Mantic Games Dreadball 2 Kickstarter - finished at $183,853

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**DaveC**

Kickstarter link

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1744629938/dreadball-the-futuristic-sports-game-2/description

https://manticblog.com/2016/06/10/dreadball-goes-close-season/

The new edition update will address:

- Enhanced Game Play – Faster to play, simpler to learn and easier to collect, the new edition will streamline 6 seasons worth of rules, FAQ and errata without losing any of the soul of original DreadBall.
- A New League System – built from the ground up, offering unprecedented options for team building
- Improvements based on your feedback – Reworking Jacks, Giants and MVPs to become central to the game are high on our priority list!
-Balanced Teams – each team will have a unique play-style and will be fairly balanced for competitive gaming.

DreadBall 2nd Edition will be spearheaded by a new 2nd Edition core game, which will include the new rulebook, an up-sized pitch and two new teams. The tooling and production will be funded on a simple, short Kickstarter in July, which also builds awareness of its retail launch in 2017. You’ll get updated rules for every team and Dreadball Ultimate will also get the 2nd edition treatment.

Before anyone gets worried about all their beautiful teams getting discontinued – the focus is on the rules and balance – and while we will add a couple of new teams to the core game (which will come as 1 piece figures to open the game up to a wider market) all the teams will be valid with the next edition. We just want to sort out the rules, make those improvements and get it growing all over again.

**overtyrant**

Yawn. So they make a mess out of DZ1 and DB1 and have to go back to KS to sort it out. I have lost a LOT of faith with Mantic.

**scarletsquig**

Dreadball v1 wasn't a mess and was very successful, and is still great fun to play.

At this point it's a case of the game having expanded a little too much, too quickly and needing to consolidate all of the expansions into a single book, as well as carefully fine-tuning what is already there.

Closer to what happened with Kings of War v2, that wasn't a broken system in v1, it just needed some refinement and careful game balance to turn it into the excellent, really well-polished game that is v2.

There won't be sweeping changes to the rules or lots of new teams released, just a case of polishing the game and tidying it up, at the moment the rules and army lists are spread across 8 different books which isn't great.

**overtyrant**

DBV1 was a mess, 6 seasons and what 24(?) teams. As you say to much to quickly. Teams were not balanced enough and it got to the point of.....that team does what now? Just seems at this point absolutely pointless to back a Mantic KS first time round as they will be back on KS to 'tidy up' the rules!

**decker_cky**

All the changes sound great, but this didn't need to be kickstarted.

**Polonius**

decker_cky wrote:
All the changes sound great, but this didn't need to be kickstarted.

That's my gut take, but given that it's basically a perorder system at this point, there's no real reason for Mantic not to do it.

**decker_cky**

Traction in gaming stores isn't a thing anymore? I know a few stores that got burned on Dreadball that likely won't buy in after all the people really interested in the game back the kickstarter.

**TheWaspinator**

My big question is: backwards compatibility for pitches?

**AlexHolker**

If the boxed game has two teams I want in a material that is not crap, I'll look at it. But I'm not holding my breath.

**CptJake**

I would expect them to use board game type plastic like are using for Walking Dead.

**OrlandotheTechnicoloured**

DB v1 was and is fun (baring the odd team) so I'm disappointed to see them heading back to KS with it so soon

now if they wanted to actually make a game out of the ugly step child of dreadball extreme I might have got behind it

**adamsouza**

Dreadball was a 2012 game. This is a Kickstarter to consolodate 8 books worth of rules, rebalance teams, create a new bigger pitch, and new plastic minis to be released 5 YEARS later. I'm not seeing a problem with this.

I'd have been thrilled for a New Edition of Bloodblowl every 5 years that came with new a pitch and miniatures.

**TheWaspinator**

2012 to 2017 is a pretty good span, yeah. It gets a little worse depending on how you count Dreadball Extreme, though.

**timetowaste85**

Also, as to the point of it: new plastic toys. All your old models are still good, just a new book to go with it. 5 years for a new edition isn't awful. I would see it as a bad thing only if you were forced to ditch your old teams. Personally, all my extreme stuff is sitting in a box, doing nothing. I tried to get traction for the game, and my friends went for guildball. So I'm probably sitting this one out. Not for being burned by Mantic, but friends with zero interest.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, as to the point of it: new plastic toys. All your old models are still good, just a new book to go with it. 5 years for a new edition isn't awful. I would see it as a bad thing only if you were forced to ditch your old teams. Personally, all my extreme stuff is sitting in a box, doing nothing. I tried to get traction for the game, and my friends went for guildball. So I'm probably sitting this one out. Not for being burned by Mantic, but friends with zero interest.

**JoshInJapan**

I finally managed to generate some interest locally. Hopefully none of my DB stuff (pitches specifically) will be made completely obsolete by a new edition.

**highlord tamburlaine**

Color me curious at the very least.

I always wanted to try DB, so went in for a fair chunk with DBX, as my family is far more interested in violence than they are in sportsmanship.

