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A scoring unit is a unit taken from the troop section of an armies codex or unless it specifies that the unit is scoring.

Though I have read on various forums that x10 wraithguard and a warlock is a scoring unit and that a Daemon Prince of Chaos taken from the Chaos Daemons codex is a scoring unit? I have also read that the Nurglings are a scoring unit despite having the swarm rule.

Why is this? Am i completely missing some caveat to the scoring unit rule.

The simpler explanation is that the accounts which you read in other forums were misinformed or were the result of misunderstanding the rules.

In particular, Nurglings units are not scoring because the effect of the Swarms special rule prevents that particular troop choice from scoring.

In other cases, such as the Dark Angel Ravenwing, various special rules can make otherwise non-Troop units, such as land speeders, count as scoring. Those various cases vary from codex to codex and are dependent on special rules in the particular codex which explicitly state that such and such units in that codex count as scoring.

Another alternative is that the accounts which you mention were either referencing custom, scenario specific rules determining which units were scoring, or were using the 4th edition scoring rules. For example, I believe that under 4th edition, the current daemon prince would be scoring as a non-IC monstrous creature, in contrast to the normal 5th edition scoring rules by which the daemon prince is not a scoring unit.

Depending on the codex, some units count as troops if you take them in certain numbers.

For example, if your SM Captain is on a bike, you can take bike squads as Troops OR Fast Attack.

If you take wraithguard in squads of ten, with a spiritseer, they can be taken as Troops OR Elites.

When these units are taken as Troops, then count as scoring units, and come from your six Troops slots on the FOC.

ArbitorIan wrote:If you take wraithguard in squads of ten, with a spiritseer, they can be taken as Troops OR Elites.

Yes right there Where are you getting this information from? I can't find this in the codex.

It's in the codex, look at the unit entries for Wraithguard.

An expensive 400pt troops choice, but add a fortunelock with conceal and watch as that unit marches across soaking up punishment.

Daemon Princes are definitely NOT scoring, they are Heavy Support in DoC.

Ealiom wrote:Yes right there Where are you getting this information from? I can't find this in the codex.

Page 62

Great thanks... Don't know why but i was looking under wraithgaurd entries, wraighsight, spiritseer, warlock everywhere but the points cost.

And I can't think of a reason ever where a Demon Prince is a scoring unit.

whitedragon wrote:And I can't think of a reason ever where a Demon Prince is a scoring unit.

4th Edition

I think the only non-troop unit that's currently scoring are Sternguard with Pedro Cantor.

Also note that vehicles, even if troops, are never scoring units. So no Deff Dreads, Ravenwing Speeders, etc.

But the Dark Angels codex specifically lists Ravenwing Speeders as scoring, and doesn't the codex override the BGB?

I believe that the BA dex lists Death Company as scoring in the FAQ, which should also make them scoring.

Codices don't automatically override the BGB anymore. The codex says they count as independent scoring units, but the missions specifically says that nothing that is a vehicle can score. I think in this instance mission specific rules (even for the base mission) over ride codex rules.

Polonius wrote:Codices don't automatically override the BGB anymore. The codex says they count as independent scoring units, but the missions specifically says that nothing that is a vehicle can score. I think in this instance mission specific rules (even for the base mission) over ride codex rules.

You're saying that the rule 'Vehicles which are part of a troop choice are not scoring' is more specific than 'A Ravenwing land speeder is always scoring.' That is a very surprising conclusion.

I agree with solkan on this point. The mission is not more specific (note also that scoring units are not listed under a mission type, but general rules) in this case, because it addresses all vehicles, and the RLS addresses one.

Gwar! wrote:

whitedragon wrote:And I can't think of a reason ever where a Demon Prince is a scoring unit.

4th Edition

That or some ones getting planet strike mixed up ...

Polonius wrote:I think the only non-troop unit that's currently scoring are Sternguard with Pedro Cantor.

Also note that vehicles, even if troops, are never scoring units. So no Deff Dreads, Ravenwing Speeders, etc.

Except in Planetstrike, when they are.

Planetstrike doesn't have scoring units. It just has units.

ajfirecracker wrote:Planetstrike doesn't have scoring units. It just has units.

