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Fulgrim - the Demonic possed Fulgrim or the 'real' Fulgrim ?
How will we know? By trusting Lucius? By trusting 'Fulgrim' ?
Seems there is no way to be sure....
All I could find in it was the confirmation of the noise marines as an early modification and a twist to the case of Fulgrim that isn't an improvement IMO.
At the end, mr narcisist plunders a mechanicum installation to build a city of mirrors, for obvious reasons..or?
Spoiler:
page 110:
'it will be bettewr than wondrous,' said Fulgrim, leaning down to kiss Lucius on each scarred cheek. 'For in the heart of its millions reflections I will meet the gaze of the Angel Exterminatus and the Galaxy will weep to behold its terrible beauty'.
Ferrus Manus - and another failed attempt of the Eldar to save their own butts...
Eldar try to convince the Gorgon to alter its path, the usual girly way. Note to Eldar of all kinds: subtle hints don't work, not men and surely no Primarch is going to get your point.
But there is more. A lesson. The iron Creed: the flesh is weak. And still , sometimes the weak will prevail where the seemingly strong cannot.
Spoiler:
The Eldar seers lure the Iron Hands into a trap, to separate their Primarch and use their illusions and visions to push Ferrus in a favorable direction. The Eldar are capable of blocking and controlling of the enhancements of the Iron Hands, bionics malfunctioning or worse, turning on the marines themselves. But there is the Imperial Army. Left behind and unrespected. Until the only way to beat the Eldar witches is to put faith in the normal humans, that they overcome what neutralizes the Iron Hands strength. Sure they die in droves. But they also achieve their missions goal and gain respect from the Iron Hands.
Ferrus however, has the long walk in the winding paths of the Eldars creation before he can re-unite with his sons.
Spoiler:
A beeing of chaos assails Ferrus, and there he :
page198:
...
perceived two words:
Angel...
Exterminatus....
'and the heavens burnt with its refulgent beauty'...
Ferrus hears about that Angel Exterminatus, a 'thing' we found in the story of Fulgrim too..
Didn't read further than the first two, so I'll have to wait and see if this name shows up in every story.
Spoiler:
page 174:
Monolithic statues lined its ascend, like the ones in the first cavern only much, much larger. Each one was wearing patrician robes, their hands across their chests, fingers laced in the shape of an aquila. Only their faces differentiated them. Totemic masks hid their true natures, or perhaps revealed them.
...
- it had a scalp of thrashing serpents, like the gorgon from mykenean myth.
...
- another had the skeletal aspect of death itself, hooded and gripping a scythe...
...
- two masks not one, gazed at the primarch...
....
- Ferrus saw an effigy of a bestial and snarling hound, and felt his anger rise as he passed it.
....
- Behind it was astoic drake, its crest a living flame.
....
- a heraldic knight stood alongside its much darker twin, one with a shields, the other a mace.
.....
- Leathern wings unfolded from the back of one statue. Its chiropteran mask was hard to discern from its human face, suggesting a singular lack of humanity.
....
- were others, a horse with a wild flowing mane,...
...
- a noble human countenance crowned by a laurel wreath,
...
- a lion beneath a monks cowl.
....
Statues of his brothers. But who are the knights?
Spoiler:
'Eldar 'diviner' at page 223:
Three times he had seen the exact same eventuality unfold. That in itself was remarkable.
' There is hope ' he muttered. ' in the Empire of the Battle King, he who would install a heir. Even if the Gorgon falls and fails to heed our warning, there is another who will listen, one who was lost.'
So who is this lost one, they consider willing to listen?
Target locked,ready to fire
In dedicatio imperatum ultra articulo mortis.
H.B.M.C :
We were wrong. It's not the 40k End Times. It's the Trademarkening.
Fulgrim - the Demonic possed Fulgrim or the 'real' Fulgrim ?
How will we know? By trusting Lucius? By trusting 'Fulgrim' ?
Seems there is no way to be sure....
The start of the story made me think that it was Fulgrim. Why would Fulgrim show the image of Ferrus to the Daemon to tug at his heart strings? Ferrus meant nothing to the Daemon but was a friend to Fulgrim..