We have yet to play a single game, and own a fair amount of teams across us.

If it makes things as smooth as the new Deadzone rules, I'd give it a shot.

Hopefully Mantic doesn't overdo it in terms of stretch goals and promises for things that don't come to fruition (DUNGEON SAGA GAME BOOKS, I'M LOOKING AT YOU.)

**Azazelx**

What and when was the last Dreadball expansion actually delivered to backers?

**rabidaskal**

I'll wait for retail then decide. Only because i like to know what I'm getting, and as I understand when Mantic ran a KS to fix up the DZ rules, the end product was very rather different from what was described in the KS.

Not saying that this was necessarily BAD (i hear DZ 2.0 is good) but as a process i just don't have the time to follow games that closely anymore.

**TheWaspinator**

I'll probably go for retail, too. We might miss out on an exclusive mini or two, but I've gotten a little too soured on KS.

**highlord tamburlaine**

Deadzone didn't end up all that different than what they had originally set out to fix- at least in my eyes.

The fact that they're going to go back and tighten things up with Dreadball, as they have with Deadzone and Kings of War, at least gives me a glimmer of hope that Dungeon Saga's more ambitious parts might someday see a good revision (or at least a strong fleshing out).

**Azazelx**

It just annoys me that the revised DS rules will be a kickstarter with all of the same ridiculousness in order to get tighter rules and what should have been/was promised for the Adventurer's Guide in the first place. Proofreading notwithstanding.

**jimf747**

Another kickstarter, well i'm sure mantic must have a lot of data from the previous ones that shows they have a core group of fans who will back whatever game they put out ( I don't mean that in a bad way). Maybe they feel they don't need an LGS to sell there products when they can go right to the gamers themselves.

**lord_blackfang**

scarletsquig wrote:
At this point it's a case of the game having expanded a little too much, too quickly and needing to consolidate all of the expansions into a single book, as well as carefully fine-tuning what is already there.

Closer to what happened with Kings of War v2, that wasn't a broken system in v1, it just needed some refinement and careful game balance to turn it into the excellent, really well-polished game that is v2.

Funny that you didn't mention Deadzone, that was the exact sales pitch for DZ2 too but you obviously know that none of that was delivered.

**scarletsquig**

That's why I didn't mention Deadzone, that game needed a rework from the ground up because it was dead in the water 6 months after release, whereas Deadzone v2 is getting a lot more interest.

It's true that the Infestation Kickstarter was pitched as a minor update to the rules rather than a second edition. I would hope the same route isn't taken with Dreadball since it is still being played and has a healthy tournament scene. Basically everyone wants them not to mess around with things too much, there have been ides floated around like a move to d8's that have overwhelmingly been shut down by pretty much everyone who plays. d6 works with hexes and makes the game very approachable.

**lord_blackfang**

I think if Mantic were serious about re-balancing they could just publish a living team registry. But in view of previous campaigns I expect there to be enough changes that any previous play experience is rendered meaningless, thus team balance will have to be playtested again from scratch, thus not accomplishing any damn thing, and it'll be printed in hardcopy, so necessitating another rebalance project a few years down the road. KOW got away with it because of the insanely dedicated RC and several months of public testing, DZ did not, DB will not.

**Thraxas Of Turai**

I enjoyed what I played of DB1, but will be waiting for retail. Mantic are making huge improvements with their board game material but their customer service and fulfillment record still seems like a borderline joke if any of the multitude of DZ Infestation complaints are anything to go by.

**jorny**

What dreadball really needs is a good quick start guide. The current rulebook is not that easy to understand and it is making playing the first game unnecessarily complicated. Reference sheets for actions is also sorely needed. I haven't played it much because of this, since it makes it a lot harder to entice casual gamers like my girlfriend to play it.

I hope they release a cheap rulebook so you can use your old game.

**Thebiggesthat**

Kickstarter? From Mantic?

Sure it'll be well run, well communicated, and won't hurt FLGS at all.

**Psychopomp**

As I posted on the Mantic blog, my participation in this KS depends on three criteria:

1) I want a simple, rules + the absolutely necessary accessories update bundle for current owners.

2) I want either backwards compatibility for my existing pitch, or have any new pitch included in the update bundle listed above.

3) I have to be made confident that Mantic will include rules for the Martian team early on, given the fuzziness of where they stand with that license. I bought two boxes of that team, I enjoy playing it, and it's my main team. I don't want to have to sit waiting for the Martian rules after the Kickstarter arrives like I am with DZ 2.0. (Martians were my main DZ 1.0 force, too.)

If these criteria are met, sure, I'll toss in to update my core set. But otherwise...man, DB has been idle on my shelf for so long, it won't kill me to wait til retail...to make the decision whether or not to bother updating.

**Kirasu**

decker_cky wrote:
All the changes sound great, but this didn't need to be kickstarted.

Why not? Kickstarter is a great way for people who *will* buy the game to get it at a discount + free models. I'd love for all board games to be kickstaters (assuming they don't screw up the shipping).