If i put all my units into 7 drop pods 4 of them arrive at the begining of my first turn.
In that scenario, if i get to go second, my oponent does not have ant thing to shoot in the first turn. He can just move his units, and that is is?

Incorrect.
You must have at least half of your army fielded on the board.
I'll get back to you on the page number...

EDIT: Got it.
Page 124 in the small rulebook.
Under "Preparing Reserves" at the bottom of the page.

Only half of your units (rounding up) can be in reserve.
Not counting units that MUST start in reserve and units with a dedicated transport count as one unit. (Tactical marines in a drop pod are one unit, for example.)

Units that have to start in reserves though, Drop Pods, Fliers, LotD, Marbo etc do not count towards the number of units that can be held in reserve.

Drop pod assault states, i have to deploy half of my forces at the start of my first turn.

Dont pods remove that requirement?
Anything in a pod doesnt count towards the on-the-table limit.

 Pyriel- wrote:
Dont pods remove that requirement?
Anything in a pod doesnt count towards the on-the-table limit.

No, not to my knowledge.

BRB FAQ: http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m3440036a_40K_RULEBOOK_v1.5_September_13.pdf

Q: Do units that are transported in a vehicle that MUST start in reserve count towards the number of units that can be placed in Reserves? For example, must I count the units in a Drop Pod or Valkyrie towards the 50% of units I can place in Reserves? (p124)
A: No.

{Edit}Also, since noone seems to be answering the OP, your opponent gets their turn, which they can use to move, cast psychic blessings, run, JSJ in the assault phase and anything else that they want to do. Having no targets will limit their shooting phase obviously, but there are no additional restrictions because you're not there yet.

Isn't there. Rule in sixth now that says if you have no models on the board at anytime now you lose?

Only at the end of a game turn, meaning if the podding player goes second, the pods all come down on his first turn, before the end of said game turn.

----------------------------------------------
Related FAQ:
Q: Do units that are transported in a vehicle that MUST start in reserve count towards the number of units that can be placed in Reserves? For example, must I count the units in a Drop Pod or Valkyrie towards the 50% of units I can place in Reserves?
(p124)
A: No
----------------------------------------------

Ninja'ed....

No, the rule if at the end of any GAME TURN a player has no models on the board, that player loses automatically.

Also, a 100% Drop list is still legal.

Any unit that is in a transport that MUST start in reserve, i.e. Flyer transport, Drop Pods, Mycetic Spores etc. DO NOT count towards the number of units that can be placed in reserve.

dang, Ninja'd TWICE!!
I type slow :(

 Pyriel- wrote:
Dont pods remove that requirement?

Yes, they absolutely do. Page 36 (the Deep Strike rule) tells us, "When working out how many units can be placed in reserve, units that must be deployed by Deep Strike (along with any models embarked upon them) are ignored."

If all of your units are embarked upon Drop Pods at the beginning of the game, you have no units for the purpose of calculating reserves.

Ok, and in a drop pod list, any non-drop pod unit must be deployed as normal? Eg. If i want to deploy three Predator. Should 2 of them start on the table, and one of them can start in reserves?or can i put all of them in reserves?

gausus wrote:
Ok, and in a drop pod list, any non-drop pod unit must be deployed as normal? Eg. If i want to deploy three Predator. Should 2 of them start on the table, and one of them can start in reserves?or can i put all of them in reserves?

Drop Pods and the units embarked upon them are ignored when calculating Reserves. According to the Reserves rule (p 124) you can choose not to deploy up to half your units, rounding up.

In this particular case, you would have only three Predators for the purpose of calculating Reserves, so you could put up to two of them in Reserves.

Half rounding up in reserves. So 2 of the Preds can be in reserve with one starting the game on the table and drawing the fire of any and everything that has range and LOS.

Q: Do units that are transported in a vehicle that MUST start in reserve count towards the number of units that can be placed in Reserves? For example, must I count the units in a Drop Pod or Valkyrie towards the 50% of units I can place in Reserves? (p124)
A: No.

====

Your HQ units do not have the "Must start in reserves." So, a list with 2 HQ and all other units bought pods, then 1 HQ must start on the board and the other may start in reserves.

The HQs embarked in pods must start in reserves.
So an all drop pod, null deployment list is absolutely fine.

rigeld2 wrote:
The HQs embarked in pods must start in reserves.
So an all drop pod, null deployment list is absolutely fine.

I think the argument can be that HQs don't have dedicated transports, so they are not embarked in a drop pod by default.

I know they have the option to join a Command Squad that can take a drop pod, so that might still cover them that way though.

HQs don't need to have to be in the pods, as long as they've joined the squad in it and are thus transported by a unit that has to deepstrike you're good to go.


Edit: I'm expressing myself horrendously , but I meant that it doesn't matter whether or not the pod is the HQ's dedicated transport.

 d-usa wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:
The HQs embarked in pods must start in reserves.
So an all drop pod, null deployment list is absolutely fine.

I think the argument can be that HQs don't have dedicated transports, so they are not embarked in a drop pod by default.

I know they have the option to join a Command Squad that can take a drop pod, so that might still cover them that way though.

The tac squads aren't embarked by default either - you have the option.

rigeld2 wrote:

 d-usa wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:
The HQs embarked in pods must start in reserves.
So an all drop pod, null deployment list is absolutely fine.

I think the argument can be that HQs don't have dedicated transports, so they are not embarked in a drop pod by default.

I know they have the option to join a Command Squad that can take a drop pod, so that might still cover them that way though.

The tac squads aren't embarked by default either - you have the option.

But they can take them as a dedicated transport.

But there is no HQ option that can take them as a dedicated transport.

Don't know if the dedicated transport makes a difference, just throwing it out there.

Q: Do units that are transported in a vehicle that MUST start in reserve count towards the number of units that can be placed in Reserves? For example, must I count the units in a Drop Pod or Valkyrie towards the 50% of units I can place in Reserves? (p124)
A: No.

No mention that it only applies to dedicated transports.

Dedicated Transport has absolutely *NOTHING* to do with it. You can declare the IC joined to a unit in reserve as well - thereby putting them in a pod at which point they are ignored for working out the 50%.

So, to sum up - if your list is in 100% pods you can reserve it all and you won't lose because you'll have pods down by the end of game turn 1. What you can also do - because the reserves limitation is rounded up - is have but a single unit that doesn't HAVE to be held in reserve, and still reserve it anyway.

 d-usa wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:

 d-usa wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:
The HQs embarked in pods must start in reserves.
So an all drop pod, null deployment list is absolutely fine.