1hadhq wrote:
Spoiler:
page 110:
'it will be bettewr than wondrous,' said Fulgrim, leaning down to kiss Lucius on each scarred cheek. 'For in the heart of its millions reflections I will meet the gaze of the Angel Exterminatus and the Galaxy will weep to behold its terrible beauty'.
Spoiler:
A beeing of chaos assails Ferrus, and there he :
page198:
...
perceived two words:
Angel...
Exterminatus....
'and the heavens burnt with its refulgent beauty'...
This is interesting and I am looking forward to finding out what it is.
1hadhq wrote:
Spoiler:
page 174:
Monolithic statues lined its ascend, like the ones in the first cavern only much, much larger. Each one was wearing patrician robes, their hands across their chests, fingers laced in the shape of an aquila. Only their faces differentiated them. Totemic masks hid their true natures, or perhaps revealed them.
...
- it had a scalp of thrashing serpents, like the gorgon from mykenean myth.
...
- another had the skeletal aspect of death itself, hooded and gripping a scythe...
...
- two masks not one, gazed at the primarch...
....
- Ferrus saw an effigy of a bestial and snarling hound, and felt his anger rise as he passed it.
....
- Behind it was astoic drake, its crest a living flame.
....
- a heraldic knight stood alongside its much darker twin, one with a shields, the other a mace.
.....
- Leathern wings unfolded from the back of one statue. Its chiropteran mask was hard to discern from its human face, suggesting a singular lack of humanity.
....
- were others, a horse with a wild flowing mane,...
...
- a noble human countenance crowned by a laurel wreath,
...
- a lion beneath a monks cowl.
....
Who do you think they are?
Ferrus
Mortarion
Alpharius/Omegon?
Angron/Russ?
Vulkan
Horus and Guilliman/Dorn?
Night Haunter
The Khan
Guilliman/Dorn?
The Lion
I also think Corax is mentioned and maybe Sanguinius?
1hadhq wrote:
Spoiler:
'Eldar 'diviner' at page 223:
Three times he had seen the exact same eventuality unfold. That in itself was remarkable.
' There is hope ' he muttered. ' in the Empire of the Battle King, he who would install a heir. Even if the Gorgon falls and fails to heed our warning, there is another who will listen, one who was lost.'
So who is this lost one, they consider willing to listen?
I know, maybe a hint to the unexpected assistance in Collected Visions - although I thought that this would possibly be Tarvitz and the Isstvann survivors.
I'm a bit surprised that people ahven't been more freaked out by a certain person, literally, losing their head in the tale.
Of course the actions that this person did later could of course have been carried out by either someone with the same name/named after them, or perhaps the presence of Fabius -- you know.. the Clonemaster -- might start earlier than we'd thought ?
The poor man really has a stake in the country. The rich man hasn't; he can go away to New Guinea in a yacht. The poor have sometimes objected to being governed badly; the rich have always objected to being governed at all
We love our superheroes because they refuse to give up on us. We can analyze them out of existence, kill them, ban them, mock them, and still they return, patiently reminding us of who we are and what we wish we could be.
"the play's the thing wherein I'll catch the conscience of the king,
I'm a bit surprised that people haven't been more freaked out by a certain person, literally, losing their head in the tale.
Of course the actions that this person did later could of course have been carried out by either someone with the same name/named after them, or perhaps the presence of Fabius -- you know.. the Clonemaster -- might start earlier than we'd thought ?
Maybe all agreed this person deserved It ?
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Pilau Rice wrote:
The start of the story made me think that it was Fulgrim. Why would Fulgrim show the image of Ferrus to the Daemon to tug at his heart strings? Ferrus meant nothing to the Daemon but was a friend to Fulgrim..
Spoiler:
In Ferrus story, he got attacked by a ?Demon? and this thing using Fulgrims face to unsettle Ferrus could show a certain interest of chaos in those two Primarchs. Plus the investment of the Eldar in valuable Eldar lives to alter the path of Ferrus would be another point towards some interest in Ferrus as it seems his existance can change the outcome.. if we believe Eldar seers.
Fulgrim was pushed to kill his BEST friend and then easily exorcises the creature that got him there. Really?
He lacked the will to undo Ferrus and gave in to the Demon. He also promised to Horus to bring Ferrus into the fold.
