2 Types of dreadnoughts, one with a Psycannon gatling gun, one with wings...

AgeOfEgos wrote:

Just Dave wrote:I'd have to agree, but Mr Kelly isn't perfect by any means. Thunderwolf Cavalry, Rune Priests and Long Fangs say so.

Yeah, he's their best by far.

As far as 'better units' in each dex, if I was writing a dex I wouldn't be too concerned about it. Like the article someone posted earlier (Which was excellent by the way, thanks to whomever posted it!) pointed out, there will always be top/middle/bottom tier aspects of each codex (Or in game design). It's simply inevitable. However, what Kelly does do well is;

Get the background right
Match the units to the background
Match themes to the units/background
Make almost all the choices viable (No garbage tier, simply lower-higher)


His books are fun to read, fun to play and fun to tinker with. Take the Wolf dex.....it's the ultimate counts as dex. Why? Because you can tinker all damn day with the thing! Thundercav heavy, Wolf Guard Heavy, GH Heavy, Long Fang Heavy, etc etc. Just a damn fun dex to play (against and with). Themes abound and the codex lets you use your imagination. Fun first, everything else after.

You are correct good sir, however not everyone sees things by the perspective of Fun First, everything else after and will therefore abuse any 'flaws' within said Codex.
None the less, what I was getting at was that Phil Kelly is good, but he's not perfect. But as you said "their best by far"

I want phil kelly for C:GK.
Judging codexes:
IG: a massive change from 4th ed. a lot better, and orders are pretty good. maybe try to make platoons better (the only way is blob)
SM: same old, same old. suprisingly, not too OP.
BA: a bit cheesy, but a fun army.
SW: ditto.
orks: nice- maybe a DT with more transport cap. improve the sv. by 1 and make 'em more points (8?). better SC's and IC's.
'nids: synapse rule is a nice idea, but more creatures should be synapse. Doom is wierd.
DH: needs a new codex.
tau: A terrible army to play on a 4x4 board. tau should be cheaper, and pathfinders and fire warriors should swap weapons.
'crons: monolith should lose the ignores lance/melta rule and shouldn't DS (a S10 AV 14/14/14 giant shouldn't be able to teleport behind the enemy) and should have a shiny codex.
SoB: see DH. stats should be the same as SM. A SoB dread would be cool.

I'm with ya

Just Dave wrote:

AgeOfEgos wrote:

Just Dave wrote:I'd have to agree, but Mr Kelly isn't perfect by any means. Thunderwolf Cavalry, Rune Priests and Long Fangs say so.

Yeah, he's their best by far.

As far as 'better units' in each dex, if I was writing a dex I wouldn't be too concerned about it. Like the article someone posted earlier (Which was excellent by the way, thanks to whomever posted it!) pointed out, there will always be top/middle/bottom tier aspects of each codex (Or in game design). It's simply inevitable. However, what Kelly does do well is;

Get the background right
Match the units to the background
Match themes to the units/background
Make almost all the choices viable (No garbage tier, simply lower-higher)


His books are fun to read, fun to play and fun to tinker with. Take the Wolf dex.....it's the ultimate counts as dex. Why? Because you can tinker all damn day with the thing! Thundercav heavy, Wolf Guard Heavy, GH Heavy, Long Fang Heavy, etc etc. Just a damn fun dex to play (against and with). Themes abound and the codex lets you use your imagination. Fun first, everything else after.

You are correct good sir, however not everyone sees things by the perspective of Fun First, everything else after and will therefore abuse any 'flaws' within said Codex.
None the less, what I was getting at was that Phil Kelly is good, but he's not perfect. But as you said "their best by far"

shrike wrote:
'crons: monolith should lose the ignores lance/melta rule and shouldn't DS (a S10 AV 14/14/14 giant shouldn't be able to teleport behind the enemy) and should have a shiny codex.

Kurgash wrote:

shrike wrote:
'crons: monolith should lose the ignores lance/melta rule and shouldn't DS (a S10 AV 14/14/14 giant shouldn't be able to teleport behind the enemy) and should have a shiny codex.

? it's true! eldar armies have a ver hard time because they rely on lances and meltas. They should have a shiny new codex. thier one sucks.

Yeah, but DS and Living Metal is what makes the Monolith so good. You can't just take it away because a couple of armies struggle with it. For one thing, Eldar have Witchblades and Fire Prisms which are good against it.
Finally, these things are 265pts and best ignored.

But yes, they should have a shiny new Codex.