I think the argument can be that HQs don't have dedicated transports, so they are not embarked in a drop pod by default.

I know they have the option to join a Command Squad that can take a drop pod, so that might still cover them that way though.

The tac squads aren't embarked by default either - you have the option.

But they can take them as a dedicated transport.

But there is no HQ option that can take them as a dedicated transport.

Don't know if the dedicated transport makes a difference, just throwing it out there.

It doesn't make a difference. The only special thing about dedicated transports is that the units that can begin the game embarked on them are limited. (Some SRs confer to dedicated transport, but that's the exception rather than the rule)

 Ond Angel wrote:
Incorrect.
You must have at least half of your army fielded on the board.

Only half of your units (rounding up) can be in reserve.
Not counting units that MUST start in reserve and units with a dedicated transport count as one unit. (Tactical marines in a drop pod are one unit, for example.)

you hit it right on the head their sir. not counting units that MUST start in reserves witch droppods do so this is Correct.
as i do use this alot. even up to as much as 13droppods

where does it say end of game turn, not player turn, for having to have at least one model on the table?

 easysauce wrote:
where does it say end of game turn, not player turn, for having to have at least one model on the table?

In the same sentence where it says that you lose if you have nothing on the table at the end of a turn.

 easysauce wrote:
where does it say end of game turn, not player turn, for having to have at least one model on the table?

If i had the BRB on me i would show you. me and my local GW manager looked it up and it says if no enemy models are on the bored by the end of your opponents game turn you win.
But 1/2 your droppods come in t1 automatically
try looking under alternate ways to win or such i think we found it. under tabling or something.

 easysauce wrote:
where does it say end of game turn, not player turn, for having to have at least one model on the table?

Pg122, paragraph above objectives

 Orkimedezz wrote:

If i had the BRB on me i would show you. me and my local GW manager looked it up and it says if no enemy models are on the bored by the end of your opponents game turn you win..

There is no such thing as an 'opponent's game turn'.

Each player has a player turn. When both player turns are completed, that's the end of the game turn.

You lose if you have nothing on the board at the end of the game turn, not the end of your player turn.

An IC always counts as a seperate unit when calculating what can start in reserves. You can put everything in drop pods, but you cannot add any IC's to those things, or fliers, as per page 124 in the BRB.

Most people don't know about this, and to drive the point home the adepticon and nova FAQ's have a specific FAQ telling you that you can do this legally, but you can't as per the rulebook, mostly because they only FAQ things they want to, the way they want to at the time.

 juraigamer wrote:
An IC always counts as a seperate unit when calculating what can start in reserves. You can put everything in drop pods, but you cannot add any IC's to those things, or fliers, as per page 124 in the BRB.

Most people don't know about this, and to drive the point home the adepticon and nova FAQ's have a specific FAQ telling you that you can do this legally, but you can't as per the rulebook, mostly because they only FAQ things they want to, the way they want to at the time.

The IC is a separate unit for those calculations.
The IC is embarked on a transport that must start in Reserves.
Therefore the separate IC unit does not count towards the total.

It's the actual rules.

It says it on the page specified. An IC is always counted as a separate unit, even if it joins a unit. 9 tacticals and an attached IC is 1 unit reserve, that needs 1 unit on the table to legally play.

 juraigamer wrote:
It says it on the page specified. An IC is always counted as a separate unit, even if it joins a unit. 9 tacticals and an attached IC is 1 unit reserve, that needs 1 unit on the table to legally play.

He absolutely counts as a separate unit.
Is that unit embarked on a transport that must start in Reserves?

What page is the "no units on table = victory" rules on?
I'm a bit pissed and cannot remember.

 Kommissar Kel wrote:
What page is the "no units on table = victory" rules on?
I'm a bit pissed and cannot remember.

122 iirc

 juraigamer wrote:
An IC always counts as a seperate unit when calculating what can start in reserves. You can put everything in drop pods, but you cannot add any IC's to those things, or fliers, as per page 124 in the BRB.

Yes, an Independent Character counts as a separate unit when calculating what can start in Reserves. However, the Deep Strike special rule (p 36) modifies the basic rules: "When working out how many units can be placed in reserve, units that must be deployed by Deep Strike (along with any models embarked upon them) are ignored." If the IC is embarked upon a Drop Pod, it's not part of the calculation for determining how many units can start in reserve.

I'm not sure where you're getting the idea that you can't add ICs to units embarked upon transports in reserve. It's certainly not on page 124. In the last paragraph of the first column, we are told that we may join ICs to units in reserve and that we may embark units upon transports in reserve. The rules for ICs joining a unit can be found under the Independent Character special rule (p 39), where we are told that an IC joined to a unit counts as part of that unit for "all rules purposes." That means that they can embark upon transports (and even dedicated transports) with the units they are joined to. Unless I'm misunderstanding you, page 124 seems to say the opposite of what you're claiming.

Once a unit in reserve and any attached ICs are embarked upon a Drop Pod, the unit and the ICs cease to exist for the purpose of calculating what may be kept in reserve. The Deep Strike rule is clear on that.

Flyers are a different story. Unless there's a rule I have missed, flyers are ignored for the purpose of calculating reserves, but the models embarked upon them are not. A unit with an IC joined to it would count as two units when calculating the number of units that may be kept in reserve.

Youngblood13,

The last page of the Basic Rule Book's Frequently Asked Questions states that any model on a transport that must begin in reserves do not count towards the total. A flyer is even brought up as one of the examples of a transport that must begin in reserve, so it is hard to state that flyers where not intended with this Frequently Asked Question and answer. As these are meant to clarify the rules, though honestly I have my doubt over how well the Frequently Asked Questions do that, it does mean any unit which begins on a transport in reserves does not count towards the reserve limit regardless if it is a dedicated transport, one that starts with deep strike or any other factor concerning said transportation.

The last page of the Basic Rule Book's Frequently Asked Questions states that any model on a transport that must begin in reserves do not count towards the total. A flyer is even brought up as one of the examples of a transport that must begin in reserve, so it is hard to state that flyers where not intended with this Frequently Asked Question and answer. As these are meant to clarify the rules, though honestly I have my doubt over how well the Frequently Asked Questions do that, it does mean any unit which begins on a transport that must begin in reserves does not count towards the reserve limit regardless if it is a dedicated transport, one that starts with deep strike or any other factor concerning said transportation.