So he wasn't able to end his friend, nor was he able to sway him to the dark side. The Demon however was willing to act and even talking to Horus as 'Fulgrim that isn't Fulgrim' . Doesn't look like he had the power to free himself.
Teh 20 statues, of which 18 have a face:
Spoiler:
page 174:
...
- it had a scalp of thrashing serpents, like the gorgon from mykenean myth. Ferrus himself
...
- another had the skeletal aspect of death itself, hooded and gripping a scythe... mortarion
...
- two masks not one, gazed at the primarch... Alpharius and omegon
....
- Ferrus saw an effigy of a bestial and snarling hound, and felt his anger rise as he passed it. maybe Angron
....
- Behind it was astoic drake, its crest a living flame. Vulkan
....
- a heraldic knight stood alongside its much darker twin, one with a shields, the other a mace. still not sure..
.....
- Leathern wings unfolded from the back of one statue. Its chiropteran mask was hard to discern from its human face, suggesting a singular lack of humanity. Conny Curze
....
- were others, a horse with a wild flowing mane,... Jaghatai Khan
...
- a noble human countenance crowned by a laurel wreath, Rowboat Gullyman
...
- a lion beneath a monks cowl. Lion el'Johnson
....
Can't see an obvious choice for the 2 knightly ones. First I'd thought the one with a shield is Dorn, the other Perturabo..but this can't be??
Fulgrim is the last one he sees. So 11 are 'identified' and 2 are unknown, of 7 we don't get a description for.
Spoiler:
'Eldar 'diviner' at page 223:
Three times he had seen the exact same eventuality unfold. That in itself was remarkable.
' There is hope ' he muttered. ' in the Empire of the Battle King, he who would install a heir. Even if the Gorgon falls and fails to heed our warning, there is another who will listen, one who was lost.'
Pilau Rice wrote:
I know, maybe a hint to the unexpected assistance in Collected Visions - although I thought that this would possibly be Tarvitz and the Istvaan survivors.
The hint on the 'battle king' and his empire and a heir.
Spoiler:
Gulliman , Ultramar , Imperium secundus. But who was lost? And lost where?
Another tiny bit from story 2:
Spoiler:
page 196:
...But when his father came and brought him to seventeen remarkable brothers,...
17. Not 20. Possible that some never met brother 2 and 11?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/05/29 20:39:38
Target locked,ready to fire
In dedicatio imperatum ultra articulo mortis.
H.B.M.C :
We were wrong. It's not the 40k End Times. It's the Trademarkening.
Three times he had seen the exact same eventuality unfold. That in itself was remarkable.
' There is hope ' he muttered. ' in the Empire of the Battle King, he who would install a heir. Even if the Gorgon falls and fails to heed our warning, there is another who will listen, one who was lost.'
So who is this lost one, they consider willing to listen?
They call him Roboute Guilliman.
Guilliman’s arrival was a time of great omen for the people of Macragge. Konor, one of the two Battle Kings
I'm a bit surprised that people haven't been more freaked out by a certain person, literally, losing their head in the tale.
Of course the actions that this person did later could of course have been carried out by either someone with the same name/named after them, or perhaps the presence of Fabius -- you know.. the Clonemaster -- might start earlier than we'd thought ?
Maybe all agreed this person deserved It ?
Yeah, I was glad that he copped it personally But that is a good point Red, I thought though that after the KNF thing with Tarik it might be the same dealio with Eidolon. But that would make more sense knowing the story behind his cloning.
1hadhq wrote:
Spoiler:
In Ferrus story, he got attacked by a ?Demon? and this thing using Fulgrims face to unsettle Ferrus could show a certain interest of chaos in those two Primarchs. Plus the investment of the Eldar in valuable Eldar lives to alter the path of Ferrus would be another point towards some interest in Ferrus as it seems his existance can change the outcome.. if we believe Eldar seers.
Fulgrim was pushed to kill his BEST friend and then easily exorcises the creature that got him there. Really?
He lacked the will to undo Ferrus and gave in to the Demon. He also promised to Horus to bring Ferrus into the fold.
So he wasn't able to end his friend, nor was he able to sway him to the dark side. The Demon however was willing to act and even talking to Horus as 'Fulgrim that isn't Fulgrim' . Doesn't look like he had the power to free himself.
