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I like the new Ork Codex and most enries in it, but I have a specail place for Nobz and Mega Armored Nobz specifically. Yet the MegaNobz are easily one of the worst entries in the list. So, I was wondering how best to use them. I have two ideas:

1) 5 MegaNobz + Trukk (any kit) + Mad Dok Grotsnik
Pros - Fearless so does not have the leadership issues, FNP, ability to take Cybrok Bodies
Cons - Comes in at over 400 points, Can lead around by the nose from the Mad Dok's rules
2) 5 MegaNobz + Trukk (any kit) + Warboss w/ Mega Armor, Boss Pole, and Attack Sqig
Pros - Warboss greatly help their leadership problem, Cheaper than above
Cons - Still expensive

Are there others ways to try and use them?

The Wraith

Sadly NO!

Anything a MANs can do regular nobs can do better!

Except have an armour save against krak missiles...

Well you can always do da deff wing!

Warboss, mega armor

Warboss, mega armor

nob squad as troops

battlewagon

nob squad as troops

battlewagon

2 more of the same as elites.

No invunrable hurts, as well as being outnumbered, but just think of all the dark angels players who would guffaw?! at your army!

The meganobz have their place. I don't know what it is yet. Getting 6 orks for less than the price of a meganobz really makes me run away from them.

If you get the grot banner boy for the bikes as a bit, and rebase your Meganobz, I think they'd make excellent Killa Kanz.

That's what I've suggested to my friends with 10 meganobz and no kanz, anyway.

Meganobz are resistant to the kind of weapons that will make Ork lives very hard, brutish, and short. They get saves against Flamers and most other template weapons. Without upgrades they are fewer points than Nobz with Stikkbombz and Power Klaws, and far fewer points (and somewhat harder) than Nobz with all the bells and whistles like 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Bodies, and a Painboy.

With a stiff tail-wind and a Waaagh! behind them, plus they'll move as fast a Nobz in difficult terrain.

It seems, and this is a tentative conclusion, that they are for assaulting fortified positions where their Power Klaws won't have to worry about going last because of their Stikkbombs (although remember they can always default to their ordinary close combat attacks when assaulting), and they can tear down fortifications like tank-traps and bunkers so that the Boyz can exploit the gap.

They'd also be dandy in situations involving Necrons.

Conversely ordinary Nobz would be for fighting in the open field and against opponents that don't show the courtesy of standing around and fighting fair (like Eldar...).

Power fists, klaws, and thunder hammers always always always go last. Even if you used frags to get into combat.

Meganobz are more vulnerable than chaos termies and don't have a shoot from back here option to alleviate that.

They aren't horrible, but for their points I'll lose 5 Orks to a flamer rather than bring meganobz.

They're great for Medium Strength Monstrous Creature hunting. Stick them in a trukk and send them after a hive tyrant or something else with only a few attacks below strength 8. The two wounds makes it impossible for the squad to lose combat because the creature will almost always die.

I've used this trick successfully against Tyrants, and Avatars, a squad of 4 drew the entire focus toward the center of the board where they had locked the monsters.

I think they are best against Guard, Horde 'Nids, and Eldar. Because they don't have as much to scare them with instant death once they hit combat. Event then though they are tricky to use.

Stelek: Well, that certainly explains why Terminators don't have them! I had wondered... That said Meganobz still have Stikkbombz that they can use with ordinary close combat attacks, and they're still cheaper than Nobz with equivalent equipment.

When you think PK you think of them as being MEQ and close combat MC/ dreadnought killers, including Crons.

Their biggest problem is anything with a power weapon. I'd say they're more useful in a list that is heavy on the 4+ saves than one that is heavy on 6+ Boyz.

Like other Ork elite close combat stuff they do well with Ghazzkul and his 6" fleet move, not to mention the Fearless bonus that goes with it.

Three of them are about the same price as a Warboss and just about as good, really. They're just Power Klaw attacks. Terminators have invulnerable saves at least, this tends to keep them around when facing MEQ power weapons, dreads and monstrous creatures.

They'd make lousy Dreadnought killers, unless we're talking Ork Dreadnoughts. Space Marine Dreadnoughts, Chaos Marine Dreadnoughts, and Defilers would hit them first, ignore their saves with one or Dreadnought Close Combat Weapons, and then Instant Kill them.

In my experience what keeps my Terminators around in the face of Power Weapon attacks and some Monstrous Creatures is using their ordinary close combat attacks rather than their special close combat attacks. Dreadnoughts and faster Monstrous Creatures tend to mangle them. Meganobz would hit harder with their ordinary close combat attacks on the charge thanks to Furious Charge, and hit at the same I interval as Assault Marines with those attacks thanks to Furious Charge.