I fixed that for you. Transports that can begin in reserve but may also begin on the table (such as rhinos and land raiders) most certainly do count towards the limit.

Thank you for that, indeed it was an oversight.

JinxDragon,

I must have read that entry four or five times and never noticed the Valkyrie example. Thanks!

I agree completely about FAQs sometimes confusing things. In this case, what I would have liked to see was errata or an addendum that modified the language on page 124, akin to the parenthetical under the Deep Strike entry, but what can you do?

The fact the Valkyrie was tacked on as an example, one which doesn't fit the question very well or the rules prior to this question, makes me feel as if the person answering it was manipulated into providing an answer without realizing how far reaching that answer would be. There are several ways to load a question, and not all of them are designed to present only two negative outcomes, after all. Some loaded questions are designed to get the answer you want, even if it might not be the correct one. I keep getting the feeling about this particular answer, that it was loaded in order to make it easier for flyer based lists to start with a higher end number of units in reserve then would otherwise be allowed.

So I too would of liked to see it as errata, or at least explained in more details then just a simple 'no.' It feels rushed and makes me wonder if the answer even took the examples into account, or if they where simply focusing on the 'must begin in reserve' part of the question. Yet because the example included a flyer that was clearly not a dedicated transport, it expanded on the existing rule to include things that would otherwise have not been covered.

Defiantly something that should of been explained with errata or the very least more then a single word answer!

ignore this~ dem mods

The deep strike rules do not override the more specific IC rules regarding reserves as listed on page 124. It doesn't matter if the other passage says anything unless it is as specific as well. The deep strike rules on page 36 are just that, the deep strike rules. Page 124 deals with reserves.

 juraigamer wrote:
The deep strike rules do not override the more specific IC rules regarding reserves as listed on page 124. It doesn't matter if the other passage says anything unless it is as specific as well. The deep strike rules on page 36 are just that, the deep strike rules. Page 124 deals with reserves.

What are you addressing here? It's not clear.

IC attached to a 5 man C: SM unit in a Drop Pod. How many units does that count as - 1 or 0?

Counts as 0 units in reserve, 1 if it had attached IC. Page 124.

Actually 2
But since they both are embarked on a transport, they count as zero when we have to determine the maximum you can Reserve.

Kangodo wrote:
Actually 2
But since they both are embarked on a transport that must start in reserve, they count as zero when we have to determine the maximum you can Reserve.

Fixed that for you .

Juraigamer: If a model/unit is embarked on a transport that must start in reserve (Flyers, Drop Pods, etc.) the model/unit is not counted towards the number of units that can begin in Reserve.


So if an IC is attached to a unit that has a transport that does need to start in reserve they are counted as three units towards the max reserves. Example: SM Captain + Tactical Squad + Rhino.
If an IC is attached to a unit that has a transport that must start in reserve they are counted as zero units toward the max reserves. Example: SM Captain + Tactical Squad + Dreadnought + Stormraven.

Note that it does not matter if the transport is a dedicated transport. Only that it must start in reserve.

 juraigamer wrote:
The deep strike rules do not override the more specific IC rules regarding reserves as listed on page 124. It doesn't matter if the other passage says anything unless it is as specific as well. The deep strike rules on page 36 are just that, the deep strike rules. Page 124 deals with reserves.

Nobody is saying that they do.

Yes, the IC counts as a separate unit when declaring Reserves. However, as per the rules for models in vehicles that must start in reserve, so long as he is in such a vehicle he is a separate unit that doesn't count towards the total units in reserve.

The rules conflict. Generally models starting in reserve and the model in them don't count towards the reserve limit, but it's specifically stated on page 124 that IC's always count as a separate unit. Always. Regardless of what page 36 says.

It even goes into further detail stating they always count as a single unit even if they join another unit.

As far as I can tell, the part about IC's always counting takes precedence over the general "models in vehicle that must start in reserve don't count"

I'm not arguing about page 36, I'm stating page 124 is being ignored when dealing with attached IC's.

It even mentions "a unit and it's dedicated transport" when discussing what counts towards the limit.

Finally it doesn't matter what page 39 says about independent characters, because of the part about them counting as a separate unit, regardless of joining.

The math is quite simple for this. Tactical + IC + drop pod equals three units in reserves but the deepstrike rules supported by an FAQ says you now multiply that whole thing by ZERO. (1+1+1)X 0 equals Zero.

It doesn't matter that they are a separate unit, the question is are they embarked on a transport that must start the game in reserve?

Yes, ICs always count as a separate unit for calculating reserves, but so long as they are embarked upon a transport that must start the game in reserves they are not counted as a unit in reserves making an all drop pod/flyer list possible. This is established in the BRB.

It was pretty clear before, but the FAQ has since laid the issue to rest without question.

BRB FAQ 1.5 Pg10

Q: Do units that are transported in a vehicle that MUST start in
reserve count towards the number of units that can be placed in
Reserves? For example, must I count the units in a Drop Pod or
Valkyrie towards the 50% of units I can place in Reserves?
(p124)
A: No.

Is an IC attached to a unit in a Drop Pod, a vehicle that must start the game in reserves, counted towards the number of units that can be placed in Reserves?

No

Dead. Horse. Beat.

Juraigamer, you're still missing the point. There is no conflict. The rules say that ICs always count as a separate unit for reserves. They don't say that they always count towards the number of units that you can have in reserves.

Yes, the IC is a separate unit. But that won't matter if another rule says not to count him towards your reserves total.

A Dalmatian is always a separate kind of dog to a Bull Terrier... But if you're only counting dogs that don't have short hair, you're still never going to count the Dalmatian.

Fine whatever guys, It's like no one reads the rulebook, only quotes others and FAQ's.

I'm still sticking with the facts of what page 124 says makes a full reserve impossible unless you don't have any IC's. Regardless (as it says)

 juraigamer wrote:
Fine whatever guys, It's like no one reads the rulebook, only quotes others and FAQ's.

I'm still sticking with the facts of what page 124 says makes a full reserve impossible unless you don't have any IC's. Regardless (as it says)

Except it doesn't say that.
You've failed to quote that and you're literally ignoring quoted rules that prove you wrong. What more do you want?

 juraigamer wrote:
Fine whatever guys, It's like no one reads the rulebook, only quotes others and FAQ's.

