I'm curious to see how many people are standing against Forgeworld still, since the pitchforks and torches seem to have been put down. (I say that with a pinch of disappointment.)

Never actively boycotted them in the first place, never mind "still"

I don't buy a lot from them either way, mostly as there is enough grey plastic and even old metal here to last a lifetime without adding a stack of resin on top of it.

leopard wrote:
Never actively boycotted them in the first place, never mind "still"

I don't buy a lot from them either way, mostly as there is enough grey plastic and even old metal here to last a lifetime without adding a stack of resin on top of it.

Pretty much this. I don't think I've actually bought anything from them but would have no moral objection to doing so.

I am, but if I'm honest...I started boycotting them a long time ago. Their prices have rarely, if ever been justified. But any weakness I'd have had to try them again has disappeared.

I am not boycotting them and never planned to boycott them.

I have cut way back on how much I plan to purchase from them. I had probably a couple thousand GBP worth of stuff that was on my list to pick up over the next few years, but after so many things going LCTB and the price hike I've cut probably 80% of it off my list. That's not the same thing as a boycott though.

Customer of Forgeworld for 20+ years from all the way back to their mail order program. Price increase was nail in the coffin. Wrote them a long, well thought out email with #'s & my concerns for the companies future. Received what might as well have been an automated response. Tbh, its been much easier than I had anticipated. They haven't released any new 40k product in years. Its all Horus Heresy, custodes product. There is actually less product available for 40k players now then there was years ago. Seems they have chosen their target audience and its not Warhammer 40k players.

I have never boycotted Forge World. I have just not found their prices reasonable to buy. I bought one item from Forge World and that was nearly 20 years ago.

Games Workshop I boycotted twice in the Kirby years, both for a full year, and I kept to the boycott.

let me put it this way i have a friend that has always bought some really really really really similar "alternative" models who I used to always give crap too, but on his most recent order of stuff I've placed an order. The amount of cleaning i did on my last FW order was ridiculous for a "premiere" product and the alternatives i bought were of higher quality

I am. I'm not a massive buyer to begin with, but I did have a "get one thing every year" thing going on. That's totally out the window now, and my reservations about buying chinese products have gone out the window.

 vaklor4 wrote:
I am. I'm not a massive buyer to begin with, but I did have a "get one thing every year" thing going on. That's totally out the window now, and my reservations about buying chinese products have gone out the window.

Similar here. I usually buy 2-3 sets of models/year from them, but now I'm going through all other options^TM I can find first.

For me, FW just hasn't really released anything I have wanted for years, and of the stuff I did want, theyve retired most of it (id love to buy more DKoK Grenadiers...but ah....)

So, no boycott on my end as such...but I just don't care about anything they're putting out these days, like the Marine HH stuff, not my bag, doubly so when they're sticking to the atrocious 7E core rules for all of it, nooooo thanks in going back to that hideousness.

Im all for FE inclusion in games, im not actively boycotting them really, but they just dont have anything I want. **** if I'm going to drop a hundred bucks on a single configuration Russ tank.

I wasn't buying from them due to high prices before this mess. Not sure if that counts as boycotting or not. I checked Not boycotting though.

Same as Reemule, their prices went from “too high for me to consider in the first place” to “even higher,” so nothing changed for me. It’s kind of a shame, too. FW makes some really cool stuff, it’s just out of my price range.

Judging by the amount of LCTB a boycott isn’t needed, as no-one was buying in the first place!

MY need for Forge World is limited to 30K material these days.
I am still waiting for the Lion and the First Legion book. For Orks as far as I can tell I have basically everything I want and plan to scratch build or kit bash anything else. Until such time as there are new Ork models from FW and at this time there are not. If I absolutely need a bit for a kit bash I can get most from China if I can't figure out how to make said bit first. Instant gratification and all that.

I wouldn't use the word 'boycott' but I've never actually purchased anything from FW. The closest thing I've got are 2 recast Hornets.
The price has always been an issue, but the deal breaker for me is the accessibility. I'm old fashioned in that I like to go to a store to buy stuff, only recently using eBay for its convenience. I can't buy FW stuff at a store, eBay is even more expensive for FW stuff and the direct shipping takes forever.

Add to the fact that GW already has way, WAY too much variety as-is (in that I can't keep up with what's out there and new) and I can only see the demise of FW as a good thing.
Not boycotting, just glad there will be less to think about.

-

I am just a little bit salty about the xenos LCTB. I had been slowly purchasing every Ork model FW made over the last year and I now have almost everything. The Flakka Gunz and Grot Sponsons went LCTB just before 1 AM my time and were sold out by when I woke up at 7 AM (IIRC).

Oh well, I guess I'll just have to get them used or recast.

I've never bought anything from forge world, I'm open to the possiability of doing so but given their prices it needs to be something "truely special" to get me to buy

I've made a few purchases from fw over the years but I will never be again. The price has just gotten to a point of such hilarious disproportion to what you get that I can pretty confidently say I'll just live without it.

I have never bought from forgeworld but I am not actively boycotting it. I just don't feel the need to own anything that they sell when there are enough perfectly good options from gw that are in the codex i already own. Also my group tend not to use bigger models so I am not looking at their super heavies.

Bought some 30k upgrade packs just yesterday.

Not boycotting.

de facto? Yes.

I'm also de facto boycotting GW.

Unless something amazing cool appears, like a return of Dogs of War.

Like many people posted, it's not that I'm actively boycotting them - but with prices 30% higher in the US as a result of their new policies, the end result isn't all that different in that I just won't be purchasing much compared to previously.

Why are we boycotting them?

Not boycotting, in fact I love FW stuff.

That said I feel FW overshadows codex entries too much and too often and therefore I rarely include any these days despite what models I own. Certain guilty pleasures aside (such as arkos).

I personally am not boycotting. Sure, the price increase does sting a little, yet FW still has some nice goodies. Also I never had a problem with quality. So no, no boycott here.

I'm not boycotting but I'd probably not buy anything from them at this point. To expensive and resin is pain to deal with. Not to mention they keep purging models left and right..

It's honestly only a boycott if you bought from them ALL the time.

Based on how few purchases I make, a boycott is silly for me personally. Granted it means I might not get my Mk5 Assault Marines anytime sooner, but I wasn't gonna get them soon anyway.

I'm still planning on buying stuff.

I'm not calling it a 'boycott'. I'm just not doing business with them, because I don't think their products are worth the current pricing model.

Yeah, not so much a boycott as their products are no longer worth the price they currently charge.

Not so much boycotting as 'never could afford anyway'...

Not boycotting, but I haven't bought much from them anyways.

Bummed to find out that the Land Raider reinforced armor isn't for sale anymore. If I had known they were getting rid of it I would have bought two more sets.

I think I have the few items I thought were reasonable value for money in my collection. If other things I want appear I'll buy them, but what I got for £250 this month feels underwhelming to the stack of plastics I could have had.

Voted no on the boycott, but I have yet to be a customer anyway.

I'm not buying any Forgeworld stuff anymore.

I wouldn't call it a boycott per se because I'm not like, trying to force a broader change or morally opposed to them for some reason; I just no longer think their products are worth the premium combined with a lack of appealing products. When I find stuff I wan secondhand on ebay then I would buy them now although it's been a while even for secondhand, I think my last purchase was some purity seals from a DCM bro a while ago.

If they had products that piqued my interest and I felt were priced appropriately I would still buy them but that doesn't seem to have been the case for some time. My last direct order was I believe in mid-2016 or thereabouts. It all seems to be Megazords and Horus Heresy now.

I mostly like Orks and Necrons, and I haven't seen any new Ork stuff in a really long time, I don't think. The last Necron FW stuff was roughly 2011 (right?) and that was, to be honest, pretty poor effort - some of the models felt like lazy, half ass conversions of existing plastic kits that an amateur scratchbuilder could have done.

 TapedTempest wrote:
I'm curious to see how many people are standing against Forgeworld still, since the pitchforks and torches seem to have been put down. (I say that with a pinch of disappointment.)

Who's boycotting them, is this actually a thing. This is so stupid. If you boycott FW, you are damaging GW, I'd rather have the company continue existing. I'm not a GW apple polisher but boycotting doesn't solve anything. Their rules aren't great at the moment, so what, they won't always be, I'll continue adding to my collection while everyone has a strop.

in the past year I've probably spent $1000 on stuff from them and was(not really) happy to pay their stupid VAT crap as my card doesn't charge me for foreign currency conv. But with the change to "local" currency and resultant price hike all of the big ($100)+ models I've been looking at are off the table, I'm just gonna buy the upgrade stuff for my salamanders and nothing else. if they see a large drop off of higher ($¥£€) models it could really eat into their profits and signal that they might want to look at their pricing structure. but probably not.

 Delvarus Centurion wrote:

 TapedTempest wrote:
I'm curious to see how many people are standing against Forgeworld still, since the pitchforks and torches seem to have been put down. (I say that with a pinch of disappointment.)

Who's boycotting them, is this actually a thing. This is so stupid. If you boycott FW, you are damaging GW, I'd rather have the company continue existing. I'm not a GW apple polisher but boycotting doesn't solve anything. Their rules aren't great at the moment, so what, they won't always be, I'll continue adding to my collection while everyone has a strop.

Since you're in the UK Del you may be unaware but when they shifted over to the regional pricing people in North America got hit with something like a 30% price increase. THAT is why there was talk of a Boycott.

BrianDavion wrote:

 Delvarus Centurion wrote:

 TapedTempest wrote:
I'm curious to see how many people are standing against Forgeworld still, since the pitchforks and torches seem to have been put down. (I say that with a pinch of disappointment.)

Who's boycotting them, is this actually a thing. This is so stupid. If you boycott FW, you are damaging GW, I'd rather have the company continue existing. I'm not a GW apple polisher but boycotting doesn't solve anything. Their rules aren't great at the moment, so what, they won't always be, I'll continue adding to my collection while everyone has a strop.

Since you're in the UK Del you may be unaware but when they shifted over to the regional pricing people in North America got hit with something like a 30% price increase. THAT is why there was talk of a Boycott.

Ah, fair enough then. I thought it was due to the rules.

I'm not, but I'm british so I'm not seeing the price hike. If I was, I'd probably boycott it or feel justified looking for "alternatives".