Back on topic:

Yoinked from the GK rumour thread on Warseer:

there are no more stormtroopers in the codex except for as a inquisitorial henchmen. There is a way to get 2 wound terminators as troops in the codex rocking a 4++ and all basic grey knight troops come with a storm bolter and nemesis force weapon that counds as a power weapon but no bouns to strength and are all psy.

two psy powers they can use

hammerhand- justicar doubbles strength after modifications so is str 10
?- forget the name but test as a squad and then their storm bolters become str 5 for the turn.

they are going to be an elite army but if you run all troops you can get 60+ in a 2000pt list so really not that shabby.

there is ways to move units around for the FOC and other simillar shenanigans

Phill Kelly's prose is not diamonds.

wolfshadow wrote:Back on topic:

Yoinked from the GK rumour thread on Warseer:

there are no more stormtroopers in the codex except for as a inquisitorial henchmen. There is a way to get 2 wound terminators as troops in the codex rocking a 4++ and all basic grey knight troops come with a storm bolter and nemesis force weapon that counds as a power weapon but no bouns to strength and are all psy.

two psy powers they can use

hammerhand- justicar doubbles strength after modifications so is str 10
?- forget the name but test as a squad and then their storm bolters become str 5 for the turn.

they are going to be an elite army but if you run all troops you can get 60+ in a 2000pt list so really not that shabby.

there is ways to move units around for the FOC and other simillar shenanigans

Wait, I thought it was 100% confirmed that we COULD use stormtroopers. Because I have 2 ten man squads I wanted to use...

@Happy - one of the rumors is that one of the FOC shenanigans is a character that would let you use ISTs as troops. Whether or not that is 100% confirmed is another matter.

Nothing is EVER set in stone.

I remember someone's Sig:

When GW releases a codex, your current army will not be usable...

According to the latest batch of rumours, INQ stormies are retinue only, but one spec charachter allows retinue as troops, so you may still be ok.

Stickmonkey, who is now under a NDA says some of the newest rumours contradict what he knows but he's under a NDA and cannot comment anymore.

shrike wrote:can anyone sum up so far what the rumors are?
In the few pages i've read I have got:
AP3 psycannons
plastic heros
no allies
T5 W2 FNP 2+/4++ termies
termie troops
halberd upgrade
no radical inq.
HQ that unlocks ISTs
re-rolling Sv
+2S everywhere
valks
stormravens ?
hellhounds
banners in kits ?
chaplain ?
justicar char.
paladin char.
scenery ?
most are psykers
different psychic powers
blast weapons!
PAGK=SM sarge stats
wound daemons on a 2+. ?
PAGK NFW is power weapon but no +2 strength
psychic powers for squads:
storm bolters become str 5 for the turn
justicar doubbles strength after modifications
that's including other GK threads. Those that I missed quote this and add.

Why is stick monkey under NDA, is he a GW operative?

Jaon wrote:Why is stick monkey under NDA, is he a GW operative?

Probably works for a company that works with GW. Maaybe advertising or something like that.

Someone asked... I'll go check to see if he answered.

i can say that some of these new rumors are contradictory to what i have heard from a reliable 2nd party.


the codex IS written and is just waiting for the official release.

GKs, sadly don't get to re-roll their saves, but can purchase an item that gives the squad a 2+ invuln.

regular PAGKs are 20 points each.

All these rumors seem a bit far fetched to me...rerolls to armour saves or not, 2 wound terminators, 4++ invulnerable saves on all terminators, all gaining force weapons etc.

tweaked assassins, better grandmasters, more variety in the troops (anticipating frag grenades) and a plastic psycannon are all I hope for. A simple fix.

Then again it's most likely to be a complete overhaul, but I like to think small so I won't be disappointed to find out TAGK are still 1 wound or that there will be no chaplains (I do see much evidence for these, but then again if they lose fearless it might come into play).

What will be disappointing is seeing 25pt models still dying to combat resolution in the new codex.

Ehsteve wrote:What will be disappointing is seeing 25pt models still dying to combat resolution in the new codex.

I doubt the Grey Knights will be lumped with the Stupidity/Fearless rule.

Yeah, they will probably gain Stubborn and ATSKNF.

they are older then ATSKNF after all.


if they do gain either the 2+ invuln for the squad or rerollable armor saves then they might tie ork boyz in CC depending on who gets the charge.


GKs also have Stormbolters. Infantry really arn't where GKs have had problems in the past.

Grey Templar wrote:Yeah, they will probably gain Stubborn and ATSKNF.

they are older then ATSKNF after all.


if they do gain either the 2+ invuln for the squad or rerollable armor saves then they might tie ork boyz in CC depending on who gets the charge.


GKs also have Stormbolters. Infantry really arn't where GKs have had problems in the past.

I sincerely hope so...
the problems GK have had:
tank armies
hordes

That's funny.

i have never lost to either Greentide or Nidswarm.