I'm still sticking with the facts of what page 124 says makes a full reserve impossible unless you don't have any IC's. Regardless (as it says)

People have listened to what you have said and also read the rule book. You are right, IC's count as another unit for the purposes of calculating reserves, even if with another unit. Nobody is denying this.

However, this doesn't change the fact that the 'FAQ on transports that must start play in reserves' clearly states that the unit inside the drop pod, as well as the pod itself, do not count when calculating the reserves limit.

An IC alone in a drop pod wont count, a squad of troops wont count, so why would joining the IC to the squad in the pod suddenly change the result?

If it wasn't a unit that must be kept in reserves, A captain with terminators in a landraider for example, then you would be correct and it would count as 2 units on the board.


OT: Thanks for the info on player and game turns guys, I had always played it as end of the player turn when determining if a game was won due to no models on the board.

OT: Thanks for the info on player and game turns guys, I had always played it as end of the player turn when determining if a game was won due to no models on the board

So you really played that the old Daemon codex auto lost if they didn't go first?

Back on topic I think this has been done to death but I think all reasonable and intelligent people can read the thread and conclude that the all DP army is legal.

 FlingitNow wrote:

OT: Thanks for the info on player and game turns guys, I had always played it as end of the player turn when determining if a game was won due to no models on the board

So you really played that the old Daemon codex auto lost if they didn't go first?

maybe he never played against a Daemon army in 6th ed before the new codex dropped.

 DeathReaper wrote:

 FlingitNow wrote:

OT: Thanks for the info on player and game turns guys, I had always played it as end of the player turn when determining if a game was won due to no models on the board

So you really played that the old Daemon codex auto lost if they didn't go first?

maybe he never played against a Daemon army in 6th ed before the new codex dropped.

Yeah this, just no one I played against ran daemons. Now that you say it that way it does sound a little silly.

 Big Blind Bill wrote:

You are right, IC's count as another unit for the purposes of calculating reserves, even if with another unit.

It's just another case of GW not knowing what their rules say. If they FAQ ommited the line I would be happy.

 juraigamer wrote:

 Big Blind Bill wrote:

You are right, IC's count as another unit for the purposes of calculating reserves, even if with another unit.

It's just another case of GW not knowing what their rules say. If they FAQ ommited the line I would be happy.

An IC never counts as a unit for reserves purposes if it's embarked on a transport that must start in reserve.

Example:
5 model Tac squad
Marneus Calgar
Drop Pod

I have 2 units that count for reserve.
Embark the Tac squad in the Drop Pod.
I now must follow the rule clarified here:

GW FAQ wrote:Q: Do units that are transported in a vehicle that MUST start in
reserve count towards the num ber of units that can be placed in
Reserves? For e xample , must I count the units in a Drop Pod or
Valkyrie towards the 50%of units I can place in Reserves?
(p124)
A: No.

Since the Tac Squad is a unit embarked on a vehicle that must start in reserve, it is not counted. I have 1 unit that counts for reserve.

I embark Marneus into the Drop Pod (permitted because he's joining the currently embarked unit).
He still counts as an extra unit, but the above FAQ says to ignore any unit embarked on a transport that must start in reserve. Therefore to count him would be breaking the rules.
I have 0 units that count for reserve.

Please cite actual rules that disagree.

 juraigamer wrote:

 Big Blind Bill wrote:

You are right, IC's count as another unit for the purposes of calculating reserves, even if with another unit.

It's just another case of GW not knowing what their rules say. If they FAQ ommited the line I would be happy.

Whilst they certainly do not spell out what they intend for IC's. this quote from the FAQ:

Q: Do units that are transported in a vehicle that MUST start in
reserve count towards the number of units that can be placed in
Reserves? For example, must I count the units in a Drop Pod or
Valkyrie towards the 50% of units I can place in Reserves?
(p124)
A: No.

Regardless of how many units are there, as long as they are inside the drop pod they do not count towards the reserves limit. As they do not omit IC's specifically, there is no reason to my mind for them not to be effected by this rule change.
A similar example would be combat squading a unit of marines when they are in the pod. Technically if they were in a normal transport they would count as 2 units. However in this case they still both count as nothing as they are both in a transport that must start in reserve.

 juraigamer wrote:
Fine whatever guys, It's like no one reads the rulebook, only quotes others and FAQ's.

I'm still sticking with the facts of what page 124 says makes a full reserve impossible unless you don't have any IC's. Regardless (as it says)

This has almost gotten comical, if it wasn't sad...

There is only one person in this thread who hasn't read the relevant rules and FAQ clarification with understanding.

Short answer to your question. Yes it's legal. Just hope you win the roll off to go second.

Have fun.

rigeld2 wrote:


Please cite actual rules that disagree.

Been doing that, but oh well for those without a book, page 124 brb:

"Units that must start the game in reserve are
ignored for the purposes of working out how many other units
may do so. A unit and its Dedicated Transport are counted as a
single unit for these purposes. Independent Characters are also
counted as a single unit regardless of whether they have joined
another unit or not."

To me, this means that it doesn't matter if the IC joins a unit in a drop pod or flier, it still counts towards the reserve limit.

The FAQ doesn't matter in this case, because it doesn't address this situation in the rulebook, there it says you can't do it.

Jurai, ignoring IC's for the moment:

The rule you quoted (repeatedly) states that a DT and it's unit are considered one unit for the purposes of counting. If that DT is a Drop Pod, does it still count towards the reserve limit?

So long as there's no IC in the pod/flier, it's legal deployment.

 juraigamer wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:


Please cite actual rules that disagree.

Been doing that, but oh well for those without a book, page 124 brb:

"Units that must start the game in reserve are
ignored for the purposes of working out how many other units
may do so. A unit and its Dedicated Transport are counted as a
single unit for these purposes. Independent Characters are also
counted as a single unit regardless of whether they have joined
another unit or not."

To me, this means that it doesn't matter if the IC joins a unit in a drop pod or flier, it still counts towards the reserve limit.

The FAQ doesn't matter in this case, because it doesn't address this situation in the rulebook, there it says you can't do it.

You are taking a single rule and applying it as if it were in a vacuum. You must account for the other rules as well.

BRB Page 36 states that "When working out how many units can be placed in reserve,
units that must be deployed by Deep Strike (along with any
models embarked upon them) are ignored."