Yeah but the point here as well is, after seeing all this power and all this pleasure that Fulgrim could gain from getting his body back, he would want to fight for his body. If what he said is true, that he lulled the daemon into a false sense of security letting it take over his body and he knew that he could best it. It's a tricky one, but I think a Primarch could. The Daemon was a bit of a wuss, it got itself stuck in a sword after all
1hadhq wrote:
Spoiler:
'Eldar 'diviner' at page 223:
Three times he had seen the exact same eventuality unfold. That in itself was remarkable.
' There is hope ' he muttered. ' in the Empire of the Battle King, he who would install a heir. Even if the Gorgon falls and fails to heed our warning, there is another who will listen, one who was lost.'
Pilau Rice wrote:
I know, maybe a hint to the unexpected assistance in Collected Visions - although I thought that this would possibly be Tarvitz and the Istvaan survivors.
The hint on the 'battle king' and his empire and a heir.
Spoiler:
Gulliman , Ultramar , Imperium secundus. But who was lost? And lost where?
What I meant here was that it could mean one of the lost Primarchs, as in Collected Visions there is a part where, I think it's the Space Wolves, receive assistance from an unknown quarter, who they are is never mentioned. One of the Lost Legions, according to some of the fluff which I think was Rick Priestleys, said that one of the Lost Legions assisted in the Heresy and is the reason why they were eventually deleted from records rather than expunged as they had redeemed themselves in the eye of the Emperor. I'll see if I can find this again and will linky.
It's from the 40k Radioshow about half way through. Rick says that the missing Legions had done something terrible and were redeemed. Them being removed from records was their reward.
1hadhq wrote:Another tiny bit from story 2:
Spoiler:
page 196:
...But when his father came and brought him to seventeen remarkable brothers,...
17. Not 20. Possible that some never met brother 2 and 11?
This is a given, not all met them. I don't think Lorgar ever met them from what we know about the tale, he just feels affinity with them as they were his brothers and many of the ones still around have contempt for him.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/05/30 12:07:06
I hav'nt read these stories yet so all i have to go on is all you have quoted but i'll throw a theory out there for fun. Perhaps the one who is lost is Alpharius or Omegon, maybe at some point one or both will have a change of heart and try to stop the heresy, it would explain why the heresy failed. Because in Legion the future guaranteed horus a victory with the Alpha Legion on their side....but he does'nt win and we know that. I'm probably grasping at straws here but it's just a thought as to why they turned on the imperium "for the emperor" for apparently nothing. They also did listen to aliens. They turned and were lost but something has to happen.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2012/05/30 10:05:05
Made it through N°3 and wondering who kept an eye on thorpe so we don't have the DA stuck with a questionable short story.
'The Lion ( G.Thorpe )
Basically confirms what is already established in the former DA related fluff of the HH-series.
Not bad, as we may know which side he is on now. His own. No no , I didn't write that. Obviously he sides with.... the Imperium represented by him and .. wait.
I shall provide the end of the story first:
Spoiler:
page 324:
Iaxis and his device were safely stowed in the deepest holds of the Invincible Reason . Magellix station had been turned to molten slag and rubble in a few hours; nothing was left for any other Legion to claim.
....
' Gulliman is a misguided fool at best, and a traitorous dog at worst. '
He took a deep breath. ' I know that, but I would no sooner bend my knee to him than to Horus. Curze has the truth of it, but I was blinded by my anger. It has fallen to me to be the scale upon which history will be balanced. Every event has its counter, every brother has its equal. Curze seeks to sap my morale and the strength of my Legion with unending war. Such shall be the duty of the Dark Angels. Yes, they will be ready for the task. There will be no new Emperor, only a lifetime of war. My brothers will bleed each other dry, contesting for eternity until there can be no victor. No, not even him. There is only one Emperor, none is worthy of inheriting that mantle. I will ensure the Legiones Astartes destroy themselves before another matches the power upon Terra. That is true. Faced with the prospect of mutual annihilation, my brothers may come to terms. Horus will be forced to acknowledge the Emperor again, and Gulliman and the others will not usurp their true master.'
The Lion subscribed to the Imperium and the Emperors cause. To him, its not only Horus who wants to be Emperor instead of the Emperor...