Stormbolters for a good 3 turns.

then i charge in with my attacks and Holocaust.

ah. I have heard of many GK players dying to massed swarms. the gaunts are just too good in CC now. 6 point A3 I5 troops?!

shrike wrote:6 point A3 I5 troops?!

Gaunts aren't 6 points, 3 attacks, and I5 at the same time.

They are only A2 unless you mean on the charge. I am so excited for GK though. They sound really unique which is the most important thing to me in a codex.

shrike wrote:ah. I have heard of many GK players dying to massed swarms. the gaunts are just too good in CC now. 6 point A3 I5 troops?!

they probably arn't deploying as far forward as possable, moving back 6" each turn, firing Stormbolters as they go untill they reach the board edge. then they counter attack.

Kiting... Done it many a time with my GK, it works well, thinning swarms helps a lot.

Grey Templar wrote:i can say that some of these new rumors are contradictory to what i have heard from a reliable 2nd party.


the codex IS written and is just waiting for the official release.

GKs, sadly don't get to re-roll their saves, but can purchase an item that gives the squad a 2+ invuln.

regular PAGKs are 20 points each.

written? good. any news on who wrote it?
*phil phil phil phil...*
2+ invul?! re-roll armour means if you take a wound it's a 1 in 6, 2+ is 1 in 6, but now they can still have that 1 in 6 if they get a basilisk on thier heads? wow. I am definitely gonna get a apoc. force of these.

I'd imagine such an item being 50+ Pts... However, that makes power weapons nigh stupid to use against GK that have it, and makes swarming them with attacks better...

Please tell me we still have stormtroopers. PLEEEEAAAASSSSEEEEEE!

still, that's 250 points for 10 3+/2++, stubborn, S6, storm-bolter armed space marines! they will destroy most MEQ armies (outnumbered 16 to 25, but alot better) and most IG armies (ID'ing everyone, AP5 all round). paying 9 more points per model to have a storm bolter, ECCW, +2S, stubborn, 2++? c'mon.

Hasn't it been rumored that stormtroopers will be retinue unless a SC is taken? *CoughCorteazCoughhackdie*

And to the above, I thought S6 was removed... And I can see them becoming more expensive, but slightly more versatile...

ah. oh well. they're still OP enough for me to do apoc.
I'll be doing a pure GK army (aside from an inquisitor- I like the fluff).

GKs also have Stormbolters. Infantry really arn't where GKs have had problems in the past.

All those power weapons are utterly wasted on dirt cheap minis and cc specialists like orks, IG, wytches and pretty much everything that doesnt cost anything, is fearless or has high Ld and doesnt get armour saves.

I wonder now if PAGKs will now be the ultimate anti MEQ infantry squad, what will there be that is good against tanks, monstrous creatures and dirt cheap hordes.
If a 100p dread or wraithlord can kill a 250p GK unit or a 60p wych squad can tie up the same GK unit in melee there has to be other toys and specialist units hidden in the DH codex

I agree, GK seem to be shaping up to neutralize anything MeQ while AT still remains their problem... Though standard storm bolters may have a CHANCE if they get rending... I doubt it though.

Hopefully the 2++ save is an over exaggerated rumour. A lot of these rumoured rules are sounding somewhat “cheesey” and are most likely over exaggerated rumours. Otherwise GK is set to take the Crown of Cheese away from BA.

With a 2++ save combat res. wounds shouldn't be a problem assuming GK's get Fearless (or run and get caught in the SA leading to combat res. saves).

The best way to kill GK's is going to be weight of attacks or shots. 2++ or 3++ rerolling is only going to go so far.

Hopefully the 2++ save is an over exaggerated rumour. A lot of these rumoured rules are sounding somewhat “cheesey” and are most likely over exaggerated rumours. Otherwise GK is set to take the Crown of Cheese away from BA.

Never mind the rules, its all about point cost!
No matter how OP something sounds, it can still be pretty damn useless if it is overpriced.

Take a look at jumppack vanguard squads or legion of the damned squads, on paper they sound like game breakers but the point cost they have make them outright useless.

Just Dave wrote:

AgeOfEgos wrote:

Just Dave wrote:I'd have to agree, but Mr Kelly isn't perfect by any means. Thunderwolf Cavalry, Rune Priests and Long Fangs say so.

Yeah, he's their best by far.

As far as 'better units' in each dex, if I was writing a dex I wouldn't be too concerned about it. Like the article someone posted earlier (Which was excellent by the way, thanks to whomever posted it!) pointed out, there will always be top/middle/bottom tier aspects of each codex (Or in game design). It's simply inevitable. However, what Kelly does do well is;

Get the background right
Match the units to the background
Match themes to the units/background
Make almost all the choices viable (No garbage tier, simply lower-higher)


His books are fun to read, fun to play and fun to tinker with. Take the Wolf dex.....it's the ultimate counts as dex. Why? Because you can tinker all damn day with the thing! Thundercav heavy, Wolf Guard Heavy, GH Heavy, Long Fang Heavy, etc etc. Just a damn fun dex to play (against and with). Themes abound and the codex lets you use your imagination. Fun first, everything else after.