Note it says ANY "models" embarked upon them. This tells you that the unit, its dedicated transport (in this case lets just stick with a drop pod) and ANY models embarked upon it are ignored for purposes of calculating reserves limits.

Honestly, the FAQ answer was not even needed (imo). The rules are already clear. If a model is embarked on a transport that MUST start in reserve, ignore it for calculating reserves limits. Forget about "attached" and any other qualifiers. if it is embarked, it is ignored; full stop.

Yes, the IC is a single unit. However, it is a model embarked upon a vehicle that must start in reserves. Therefore, the Deepstrike rule must be taken into account. You have 2 units (transport + troops is one, IC is another), all embarked upon a vehicle that must start in reserves. What happens when calculating reserves and a model is embarked on said vehicle? You ignore it for those calculations.

*edit : I've never understood why people get so confused about the deep strike and reserves rules .. this comes up so often it is mind boggling.

 juraigamer wrote:
So long as there's no IC in the pod/flier, it's legal deployment.

Why? The rule says they are counted as one. And that an IC is still counted as one even if he joins, so:

Unit, non-DT, IC = 3 units for the reserve count.
Unit, DT, IC = 2 units for the reserve count.
Unit, DT-that-must-start-in-reserve = 1 unit but is not counted.
Unit, DT-that-must-start-in-reserve, IC = 2 units but not counted.

The IC is still a unit, but it's transported in a transport that Must-Start-In-Reserves, so therefore falls under the category of the FAQ that has been (also repeatedly) quoted.

{Edit} Rorschach9: The FAQ was needed for units that must start in reserve but don't Deep Strike (such as a unit in a flier). As the Deep Strike rule covers itself but the flier rules don't.

most importantly, what are we considering a "game turn?" your turn, my turn? or is a game turn defined as a round in which both players have taken a turn? that's what will determine if this is feasible. a player with no models at the end of a game turn, loses? whats a game turn?

pulse211 wrote:
most importantly, what are we considering a "game turn?" your turn, my turn? or is a game turn defined as a round in which both players have taken a turn? that's what will determine if this is feasible. a player with no models at the end of a game turn, loses? whats a game turn?

BRB page 9 defines what a game turn and a player turn are and that whenever the rules refer simply to "a turn" it always means player turn.

pulse211 wrote:
most importantly, what are we considering a "game turn?" your turn, my turn? or is a game turn defined as a round in which both players have taken a turn? that's what will determine if this is feasible. a player with no models at the end of a game turn, loses? whats a game turn?

This is actually the LEAST important part of this thread. Look in the index under "Game Turn," and the BRB will quite simply define it for you.

 juraigamer wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:


Please cite actual rules that disagree.

Been doing that, but oh well for those without a book, page 124 brb:

"Units that must start the game in reserve are
ignored for the purposes of working out how many other units
may do so. A unit and its Dedicated Transport are counted as a
single unit for these purposes. Independent Characters are also
counted as a single unit regardless of whether they have joined
another unit or not."

To me, this means that it doesn't matter if the IC joins a unit in a drop pod or flier, it still counts towards the reserve limit.

The FAQ doesn't matter in this case, because it doesn't address this situation in the rulebook, there it says you can't do it.

The rule doesn't cover the drop pod question at all.

It just means that an IC counts as one unit.
Same as a Tactical Squad.
Same as a Thundercannon.
Same as a Dreadnaught.

If the unit is in a drop pod, then it doesn't have to start on the table.
Same as a Tactical Squad.
Same as a Thundercannon.
Same as a Dreadnaught.

 Elric Greywolf wrote:

pulse211 wrote:
most importantly, what are we considering a "game turn?" your turn, my turn? or is a game turn defined as a round in which both players have taken a turn? that's what will determine if this is feasible. a player with no models at the end of a game turn, loses? whats a game turn?

This is actually the LEAST important part of this thread. Look in the index under "Turn" and/or "Game Turn," and the BRB will quite simply define it for you.

well then it is simple and I don't understand why this discussion has gone on for so long. if the brb says that a player with no models on the field at the end of any game turn loses and you go second with a drop pod list, you lose at the end of the first turn cause you didn't have any models on the field. no matter how you try to wrap the deep strike and reserve rules around it.

pulse211 wrote:

 Elric Greywolf wrote:

pulse211 wrote:
most importantly, what are we considering a "game turn?" your turn, my turn? or is a game turn defined as a round in which both players have taken a turn? that's what will determine if this is feasible. a player with no models at the end of a game turn, loses? whats a game turn?

This is actually the LEAST important part of this thread. Look in the index under "Turn" and/or "Game Turn," and the BRB will quite simply define it for you.

well then it is simple and I don't understand why this discussion has gone on for so long. if the brb says that a player with no models on the field at the end of any game turn loses and you go second with a drop pod list, you lose at the end of the first turn cause you didn't have any models on the field. no matter how you try to wrap the deep strike and reserve rules around it.

If you read the discussion you will notice its not centered on the no models/game turn question but rather what must be counted for reserves, which is why it has gone on so long (really it's just one persons misunderstanding of the reserves rules that is continuing the discussion as far as I can see).

Also, you do not lose if you go second with an all drop list. You lose at the end of a "game turn" with no models on the table, not Player turn (BRB p122) and as stated already, the two types of turns are defined on BRB p9.

pulse211 wrote:

 Elric Greywolf wrote:

pulse211 wrote:
most importantly, what are we considering a "game turn?" your turn, my turn? or is a game turn defined as a round in which both players have taken a turn? that's what will determine if this is feasible. a player with no models at the end of a game turn, loses? whats a game turn?

This is actually the LEAST important part of this thread. Look in the index under "Turn" and/or "Game Turn," and the BRB will quite simply define it for you.

well then it is simple and I don't understand why this discussion has gone on for so long. if the brb says that a player with no models on the field at the end of any game turn loses and you go second with a drop pod list, you lose at the end of the first turn cause you didn't have any models on the field. no matter how you try to wrap the deep strike and reserve rules around it.

Sorry if this sounds rude, but did you actually read your rule book? Check what a game turn actually is, I believe it is page 9.

Edit: Ninja'd

My friend once tried alldrop marines against Tau in 5E and Tau get the first turn. Then Tau player flooded the table with three ridiculously stretched Kroot Blobs, so he was forced to land all his drop pods on the far corner of the table with no cover and far from objectives.

I imagine tyranids could do this too with mass genestealers.

 juraigamer wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:
Please cite actual rules that disagree.