The one he talks to and the future of the Legion:
Spoiler:
page 325:
......
and out of the shadows appeared a diminutive figure. It was no taller than the height of a man's knee, clad in an ebon robe, tiny and nimble black-gloved hands visible, but the rest of its body and face hidden in shadow. The diminutive creature looked up at the Lion and two coal-like glows briefly lit the inside of its hood.
' No , uits too important, ' said the Primarch. 'Even if what you say is true, I cannot return to Caliban yet. Come what may, I have to stop Horus and Gulliman.'
The small figure bowed its head, and the Lion did the same, his whisper full of sorrow.
' Yes, even if it costs me my Legion.'
The watchers are on-board and it seems the Lion is aware of the risk. That means a possible change when he finally returns to his home? His plans to tip the scales in favor of his image of the Imperium may or may not work as both of his brothers don't survive the Heresy...
One thing I'd like to see by FW:
Spoiler:
the Mastodon troop carrier , transporting 40 marines, protective power-fields and "quad-tracked". fits the naming convention and could be balanced without stepping on the toes of Land Raiders and rhinos.
The other two small bits to consider in this story is the loyality of the Iron Hands after the loss of their Primarch and the hint of the motivation of Typhus to follow his own path.
Spoiler:
The Iron Hands seem to act upon Gullimans orders, putting them close to this blue and iron coalition of the Eldar farseers vision in the 2nd story but IMO the fact its a mechanicum installation and the tattoo of a dragon on the Magos wrist may point to another possible story arc. Because the IH are adopting the codex but their ties to the priests of mars and the 'living metal' of Ferrus hands provides a darker path to take...
Callas Typhon, who deems it a good idea to insult a primarch and barely manages to keep his head on his shoulders for that,
shows us how far the command of the Primarchs is ingrained into the Astartes when he's immobilized by a command and has to rely upon 'the father' to free himself. The Lion is not his liege, but authority and the help of a few librarians make 2 warring groups of marines stop dead cold in their tracks. Additionally we are told the first captain of the Death Guard was a librarian himself, turning to 'the father' because of the distrust his Primarch Mortarion had for all psykers. Nikea seems a great success for chaos...
The story ran smoothly, a surprise after suffering the read of DL by mr thorpe, so IMO the Primarchs is not as bad as expected from the previews in the BL news&rumor thread. This time the Lion distrusted everyone, not like last time when he gave some guns to Perturabo.
Looking forward to n°4 and the possibility it doesn't surprise me as I couldn't resist to watch out where the storys will go before ordering the book.
So where is this "dark secret" now"?
Pilau Rice wrote:
One of the Lost Legions, according to some of the fluff which I think was Rick Priestleys, said that one of the Lost Legions assisted in the Heresy and is the reason why they were eventually deleted from records rather than expunged as they had redeemed themselves in the eye of the Emperor. I'll see if I can find this again and will linky.
It's from the 40k Radioshow about half way through. Rick says that the missing Legions had done something terrible and were redeemed. Them being removed from records was their reward.
Didn't hear of this before.
Interesting take but without Priestley active at GW... . chances are someone less able has a shot at the fate of these Legions and I'd prefer to keep it unknown instead of having it ruined.
Target locked,ready to fire
In dedicatio imperatum ultra articulo mortis.
H.B.M.C :
We were wrong. It's not the 40k End Times. It's the Trademarkening.
The Alpha legion playing alpha legion on the alpha legion...
Too many heads, confusion ensured..
No its not bad. Who is who is clear and I for one expected this move.
We get a "new" race and small glimpse of what could have been, if the AL just took from the xeno and stayed true to the Imperial truth...if truth exists that is.
Return of the space...."miners"...
Spoiler:
page 377:
'...is the site of existing clandestine operations, unknown to the rest of the Imperium.'
'xenos?'
'Indeed. The Demiurg are a spacefaring race that rarely enters imperial territory.'
'that at least explains why I never had heard of them.'
'Hostile?'.
'they are technologically advanced but seem to enjoy cordial relationships with other xenos cultures, several of which were eradicated during the great crusade,' the artisan told them.' Principally they are miners and traders.'
.....
' the interior cave systems and caverns of the asteroid house a small host of automated mining machines, harvesting rare and precious metals.'