You are correct good sir, however not everyone sees things by the perspective of Fun First, everything else after and will therefore abuse any 'flaws' within said Codex.
None the less, what I was getting at was that Phil Kelly is good, but he's not perfect. But as you said "their best by far"

Totally agree. What many people don't get is that tournament players comprise only a very small % of GW's customer base,on the whole. Most of their customers play for fun in a casual environment,and that is the customer base they cater to. That's not to say that they don't drop dud codices every now and again,but they do seem to be dropping a lot fewer completely and totally uncompetitive codices since 5th.

The "tournament players are only a small % of the customers" point may be true, but it's no excuse for GW not striving for game balance first and foremost, because good (not perfect, necessarily, but good) game balance is a fundamental principle of good game design, and benefits both hardcore competitive players and "fun" players.

If anything, having a balanced game is even more vital to casual gamers than to tournament players. If a tournament player buys an army, and a new codex is released for it, rendering it no longer competitive, he can just sell the army and move on to a different one; he has no personal attachment to it. If a casual player's army is rendered near-obsolete by a poor codex release, he's probably stuck with it for 5-10 years, or leaves the hobby in disgust because GW have ruined the game for him; he doesn't ever *really* want to get rid of his lovingly painted and modelled, perfectly fluffy army, but when he does, you can bet he's not coming back to "the hobby".

BOLS Rumour roundup, Mostly stuff we have heard before.. A couple of newiesh tidbits in there if you search.

Today we have a couple of summaries rounded up from the Lounge:


via Lerra:

"The GK codex has been finalized and is currently at the printers.

There is a unit in the codex called a "Dreadknight" which is basically a psychically-infused super-terminator that counts as a monstrous creature. It looks sort of like a penitent engine but better. It has a Dreadnought CCW, lots of wounds and 2+ save.

The codex looks like it's pretty sick and will be on par with the Space Wolves for overall power. Terminators can be made troops by a special character. GKs lose fearless and gain ATSKNF. Power Armor Grey Knights get squad-based psychic powers, including a power that is like Hammerhands. There is also a squad-based psychic power that increase the strength of their storm bolters to 5.

Terminators have 2 wounds and come with a 4+ invulnerable save."
~We hear those 2-wound termys are a seperate unit from the standard 1-wound ones.

via darklink


"yep cortez can make henchmen troops, so you can get stormtroopers but they are now bs3 and not nearly as good. crusaders with a marine cost and coming with a pw and ss is much more attractive.

the other real winner for henchmen are the humans that come with bolters for 5pts or storm bolters for 7pts at bs 3

other troops are the palidan termies with 2 wounds and a 5++ and can get fnp with the apothicary

pergitor squads with all the extra special weapons can become troops too.

vindicar assassin is 0-3 and have the special rounds that are quite nasty
4d6+rend vs. armor
wound on a 2+
take inv save away for the rest of the game

loses his night fight rule but still has stealth.

psy cannons are str 7 with rending

drednight with gattiling psy cannon is only str 5 but 12 shots.

the palidan termies do not have EW.

havent read into the special chars much yet as i havent had time. but ill have a chance after x-mas.

some weapons that are new for the gk
sword that grants +2 str
halbriad that grants +2 int
one more but don't remember.

playtesting the gk the army with full squads of crusader humans and assassins in a crusader will wipe most things in one assault phase, which i can see lots of people taking. I can also see lots of people running the bolter/SB spam since they are dirt cheep.

the basic grey knights top out at 20 pts little more for the justicar.

there are transports for the henchmen granted you can fit them in.
gk army has access to landraiders, rhinos, stormravens, and the chimera.

stern- beleive has a ss but have not read to him yet.\

the callidus assassin got better as when she/he appears it does d6 wounds to the unit that is ap 1/2 dont remember, then can shoot the flamer then assault as normal.

normal gk dont have access to meltas. meltas are a rare occurence in the codex. "

Looks like my 'counts as' Alpha Legion Operatives force is a go go!

Alpharius wrote:Looks like my 'counts as' Alpha Legion Operatives force is a go go!

As an Alpha Legion fan myself, I think your idea has serious merit...

Can't wait to see the 'dex when it comes out.....looks very promising!

...Dreadknight....

...sounds...

AWESOME!

If it has a model I will buy it.

Is the 2+ str swords and 2+ ini halberds a new rumour? Because so far I havent heard of it, but always wished for it.