No, it has Scoring units. More precisely, it has a Special Rule that allows ALL units to score. What is not clarified is if units that can NEVER score (Like Rippers) can score in Planetstrike and require pre-game clarification.

Gwar! wrote:

ajfirecracker wrote:Planetstrike doesn't have scoring units. It just has units.

No, it has Scoring units. More precisely, it has a Special Rule that allows ALL units to score. What is not clarified is if units that can NEVER score (Like Rippers) can score in Planetstrike and require pre-game clarification.

I think Gwar that specific rules over rule general. All units are scoring unless they specifically state they don't.

It's like the two warbosses thing. The codex doesnt say you can't have two nob squads as troops, but it doesn't exactly tell you it's ok

ajfirecracker wrote:I believe that the BA dex lists Death Company as scoring in the FAQ, which should also make them scoring.

As a BA player please allow me to say no, just no. The question is in reference to a rule that no longer exists, and even if taken literally has to be stretched in such a way I dare anyone to back that up with a straight face.

Nightwatch wrote:It's like the two warbosses thing. The codex doesnt say you can't have two nob squads as troops, but it doesn't exactly tell you it's ok

Except that...it tells you that if you take a warboss, you can take a squad of nobz as troops. So, a second warboss would therefore be able to take a second Nobz squad as troops per his entry. So, the codex does tell you that you can.

I guess I'm still curious as to whether Ravenwing Speeders can score. The codex says they do, which should be the more specific rule overriding the BGB saying that Vehicles can never score.

Neconilis, VP are still in 5e. They're described as optional, but there's rules for them and everything. So the question about Death Company's VP total is still relevent/extant.

Also, since Death Company are hardly typical elites (free, don't take up FOC, possibly 0 VP) it's not that strange an idea that they might be able to score (particularly since their rage requirements will keep them off most objectives w/o a chaplain), and the FAQ is pretty clear on this point, at least for now.

whitedragon wrote:

Nightwatch wrote:It's like the two warbosses thing. The codex doesnt say you can't have two nob squads as troops, but it doesn't exactly tell you it's ok

Except that...it tells you that if you take a warboss, you can take a squad of nobz as troops. So, a second warboss would therefore be able to take a second Nobz squad as troops per his entry. So, the codex does tell you that you can.

I guess I'm still curious as to whether Ravenwing Speeders can score. The codex says they do, which should be the more specific rule overriding the BGB saying that Vehicles can never score.

Of course they can.

The argument of; "But they are still Vehicles and therefore cannot score" is simply stupid.
It would be like saying; "But they are still Elites and therefore cannot score" to the Sternguards in an army with Pedro Cantor.

Let's see, several points to address.......

Blood Angel Death Company has no such statement about being scoring (leastwise, I didn't find it on page 18 (unit entry) or on page 10 (unit description)) in the most current download. If yours still has a bunch of FAQ stuff on the last page, go get the new one.

Codices do indeed override main rules. GW has said so over and over, in both the main rules and their FAQ/Erratta. Hence we have Elite Infantry (Sternguard, an Elite choice) that can be scoring in spite of the main rules saying Troops only. So why does everyone have so much heartburn over the fact that DA can do the same thing with RW Bike Squadron Landspeeders, overriding the no vehicles clause? It's the same rules premise, that a special rule in the codex overrides the restrictions on what is and is not scoring and allows a normally non-scoring unit to become scoring. Bottom line, by RAW, those DA RW Landspeeders are scoring.

So, I take a Big Mek and a Troopified Deff Dred. My Deff Dred, though a troop choice, is not scoring?

KaloranSLC wrote:So, I take a Big Mek and a Troopified Deff Dred. My Deff Dred, though a troop choice, is not scoring?

Correct, because it is a Vehicle.

Gwar! wrote:

KaloranSLC wrote:So, I take a Big Mek and a Troopified Deff Dred. My Deff Dred, though a troop choice, is not scoring?

Correct, because it is a Vehicle.

Huh. Why even bother, then?

Fit more into the Force Org Chart, allowing you to have 9 kans and 2 dreads in the same list, potentially.