....
'the Demiurg operate a hidden "shunt network" across our space. They use electromagnetic conveyer stations to propel ressource rich asteroids from the prospect fields to their xeno-clients homeworlds. It takes hundreds of years, but by the time the asteroid arrives in-system, the automated mining machines have excavated and processed the arranged shipment.'
'and no one has yet detected this?'
'We may be the first,' 'Imperial forces can't investigate every chunk of rock floating through the void between star systems.'
Cool. Asteroids is available in 40k.
The possibilities lost when the tools have to be denied:
Spoiler:
page 362:
'But the technology is..remarkable. Potentially even superior to the devices on Perditus.'
page 363:
'- alien tough it may be - could revolutionise the Imperium.It could secure our astrotelepathic network and the immeteorology of our trade routes.'
page 332:
'about the pylon array. The aether is in a state of calmness that I have never known. I reach out across it with my mind and my thoughts travel far, like a stone bounced across the glassy surface of a still pool.'
..
'You have prognostic abilities,' Omegon confirmed tightly.
'Yes my Lord,' Echion said.
'Enhanced in the presence of this xeno abomination?'
...
'Flowing more freely, from a becalmed source.'
'and what do you see?'
'The future my Lord, terrible and true.'
'your own?' Omegon asked.
'the Legions.'
'and..?'
'I fear we have taken a wrong turn my Lord,' the librarian said with a pained expression.' Or that we soon will. Our current path takes us to a dark place.'
Omegon nodded. He understoood all to well what Echion was saying.
3 points:
- the knowledge of some secrets isn't as limited as some think and the use of xeno tech not despised back in the days..
- the improvement a certain tech could bring was sacrificed to a cause which maybe never coming to bear fruit at all since we know the end.
- one of two may or may not alter the course ...
Spoiler:
page 415:
'A consequence Alpharius has used to further the Warmasters aims, ' Omegon informed the gathering.
'Upon building this technology in the Octiss system, and charging it with immaterial energies sapped from the Mechanicums psykers slave stock, we have succeded in eneveloping bordering regions in a communication blackout: Draconi, tiamath, chondax and the scellis-trelenya straits. We have not only restricted the White Scars Legion to the chondax system, which was Alpharius promise to Horus , but we have kept Jhagatai Khan veiled in ignorance. He is blind to the atrocities of civil war and deaf to Dorns commands to return. Without the great khan at the emperors side, the warmasters victory will be assured.'
the powerful tech used provides something no one can match, but it had to end?
Spoiler:
the twins listened to the Cabal and this new course seemed agreed on?
Now the story moving on, maybe its not both who commit to the wishes of the xeno alliance as the favorable outcome...?
- the AL interfered at Istvaan and helped the RG to escape... which isn't really a pro-Horus act...
- the AL stole the gene-samples and didn't share the real ones... again not so 100% pro-Horus..
- the AL took the xeno tech, but a twin decides its compromised and...releases the WS with its destruction maybe?
the whole doesn't sound like both follow Horus. There is also the accident of the cabal envoy.
We had Alpharius as primarch , as single primarch that is , for a while. Then it became a pair. Maybe one doesn't make it and the fact of the Hydra as a faceless entity wouldn't give any hint there ever were twins, so the authors are free to set a new course.
Didn't feel as bad as feared from first hints in the N&R thread. But maybe I am to easy to please, expect less?
Target locked,ready to fire
In dedicatio imperatum ultra articulo mortis.
H.B.M.C :
We were wrong. It's not the 40k End Times. It's the Trademarkening.
The Eldar have pinned their hope on the Lost. Potentially one of the two unknown Primarchs who are known as the 'Lost' and the Purged.
Whether this is the everyones friend Primarch or the Behinds the Scenes Schemer (See the star chart theories) remains to be seen.
It was nice to see some humanity and depth put into Ferrus Manus character.
Interesting moment from The Serpent Beneath
Spoiler:
I got the impression Omegon's hidden set of armor was the same as Alpharius' own armor and reading what he said. I take it Omegon is
going to dispose of Alpharius and run the Alpha Legion as himself and playing the role of Alpharius, so no one else in the legion knows Alpharius is gone.