I can just imagine having a good mix so you can overpower most enemy units by A) striking first with your power weapons, and if that doesnt completely topple them B) hammering them with str 6 power weapons. Very enticing

Tis my hope this rumour is true.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
You could even taylor your list accordingly! If your up against Orks, take the halberd models you have so their furious charge is downgraded from matching space marine initative to loosing against it anyway. You could seriously deter ork hordes with storm bolter and ini 6!


*wipes tear away*

Most orks dont get to I4 anyway - Theyre I2 base. Only Nobs get to I4, and you mostly see them with PKs....

Init 6 would hurt eldar the most, as they have a lot of I5 stuff.

candy.man wrote:Hopefully the 2++ save is an over exaggerated rumour. A lot of these rumoured rules are sounding somewhat “cheesey” and are most likely over exaggerated rumours. Otherwise GK is set to take the Crown of Cheese away from BA.

I hope they don't go cheesy, but I always thought SW were as cheesy.
cheese BA:
dropping LR's
dreads clinging onto mini-thunderhawks

cheese SW:
superhumans riding giant wolves
longfangs

I doubt this 2++ thing. then what's the point of the 3+? I would've thought the re-roll would be fairer. against bolters:

re-rolling:
2 in 3 hit, 1 in 2 wound, 1 in 6 dead.
2++:
2 in 3 hit, 1 in 2 wound, 1 in 6 dead.

but when it comes to LC's...
re-rolling.
2 in 3 hit, 5 in 6 wound, 1 in 1 dead.
2++
2 in 3 hit, 5 in 6 wound, 1 in 6 dead.

The odds of a model failing a rerolling 3+ is 1/9, not 1/6.

is it? oh. I stand corrected. 2++ is still too OTT to be believable IMO.

Yet 3++ SS terminators seemed unbelievable at one point.

1/3 chance of failure (first roll) x 1/3rd chance of failure (reroll) = 1/9 chance of failure from any one armour save.

yes, but still- troops having the best possible save?
apart from ghazghkull magaret thatcher, what unit has a 2++? I've heard something about Sevrin Loth having one as a psy power, that may or may not be true...

Eh, sisters can go 2++ with their Faith-witch-magic. Even their troops can reach 3++. I find the 2+invulnerable easier to believe than the 2+ rerollable save rumor.

Just Dave wrote:I'd have to agree, but Mr Kelly isn't perfect by any means. Thunderwolf Cavalry, Rune Priests and Long Fangs say so.

HERESY... these aren't broken they let me win

Yet 3++ SS terminators seemed unbelievable at one point.

We have what is basically a dark eldar IC with 11 attacks and a super HQ with 2++ as well as the flying nun of doom (the canoness with almost constant 2++ and S6 power weapon).

Perhaps the PAGK good armour save will be offset with a vulnerability tp power weapons and AP negating shooting.
Doesnt matter that much if it takes 9 bolter wounds to down one GK when a 5p plasmacannon kills of 100p of GKs in one shot.

Same goes for the TAGKs, wonder if all units will get access to the 3++ SS. Mixing in 3++ in termie squads is what makes them powerful.
I dont care how OP they are in melee etc if a lousy plasmagun can decimate half a TAGK squad, not to mention demolisher shots.

Lets hope the power, survivability and point costs are all balanced to work well together.

Hmm... Halberds with +2 Initiative sound nice, and the old NFW, being the sword, with +2 Strength sounds cool too... Now I just wonder what the third one is. I'm still holding out for the Nemesis Force Mace/Flail...

Maybe an additional amount of attacks added? Or maybe channeling of Psychic Powers via this weapon? Sounds fun, and I hope my Grey Knights have some leigh-weigh in customobility, but if GW does include the Force Mace/Flail, I will literaly jump for joy, and model an entire squad with them as a testament to my love for the weapon

Ian Sturrock wrote:The "tournament players are only a small % of the customers" point may be true, but it's no excuse for GW not striving for game balance first and foremost, because good (not perfect, necessarily, but good) game balance is a fundamental principle of good game design, and benefits both hardcore competitive players and "fun" players.

If anything, having a balanced game is even more vital to casual gamers than to tournament players. If a tournament player buys an army, and a new codex is released for it, rendering it no longer competitive, he can just sell the army and move on to a different one; he has no personal attachment to it. If a casual player's army is rendered near-obsolete by a poor codex release, he's probably stuck with it for 5-10 years, or leaves the hobby in disgust because GW have ruined the game for him; he doesn't ever *really* want to get rid of his lovingly painted and modelled, perfectly fluffy army, but when he does, you can bet he's not coming back to "the hobby".

I understand what you're saying,and agree with most of it. However,there really hasn't been a codex that's dropped in 5th that's completely uncompetitive in the casual playing environment. I think the last codex they've done that's totally uncompetitve in a casual environment is the 4th edition Dark Angels codex.