The problem against a Tyrant is getting past The Horror. Especially if there is a Choir around. I just do not see them being any good unless teamed up with something that will help their poor leadership. Even then they do have the problem of a Tyrant with implant attack. Maybe it is the meta game around here, but they always seem to have that.

Still, put Grotsnik in the army and they can be comarible to Terminators at a small points increase to SM Termies. I am just struggling to see what they can hit with relative safety AND make back their points. I do not see much, but I am hoping for something.

The Wraith

Maybe there's more to the game than a unit killing its points-worth in VPs during a game...

Take DocGrosnik and give dem mega armored nobs cybork bodies?

Thing is if you compare them to terminators, terminators have Storm Bolters and Assault Cannons at BS4, that's alot of shots going down range.

Mega Nobz have twin-linked Shootas, which while OK can be found anywhere else in the list.

Tacobake wrote:Thing is if you compare them to terminators, terminators have Storm Bolters and Assault Cannons at BS4, that's alot of shots going down range.

Mega Nobz have twin-linked Shootas, which while OK can be found anywhere else in the list.

As you can with Assault Cannons and Storm Bolters in a marine list, I fail to see why being able to find twin-linked shootas in a few other places negates their worth. I do agree that their shooting sucks compared to normal terminators, but that's always the case with Ork shooting.

Famder wrote:

Tacobake wrote:Thing is if you compare them to terminators, terminators have Storm Bolters and Assault Cannons at BS4, that's alot of shots going down range.

Mega Nobz have twin-linked Shootas, which while OK can be found anywhere else in the list.

As you can with Assault Cannons and Storm Bolters in a marine list, I fail to see why being able to find twin-linked shootas in a few other places negates their worth. I do agree that their shooting sucks compared to normal terminators, but that's always the case with Ork shooting.

I was thinking not necessarily twin-linked shootas but just a bog standard Ork Boy w/ his 6 pt BS2 shoota, four of which can be had for the price of one Mega Nobz.

Especially considering Mega Nobz don't have access to deep striking, either.

Nurglitch wrote:Except have an armour save against krak missiles...

NObs get a 5 up against crack missles. They also get a 5 up and FNP against plasma weapons which MANS get nothing against.

Nurglitch wrote:Maybe there's more to the game than a unit killing its points-worth in VPs during a game...

Umm yeah. It's called losing.

They are just very very bad.

gunkie: Well aren't you just precious.

Nurglitch wrote:Maybe there's more to the game than a unit killing its points-worth in VPs during a game...

Correct! Lots more. I can think that way, but I don't think that way. Tends to ruin my tactics.

However that said:

Being the unit that gives up it's VP's without fail in a game is however not a 'good' thing.

Meganobz with cybork bodies @ 45 points a pop....geeze I guess you can have a 'hardcore' bunch of guys in your army, but why when you can have so many more standard orks instead?

One thing I never considered is that Power Weapons and plasma only take off one wound. I guess that's OK. I guess.

Maybe because the Meganobz put more power into a smaller area than their equivalent points in Boyz?

Think about this: Firing bolters at 7 Boyz, six wounding hits result in six fewer Boyz, while firing bolters at 1 MegaNob, six wounding hits on average result in one wound on the MegaNob. In both cases one model will be left over if armour saving throw dice are [1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6], but in the case of the Meganob the survivor will be a Meganob.

So, does that mean you should replace your Boyz with Meganobz? No, of course not. Just that having one or the other is a false dilemma. Ideally you should have a unit of Meganobz to lead the assault by looking big and threatening and absorb firepower that would mangle boyz, while following up with a unit of Boyz to do the dirty work.

One response to this will be: Oh, well, anti-tank weapons will just splat them while the anti-infantry weapons will smear the Boyz. This is where tactics and strategy come in. You, as the player, need to figure out a way to take out the opposing anti-tank weapons and the material you'll need to pull it off. This is the same with Terminators; they're resistant to anti-infantry weapons and that's about: they're not supposed to be invulnerable.

Nurglitch wrote:
So, does that mean you should replace your Boyz with Meganobz? No, of course not. Just that having one or the other is a false dilemma. Ideally you should have a unit of Meganobz to lead the assault by looking big and threatening and absorb firepower that would mangle boyz, while following up with a unit of Boyz to do the dirty work.

That sounds interesting, thing is it's a shame the Mega Nobz have slower movement. Maybe use a Trukk to give them a first turn boost and then deploy. Alternatively maybe you don't care if they fall out of a truck because their 2+ helps keep them alive.