I'm currently boycotting them part in my own experience and also the experience of others and their business practices.

In my case the model I purchased required so much cleaning, reshaping and even then it just wouldn't fit correctly. For a £60 item i was a little disappointed to say the least.

Friends have also had bad experiences and one had to return his item THREE times before he got all the correct parts, and even then the quality was shocking. One had super bendy resin from a incorrect resin mix confirming to me that their "quality check" is to make sure all the parts are included - no matter the actual state of the parts...

The price increases don't affect me personally but I still think its a rather scummy business practice and just pure greed IMHO. I'll be using recasters until FW see sense and foreign prices are lowered and their internal quality is a lot better.

I am not boycotting FW but seeing as they have discontinued the R&H infantry they are doing a flaming good job of it for me had I intended to.

Not boycotting them but then again they're barely releasing anything at the minute so not a lot to boycott

I'm not boycotting them, but I honestly only bought maybe 1 or 2 things direct from forgeworld in the past 3 years. If/when they release something I actually need, i'd still consider buying. Only thing I could see myself considering this year would maybe be the delaque resin upgrades, but if Delaque comes out in november/dec...the upgrades won't be out until next year so whatever.

I'm not boycotting, but I'm not buying either. Nothing I want since finishing my iron warriors.

I have never bought from FW, and will not be going forward unless something changes. They've been price gouging my country since I started the hobby, so I'm not going to support that.

Dudeface wrote:
Not boycotting them but then again they're barely releasing anything at the minute so not a lot to boycott

Adeptus Titanicus just came out. New Blood Bowl team literally on pre-order this week. Necromunda is chucking along with steady releases. Middle Earth wargame just relaunched with a new starter box.

They've literally never released more stuff than in the last couple of months than ever before.


I just suppose people don't "recognize" it as the stuff coming from the specialist games department (formerly FW) if it isn't resin Imperial Guard tanks or Rhino doors?

 gnome_idea_what wrote:
Same as Reemule, their prices went from “too high for me to consider in the first place” to “even higher,” so nothing changed for me. It’s kind of a shame, too. FW makes some really cool stuff, it’s just out of my price range.

Ditto. There's some cool tanks and such on their website I'd love to get, but never at the prices they charge. Their recent move just put them even further out of my reach.

Sunny Side Up wrote:

Dudeface wrote:
Not boycotting them but then again they're barely releasing anything at the minute so not a lot to boycott

Adeptus Titanicus just came out. New Blood Bowl team literally on pre-order this week. Necromunda is chucking along with steady releases. Middle Earth wargame just relaunched with a new starter box.

They've literally never released more stuff than in the last couple of months than ever before.


I just suppose people don't "recognize" it as the stuff coming from the specialist games department (formerly FW) if it isn't resin Imperial Guard tanks or Rhino doors?

A lotta people think "resin minis ordered direct rom forge world" when they ehar forge world, I do tend to agree with the sentiment that if FW's quality control is lacking then why would you wanna order from them?

There's simply not much left I'd want from Forgeworld. The occasional middle earth miniature, though most of them are still GW. I'll buy the two new Orcs when they come out, maybe Thranduil as well.
Concerning 40K I got most of what I needed - Plague Hulk, Blight Drone, Necrosius, some 30K upgrade sets, DG Contemptor, DG Dreads, DG conversion sets. If they put out a Leviathan DG dread I'd be tempted, but right now it seems they're reducing HH. In my gaming group every interest in starting 30K has disappeared with their decision to keep 7th edition rules.

I'm not boycotting, but I hardly buy from them anyway - bought one Avatar of Khaine in person in Nottingham about 6 months ago but that's it. Pleased I did too, since that's one of the models that seems to have vanished with no warning since.

Considering I've only ever bought two forge world products (XV88-2, now discontinued as GW wants people to buy the plastic overweight broadside model, and a Carmine Dragon to serve as Malekith's mount) and both of them were years ago, I suppose I am unintentionally boycotting them!

But that is just because they don't make anything I am interested in. I don't care for giant stompy robots, don't care for space marines of any variety, etc. so the majority of their stuff just doesn't appeal to me.

They removed a lot of what I wanted, dark angels upgrades, certain weapon options I need to complete my army as well as certain MKs of armour I prefer in resin, then the price hike came for non U.K. people and I think they are taking the pee, it tipped me over the edge, I no longer want to buy from FW unless they change the pricing policy.

Not boycotting, but the only thing I'm likely to pick up in the next year is the Talons of the Emperor 40K book.

I don't need to consciously boycott a business that sells toys that I cannot reasonably afford.

Or have I been boycotting Ferrari all these years?

Sunny Side Up wrote:

Dudeface wrote:
Not boycotting them but then again they're barely releasing anything at the minute so not a lot to boycott

Adeptus Titanicus just came out. New Blood Bowl team literally on pre-order this week. Necromunda is chucking along with steady releases. Middle Earth wargame just relaunched with a new starter box.

They've literally never released more stuff than in the last couple of months than ever before.


I just suppose people don't "recognize" it as the stuff coming from the specialist games department (formerly FW) if it isn't resin Imperial Guard tanks or Rhino doors?

I also believe we were told the specialist games department would have no knock on effects for their mainstay releases.

In the nicest way possible, they have previewed multiple books for main 40k and nothing has come from them. They've lost more options and models from their store than they've added over the last few months, including full ranges.

Middle Earth is also being launched under main GW banners, the forgeworld aspects of it appear to be being kept separate.

If removing full ranges = gaining some specialist game teams and a new game with a 4 model range, that's pretty poor form

I would suspect that something like 90% of the people spouting vitriol against Forgeworld and claiming to boycott then have either never bought anything from them anyway, or could count the number of kits ever purchased direct from them on one hand.

I’m buy models from GW. They are overpriced by definition. I could care less about the exchange rate they choose to use. When they make something I want, I’ll decide it is either worth buying or too expensive to buy at that point.

Stux wrote:
I would suspect that something like 90% of the people spouting vitriol against Forgeworld and claiming to boycott then have either never bought anything from them anyway, or could count the number of kits ever purchased direct from them on one hand.

That would also account for the vast majority of Dakka.

Most forum members cant realistically afford Forge World products and never could.

The 'boycott' is a bit much, its clearly a luxury product and you pay a luxury price for the privilege of whatever you are getting. You don't boycott the Ritz because you cant afford to stay there, you go elsewhere.

I know of one or two Forge World whales through third parties, never met them or seen the collection. One is a severely disabled person who is on a vial of morphine a day. He lives for his hobby, it is all he has got. He buys lots of Forge World stuff. Forge World being a luxury service genuinely looks after its whales, as opposed to other gaming whale harvesters like Cloud Imperium who just laugh in their cups and exploit them, the difference is that Forge World see themselves as craftsmen doing a craftsmans service with a physical product, not as wheeler-dealer salesmen. It is very much in the mindset of the single customer orientated cottage industry the discerning connoisseur goes to. Which also has a webfront tacked on.
It is said from those who know him that his orders are placed on priority and everything is double checked for him, there is a personal customer rapport. A bit like rich ladies who shop habitually at Harrods get known by name and are looked after wherever they go.

Forge World being a luxury outfit relies heavily on its whales and the customer service it offers to them. There is a webfront for everyone and if they have to raise prices it doesn't effect their core business that much.

 Orlanth wrote:

Stux wrote:
I would suspect that something like 90% of the people spouting vitriol against Forgeworld and claiming to boycott then have either never bought anything from them anyway, or could count the number of kits ever purchased direct from them on one hand.

That would also account for the vast majority of Dakka.

Most forum members cant realistically afford Forge World products and never could.

The 'boycott' is a bit much, its clearly a luxury product and you pay a luxury price for the privilege of whatever you are getting. You don't boycott the Ritz because you cant afford to stay there, you go elsewhere.

I know of one or two Forge World whales through third parties, never met them or seen the collection. One is a severely disabled person who is on a vial of morphine a day. He lives for his hobby, it is all he has got. He buys lots of Forge World stuff. Forge World being a luxury service genuinely looks after its whales, as opposed to other gaming whale harvesters like Cloud Imperium who just laugh in their cups and exploit them, the difference is that Forge World see themselves as craftsmen doing a craftsmans service with a physical product, not as wheeler-dealer salesmen. It is very much in the mindset of the single customer orientated cottage industry the discerning connoisseur goes to. Which also has a webfront tacked on.
It is said from those who know him that his orders are placed on priority and everything is double checked for him, there is a personal customer rapport. A bit like rich ladies who shop habitually at Harrods get known by name and are looked after wherever they go.

Forge World being a luxury outfit relies heavily on its whales and the customer service it offers to them. There is a webfront for everyone and if they have to raise prices it doesn't effect their core business that much.

Exactly.

A grass roots boycott will do nothing. Forgeworld is about selling to whales, that's the business model.

 Orlanth wrote:

Stux wrote:
I would suspect that something like 90% of the people spouting vitriol against Forgeworld and claiming to boycott then have either never bought anything from them anyway, or could count the number of kits ever purchased direct from them on one hand.

That would also account for the vast majority of Dakka.

Most forum members cant realistically afford Forge World products and never could.

The 'boycott' is a bit much, its clearly a luxury product and you pay a luxury price for the privilege of whatever you are getting. You don't boycott the Ritz because you cant afford to stay there, you go elsewhere.

I question how accurate this is. 40K is a pretty old game now - 30 years? A little more? Which means the teenager who played Rogue Trader in the late 80s is now in their mid 40s with substantial disposable income. I've probably dropped at least two grand in FW stuff over the last decade without really even thinking about it. My coworker just bought that gigantic ridiculous titan the size of a toddler.


I don't think there is any data to decide that "most 40k people can't afford FW".

 Ouze wrote:

 Orlanth wrote:

Stux wrote:
I would suspect that something like 90% of the people spouting vitriol against Forgeworld and claiming to boycott then have either never bought anything from them anyway, or could count the number of kits ever purchased direct from them on one hand.

That would also account for the vast majority of Dakka.

Most forum members cant realistically afford Forge World products and never could.

The 'boycott' is a bit much, its clearly a luxury product and you pay a luxury price for the privilege of whatever you are getting. You don't boycott the Ritz because you cant afford to stay there, you go elsewhere.