Pagk s6 or i6 with a storm bolter=no problem

Pagk s4 with power weapons/storm bolter>20 points, so any reports of that combo for 20 points a model need a big grain of salt.

Pagk with s6 power weapons for 20 points is best described as delusional. Every tournament list would spend 1200 points on 60 of them and all other meq lists would be unplayable. Top tier armies would only consist of ig and grey knights. Codex creep creates a lot of monsters, but none have ever been that under priced.

the 2++ save item is 100% real.

it does cost 35 points and is wargear for the justicar. armys that can snipe individual models will have a chance to remove it.


that dreadknight sounds stupid and i can say is most likely false.


PAGKs are no longer Str6 base. they are Str4 Force weapon and Stormbolter base. Str6 is an upgrade for the whole squad. they probably end up about the same price they are now with that upgrade(20 pts to 25)


ISTs are unlocked by a Special Character only. Inquisitors take them as Retinue.


Stormravens are FA.

Interesting - so I can still model and field and Alpha Legion Operative army... excellent!

thanks for the confirmation!
my hypothetical army:
GK grand master ~150
Inquisitor ~100
henchmen ~100
10 TAGK ~500
20 PAGK (all 2++ and S6) ~500
dreadnought ~100
stormraven ~200
stormraven ~200
dreadnought ~100
~2000pt army

Will be interesting to see if rumors allowing combination of 2++ and re-rolls for squad are actually true. I find this ... improbable at best. 1/36 chance to kill each model = silly.

Same here... I just can't see this happening.

But then, I never envisioned Marines riding on giant wolf analogues either...

Alpharius wrote:Same here... I just can't see this happening.

But then, I never envisioned Marines riding on giant wolf analogues either...

Hey now. Stop dissing Thunderwolves!

I mean, is it really that hard to believe a few Space Wolves here and there would look at a Thunderwolf(which even before this last Codex were described as getting to be as large as Rhino APCs) and think "You know...I bet I could ride that!"?

If anyone would, I know a Space Wolf would try it, but still... it's a bit much, even for 40K!

I want GK Terminators riding Carnosaurs.

Alpharius wrote:If anyone would, I know a Space Wolf would try it, but still... it's a bit much, even for 40K!

Then so is chaos champions riding blood daemons, right?

I want a GK riding a SoB!......

H.B.M.C. wrote:I want Exodites riding Carnosaurs.

Fixed for effect and awesomeness.

Pfft! As if.

A Grey Knight Grandmaster riding into battle atop King Grimlock would be awesome.

H.B.M.C. wrote:Pfft! As if.

A Grey Knight Grandmaster riding into battle atop King Grimlock would be awesome.

Nah.

What you want is a Grey Knight Grandmaster striding into combat with his loyal Blessed Cyberlion at his heels!

Kanluwen wrote:

Alpharius wrote:Same here... I just can't see this happening.

But then, I never envisioned Marines riding on giant wolf analogues either...

Hey now. Stop dissing Thunderwolves!

I mean, is it really that hard to believe a few Space Wolves here and there would look at a Thunderwolf(which even before this last Codex were described as getting to be as large as Rhino APCs) and think "You know...I bet I could ride that!"?

This leads to the question... how much ale would it take to get a Space Wolf drunk?

"HEY SVEN! WATCH THIS! I'MMA RIDE THAT WOLF"

Unfortunately, this is one of the many unspoken cons of being a Space Marine - you're either sober or unconscious. No put-that-trash-can-on-your-head-and-do-a-Vader stuff for them.

H.B.M.C. wrote:I want GK Terminators riding Autobots.

Fixed.

Grey Knights, ROCK OUT!

BaronIveagh wrote:

H.B.M.C. wrote:I want GK Terminators riding Autobots.

Fixed.

Grey Knights, ROCK OUT!

Baron, I want grey knights rocking out on whatever the hell that is in your sig. It'll be very festive.

Reecius wrote:I want a GK riding a SoB!......

Screw that I want a SoB riding a GK :p

Now children.....

Who am I kidding, I chuckled

How about a SoB RIDING ANOTHER SoB. Some good old SoB on SoB action.




Are we still talking about the game?

How about we check the juvenile humor at the door, get the thread back on track and stay suspension free?

yes please

There's the warning. Anyway, Stickymonkey isn't able to provide us with anything more right? He's under contract and can't give out GK rumors?

a GW store manager told me last week that there will be new GKs coming soon.


GW admitting stuff is coming????

Grey Templar wrote:a GW store manager told me last week that there will be new GKs coming soon.

GW admitting stuff is coming????

There's nothing new about GW store managers making claims about what's coming out. It's just that these claims are all lies, even the ones that coincidentally happen to be true.

