOT ALWAYS count as having moved whether it does or not, which is NOT to say that it NEVER counts as having moved. It may stay stationary and count as stationary (thus allowing it to fire heavy weapons), or it may move 3" for regrouping, and then it is allowed to move and act normally, but in either case if it moves at all, it counts as having moved.

At least that is what the other side is arguing, and as I said, I see their point. I think the INTENT is that it should be a free 3" for Space Marines, but that does NOT appear to be what the rule actually says, and it is worded ambiguously enough that I think it needs an FAQ. By the strict RAW, I feel that the safest interpretation is that they should count as having moved if they move the 3".

I understand the point you are making on this, and I read the YMDC before this battle report. That said, I have never seen it played that way in a casual game, RTT or GT. (of course that does not make it wrong).

That said, the rules discussion belongs in the YMDC section. The interpretation I provided is probably the most commonly accepted one. In my opinion this argument is right up there with insisting on wound allocation for dangerous terrain tests.

Fair enough. I figured it was relevant here because it came up in our game and played a part in the way I used my Long Fangs.

I think the bigger issue was me screwing up my list because my Wolf Guard all have Power Fists modeled on them. It might not have changed much in the grand scheme of things but it wouldn't be something I would want to happen in an actual tournament.

Hopefully Dave got the practice he needed and learned what worked and what didn't, because that was the point of the game anyway. My actual list mattered less than my ability to help him become more familiar with his against various opponents. Another friend of mine will be doing the same thing this Wednesday, so I'm sure we will see another battle report this week.