I question how accurate this is. 40K is a pretty old game now - 30 years? A little more? Which means the teenager who played Rogue Trader in the late 80s is now in their mid 40s with substantial disposable income. I've probably dropped at least two grand in FW stuff over the last decade without really even thinking about it. My coworker just bought that gigantic ridiculous titan the size of a toddler.

I don't think there is any data to decide that "most 40k people can't afford FW".

We don't know the stats, absolutely. It's a hunch.

But it will always skew young. The people who have more or less continuously played from Rogue Trader to now will be very few in number.

No boycott.

I don't NEED Forgeworld.

I LIKE it.

Yes it's ridiculously expensive and ridiculously cool.

I've bought some pieces. Will buy some more. Won't buy others because I don't like/ can't afford / can't justify.

I would agree that GW probably skews very young. In fact, I suspect a large percentage of their model is getting a little timmy in the store, selling them a few hundred bucks of Ultramarines or whatever the AOS equivalent is, and never seeing him again.

I don't at all think that's the FW model.

And of course, FW was alwasys a bit expensive but not outrageous until recently: when I bought their weathering powder set it was $15. That's obviously an outlier but you could have bought any number of Rhino doors, brass etch, decals, and small parts and models here and there without being the Monopoly Man like it's kind of being painted in the last page here.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Personally, I think the real Forge World outrage is their gakky website which selects a random country when you visit and then when you realize your order is being calculated in Zloty or Pesos, dumps the contents of the cart when you select the correct country. I've never seen any other web merchant anywhere on the internet that required dumping the contents of the cart to switch currencies.

 Ouze wrote:
I would agree that GW probably skews very young. In fact, I suspect a large percentage of their model is getting a little timmy in the store, selling them a few hundred bucks of Ultramarines or whatever the AOS equivalent is, and never seeing him again.

I don't at all think that's the FW model.

And of course, FW was alwasys a bit expensive but not outrageous until recently...

The idea of outrageous is a subjective thing. Theyve always been outrageous to me but then I think all GW pricing is too high.

This poll is going to be skewed by the British like me who are unaffected by the recent changes to their pricing policy.

I hated FW because it was pay to win, now the points have been updated its no longer that so I had been considering FW purchases but apparently the recent rules are creeping back to the old ways.

The other skew is that quite a few are ticking either box and are openly stating that they never have been and never will/likely never will be customers no matter the prices. So it doesn't really make any difference if they are or not boycotting because, by their own admission, they are not customers of FW at all anyway.

I used to collect their catalogs and think about what to buy for years. I finally put in a big order for some BFG stuff, some Epic stuff, a few other bits, 3 brass etch detail kits and some transfers. The quality of the resin was awful, and I stopped looking at their catalogs.

However, I am now extra boycotting FW. If I want to pay ridiculous prices and get screwed on shipping, I'll buy Kingdom Death!

I was never that interested in FW anyway. I could never take those "Experimental Rules" seriously. And about 90% of the FW units I see locally are just knockoffs and conversions with battlescribe rules. Pass.

I've never bought anything from Forgeworld either.

If we're going off hunches I would guess that most GW players start young but most of the money is spent by older GW players. I started as a kid and collected for about ~6 years, but since funds were limited I made purchases very slowly. I dropped out in my late teens. When I got back in I was thirty with a decent job and no kids, so I spent far more in that first year than I did the six years I was buying stuff as a kid. I think my story is pretty common. Just a guess though.

I have no doubt that there are whales that make up a significant portion of FW's sales and they get special consideration (this isn't limited to FW or even to the gaming industry, it's a pretty common situation). On the other hand people owning a few FW models seems very common, at least in my area. It doesn't seem to be the kind of thing where almost nobody has any FW models except one or two people who have ridiculous amounts. There are certainly people who have none, and people who have lots, but there are a lot of people that have some. That's just my anecdotal observation though.

Sunny Side Up wrote:


Adeptus Titanicus just came out. New Blood Bowl team literally on pre-order this week. Necromunda is chucking along with steady releases. Middle Earth wargame just relaunched with a new starter box.

They've literally never released more stuff than in the last couple of months than ever before.


I just suppose people don't "recognize" it as the stuff coming from the specialist games department (formerly FW) if it isn't resin Imperial Guard tanks or Rhino doors?

Why would anyone assume that they had come from fw when they have the the citadel logo on them? Specialist games and fw are not the same team, fw just produce upgrade kits and extra models for them.

What's amusing to me, is that my observation is generally of the opposite when it comes to Forgeworld purchasers. While I agree only well-to-do folks will be buying $3,000 Titans, I find that most of the people I see buying Forgeworld locally are the younger guys. The college-age kids who likely "shouldn't" be buying FW but are single, young, have some cash and aren't worried terribly about finances in the future.

I find the older gamers who can afford it (and honestly most GW gamers can afford FW - it's not prohibitively expensive by dint of actual financial stress...it's prohibitively priced because it's stupid for what you get) are the ones who aren't buying Forgeworld because more or less they simply think it's a bad investment. I only know a handful of people in the local community who couldn't throw $150-200 at some pretty Forgeworld toy. They can, but they often don't.

Can most people drop $600+ on a big Forgeworld toy? Maybe not without a month or two planning (or a convenient weekend when the wife is out of town). But saying people can't afford Forgeworld is a bit disingenuous. They "won't" afford Forgeworld is the reality from what I see.

Now, the question then becomes..what provides Forgeworld with their larget income. Is it large $500+ minis or is it waves of small $50-100 purchases? That, I have no idea.

 Overread wrote:
The other skew is that quite a few are ticking either box and are openly stating that they never have been and never will/likely never will be customers no matter the prices. So it doesn't really make any difference if they are or not boycotting because, by their own admission, they are not customers of FW at all anyway.

That's not a skew. If they are boycotting FW it doesn't matter when they started.

It's hard to boycott FW when their prices were already so absurd for what you receive that you never patronized them sans a decal sheet and set of LR doors, and those were pushing it. If I had been a regular customer, you can bet I'd be boycotting a large price increase- not to mention the blatant lie that this is somehow a benefit to the customer, because shipping is easier/cheaper.

It won't matter though, too many people simply see something they want and buy it because they just have to have that new shiny possession. The "rules give you something to do with your minis" crowd. GW is quite adept at harnessing their customer base's rampant materialism.

Stux wrote:

 Orlanth wrote:

Stux wrote:
I would suspect that something like 90% of the people spouting vitriol against Forgeworld and claiming to boycott then have either never bought anything from them anyway, or could count the number of kits ever purchased direct from them on one hand.

That would also account for the vast majority of Dakka.

Most forum members cant realistically afford Forge World products and never could.

The 'boycott' is a bit much, its clearly a luxury product and you pay a luxury price for the privilege of whatever you are getting. You don't boycott the Ritz because you cant afford to stay there, you go elsewhere.

I know of one or two Forge World whales through third parties, never met them or seen the collection. One is a severely disabled person who is on a vial of morphine a day. He lives for his hobby, it is all he has got. He buys lots of Forge World stuff. Forge World being a luxury service genuinely looks after its whales, as opposed to other gaming whale harvesters like Cloud Imperium who just laugh in their cups and exploit them, the difference is that Forge World see themselves as craftsmen doing a craftsmans service with a physical product, not as wheeler-dealer salesmen. It is very much in the mindset of the single customer orientated cottage industry the discerning connoisseur goes to. Which also has a webfront tacked on.
It is said from those who know him that his orders are placed on priority and everything is double checked for him, there is a personal customer rapport. A bit like rich ladies who shop habitually at Harrods get known by name and are looked after wherever they go.

Forge World being a luxury outfit relies heavily on its whales and the customer service it offers to them. There is a webfront for everyone and if they have to raise prices it doesn't effect their core business that much.

Exactly.

A grass roots boycott will do nothing. Forgeworld is about selling to whales, that's the business model.

Could you clarify - what is a 'whale' in the context of these responses?

A "Whale" in sales terms is a customer that spends a LOT of money. You get the little fishes, big fish... look out for the sharks... but you get a Whale? That's big money, little effort. They buy all the starter sets. They buy all the brushes. They buy an army worth of Knights in one go. They have so many unopened boxes at home, they could start their own store but just keep buying. That's a Whale.

Whales don't care about price. They want it, they can afford it, so they buy it.

PS: Not actively boycotting FW, but I generally can't afford it. I have purchased exactly one thing from them, and that's the Vendetta Upgrade Kit for a Valk... when the Vendetta was first introduced. Never regretted it, easier than trying to convert, but still pricey to get here.

But since that's the only thing I ever bought, and the only other thing I've ever really wanted was Kreigers... lulz... my money wasn't going to them anyhow.

 A Town Called Malus wrote:
Considering I've only ever bought two forge world products (XV88-2, now discontinued as GW wants people to buy the plastic overweight broadside model, and a Carmine Dragon to serve as Malekith's mount) and both of them were years ago, I suppose I am unintentionally boycotting them!

But that is just because they don't make anything I am interested in. I don't care for giant stompy robots, don't care for space marines of any variety, etc. so the majority of their stuff just doesn't appeal to me.

How did it work out with the Carmine? I've been wanting to pick up the mounted Carmine to use for a High Elf centrepiece model for a while now. I've just been putting it off as a carrot to get my models painte but I'm pretty much there now.

 NoiseMarine with Tinnitus wrote:

Stux wrote:

 Orlanth wrote:

Stux wrote:
I would suspect that something like 90% of the people spouting vitriol against Forgeworld and claiming to boycott then have either never bought anything from them anyway, or could count the number of kits ever purchased direct from them on one hand.

That would also account for the vast majority of Dakka.

Most forum members cant realistically afford Forge World products and never could.

The 'boycott' is a bit much, its clearly a luxury product and you pay a luxury price for the privilege of whatever you are getting. You don't boycott the Ritz because you cant afford to stay there, you go elsewhere.

I know of one or two Forge World whales through third parties, never met them or seen the collection. One is a severely disabled person who is on a vial of morphine a day. He lives for his hobby, it is all he has got. He buys lots of Forge World stuff. Forge World being a luxury service genuinely looks after its whales, as opposed to other gaming whale harvesters like Cloud Imperium who just laugh in their cups and exploit them, the difference is that Forge World see themselves as craftsmen doing a craftsmans service with a physical product, not as wheeler-dealer salesmen. It is very much in the mindset of the single customer orientated cottage industry the discerning connoisseur goes to. Which also has a webfront tacked on.
It is said from those who know him that his orders are placed on priority and everything is double checked for him, there is a personal customer rapport. A bit like rich ladies who shop habitually at Harrods get known by name and are looked after wherever they go.