I have no memory of finding this but i think it is a fandex, if not it is msot likely an older version.
(il try my best to attach the darn thing as it is a pdf file from the looks of it)

Fan dex.

ph34r wrote:Fan dex.

Thought so.... o well, il still keep it kicking around untill the actual codex gets released.

Alpharius wrote:Same here... I just can't see this happening.

But then, I never envisioned Marines riding on giant wolf analogues either...

Pft, we burly chaos men had our champions riding juggernauts with master crafted power weapons and chaos armor in third edition! Cavalry is nothing new!

Unfortunately, juggs are bullgak now, and only make for good bike proxies.

Tell that to the deamon players who use crushers and fateweaver

Deamon Juggs are good.

CSM juggs, not so much.

Zefig wrote:

BaronIveagh wrote:

H.B.M.C. wrote:I want GK Terminators riding Autobots.

Fixed.

Grey Knights, ROCK OUT!

Baron, I want grey knights rocking out on whatever the hell that is in your sig. It'll be very festive.

Nah, Grey Knights riding Christmas themed dragons would be a little too Warhammer and not very 40k. Though none the less awesome.

... for some reason I just flashed on Saint Nicholas leading an Imperial crusade to the Tannenbaum Nebula...

I don't really understand all these rumors, but I'm new at this. It does sound good though (from reading all yours guys posts)

I was planning on starting a GK army for my first one. Love the fluff.

This could be fun, these GK's.

I swore I would never play anything Space Marine.. but the old metal GK mini's were just too good to pass up.

I have to convince myself that GK's arent Space Marines.. They just look like space marines.. walk like space marines.. talk like...

dammit.

GK are not space marines, because nobody plays them.

GK are sorta Space Marines, (correct me if I'm wrong) just without a specific company, and rather opt for purity, despite the ornate things on their armor to sybolize their heraldry. PLUS, none of them have ever fallen to Chaos...

They have Power Armor yes, they look like space marines, yes. But they would gladly shove a NFW up a space marines arse if they believed he was falling to Chaos...

Jaon wrote:GK are not space marines, because nobody plays them.

They ate a space marine chapter, created in secret by da emprah, except they have different armour, training, recruitment and weapons to other SM chapters.
I fear that when GK come out in plastic, they will be the noob race that everyone collects- hordes of 12-year-olds swarming around to buy [stereotypical geeky voice]"Dose supa coo-el awesum gauyz fwom warhammerr"[/voice]
I will not be sleeping tonight...

Grey Knights LOOK like space marines,

they have the Stats of Space Marines,

they are Space Marines in the fluff,

but they are not, i repeat NOT, a Space Marine army.



they have a completely different set of tactics, rules, and organization.

Grey Templar wrote:Grey Knights LOOK like space marines,

they have the Stats of Space Marines,

they are Space Marines in the fluff,

but they are not, i repeat NOT, a Space Marine army.



they have a completely different set of tactics, rules, and organization.

well if they are as good as SM, look like SM, and are SM, I think they're SM.
SW have a different set of tactics, rules and organisation. They're SM.

lol transprots.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Lol transprots.

shrike wrote:
I fear that when GK come out in plastic, they will be the noob race that everyone collects- hordes of 12-year-olds swarming around to buy [stereotypical geeky voice]"Dose supa coo-el awesum gauyz fwom warhammerr"[/voice]
I will not be sleeping tonight...

I was considering them since I enjoy playing armies that use quality over quantity, but instead just am working on an iron hands biker/mechanized army instead and will wait to get all the ebay goodies when kids start selling their GK

It will be hard to separate the bandwagon people from the ones who collect them for nostalgia. Dont know about the others, but Grey Knights and DE were on my list of things I really wanted to collect, but their bad codexes and dated (in the case of DE) and expensive (in the case of Grey Knights) models made it just not worth the venture.

yep. The only thing that kept me off doing GK right from the start was a lack of funds. But then I had enough money to splash out on them during the summer holidays- I went into GW to buy the codex- and they'd taken them off the shelves and the new codex was on the way, so I waited.
...
waiting
...

To be honest, I'm not sure if I'll be sticking with GK when the codex comes out - I've got a pretty decently sized force including 3 LR, but depending on what the codex is like I might just go ahead and sell them. Mostly because I've been getting into Fantasy more and would like to focus more on that, but also because of the whole "LOL NEW ARMY TIME EVERYONE COLLECT." I'll still wait and see first, though.

DiscoVader wrote:...but also because of the whole "LOL NEW ARMY TIME EVERYONE COLLECT." I'll still wait and see first, though.

Why would you let that have any impact on your decision?

hmm. I was thinking that too. BTW you probably won't get a decent price on your old metal GK, no matter how nice the models are. The plastics will be here.

keep the metals.

it will prevent crys of Cheese when the codex come out.


just show that you have the old metal models and deserve to have your cheese.