Been doing that, but oh well for those without a book, page 124 brb:

"Units that must start the game in reserve are
ignored for the purposes of working out how many other units
may do so. A unit and its Dedicated Transport are counted as a
single unit for these purposes. Independent Characters are also
counted as a single unit regardless of whether they have joined
another unit or not."

To me, this means that it doesn't matter if the IC joins a unit in a drop pod or flier, it still counts towards the reserve limit.

The FAQ doesn't matter in this case, because it doesn't address this situation in the rulebook, there it says you can't do it.

Great - so we have 2 units (the SM and Marneus).
They both are embarked on a transport that must start in reserves.
Please quote the relevant rules that cover this situation - all of them.

Separate (for purpose of units in reserve) even if they join a unit, regardless. The rule states they are always counted as a unit in reserve, so it doesn't matter what the FAQ and deep strike rules state. If the IC joins a unit, it's still counted, doesn't matter what that unit is.

You tell me were we ignore this. Show me what rule superceeds this notion that "Independent Characters are also
counted as a single unit regardless of whether they have joined
another unit or not." There is no rule that says we ignore this sentance/page/line.

Please cite a rule, page and bold the important text if you disagree. Include quotes and proper formatting.

 juraigamer wrote:
Separate (for purpose of units in reserve) even if they join a unit, regardless. The rule states they are always counted as a unit in reserve, so it doesn't matter what the FAQ and deep strike rules state. If the IC joins a unit, it's still counted, doesn't matter what that unit is.

You tell me were we ignore this. Show me what rule superceeds this notion that "Independent Characters are also
counted as a single unit regardless of whether they have joined
another unit or not." There is no rule that says we ignore this sentance/page/line.

Please cite a rule, page and bold the important text if you disagree. Include quotes and proper formatting.

I've never - ever- as in, you're correct - said that the IC is not counted as a separate unit.

Your assertion is that it doesn't matter what that unit is embarked on. I've quoted the FAQ that says "units that are transported in a vehicle that MUST start in reserve" do not count.
The IC unit is transported in a vehicle that MUST start in reserve. Tell me why it does count in contradiction with that FAQ.
Note that I'm not referring to page 36 or any Deep Strike rules - the FAQ operates on page 124, the same page you have cited.

Every single unit is always counted. Every game, regaldless of the unit type. The IC is always counted as a unit and follows all the rules for units.

Including starting in reserves if it is in a transport that has to start in reserves.

 juraigamer wrote:
Separate (for purpose of units in reserve) even if they join a unit, regardless. The rule states they are always counted as a unit in reserve, so it doesn't matter what the FAQ and deep strike rules state. If the IC joins a unit, it's still counted, doesn't matter what that unit is.

You tell me were we ignore this. Show me what rule superceeds this notion that "Independent Characters are also
counted as a single unit regardless of whether they have joined
another unit or not." There is no rule that says we ignore this sentance/page/line.

Please cite a rule, page and bold the important text if you disagree. Include quotes and proper formatting.

I was planning on staying out of this, but I'll bite.

Since we are using a Drop Pod in this scenario, I won't even mention the FAQ (though it appears it would not matter as you'd just ignore it).

Page 36 - Deep Strike, left column, second paragraph.

When working out how many units can be placed in reserve, units that must be deployed by Deep Strike (along with any models embarked upon them) are ignored.

So we have a Drop Pod. It must be deployed by Deep Strike. Per the posted rule, it is ignored. Furthermore, any model embarked is also ignored. Oh look, a case of specific (models embarked on a transport that must DS) vs general (units in reserve). Guess which one wins?

 Happyjew wrote:
Page 36 - Deep Strike, left column, second paragraph.

He's made the assertion that page 36 is general deep strike and 124 covers specifically ICs in reserves. It's an incorrect argument, but he's "addressed" it already.

Might as well lock this thread, just circle talk now.

 Happyjew wrote:

 juraigamer wrote:
Separate (for purpose of units in reserve) even if they join a unit, regardless. The rule states they are always counted as a unit in reserve, so it doesn't matter what the FAQ and deep strike rules state. If the IC joins a unit, it's still counted, doesn't matter what that unit is.

You tell me were we ignore this. Show me what rule superceeds this notion that "Independent Characters are also
counted as a single unit regardless of whether they have joined
another unit or not." There is no rule that says we ignore this sentance/page/line.

Please cite a rule, page and bold the important text if you disagree. Include quotes and proper formatting.

I was planning on staying out of this, but I'll bite.

Since we are using a Drop Pod in this scenario, I won't even mention the FAQ (though it appears it would not matter as you'd just ignore it).

Page 36 - Deep Strike, left column, second paragraph.

When working out how many units can be placed in reserve, units that must be deployed by Deep Strike (along with any models embarked upon them) are ignored.

So we have a Drop Pod. It must be deployed by Deep Strike. Per the posted rule, it is ignored. Furthermore, any model embarked is also ignored. Oh look, a case of specific (models embarked on a transport that must DS) vs general (units in reserve). Guess which one wins?

I already provided those rules for Juraigamer. He seems to feel they are irrelevant because the IC rules (apparently) say otherwise (which they don't).

@Juraigamer : IF there were a conflict between the Deep Strike reserves rules and the IC rules then I imagine the IC rules would supercede. There is no conflict, so both rules must apply. If you choose to not follow the rules for Deep Striking reserves (which clearly state all models in a transport that must start in reserve are not counted for the purposes of determining reserves limits) then you are not following the relevant rules.

Could we get a poll added to this thread? Maybe if Juraigamer saw the overwhelming opinion that his reading skills are failing in this case, he'd be more likely to agree?
If 5000 people say one thing, and you say another, it's a good indication that you're wrong. Not automatically wrong...but it's certainly something that you should consider.

Wow!

Just the same happyjew, page 124 tells us IC's are always counted as a separate unit in reserve, regardless of if they join a unit, so two specific rules are colliding. What do. Which takes precedent? Both rules take effect, being in the pod and being an IC. Page 124. I'm not arguing what it says on page 36, please stop blindly quoting it. I have never encountered two specifics colliding before like this. I'm looking for an explanation on this, since page 1, not copy paste and knee jerk responses.

 juraigamer wrote:
Just the same happyjew, page 124 tells us IC's are always counted as a separate unit in reserve, regardless of if they join a unit, so two specific rules are colliding. What do. Which takes precedent? Both rules take effect, being in the pod and being an IC. Pages 36 and 124. I have never encountered two specifics colliding before like this. I'm looking for an explanation on this, since page 1, not copy paste and knee jerk responses.