Forge World being a luxury outfit relies heavily on its whales and the customer service it offers to them. There is a webfront for everyone and if they have to raise prices it doesn't effect their core business that much.

Exactly.

A grass roots boycott will do nothing. Forgeworld is about selling to whales, that's the business model.

Could you clarify - what is a 'whale' in the context of these responses?

It's a casino term that's been adopted into gaming in general as additional paid content became more and more commonplace. Basically people are catagorised into sizes based on how much they're willing to spend; and in general how easily they are to part with their money. Unfortunately this seems to be a more and more common business model.

 SHUPPET wrote:

 Overread wrote:
The other skew is that quite a few are ticking either box and are openly stating that they never have been and never will/likely never will be customers no matter the prices. So it doesn't really make any difference if they are or not boycotting because, by their own admission, they are not customers of FW at all anyway.

That's not a skew. If they are boycotting FW it doesn't matter when they started.

Agree with this. While demographics and how they purchase over time is interesting it's not really relevant to the core topic.

My point was two fold:

1)
Most of the people claiming to boycott weren't buying anything anyway. Sure, they may have bought one or two bits in the past, but they aren't active buyers, and therefore them 'boycotting' means nothing.

2)
The only people who actually matter as far as a boycott having any affect are the whales.

Stux wrote:

 SHUPPET wrote:

 Overread wrote:
The other skew is that quite a few are ticking either box and are openly stating that they never have been and never will/likely never will be customers no matter the prices. So it doesn't really make any difference if they are or not boycotting because, by their own admission, they are not customers of FW at all anyway.

That's not a skew. If they are boycotting FW it doesn't matter when they started.

Agree with this. While demographics and how they purchase over time is interesting it's not really relevant to the core topic.

My point was two fold:

1)
Most of the people claiming to boycott weren't buying anything anyway. Sure, they may have bought one or two bits in the past, but they aren't active buyers, and therefore them 'boycotting' means nothing.

2)
The only people who actually matter as far as a boycott having any affect are the whales.

I have no idea how we can measure #1, but #2 is doubtful. The whales leaving obviously has the largest impact, but price change won't bother them. However there is far more regular customers than there is whales, and if you lose enough of them it absolutely will have an impact. By your logic everyone would just raise prices for everything ever with zero repercussions.

And that's what I mean, people who are never buying anything from FW before the price rise are not boycotting them now as they were never the market in the first place, so them voting not to buy now isn't actually boycotting.

And I'd say that without seeing a full breakdown of FW's sales figures its impossible for us to say which market is more important - those who buy huge amounts of FW or the trickle feed of smaller purchases by a wider number of individuals. It might also be that those two groups have different product focuses within the FW product lines. Eg the AoS and much of the Xeno 40K stuff might be far more bought by many people buying fewer products; whilst the Marines and 30K stuff might be all whale market focused.

So a boycott of whale purchases might only impact select FW lines not the entire library of products.

 Overread wrote:
And that's what I mean, people who are never buying anything from FW before the price rise are not boycotting them now as they were never the market in the first place, so them voting not to buy now isn't actually boycotting.

I guess not to the relevance of the poll trying to see the impacts, you are right, it doesn't really make a difference I guess.



One thing I will say - people who started boycotting this month due to a "moral" dilemna over price gouging, do not exist. They have been openly price gouging for years, just ask Australians or New Zealands, they just began including a few more countries, it's not a secret. Anyone with a moral objection against price gouging was either already boycotting them already or didn't actually have that much of a moral dilemna with it at all when it didn't affect them. Anyone who stopped shopping with them this month did so because they can no longer afford to. My opinion.

 SHUPPET wrote:

Stux wrote:

 SHUPPET wrote:

 Overread wrote:
The other skew is that quite a few are ticking either box and are openly stating that they never have been and never will/likely never will be customers no matter the prices. So it doesn't really make any difference if they are or not boycotting because, by their own admission, they are not customers of FW at all anyway.

That's not a skew. If they are boycotting FW it doesn't matter when they started.

Agree with this. While demographics and how they purchase over time is interesting it's not really relevant to the core topic.

My point was two fold:

1)
Most of the people claiming to boycott weren't buying anything anyway. Sure, they may have bought one or two bits in the past, but they aren't active buyers, and therefore them 'boycotting' means nothing.

2)
The only people who actually matter as far as a boycott having any affect are the whales.

I have no idea how we can measure #1, but #2 is doubtful. The whales leaving obviously has the largest impact, but price change won't bother them. However there is far more regular customers than there is whales, and if you lose enough of them it absolutely will have an impact. By your logic everyone would just raise prices for everything ever with zero repercussions.

Not at all. There obviously is a tipping point. But as a boutique luxury range, normal forces don't apply in the same way to Forgeworld. Whales are a much bigger factor than for say core GW. A single whale is easily spending 100x what a median gamer is spending.

Anyway, whales aside, anyone interested in boycotts generally should give this a listen:

http://freakonomics.com/podcast/do-boycotts-work-a-new-freakonomics-radio-podcast/

Honestly, the fact that it's some 10% more expensive in euro doesn't affect me.

The reason I don't buy from Forgeworld is that they sell crap.

They discontinued some of my favorite kits and models, so I had to find other ways.

And whatever they have is low quality amateurish casting with questionable QC at crazy high prices.



I will start buying from ForgeWorld if:

- they get their prices to about 2x/3x recast at most
- they learn to cast without warping, bubbles or other defects
- they get their QC right
- they use the best resin there is


The problem here is that there are people out there who cast way better than FW, have proper QC, acceptable resin (generally worse than FW though) and very good prices.




Lastly, about "price gouging", I don't think that's what they're doing.

Instead, they're incorporating the cost of shipping ( -s if you include returns) and the currency variation in the price to make it equivalent for them to sell to UK, EU or US (or AU).

If you take the highest level of the USD in the past year, which would be a fair point if you're playing it safe as a company, we're talking 1.43 GBPUSD, that means your USD97 Eldar Avatar should be USD88 without considering shipping costs, which brings it to roughly 10% more expensive.

Does 10% in shipping costs difference for a FW Avatar make sense?

Definitely in my book, I don't think you can ship something from the UK to the US, risk included, for less than USD9 on top of the UK shipping.

What *is* questionable though, is VAT, as I don't think it should be charged to non-UK customers, and there is no VAT in the US - which means there might be an issue there, as the UK price does include 21% VAT.

I am not b,c of price, but they stop supporting Corsairs. I spent 2yrs trying to get their product, playing them with counts as (and the most fun i ever had in 40k ever) just for them to kill off the army.

If they bring back Corsairs i might buy from them again.

morgoth wrote:
Lastly, about "price gouging", I don't think that's what they're doing.

Instead, they're incorporating the cost of shipping ( -s if you include returns) and the currency variation in the price to make it equivalent for them to sell to UK, EU or US (or AU).

If you take the highest level of the USD in the past year, which would be a fair point if you're playing it safe as a company, we're talking 1.43 GBPUSD, that means your USD97 Eldar Avatar should be USD88 without considering shipping costs, which brings it to roughly 10% more expensive.

Does 10% in shipping costs difference for a FW Avatar make sense?

Definitely in my book, I don't think you can ship something from the UK to the US, risk included, for less than USD9 on top of the UK shipping.

What *is* questionable though, is VAT, as I don't think it should be charged to non-UK customers, and there is no VAT in the US - which means there might be an issue there, as the UK price does include 21% VAT.

Except it's very blatantly price gouging in some cases. A set of rhino doors went from £14 to AU$40, the current exchange rate puts £14 at AU$25.44. That is quite frankly insane. That US$97 eldar avatar you mentioned? AU$174. When was the last time the pound was worth almost 3 Australian dollars? Baking in the exchange rate plus a bit of leg room for fluctuations is fine. Close to doubling the price of items is not. Postage should never be something baked into items like this. It's very unlikely that someone outside of Europe will be buying only a single kit in which case putting anything extra into the price of a kit to cover postage is insane. Adding a second set of rhino doors does not double the shipping cost.

That said I'm not boycotting anything. I was only going to buy some rhino doors and now I won't be because it doubles the cost of a rhino and that isn't worth it to me. I still buy GW plastic kits that have pretty much the same markup, I buy them from a hobby store that has 20% off RRP but I still buy them. Buying from FW just isn't worth it for me anymore. It's only really a boycott if someone in UK or somewhere with a tiny markup stops buying because of the international markup. Which we know they won't because they've had no problem with GW gouging the international market on plastic for years. If you stop buying something because the price for you has increased, whether you can afford the new price or not, isn't a boycott. It's just reevaluating if the product is worth it to you.

You have to pay shipping costs anyway
It's cheaper to buy it in England, have it shipped to a friend, and have that friend ship it to you, which should cost MORE if the price was shipping.
Not to mention the deals that businesses get with shipping companies.

At this point it's absurd to say it's to cover shipping and handling lol

 SHUPPET wrote:
You have to pay shipping costs anyway
It's cheaper to buy it in England, have it shipped to a friend, and have that friend ship it to you, which should cost MORE if the price was shipping.
Not to mention the deals that businesses get with shipping companies.

At this point it's absurd to say it's to cover shipping and handling lol

100% agree.
Unfortunately I think the change was more to bring FW into line with GW main. As someone pointed out it was cheaper to by FW unit + upgrade kits than the unit kit in Aus$.

I will not be Boycotting Forgeworld, their action's don't make me want to boycott them, however, it does limit my desire to buy anything from their store though. Why spend two or even three times more then a similar model in the GW range when I can just buy 2 or 3 of the GW models instead. I mean I would love some Meka Dreadz and others but I tend to build my army piece by piece.

Stux wrote:
I would suspect that something like 90% of the people spouting vitriol against Forgeworld and claiming to boycott then have either never bought anything from them anyway, or could count the number of kits ever purchased direct from them on one hand.

I guess I am a 10% -er!