The "old" one grant you cheese?
What do you get for the ancient ones (25mm bases..) if thats the case ?

They grant you eternal life...

shrike wrote:They grant you eternal life...

*queues up Queen - Who Wants to Live Forever*

BaronIveagh wrote:

shrike wrote:They grant you eternal life...

*queues up Queen - Who Wants to Live Forever*

If anyone cries cheese when I put my GK on the table, I will soundly thrash them with a good, non cheesy list, OR they will beat me, and I will say "See, no cheese?"

I dread building another land raider tho ;( I hate building land raiders, but they are rather essential to what will be a terminator heavy list.

None the less, I am not flavour of the monthing, I have always wanted GK, but the prices and complete army of metal models and bad codex (underpowered) put me off.

Jaon wrote:If anyone cries cheese when I put my GK on the table, I will soundly thrash them with a good, non cheesy list, OR they will beat me, and I will say "See, no cheese?

Or pick up the a rather large metal model and thrash them with that

I dread building another land raider tho ;( I hate building land raiders, but they are rather essential to what will be a terminator heavy list.

I almost snapped the top plate part of my raider in half putting it in!

None the less, I am not flavour of the monthing, I have always wanted GK, but the prices and complete army of metal models and bad codex (underpowered) put me off.

Same, Metal+Bad Dex'= me staying off GK's... until now hopefully

Looks like its going to be GK's Forever

Funny thing is I play Ultrasmurfs ( )

At the time of making this account I was just getting into the DA fluff and was loving it.

Hahah dont worry, we have ALL played Ultrasmurfs

youbedead wrote:

BaronIveagh wrote:

shrike wrote:They grant you eternal life...

*queues up Queen - Who Wants to Live Forever*

I see
The Emperor provides.

Jaon wrote:Hahah dont worry, we have ALL played Ultrasmurfs

No. Not a single second.

Still planning to walk into the store, plonk down the Ancient ones and ask "may I expand this little force of mine ?".
We'll see if they are Real Hobbyists, if they identify them correctly or not


Anyone got a release date?

I WANNA RELEASE DATE!!! (april would be best for me )

Jaon wrote:I have always wanted GK, but the prices and complete army of metal models and bad codex (underpowered) put me off.

+1.

Jaon wrote:Hahah dont worry, we have ALL played Ultrasmurfs

I haven't.
Ipainted about 5 marines in BA, Smurf, IF, RG, Crimson fists.
I went raven guard.

Luckily for me, because of the high noob-to-gamer ratio (about 4:1 ) No-one really cries cheese, because they are so used to it.
We have about 6 12-year-old BA players and about 4 12-year-old SW players. They know nothing about the fluff and go mental on mary-sues and other cheesy units.
no-one bats an eyelid. (Apart from me and a couple of others)

Jaon wrote:Hahah dont worry, we have ALL played Ultrasmurfs

*dons Ian Paisley voice* NEVER! NEVER! NEVER! *and relax*

Maybe a safer generalization is that most of us have played marines.

agreed.
but then...GK are SM...




"NOT THIS AGAIN!"

shrike wrote:

"NOT THIS AGAIN!"

End him... Quickly.

PURGE!!!
_______
_______
_______

The only way to be sure...

EXTERMINATUS

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Well Gk are dudes in power armour with boltguns that the emperor made, but they dont play like the "Space Marines" we know. And by far not as nooby. And I hope it stays that way

Yep.
All I hope is:
either +2S for PAGK or power weapons for PAGK.
Not replace BA and SW as the cheesy army.
No noobs getting them, becoming the new noob army.
GKGM still have NFW to the full potential.
plastics!!!
inquisitors as good as SM captains (woundswise)
TAGK not just TASM with power weapons. (either NFW to full or W2, or something like that)

Yes i hope GK's stay very much as an "elite" army

Theres no doubt TAGK will be better than TASM, they were in their old codex, they really can only get better. Heres hoping you can get NFW/SS 2+ ini +2 str instant death power weapons!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HURRR!

On a serious note, i am very confused on the NFW status at the moment, obviously the terminator ones are power weapons, so rendings gunna be rather useless on them, 2+ str has been kinda ruled out, as has ID, and that only leaves 2+ ini for halberds? Im thinking 2+ str for swords, 2+ ini for halberds.

And on the subject of inquisitor stats, Rumours say that they will still be human (GEQ) meaning t3 st3 (augmented?) but I suspect 3 wounds, we all know 2 wounds FAIL. Unless we see inquisitors and Inquisitor lords that is, which will be a whole different ball game.

Two threads on this subject is two too many.

Especially as people are posting the same thing in both of them.

Go see the other one please...

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/334488.page