Which raises questions galore to Omegon's motives. I get the impression they are looking for a 3rd way to out do Chaos and the Cabal vision of 40k.
Reflection Cracked
Spoiler:
Im not sure Fulgrim turning out to be Fulgrim has added to the setting or destroyed one of the big tales of woe moments. Maybe the next book Angel Exterminatus will put it into a sensible context. Although im not 100% convinced its all a daemonic lie.
The Lion
Spoiler:
The angels get Darker and Johnson's motives get murkier and just who the hell are the watchers in the dark really. Perhaps the rumoured the Fallen where the good guys was right all alone, lets see how this pans out.
A huge holy s**t moment when Johnson killed Nemiel, can honestly say i was shocked. The Libarian he saved, Asmodeus, isnt that the same Asmodeus who was the first interogator chaplain?
So then, does this mean that Fulgrim would have fallen to Chaos without a daemon pushing him, or has he simply been driven insane from living in the Warp? My theory on him getting rid of the daemon is that he made a deal with Slaanesh, which if so was probably Slaanesh's plan all along. Better than running the risk of Fulgrim possessing himself later on and turning against Chaos. Though I doubt it's the last appearance of the Laeran daemon.
Arguing with some people is like playing chess with a pigeon. You can play the best chess in the world, but at the end of the day the pigeon will still knock all the pieces off the board and then gak all over it.
The Eldar have pinned their hope on the Lost. Potentially one of the two unknown Primarchs who are known as the 'Lost' and the Purged.
Whether this is the everyones friend Primarch or the Behinds the Scenes Schemer (See the star chart theories) remains to be seen.
It was nice to see some humanity and depth put into Ferrus Manus character.
Interesting moment from The Serpent Beneath
Spoiler:
I got the impression Omegon's hidden set of armor was the same as Alpharius' own armor and reading what he said. I take it Omegon is
going to dispose of Alpharius and run the Alpha Legion as himself and playing the role of Alpharius, so no one else in the legion knows Alpharius is gone.
Which raises questions galore to Omegon's motives. I get the impression they are looking for a 3rd way to out do Chaos and the Cabal vision of 40k.
Reflection Cracked
Spoiler:
Im not sure Fulgrim turning out to be Fulgrim has added to the setting or destroyed one of the big tales of woe moments. Maybe the next book Angel Exterminatus will put it into a sensible context. Although im not 100% convinced its all a daemonic lie.
The Lion
Spoiler:
The angels get Darker and Johnson's motives get murkier and just who the hell are the watchers in the dark really. Perhaps the rumoured the Fallen where the good guys was right all alone, lets see how this pans out.
A huge holy s**t moment when Johnson killed Nemiel, can honestly say i was shocked. The Libarian he saved, Asmodeus, isnt that the same Asmodeus who was the first interogator chaplain?
Ref: The Lion, no its not the same guy, trying to remember but im sure that Admodi (diferent name im sure) was the oldest living interogator chaplain, just a guess but id put him at 800 years old
Im not sure Fulgrim turning out to be Fulgrim has added to the setting or destroyed one of the big tales of woe moments. Maybe the next book Angel Exterminatus will put it into a sensible context. Although im not 100% convinced its all a daemonic lie.
Does anyone know if Graham McNeil has been kidknapped/murdered, and replaced with a doppleganger who is exactly the same in every regard except minus writing ability? Presumably, whoever has done this also has a twisted sense of humour and has cunningly referenced McNeil's own plight in the contents of the story.
The 'Reflection Crack'd' was perhaps the worst book I have ever read as part of the Heresy series, short story or no. And yes that includes Battle for the Abyss - at least that book added something to the series. This short story actually chews up one of McNeil's previously lauded books and spits it out in a discharge of inconsistent characters, action that would make a copy of 50's comic 'Battle, for Boys' blush, and appalling, cringe-worthy dialogue.
I'm going to have to write a review on my blog at some point, but for now I'm still a little stunned about quite how bad it is and need to get my thoughts in order. Honestly, I don't know where to start with it.