<—- I have been buying from GW and FW since 2008. My FW orders always hit the free shipping mark (200 or 250 British pound moneys). I easily have $3k in FW gak in my basement. I have been critical of people that buy from recasters in the past. All of my HH gak is legit from FW even though a lot of HH players I talk to brag about their China recasts.

This price increase? feth you, FW. Seriously, feth you. Your US/UK conversion is too far out of whack.

I have also sent an email telling them that as a long time customer, they have lost me for good. Until they roll back this BS policy, they will never see another dime from me.

 kronk wrote:

Stux wrote:
I would suspect that something like 90% of the people spouting vitriol against Forgeworld and claiming to boycott then have either never bought anything from them anyway, or could count the number of kits ever purchased direct from them on one hand.

I guess I am a 10% -er!

<—- I have been buying from GW and FW since 2008. My FW orders always hit the free shipping mark (200 or 250 British pound moneys). I easily have $3k in FW gak in my basement. I have been critical of people that buy from recasters in the past. All of my HH gak is legit from FW even though a lot of HH players I talk to brag about their China recasts.

This price increase? feth you, FW. Seriously, feth you. Your US/UK conversion is too far out of whack.

I have also sent an email telling them that as a little g time customer, they have lost me for good. Until they roll back this BS policy, they will never see another dime from me.

I would say that you are yes, at least top 10% of GW gamers by amount spent on Forgeworld.

My contribution to the data is:

Personally spent nothing directly. Spent about £100 total on bits through eBay.
Gaming group: several people who've never bought anything from FW, and one guy who works for Games Workshop and even with his discount has probably still only spent close to £100 on FW products.

To be clear, I wasn’t claiming to be a whale, as I know guys that have spent WAY more than I ever will through FW. Nor was I being snarky to you, Stux.

I was just pissed about the price increase. Funny, I am now in “meh” mode, meaning “ I will miss FW as much as my ex. Not as all.”

 kronk wrote:
To be clear, I wasn’t claiming to be a whale, as I know guys that have spent WAY more than I ever will through FW. Nor was I being snarky to you, Stux.

I was just pissed about the price increase. Funny, I am now in “meh” mode, meaning “ I will miss FW as much as my ex. Not as all.”

Don't worry, I didn't take it as snarky all friendly here!

No, I wouldn't say you're a whale either. An intermediate level user perhaps.

I want the orc character set. Warboss and BSB. £35 is expensive but not especially so, at least the price has not ye gone up.

Is the Forge world price rise something in planning or something already done?

Allowing the fact that I just bought Kurt Helborg on the GW made to order range (which needs a lot longer than one week), and he cost £25 on his steed, I am prepared to pay £35.

Its really close to the upper limit I am prepared to pay, but not beyond.

Howe much is Forge World P&P, this would be my first order since I bought a Wave Serpent upgrade kit in 2002.

 Orlanth wrote:
I want the orc character set. Warboss and BSB. £35 is expensive but not especially so, at least the price has not ye gone up.

Is the Forge world price rise something in planning or something already done?

Allowing the fact that I just bought Kurt Helborg on the GW made to order range (which needs a lot longer than one week), and he cost £25 on his steed, I am prepared to pay £35.

Its really close to the upper limit I am prepared to pay, but not beyond.

Howe much is Forge World P&P, this would be my first order since I bought a Wave Serpent upgrade kit in 2002.

It's a change to the international pricing model, so won't affect you if you're based in the UK as your flag suggests!

They've gone from buying in GBP and just converting at payment to a model where every country has its own store with regional pricing.

And I take it they have pulled the Oz trick with currency exchange rates?

I can see how that could suck.
Pissing off the US market is probably not wise.

Maybe is a prep for Brexit, maybe just myopic leadership. I always wondered where Kirby went, maybe he or his clone is nesting Forge World twirling their moustache and dreaming of profits-now.

Like a few users, I'm not so much boycotting as simply not buying from a lot in the first place. The most I've bought is a Warp Hunter, two Hornets, and two Tetras, and as well as simply being all I really want from FW--except maybe the Necron Sentry Pylon, but the Heat Cannon is OOP, so I guess not--the quality hardly lived up to the premium pricing.

There wasn't much of the Eldar stuff that didn't need a warm water bath and drastic realignment, and a fair bit simply had an unreasonable amount of holes, gouges, or straight-up miscasting. I even contacted them about the Tetras I recieved having whopping great holes in the hull, some of which went right through the model almost as if they'd been drilled out, and got back the equivalent of a shrug and 'meh'.

Not too bothered by the price increase, personally. My purchases are so few and far between and so specific that I don’t really mind the premium that they demand. Don’t get me wrong, I’d love them to be cheaper, but I’m just not interested in the bulk of what FW offers.

My current hobby focus for the forseeable future is mainly AoS, Necromunda and AT, but mostly AoS. That effectively limits my purchases to maybe, at most 1/4th of FW’s offerings.

FW’s AoS catalogue isn’t all that impressive and I already own everything I want from that range from purchases in years previous. Unless they bulk out the Fimirach with new stuff, I don’t see myself buying anything from their AoS range currently. If they bring back the Curs’d Ettin and Incarnate of Beasts, its game on as well.

For Necromunda, I recently (before the price increase) received my order of 2 of every character and upgrade kit. I’m set until the next spread of characters and upgrades come out, so no purchases for at least another 6 months unless they drop a ton of new stuff in that time frame.

Nothing is currently available for AT, so I’m safe there. Once(if) they release new Titans, upgrade kits, weapon options or Legio specific shoulderpads/icons and such, I’ll be getting those, no question.

Buying from FW was always painful, and its going to get more painful from here out, but I justify it by how specific and rare my purchases are. YMMV, but thats where I’m at, currently. I can definitely sympathize with folks that have been priced out. I completely understand it. If I played 30K or 40K, I’d probably be singing a different tune.

Now I know I will not be effected my opinion hasnt changed, not from lack of care but lack of interest.

Were I outside the UK I might still buy the orc BSB I am after. Its a BSB its a highlight of a large army mostly of cheap plastics I can afford to splash out on a centrepiece miniature. Even though its expensive for what it is, it's focus makes it special.
I wanted the dwarf BSB/character sert also, but that is no longer available and sell for mad money on eBay.
I went with Russian Alternative instead and am happy.

Were I collecting Imperial Guard and considering Forge World a hike on this level would make all the difference, if I was buying it anyway.

Deleted

 Bi'ios wrote:
Since I’m a reasonable adult who doesn’t throw a tantrum when things change, I’m not boycotting anything, and if you are, I very strongly suggest you reevaluate your priorities.

You may not mind being taken advantage of, but others do. There is nothing immature about refusing to waste your income on overpriced stuff- especially when the company jacking up said price lies to your face about it. The word "boycott" may have more of a political connotation, but ceasing to purchase from a company with poor business practices is the only thing that might cause said company to change its behavior.

Blastaar wrote:

 Bi'ios wrote:
Since I’m a reasonable adult who doesn’t throw a tantrum when things change, I’m not boycotting anything, and if you are, I very strongly suggest you reevaluate your priorities.

You may not mind being taken advantage of, but others do. There is nothing immature about refusing to waste your income on overpriced stuff- especially when the company jacking up said price lies to your face about it. The word "boycott" may have more of a political connotation, but ceasing to purchase from a company with poor business practices is the only thing that might cause said company to change its behavior.

Exactly. No matter whether you choose to continue to support them or not, I feel like the only immature stance that can be taken is getting upset that others don't do the same, no matter which side of the decision you may fall on.

Haven't placed an order post change. Prior I bought ten tyrant siege, a whirlwind scorpius, three quad mortar rapiers, two sets of ten iron havocs, etc.

Not boycotting really, but the MASSIVE jump in prices to get FW stuff in AU just means I can no longer afford the Porphyrion or Warhound I was eyeing off. Both went up almost $200 so I'll just go back to lurking on ebay for second hand ones.

Discontinuing the Chaos Warhound doesn't help my enthusiasm either...

In the words of the God Emperor himself: China.

Thanks GW :^)

 Bi'ios wrote:
Since I’m a reasonable adult who doesn’t throw a tantrum when things change, I’m not boycotting anything, and if you are, I very strongly suggest you reevaluate your priorities.

Refusing to pay an additional 20-46% more depending on where you live outside the UK, for the exact same product isn't so much a tantrum as it is common sense. Want to see what that difference looks like for Australians who want to buy a warlord titan?



They are buying the exact same product as those in the UK, yet pay 469 pounds more because reasons. To those in the UK who think this doesn't impact you, it will. If people from around the globe are no longer buying product or buying less product, it impacts the entire hobby. Which means less releases, less models for everyone.

 kronk wrote:

Stux wrote:
I would suspect that something like 90% of the people spouting vitriol against Forgeworld and claiming to boycott then have either never bought anything from them anyway, or could count the number of kits ever purchased direct from them on one hand.

I guess I am a 10% -er!

<—- I have been buying from GW and FW since 2008. My FW orders always hit the free shipping mark (200 or 250 British pound moneys). I easily have $3k in FW gak in my basement. I have been critical of people that buy from recasters in the past. All of my HH gak is legit from FW even though a lot of HH players I talk to brag about their China recasts.

This price increase? feth you, FW. Seriously, feth you. Your US/UK conversion is too far out of whack.

I have also sent an email telling them that as a long time customer, they have lost me for good. Until they roll back this BS policy, they will never see another dime from me.

So are you boycotting GW prime as well then? After all they have same conversion rate...Or are you another of these who have principle "if GW does X it's all right, if FW does same it's bad"...

Boycot FW sure but boycot GW as well then since they do same and are almost certainly behind this as well.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Commissar Benny wrote:

 Bi'ios wrote:
Since I’m a reasonable adult who doesn’t throw a tantrum when things change, I’m not boycotting anything, and if you are, I very strongly suggest you reevaluate your priorities.

Refusing to pay an additional 20-46% more depending on where you live outside the UK, for the exact same product isn't so much a tantrum as it is common sense. Want to see what that difference looks like for Australians who want to buy a warlord titan?



They are buying the exact same product as those in the UK, yet pay 469 pounds more because reasons. To those in the UK who think this doesn't impact you, it will. If people from around the globe are no longer buying product or buying less product, it impacts the entire hobby. Which means less releases, less models for everyone.