As I mentioned before, the FAQ doesn't even matter in this case.

The IC is a separate unit in reserves.

The IC is embarked upon a transport vehicle that MUST start in reserves.

Vehicles that must start in reserves AND ALL MODELS EMBARKED upon those vehicles are not counted for determining reserves limits.

Where is the conflict? You have a unit (and therefore, models) embarked upon a vehicle. Whether or not they are a unit in reserves is irrelevant because they are embarked upon a vehicle that MUST start in reserves (as opposed to MAY) and that further rule removes them from calculations for reserves.

What if you did not attach the IC to a unit? An IC on a Stormraven for example .. is it still counted towards reserves?
The reserves rules say no (FAQ ignored as it's merely a clarification of rules that already exist).
It's no different for any other vehicle that must start in reserve and has models embarked upon it. There is no conflict. Yes, the IC is a unit all on its own. As is any troop choice you embark upon the vehicle. But once embarked upon that vehicle (that must begin in reserves), they are removed from reserves calculations (and only for those purposes are they ignored), as per the rules (ALL of the rules, not just handpicked individual rules).

To do otherwise would be ignoring rules.

Just let it slide . If he ever rans into someone playing a full drop pod list in a friendly they wont play against each other and are done. If he ever rans into someone on a tournament a judge will quickly solve the debate.

Juraigamer is that also how you would play it or are you simply arguing RAW?

 Mywik wrote:
Just let it slide . If he ever rans into someone playing a full drop pod list in a friendly they wont play against each other and are done. If he ever rans into someone on a tournament a judge will quickly solve the debate.

Juraigamer is that also how you would play it or are you simply arguing RAW?

Its gotta be how he would play it, because the rules are clear that all models embarked on drop pods do not count.

 DeathReaper wrote:

 Mywik wrote:
Just let it slide . If he ever rans into someone playing a full drop pod list in a friendly they wont play against each other and are done. If he ever rans into someone on a tournament a judge will quickly solve the debate.

Juraigamer is that also how you would play it or are you simply arguing RAW?

Its gotta be how he would play it, because the rules are clear that all models embarked on drop pods do not count.

Did i disagree? Why not let him answer my question anyway?

 juraigamer wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:


Please cite actual rules that disagree.

Been doing that, but oh well for those without a book, page 124 brb:

"Units that must start the game in reserve are
ignored for the purposes of working out how many other units
may do so. A unit and its Dedicated Transport are counted as a
single unit for these purposes. Independent Characters are also
counted as a single unit regardless of whether they have joined
another unit or not."

To me, this means that it doesn't matter if the IC joins a unit in a drop pod or flier, it still counts towards the reserve limit.

The FAQ doesn't matter in this case, because it doesn't address this situation in the rulebook, there it says you can't do it.

Wrong. The more specific rules for drop pods and their FAQ supercede the less specific rules as stated on page 124 of the rulebook. I'm not sure how you can not grasp this and am beginning to suspect that you're trolling us to see how many pages of responses you will get. This will be my last response.

 juraigamer wrote:
Been doing that, but oh well for those without a book, page 124 brb:

"Units that must start the game in reserve are
ignored for the purposes of working out how many other units
may do so. A unit and its Dedicated Transport are counted as a
single unit for these purposes. Independent Characters are also
counted as a single unit regardless of whether they have joined
another unit or not."

To me, this means that it doesn't matter if the IC joins a unit in a drop pod or flier, it still counts towards the reserve limit.

The FAQ doesn't matter in this case, because it doesn't address this situation in the rulebook, there it says you can't do it.

OK... now can you explain why you feel that 'counts as a single unit' automatically means 'counts towards your reserves limit"?

Because if counting as a single unit is all that is required for the unit to count towards your reserve limit, the drop pod is also going to count towards your reserve limit, based on that quote. Despite the rules elsewhere saying it doesn't.

 juraigamer wrote:
Just the same happyjew, page 124 tells us IC's are always counted as a separate unit in reserve, regardless of if they join a unit, so two specific rules are colliding. What do. Which takes precedent? Both rules take effect, being in the pod and being an IC. Page 124. I'm not arguing what it says on page 36, please stop blindly quoting it. I have never encountered two specifics colliding before like this. I'm looking for an explanation on this, since page 1, not copy paste and knee jerk responses.

Funny. I just made a full drop pod army that will never be allowed to get on board except for the second half.

HQ-IC
HQ-IC
Techmarine-IC x 2
Squads x 4
Drop Pods x 4


Based on what you are saying, I have 4 Drop Pods with a squad and an independent character inside each one. These would be 4 units (squad and pod ignored in calculations). Half of these could go to reserve. Now the problem is that "Drop Pods and units embarked upon them must be held in reserve and must enter play using the Deep Strike rules." Since all Drop Pods must start in reserves and half of them can't and you can't deploy the pod with the models inside (because they are embarked on the Drop Pod) normally the game just explodes.

Why does this happen? All of the pods must start in reserve. Also half of the pods can not start in reserve (they have IC aboard). Half of the pods can start in reserve. Half of the pods is not all of the pods.


Tell me, how is the above handled according to you?


Ps. This is stupid.

 kaapelikala wrote:

HQ-IC
HQ-IC
Techmarine-IC x 2
Squads x 4
Drop Pods x 4

...how is the above handled...?

So if we're playing Purge the Alien then I'm counting 12 units (2HQsd, 2 Techmarines, 4 squads, 4 DPs). Your drop pods start in reserve automatically and are not counted when determining reserves. The Squads start on the pods and therefore aren't counted either. If you don't put anything else into the pods, then you only have 4 units that I am allowed to count towards determining reserves. So, you can put 2 more units into reserves. If, however, you put your 2 HQ units onto a pod, then you only have 2 units that I am allowed to count towards determining reserves. So, you can put 1 more unit into reserves. Finally, if your pods have room, and you, for instance, put 1 HQ into DP-A, 1 HQ into DP-B, 1 techmarine into DP-C, and 1 techmarine into DP-D, then you have no units that I'm allowed to count towards reserves. This is because all 8 units are embarked on 4 units that "must arrive by Deep Strike" and in this case all units that "must be deployed by Deep Strike (along with any models embarked upon them) are ignored" when trying to calculate how many units may start in reserves. (p36) This is further clarified with the same language on p124 and reconfirmed in the FAQ when it states "Do unitS [plural] that are TRANSPORTED in a vehicle that MUST start in reserve count towards the number of units that can be placed in Reserves? For example, must I count the units IN a DROP POD or Valkyrie towards the 50% of units I can place in Reserves? (p124) A: No." (emphasis added).