Problem remains that 6 meganobz without any upgrades are 240 points. Add a trukk without upgrades, and that's 275 points.

Is this your 'one'? The 'one' that crushes the enemy in assault?

Nearly 20% of your 1500 point army? Really? Seems like a bad plan to me.

Consolidate 3", move slow and assault slow...no real shooting, no high init attacks.

What's to like? Running min sized squads? 120 points is 20 orks.

Kombi weapon choices are bad.

The fact they are elites is a serious drawback. Trade a CC unit for lootas? Not today or any day.

The only real choice is you can stick them in as troops with a Warboss, and run multiple units of them (up to 5).

Almost might be scary. The extra wound is not of much use against TMC lists, since Tyrants with implant attack and carnifexes with S9 zap 'em away; and that's where quasi termies in trukks come in handy. Sure you can suicide if you want to, but it doesn't seem like a great trade since 2 TMC are probably worth the number of meganobz you'd need to kill 'em.

All I see is either the trukk getting blown up and the meganobz getting pinned, or the meganobz get lucky and get shot out in front of you. Having clear shots to the meganobz after they get out will make life difficult.

Meganobz, not scary.

No, that unit is the one that gets thrown forward and soaks up all that anti-infantry fire that might otherwise inconvenience the Boyz following them up to do the crushing.

Lootas are expensive and squishy. They're overkill to any unit that isn't Armour 14 and nearly useless against those that are (given the Mekboyz). They look like a great idea until people learn how to shake and bake them. Whirlwinds, a handy utility vehicle against Orks, eat them. Likewise a squad of Terminators with a heavy flamer does to them what they do to all Orks, except they get a 2.5x deal for every wound they cause on Lootas.

Everyone's gaga over Lootas, and then we'll hear the cries of cheese or whatever the newspeak is, and then eventually people will realize either how to deal with them or how taking more than one mob makes the army a one-trick pony and the fuss'll die down. We won't see the opposite for Meganobz though. The wise men of the Internet Consensus will write them off, and it'll just be a self-reinforcing spiral downwards. Those who learn to use them, like us Shooty Ork Warbosses of the 3rd editon Codex, will be cheerfully ignored because they are a minority.

120 points of Boyz is likewise bolter bait. Wound that unit with 12 bolter shots and lose 10 Boyz, wound the Nobz with the same and lose one Nob. At that rate in two turns you'll have 0 Boyz and four Meganobz. Oh, and the Meganobz will move faster thanks to the trukk.

Combi-weapons are handy for that one-shot softening effect that Skorchas have on infantry and Rokkits have on Monstrous Creatures.

If you're really that risk-adverse, take Mad Doc Grotsnik and throw him in with the Meganobz. The Cybork Bodies are okay if you want to, but the real value will be in having Fearless Meganobz.

Mega Nobz are 240 points for six power claws with two wounds each and a 2+. This is the most you can fit into a truck.

6 Nobz including a Pain Boy are 150 points. Putting three power claws in there brings you up to 225. Give them +1 WS and it takes them to 240 points.

So you can have six power klaws with a 2+ or you can have 3 WS5 power klaws (and an extra attack from the slugga) with 6+/FNP.

With leadership 7 both Nobz and Mega Nobz do well as HQ bodyguards, and it's true that the Mega Nobz REALLY do well with the Mad Doc. Fearless, Cybork and FNP is exactly what they're looking for.

I can see myself taking a squad of 10 with the Mad Doc marching smack dab in the middle of my army. I've always wanted a cool terminator army. They even get 10 twin-linked shootas, which the Nobz have to pay an extra 5 points for.

But the problem I see there Nurglich is that, sure they are Fearless but they now have to charge the closest target...

That doesn't fit very well with their Slow and Purposeful. Any opponent that is smart will sacrifice something to lure you around the battlefield to the point of ineffectuality. Grotsnik is a really fluffy character; however, it is a double edged sword.

While I don't find MA Nobs useless, I don't find them a glaringly powerful choice. They are best left for people running fluffly lists or playing friendly games. They are just too many points for their battlefield effectivness. Couple that with low squad sizes and you have a very fragile unit that has cost you a sizable chunk of your force.

I have 8 MA Nob models...and I'll miss putting them on the table in serious games. I was hoping they would get a boost, but all they got was left behind in a previous edition, with less upgrades. But....we got Lootas in Elite slots...<shrug> Coun't me slightly unimpressed.

Umm yeah. It's called losing.

must...resist...urge...to...feed...the...troll.....