So I presume your GW model count is 0 as well from many many years ago. You don't have 8th ed rules and codexes either as US pays more for it than they should based on conversation rates than UK. Your newest purchase from GW would thus be decades ago.

I don't know why you're getting so militant about this tneva, that second person never even said they were boycotting either of the stores. Regardless, there's a ton of people who never ever buy models GW, so I'm not sure what your point is. Maybe that's rare where you are? Where I'm at in Australia, my local T.O. would literally ask the group if they'd like anything before he submits group orders through a recaster on people's behalf, and I know that it's not a rarity amongst our communities. GW doesn't have a lot of goodwill left here.

tneva82 wrote:
So I presume your GW model count is 0 as well from many many years ago. You don't have 8th ed rules and codexes either as US pays more for it than they should based on conversation rates than UK. Your newest purchase from GW would thus be decades ago.

Its one thing to increase the price of your products incrementally over decades than to increase the price of your products 46% overnight with no foreseeable benefit to the customer. GW's models have improved in quality over the years (generally speaking). I'm willing to pay more for quality. FW on the other hand, their quality has declined. They have less products available now for 40k players than they did a decade ago. I have models that no longer have rules & thus cannot use because FW no longer supports them. The amount of work I have to do to cleanup models is unacceptable. 3rd party startups are producing better quality products out of their garages.

I don't think them not currently producing the models I want counts as me boycotting them.

Edit: Eh, looks like I'm wrong on that. They DO make something I want! (I just saw that 30k Whirlwind with the giant RT-esque rocket launchers. That's going to get added to the collection)

tneva82 wrote:
So I presume your GW model count is 0 as well from many many years ago. You don't have 8th ed rules and codexes either as US pays more for it than they should based on conversation rates than UK. Your newest purchase from GW would thus be decades ago.

Except it doesn't really work like that. Paying an extra ~50% or something on a plastic kit or codex doesn't hurt as much in the short term than it does with a resin kit, especially something like a titan. Sure if you spend the amount of a titan on plastic kits you're paying the same markup and wasting money. But when those purchases are spread out over a year the customer feels it a lot less. People are much more likely to fine with paying an extra AU$15 for a rhino, especially when they can get it at 20% off bringing to only being an extra AU$4 than they are to be fine paying an extra AU$845 on a titan. They have no options to get a discount on FW models and have to wait 3 weeks for it to even arrive. When the biggest single kit from GW currently is the knight castellan is £100 for a AU$70 markup on RRP, only a AU$20 markup with a 20% discount it is a much less bitter pill to swallow. You only really start to notice it with the more expensive resin kits or buying many kits at once.

It's also been ~8 years or so since we've been forbidden from buying plastic kits internationally. Anyone who couldn't stand that is long gone from the hobby or they got over it by now.

TL;DR FW kits are much more expensive and the change was sudden. People are used to the plastic markup by now but sticker shock on the more expensive resin kits hits harder. An extra 50% is much easier to swallow on a £22 kit than a £1,293 kit.

The other thing is that right up until the prices rose the marketing that GW put out was all indicating that the FW prices were going to go DOWN in terms of shipping and that they'd also be posted faster.There was no hint nor warning that the prices on the models themselves were going to significantly rise on everything.

So not only is it a shock at sudden price rises, but it was a shock for a lot because they were hoping to make an order and have the postage and overall price of the order be cheaper for them. So you had a lot of people lining up ready to order who suddenly found that what they wanted was 50% more expensive before postage.

That isn't just a small increase but the kind that makes someone stop buying either on policy or because they simply don't have the money to cover it.

Haven't really felt compelled to boycot them because they simply haven't been releasing anything I care about. Heresy Marines and more Banannamarines are all we've gotten from them since forever.

When they do release something I want, I'll be sure to buy a recast of it though.

I live in the UK, and I just scratchbuild anyway.

A better question would be for -non- brits. As they have no reason to Boycott forgeworld. Australians however were hit by a 60% + 10% GST (New law passed) price increase on most items.

China will be loving this price increase. And I'll be boycotting FW.

 Commissar Benny wrote:
To those in the UK who think this doesn't impact you, it will. If people from around the globe are no longer buying product or buying less product, it impacts the entire hobby. Which means less releases, less models for everyone.

This smacks of accusing the UK community base as self centered and thoughtless of others.
Yes, are are not experiencing this price hike, but we have seen major price jumps in the past, and are not in approval of GW's overseas retail policies.

I am & I am not!
Bought 3 times from them. Problems 3 times, good customers services fixes what they forgot or mess up but can not fixes the poor quality of the product.

So I do not buy directly from them anymore. I only buy second hand FW models and ask a lot of pictures before doing it.
I have bought a Sicaran, a Arvus lighter, a Vulture Gunship, a trojan, and must of my tauros on second hand.

Quality is not meeting the price!

 Orlanth wrote:

 Commissar Benny wrote:
To those in the UK who think this doesn't impact you, it will. If people from around the globe are no longer buying product or buying less product, it impacts the entire hobby. Which means less releases, less models for everyone.

This smacks of accusing the UK community base as self centered and thoughtless of others.
Yes, are are not experiencing this price hike, but we have seen major price jumps in the past, and are not in approval of GW's overseas retail policies.

Agreed. We didn't see a movement to boycott from the US over Australian pricing ever did we?

Also, I'm yet to be convinced that any US attempt to boycott now is having significant impact on Forgeworld. Feels like a lot of shouting in an echo chamber to me.

I can't really say that I'm boycotting it about a month before the shift I purchased, in one big swoop, all but one model that I've wanted. I don't really have anything at the moment to boycott with, but should something come in the future I won't be getting it unless we see some change.

There's not really anything I want to buy from them at the moment, but if there was, I'd find it really hard to hold a moral objection from buying from them due to their inflated prices and continue to buy regular GW stuff at their equally inflated prices. I totally get the outrage, but I don't get why its somehow okay to be overcharged on the normal stuff just because you're used to it.

 LunarSol wrote:
There's not really anything I want to buy from them at the moment, but if there was, I'd find it really hard to hold a moral objection from buying from them due to their inflated prices and continue to buy regular GW stuff at their equally inflated prices. I totally get the outrage, but I don't get why its somehow okay to be overcharged on the normal stuff just because you're used to it.

It's because a 30% markup on a plastic unit doesn't hurt the wallet anywhere near as much as a 30% markup on FW resin. Depending where you shop you can get up to 20% off RRP on plastic from third party stockists too. No such luck with FW, gotta buy it direct.

While the Aus tax from GW hurts, it's not quite so bad 'cause at the very least they give us a place to game with nice terrain, a good manager (though obviously that's going to vary from store to store) and monthly comps and prizes to offset the ball kicking they give us on price.

FW though? Nothing like that to justify an already hefty pricetag going up 30% or more. I'm glad I brought an excess of my Thousand Sons 30k army a while back in a couple of batches as there's no way they're getting reinforcements past the ~4k they already have under this pricing scheme. The bald faced lies about the cost being "shipping improvements" only rubs further salt into the wound. If it was really a shipping cost, then surely that's what the seperate shipping charge is for?

 IronBrand wrote:

 LunarSol wrote:
There's not really anything I want to buy from them at the moment, but if there was, I'd find it really hard to hold a moral objection from buying from them due to their inflated prices and continue to buy regular GW stuff at their equally inflated prices. I totally get the outrage, but I don't get why its somehow okay to be overcharged on the normal stuff just because you're used to it.

It's because a 30% markup on a plastic unit doesn't hurt the wallet anywhere near as much as a 30% markup on FW resin. Depending where you shop you can get up to 20% off RRP on plastic from third party stockists too. No such luck with FW, gotta buy it direct.

That's.... fine? Ultimately you're arguing that the product isn't worth the asking price. You're essentially still arguing that if you're suggesting that the plastics are okay because you can get it at a discount somewhere. That very well may be true; I just think arguing that one price hike demands bans and boycotts while another is okay kind of misses the point of the outrage. Extra true when you're still paying the same person the same increase. Refusing to pay GW $170 for a a Spartan tank because it should only cost about $143 but being okay with paying GW $170 for a Castellan that should only cost about $130 seems.... inconsistent? at the very least.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Drasius wrote:
While the Aus tax from GW hurts, it's not quite so bad 'cause at the very least they give us a place to game with nice terrain, a good manager (though obviously that's going to vary from store to store) and monthly comps and prizes to offset the ball kicking they give us on price.

FW though? Nothing like that to justify an already hefty pricetag going up 30% or more. I'm glad I brought an excess of my Thousand Sons 30k army a while back in a couple of batches as there's no way they're getting reinforcements past the ~4k they already have under this pricing scheme. The bald faced lies about the cost being "shipping improvements" only rubs further salt into the wound. If it was really a shipping cost, then surely that's what the seperate shipping charge is for?

You know they're the same company, right?

 LunarSol wrote:
You know they're the same company, right?

You know that the parent company will still tally up which division sold what, right?

Not sure if boycott is the right word. I was going to buy a couple leviathan dreads w/ arms from them. Didn't want to go the recaster route because it didn't seem worth the risk to get a poorly done model for my money.

Now, with the increased prices, I just don't think it is worth it. Not out of any moral outrage (they are a company and can charge what they want) but more a sense of it's just not worth the price anymore. The cost difference between the recast and the authentic version is so great now that it's almost worth the risk.

I just can't pull the trigger on a recast (I don't usually consider myself a moral high-road person but I would be so embarrassed if I brought it to a game and someone called me out or I even thought that they knew) but knowing that the equivalent model is out there at less than half the cost just makes me feel like a sucker for spending that much more.

 Drasius wrote:

 LunarSol wrote:
You know they're the same company, right?

You know that the parent company will still tally up which division sold what, right?

Actually they go out of their way to hide how much FW makes in their shareholders reports.
And combine FW into GW direct sales, it's odd but they don't seem to want to have to acknowledge or esplain FW to shareholders.

 Drasius wrote:

 LunarSol wrote:
You know they're the same company, right?

You know that the parent company will still tally up which division sold what, right?

By all means, support the retail channel. It's a high risk division that provides real benefits for players and deserves the business it gets. FW is an inherently low risk outlet for them. That's like.... pretty much the whole point.