So, to answer the OP question:

gausus wrote:
If i put all my units into 7 drop pods 4 of them arrive at the begining of my first turn.
In that scenario, if i get to go second, my oponent does not have ant thing to shoot in the first turn. He can just move his units, and that is is?

Yes, if you go second, then all your opponent may do during his first player turn is move his units around.

Yes, if you go second, then all your opponent may do during his first player turn is move his units around.

Not entirely true. He can cast blessings and use wargear like forinstance the Grimoire. A daemon player will be more than happy for your drop pod army to go second...

 FlingitNow wrote:

Yes, if you go second, then all your opponent may do during his first player turn is move his units around.

Not entirely true. He can cast blessings and use wargear like forinstance the Grimoire. A daemon player will be more than happy for your drop pod army to go second...

As a Daemon, I am happy to go first against Drop Pods, because of the Grimoire.
But as a GREY KNIGHT, I absolutely MUST go first, to the point that I will pay you $1. Warp Quake ahoy!

 kaapelikala wrote:

 juraigamer wrote:
Just the same happyjew, page 124 tells us IC's are always counted as a separate unit in reserve, regardless of if they join a unit, so two specific rules are colliding. What do. Which takes precedent? Both rules take effect, being in the pod and being an IC. Page 124. I'm not arguing what it says on page 36, please stop blindly quoting it. I have never encountered two specifics colliding before like this. I'm looking for an explanation on this, since page 1, not copy paste and knee jerk responses.

Funny. I just made a full drop pod army that will never be allowed to get on board except for the second half.

HQ-IC
HQ-IC
Techmarine-IC x 2
Squads x 4
Drop Pods x 4


Based on what you are saying, I have 4 Drop Pods with a squad and an independent character inside each one. These would be 4 units (squad and pod ignored in calculations). Half of these could go to reserve. Now the problem is that "Drop Pods and units embarked upon them must be held in reserve and must enter play using the Deep Strike rules." Since all Drop Pods must start in reserves and half of them can't and you can't deploy the pod with the models inside (because they are embarked on the Drop Pod) normally the game just explodes.

Why does this happen? All of the pods must start in reserve. Also half of the pods can not start in reserve (they have IC aboard). Half of the pods can start in reserve. Half of the pods is not all of the pods.


Tell me, how is the above handled according to you?


Ps. This is stupid.

While I agree that this formation is 100% legal, it does not address his logic. He would likely say that the IC or squad can not both deploy in the drop pod and be a legal formation. Since The drop pods are dedicated transports the IC would be required to start on the field. (Unless he is willing to admit pg 124 does handle this because drop pods must arrive via deep strike)

Orock wrote:
Isn't there. Rule in sixth now that says if you have no models on the board at anytime now you lose?

At the end of the game turn only.

So starting with the entire army in drop pods is fine.

 juraigamer wrote:


Been doing that, but oh well for those without a book, page 124 brb:

"Units that must start the game in reserve are
ignored for the purposes of working out how many other units
may do so. A unit and its Dedicated Transport are counted as a
single unit for these purposes. Independent Characters are also
counted as a single unit regardless of whether they have joined
another unit or not."

To me, this means that it doesn't matter if the IC joins a unit in a drop pod or flier, it still counts towards the reserve limit.

The FAQ doesn't matter in this case, because it doesn't address this situation in the rulebook, there it says you can't do it.

No one is arguing that an IC counts separately when calculating reserves.

Your argument for Pg.124 simply tells you that they are normally counted separate when joined to a unit. It mentions nothing in regards to being embarked on a transport that must be taken in reserve. There's nothing telling you you can't do it either....it tells you what you can do, by virtue of specific permissions. In this case, we are given explicit permission to ignore the IC (or MODEL) when calculating reserve totals, because he is embarked on a transport that must start the game in reserve.

What about using a small amount of table units, like TLOS hiding TFC, to allow for some additional units like scout speeders. Thoughts?

Edit: Ahhh got linked from tactics... Didn't realise it was YMDC

 NickTheButcher wrote:

 juraigamer wrote:


Been doing that, but oh well for those without a book, page 124 brb:

"Units that must start the game in reserve are
ignored for the purposes of working out how many other units
may do so. A unit and its Dedicated Transport are counted as a
single unit for these purposes. Independent Characters are also
counted as a single unit regardless of whether they have joined
another unit or not."

To me, this means that it doesn't matter if the IC joins a unit in a drop pod or flier, it still counts towards the reserve limit.

The FAQ doesn't matter in this case, because it doesn't address this situation in the rulebook, there it says you can't do it.

No one is arguing that an IC counts separately when calculating reserves.

Your argument for Pg.124 simply tells you that they are normally counted separate when joined to a unit. It mentions nothing in regards to being embarked on a transport that must be taken in reserve. There's nothing telling you you can't do it either....it tells you what you can do, by virtue of specific permissions. In this case, we are given explicit permission to ignore the IC (or MODEL) when calculating reserve totals, because he is embarked on a transport that must start the game in reserve.

This doesn't quite work. The IC is not "a unit that must start in reserves", the only wording that allows an embarked unit in a drop pod to be ignored along with the drop pod is the statement that units and their dedicated transport are considered one unit. Even when embarked in a drop pod, the DP is not the IC's dedicated transport, therefore he must count towards reserves.

You are ignoring the FAQ that says anyone embarked on any transport (not just dedicated) are not counted. It's been quoted multiple times in this thread - perhaps you would like to read it?

rigeld2 wrote:
You are ignoring the FAQ that says anyone embarked on any transport (not just dedicated) are not counted. It's been quoted multiple times in this thread - perhaps you would like to read it?

Fair enough. Not even sure why I chimed in since it's in my best interest for it to be allowed. LOL

Ok. So one question - does anyone tested an all drop-pod list and would like to share the info, how did the game went?

@juraigamer

1. In the described scenario, is the IC embarked in a transport that must start in reserve? (yes/no)

2. Do units that start embarked in a transport that must start in reserve count towards your reserves limit? (yes/no)