Really, I have never said this before about any book that BL has produced, but if you haven't yet read it I would seriously consider skipping through the first story in the Primarchs anthology. I just can't reconcile it with the same author who wrote Mechanicum, A Thousand Sons and Fulgrim for that matter.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2012/06/17 21:12:41
Pacific wrote:
The 'Reflection Crack'd' was perhaps the worst book I have ever read as part of the Heresy series, short story or no. And yes that includes Battle for the Abyss - at least that book added something to the series. This short story actually chews up one of McNeil's previously lauded books and spits it out in a discharge of inconsistent characters, action that would make a copy of 50's comic 'Battle, for Boys' blush, and appalling, cringe-worthy dialogue.
I'm going to have to write a review on my blog at some point, but for now I'm still a little stunned about quite how bad it is and need to get my thoughts in order. Honestly, I don't know where to start with it.
Really, I have never said this before about any book that BL has produced, but if you haven't yet read it I would seriously consider skipping through the first story in the Primarchs anthology. I just can't reconcile it with the same author who wrote Mechanicum, A Thousand Sons and Fulgrim for that matter.
I enjoyed it, but then I disliked Fulgrim. I am glad that we have the actual Fulgrim and not a Daemon, well, if we are to take what occurred in Crack'd as gospel.
I'm assuming that the whole 'it's really Fulgrim' is to make his character more evil rather than just a Daemon, who are just evil anyway. Perhaps it's to make what happens with the civilian population of Terra during the siege more dramatic. I never understood why they went with the whole Dorian Gray angle and didn't just stick with the original turn of events. Merrett ballsed this up with the CCG.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/06/18 09:55:55
Sitting on the roof of my house with a shotgun, and a six pack of beers
Interesting moment from The Serpent Beneath
Spoiler:
My thinking about the second set of armour was that it was a loyalists armor, Omegon is clearly not singing from the same hymn sheet as Alpharius, and if it turned out that one of the Alpha legion primarch was actuall still loyal it would make a lot of their seemingly contradictory actions make sense
The 'Reflection Crack'd' was perhaps the worst book I have ever read as part of the Heresy series, short story or no. And yes that includes Battle for the Abyss - at least that book added something to the series. This short story actually chews up one of McNeil's previously lauded books and spits it out in a discharge of inconsistent characters, action that would make a copy of 50's comic 'Battle, for Boys' blush, and appalling, cringe-worthy dialogue.
IMHO Bit harsh but agree with the sentiment, Fulgrim went from being a classical tradgic hero to just another douche
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"If we hit that bullseye, the rest of the dominoes should fall like a house of cards. Checkmate!" Zapp Brannigan
My thinking about the second set of armour was that it was a loyalists armor, Omegon is clearly not singing from the same hymn sheet as Alpharius, and if it turned out that one of the Alpha legion primarch was actuall still loyal it would make a lot of their seemingly contradictory actions make sense
I would like to add my thoughts to that spoiler
Spoiler:
I have the feeling that Omegon isn't actually loyal at all. There are a couple of ways that this could be going that i think are being overlooked by some. Firstly, The blue armor may be Ultramarine armor. Why? well, apparently the Ultra's refute that they were ever at [the place where Guilliman killed Alpharius] Was it actually a civil war between the Alpha Legion, where half of them were disguised as the Ultramarines, with Omegon playing the part of Guilliman? Also, because there is already a plain set of armor in his own legions colors. The line about "let me be the serpent beneath.." to me either says that he either wants to be the one to go after Guilliman, or he wants to take out Alpharius himself. This would also explain why Guilliman attacked the Alpha's like they did, which in some ways seems counter-intuitive to what Roboute would do. Unlikely? Yes. Impossible? No.
Secondly, Omegon, to me, seems like he is doing just enough to ensure a near stalemate. Could the 3rd acuity be that the Emperor and Horus both die, causing 40k as we know it? While Alpharius seems to be intent on having Horus win, thus causing the collapse of the Chaos powers which in my mind is more loyal than Omegon trying to have Horus lose which would cause Chaos to fluorish as it has (seems very traitor to me)
But that is a good point Red, I thought though that after the KNF thing with Tarik it might be the same dealio with Eidolon. But that would make more sense knowing the story behind his cloning.
and it seems the Lion is aware of the risk. That means a possible change when he finally returns to his home? His plans to tip the scales in favor of his image of the Imperium may or may not work as both of his brothers don't survive the Heresy...