Lets be real though, no one in the FW chain woke up one morning and said, "I know, lets charge a bunch more for our stuff to make more money!" The price change is a result of GW accepting foreign currency at the same abysmal rate they do everywhere else. The parent company did this, it knew exactly what it was doing and it probably knows exactly how people would respond and they likely don't really care. I don't like it, but I'm not going to storm off and give the same people my money for doing the exact same thing to me just because they're wearing a different hat.

just ordered a Damocles Rhino
€50 plus €8 postage to Ireland
however in ireland we have a parcel service which gives the use of a UK address
so worked out at £40 plus £3.50 postage (~€50) plus €3.50 service charge for the UK address

minimal saving but i still like to feel like i got one up on them!!!

 Drasius wrote:
While the Aus tax from GW hurts, it's not quite so bad 'cause at the very least they give us a place to game with nice terrain, a good manager (though obviously that's going to vary from store to store) and monthly comps and prizes to offset the ball kicking they give us on price.

Jeez wish I got that.

bananathug wrote:
Not sure if boycott is the right word. I was going to buy a couple leviathan dreads w/ arms from them. Didn't want to go the recaster route because it didn't seem worth the risk to get a poorly done model for my money.

Now, with the increased prices, I just don't think it is worth it. Not out of any moral outrage (they are a company and can charge what they want) but more a sense of it's just not worth the price anymore. The cost difference between the recast and the authentic version is so great now that it's almost worth the risk.

I just can't pull the trigger on a recast (I don't usually consider myself a moral high-road person but I would be so embarrassed if I brought it to a game and someone called me out or I even thought that they knew) but knowing that the equivalent model is out there at less than half the cost just makes me feel like a sucker for spending that much more.

I have a legit FW Leviathan and my buddy has a Chinacast Leviathan. I cannot tell them apart and will likely be buying 100% Chinacast from now on unless FW does something amazing to generate some serious good will. Honestly, the price hike wasn't even what pissed me off as I am fortunate enough to be able to afford the FW models I want/need for my armies even at the new prices, it was the insulting way they portrayed it as being in my best interests. If you're going to feth me, be honest about it, or at the very least come up with a prettier lie than the one they went with.

 Galef wrote:
I wouldn't use the word 'boycott' but I've never actually purchased anything from FW. The closest thing I've got are 2 recast Hornets.
The price has always been an issue, but the deal breaker for me is the accessibility. I'm old fashioned in that I like to go to a store to buy stuff, only recently using eBay for its convenience. I can't buy FW stuff at a store, eBay is even more expensive for FW stuff and the direct shipping takes forever.

Add to the fact that GW already has way, WAY too much variety as-is (in that I can't keep up with what's out there and new) and I can only see the demise of FW as a good thing.
Not boycotting, just glad there will be less to think about.

-

Unless you happen to be a chaos player who wants to run with drop pods that happen to be in the lore, but are mysteriously absent from the model range. For me, as soon as the chaos holes are plugged then its a sad evil. This is me being biased btw. I just thought it must be damn nice to be able to complain about having to many choices to play;D

 LunarSol wrote:
That's.... fine? Ultimately you're arguing that the product isn't worth the asking price. You're essentially still arguing that if you're suggesting that the plastics are okay because you can get it at a discount somewhere. That very well may be true; I just think arguing that one price hike demands bans and boycotts while another is okay kind of misses the point of the outrage. Extra true when you're still paying the same person the same increase. Refusing to pay GW $170 for a a Spartan tank because it should only cost about $143 but being okay with paying GW $170 for a Castellan that should only cost about $130 seems.... inconsistent? at the very least.

I'm not arguing for boycotts. I've always held the opinion that stopping buying over the price change isn't boycotting, it's reevaluating the value. Boycotting IMO is on a moral ground, i.e. a player in the UK boycotting over the international pricing.

With the example of the spartan and castellan. In Australia the spartan went from £110 to AU$260 which at the current exchange rate works out to roughly a AU$60 markup. Whereas the castellan is £100 to AU$280 RRP, it's even more of a markup than the spartan converting to ~AU$183 at the current rate for a markup of AU$97. However, I buy my plastics at a store that gives 20% of RRP. So I get a castellan for AU$224 which is only a ~22% markup. While the spartan works out at a roughly 53% markup you still have to pay postage on top and wait 3 weeks for it to arrive that's one of the better kits for the new FW pricing. Rhino doors almost doubled in price going from ~AU$25 when buying in pounds to AU$40 and some titans work out as having a ~AU$900 price increase with the new pricing model.

Ordering plastic through a third party at a ~20% markup over the British pricing feels a hell of a lot better than buying from FW, paying them ~50% markup, still paying for postage and having to wait three weeks for it to arrive. So no, it isn't incosistent to be fine with technically the same RRP markup on the plastic as the FW resin. Most Australians would agree that only being forced to pay an extra 20% on a castellan for being Australian is a damn bargain compared to how we usually get shafted.

Obviously it varies from country to country and kit to kit but Australia is typically the worst when it comes to getting shafted on price and even we're really not paying much of a markup in price on plastic unless you're paying full retail.

I have job.. I find it extremely expensive but I'm not boycotting. I also think boycotting will exasperate the issue and is honestly fething slowed

The prices are what they are. I just ordered like $300AU or so of stuff from there because I wanted it. The game is an extravagance, if I want something I buy it, if I think something is to expensive I don't buy it. I personally think that if people don't buy certain products they will just reduce that line and axe it, over an entire overhaul of the pricing system. So I am gunna just buy what I have always wanted over the next few months, just incase.

Ice_can wrote:

 Drasius wrote:

 LunarSol wrote:
You know they're the same company, right?

You know that the parent company will still tally up which division sold what, right?

Actually they go out of their way to hide how much FW makes in their shareholders reports.
And combine FW into GW direct sales, it's odd but they don't seem to want to have to acknowledge or esplain FW to shareholders.

Whatever they report to the market, you're kidding yourself if you don't think they know exactly who sold what. Have a chat to a store manager sometime, they'll likely be more than happy to tell you about how each store has it's targets and that stores run a very real risk of getting shut down if they're not performing. It'll be no different on a larger scale for FW. I'm not implying that a few AU/NZ/US customers turning off the taps will cause them to shut down FW, but I'd suggest that they will take note that they've dropped a noticeable portion of sales from the regions most affected by the regional pricing scam.

LunarSol wrote:

 Drasius wrote:

 LunarSol wrote:
You know they're the same company, right?

You know that the parent company will still tally up which division sold what, right?

By all means, support the retail channel. It's a high risk division that provides real benefits for players and deserves the business it gets. FW is an inherently low risk outlet for them. That's like.... pretty much the whole point.

Lets be real though, no one in the FW chain woke up one morning and said, "I know, lets charge a bunch more for our stuff to make more money!" The price change is a result of GW accepting foreign currency at the same abysmal rate they do everywhere else. The parent company did this, it knew exactly what it was doing and it probably knows exactly how people would respond and they likely don't really care. I don't like it, but I'm not going to storm off and give the same people my money for doing the exact same thing to me just because they're wearing a different hat.

Oh, for sure, GW has been kicking aussies (and kiwis) in the nuts over price for years, but at least the prices are a bit closer to the global average, especially on big kits (sometimes a big kit actually works out cheaper, it's super weird). I'd almost expect the FW lads were told, "hey, we can get away with charging the non-brits well over the exchange rate, how 'bout you gents give it a bash too!".

I'm definitely not storming off to give my money to GW instead of FW, I'm simply not going to buy any more 30k toys or if I do get the urge to splurge, for the first time ever I will consider chinaforge on principle alone. Hell, FW is effectively banned in my GW, I play 30k with another group who're exclusively heresy players. My spend on GW also won't change, I'll continue to collect stuff I want, though they've not made much I'm keen on recently. Maybe that'll change when they release some new SoB - if they're close enough to my metal models that the styles don't clash horribly, I will probably grab some new toys for them.

 Drasius wrote:

Oh, for sure, GW has been kicking aussies (and kiwis) in the nuts over price for years, but at least the prices are a bit closer to the global average, especially on big kits (sometimes a big kit actually works out cheaper, it's super weird). I'd almost expect the FW lads were told, "hey, we can get away with charging the non-brits well over the exchange rate, how 'bout you gents give it a bash too!".

It's funny because if American's hadn't been so militant for years and years about "Australians are just whining, the mark up must be tax, nobody is price gouging, blah blah blah", and had supported AUS/NZ in their complaints instead of throwing them under the bus and rallying against them, then it's quite possible that FW wouldn't have felt so comfortable doing the same thing to American's today.


So they'll have to forgive me if I don't have an ounce of sympathy for their 20% mark ups, while we've been getting hit with 80% mark ups for however long.

 SHUPPET wrote:

 Drasius wrote:

Oh, for sure, GW has been kicking aussies (and kiwis) in the nuts over price for years, but at least the prices are a bit closer to the global average, especially on big kits (sometimes a big kit actually works out cheaper, it's super weird). I'd almost expect the FW lads were told, "hey, we can get away with charging the non-brits well over the exchange rate, how 'bout you gents give it a bash too!".

It's funny because if American's hadn't been so militant for years and years about "Australians are just whining, the mark up must be tax, nobody is price gouging, blah blah blah", and had supported AUS/NZ in their complaints instead of throwing them under the bus and rallying against them, then it's quite possible that FW wouldn't have felt so comfortable doing the same thing to American's today.


So they'll have to forgive me if I don't have an ounce of sympathy for their 20% mark ups, while we've been getting hit with 80% mark ups for however long.

That’s a serious chip on your shoulder. I’m not sure where your getting that idea. Anyone gouging anyone is always despicable.

 Stormonu wrote:
That’s a serious chip on your shoulder. I’m not sure where your getting that idea. Anyone gouging anyone is always despicable.

He's getting it from the experience of being Australian. The typical international response to Aussies getting gouged on anything is "well that sucks lol". Then when they have to deal with the insane prices we have to every day because there's a shortage like with RAM or the inflation on graphics cards from mining there's outrage and suddenly the sky is falling. It's human nature to only truly care about something if it affects you directly or someone you care about. If it isn't directly affecting a person they tend to brush it off as hyperbole. So Australians are typically apathetic or even amused when others are hit with the stuff we've been hit with for years.

Another good example was when blizzard finally moved the Australian World of Warcraft servers to actually being hosted in Australia. All the Americans who played on the Australian severs to get an advantage in PVP by virtue of having 1/7th the latency of the Australian players raged that the game was now "literally unplayable" because they suddenly had to experience the lag those Australians had been living with since the game launched. The response from the Australian playerbase was of course to just laugh in their faces.

 IronBrand wrote:

 LunarSol wrote:
That's.... fine? Ultimately you're arguing that the product isn't worth the asking price. You're essentially still arguing that if you're suggesting that the plastics are okay because you can get it at a discount somewhere. That very well may be true; I just think arguing that one price hike demands bans and boycotts while another is okay kind of misses the point of the outrage. Extra true when you're still paying the same person the same increase. Refusing to pay GW $170 for a a Spartan tank because it should only cost about $143 but being okay with paying GW $170 for a Castellan that should only cost about $130 seems.... inconsistent? at the very least.

I'm not arguing for boycotts. I've always held the opinion that stopping buying over the price change isn't boycotting, it's reevaluating the value. Boycotting IMO is on a moral ground, i.e. a player in the UK boycotting over the international pricing.

Thats why im boycotting, they had for me the perfect army, the most fun i've ever had, and amazingly balance (without the 1 formation that wasnt allow in tournaments anyways), but they didnt support it for 2yrs+, then they decided to can the army (Corsairs).

Been boycotting FW my whole life.

Paying more for worse models never really did it for me...GW could easily make 90% of these models in plastic but doesn't because FW is a separate entity within GW and for some reason has a lot of sway. Hopefully with this new cash grab GW stock holders will see that FW is a burden the company can no longer tolerate. Absolve into GW. Then we can get plastic kits for titans unique FW tanks and stuff...for half the cost...and GW will make twice the money off of them too.

Plus - we all know the reason FW prices are going up...

 Stormonu wrote:

 SHUPPET wrote:

 Drasius wrote:

Oh, for sure, GW has been kicking aussies (and kiwis) in the nuts over price for years, but at least the prices are a bit closer to the global average, especially on big kits (sometimes a big kit actually works out cheaper, it's super weird). I'd almost expect the FW lads were told, "hey, we can get away with charging the non-brits well over the exchange rate, how 'bout you gents give it a bash too!".

It's funny because if American's hadn't been so militant for years and years about "Australians are just whining, the mark up must be tax, nobody is price gouging, blah blah blah", and had supported AUS/NZ in their complaints instead of throwing them under the bus and rallying against them, then it's quite possible that FW wouldn't have felt so comfortable doing the same thing to American's today.


So they'll have to forgive me if I don't have an ounce of sympathy for their 20% mark ups, while we've been getting hit with 80% mark ups for however long.

That’s a serious chip on your shoulder. I’m not sure where your getting that idea. Anyone gouging anyone is always despicable.

I'm getting that "idea" from the facts of the matter. You don't speak for the entirety of your country, and the majority of comments on this topic from Americans has always been the same, mocking Australians, calling them whiney, or arguing for page after page about how it's not price gouging at all there must be some hidden cost that only exists when selling in Australia etc. The fact that you think this isn't the case is a testament to the fact that you've only just started caring recently. I've seen and participated in this discussion hundreds of times and I can guarantee this is how a large amount of your country has behaved for years concerning it. It's not me having a chip on my shoulder to say that I suspect the support and white knighting your country does for companies engaging in this practice may have been a direct factor in GWs decision to add you to the mix.

I’m not really a fan of outright boycotting. Certainly not for something like price increases. Either a product is worth the price to you, or it’s not. For that reason I have no interest in purchasing from forgeworld currently, but I wouldn’t consider it boycotting them.

The orcs I specifically wanted I bought on ebay.



I got lucky, nobody else bid and I bought a Forge World orc BSB at starting price. Things like this happen sometimes.
So the long and the short of it is, while I am not boycotting Forge World I will not be reversing my trend of not buying anything from them anytime soon.

The only other thing I wanted from Forge World since they stopped making the Eldar Aurora was this:



Mantic sells this at less than half the price:



Not 40K, I know, I know, but whether or not one buys from Forrge World applies to all the lines they do.

I bet the numbers have dropped now that the new AM tank has been announced.

 ChargerIIC wrote:
I bet the numbers have dropped now that the new AM tank has been announced.

Which one. A link for my curiosity.

I like looking at Forge World tanks on websites, its as close as I want to get towards buying one.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/09/14/battle-tanks-from-the-age-of-darkness/

Here are the rules

https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/resources/PDF/Downloads//Carnodon_Datasheet.pdf

Its pretty good tank for a gun platform, starting out at 60pts in what a Rhino chassis should be and what it "Might be."

A weird hybrid of a russ and predator? If anything this makes me less inclined to buy it. I don't ply 30k and I really prefer to avoid using any relic units outside of special occasions. It's becoming increasingly annoying that the line between the two is getting blurry and that the IOM is constantly finding new (old ) units.

Not boycotting per se, but no way will I be paying those prices for Forgeworld models right now. I don't own much Forgeworld anyway. A Malanthrope is about the most significant piece of Forgeworld I own.

'Boycotting' makes it sound overly dramatic, but as with regular GW since their regional trading rules were introduced, I'm unlikely to make any more purchases from them.

 Amishprn86 wrote:
Here are the rules

https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/resources/PDF/Downloads//Carnodon_Datasheet.pdf

Its pretty good tank for a gun platform, starting out at 60pts in what a Rhino chassis should be and what it "Might be."

It's probably the best chassis for a Multilaser. 110 points is 15 S6 shots. Even at BS4+ that's nothing to sneeze at.

 insaniak wrote:
'Boycotting' makes it sound overly dramatic, but as with regular GW since their regional trading rules were introduced, I'm unlikely to make any more purchases from them.

Yeah, the word “boycotting” seems a bit much for most of the people I’ve talked to. For me, “boycott” implies some sort of moral or ethical outrage, whereas the players in my area who stopped buying did so because of purely monetary reasons for the most part. The Carnodon is an interesting model with strong rules, but even before the price himes it would probably be out of my price range unless I found one secondhand.

I stopped buy from them when Aeronautica Imperialis got axed. Does that make it a boycott or just that they do not have what I want?

 TapedTempest wrote:
I'm curious to see how many people are standing against Forgeworld still, since the pitchforks and torches seem to have been put down. (I say that with a pinch of disappointment.)

Not "boycott", more like my wallet is in mortal terror of how badly it would empty if I bought anything from them.
Seeing some 30k games in my area and when I add up around $3000++ for an army of resin on the table I know this is a path I better not go.

 Crimson Devil wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/09/14/battle-tanks-from-the-age-of-darkness/

That's a pretty cool looking tank. My wallet really hopes I don't pull the IG out of storage next....

Can't boycott when you never bought from them, but with the price increase it pretty much cemented the fact that I'm never going to buy from Forge World. Granted the fact that they use resin, and crappy resin at that, already cemented that mentality. If I put down over $100 for a toy soldier, it better be the best damn toy soldier ever made and be utterly flawless in its casting. Not possessing a warped chassis that makes it impossible to assemble without coaxing under hot water (I've heard a lot of horror stories).

Outside of a friend picking up my last big purchase while he was on his Honeymoon in England since he could get it at the normal prices im still going strong.

You made your friend take a trip to FW on his honeymoon?

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
You made your friend take a trip to FW on his honeymoon?

Going to Warhammer world was already planned as part of his honeymoon, he offered to pick up anything for anyone that plays at our FLGS whether it be models, t-shirts ect.

Sounds spicy.

I have no problem with Forgeworld. If I was still as invested in HH armies it would be an issue, however.

To me, they are a source of the occasional unique unit to make an army more unique or fill a gap in a force. I still think they produce some stunning looking kits, models and upgrades.

My biggest problem with them right now is the fact they haven't capitalised on the popular 8th edition. Where are the Custodes and Mechanicum rules for 8th edition? Where are the upgrades for Primaris kits beyond just Repulsor doors? Etc, etc

They are becoming less relevant as a result of not adjusting course quickly enough.

Not really boycotting. Only getting the infantry/upgrade kits thus far. As the 30k players in my area are more into the fan made Centurion game mode, I don't think I'll be getting vehicles anytime soon.

 Ishagu wrote:
My biggest problem with them right now is the fact they haven't capitalised on the popular 8th edition. Where are the Custodes and Mechanicum rules for 8th edition? Where are the upgrades for Primaris kits beyond just Repulsor doors?

The Custodes Imperial Armour book is the next one due out (and there are beta rules already out), but the Admech one got dropped because the models aren't selling. What kind of upgrades are you after?

Well, the Mechanicum range isn't selling because it's not supported with 8th edition rules. It's expensive, niche and exists within a rule system in a popularity decline. HH took a real beating when it kept the 7th edition ruleset.

If the models were supported in 8th and were competitive then the sales would greatly increase. There are some beautiful kits that aren't seeing the love or appreciation they deserve.

I know Custodes are going to get a book, but I have a feeling it will he delayed. I hope I'm wrong. Imo It should have been out months ago when Custodes were new and popular.

As for what I'd like to see from Forgeworld - it's more support for the Primaris. New weapon or customisation options for infantry, new turret options for the Repulsor, new arm options for the Redemptor, etc

A common complaint from collectors is the lack of customisation in the Primaris, visual or otherwise. FW really missed an opportunity to capitalise on this and enhance the Primaris line - something they've done for the traditional Astartes for many years.

 Ishagu wrote:
Well, the Mechanicum range isn't selling because it's not supported with 8th edition rules. It's expensive, niche and exists within a rule system in a popularity decline. HH took a real beating when it kept the 7th edition ruleset.

If the models were supported in 8th and were competitive then the sales would greatly increase. There are some beautiful kits that aren't seeing the love or appreciation they deserve.

As for what I'd like to see from Forgeworld - it's more support for the Primaris. New weapon or customisation options for infantry, new turret options for the Repulsor, new arm options for the Redemptor, etc

I would totally buy into (more)admech if I could add a cybernetica cohort but no rules so....... the 40k admech dont really inspire me like the Domitar & Ursarax do.

I fosho want more upgrade stuff for Primaris, my redepmtor wants a lascannon arm and a Salamanders chest plate.