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I have seen this debate before on here(except it was only ground battles) and I have seen many IOM vs GE threads and I was wondering what would happen if there was a all out war between the two forces? We all know that the GE could win because it has faster FTL speeds and the IOM could win because it has more numbers. So here is my scenario for this debate
Scenario: What would happen if a few portals opened up in the IOM territory to several planets in Star Wars a few days after the battle of Hoth?
Also what would happen if one portal was opened during the battle of Hoth instead of many?
How much faster would this war go if every IOM ship was upgraded with Hyperdrives how would that work?
How would they do if the IOM invaded with just the way they are?

Oh great it's this tread again .

Not another one, The IoM.

The IoM has far superior numbers, but not necessarily better technology, and that makes a huge difference. I doubt a squad of ten Jedi would have much trouble defeating hundreds of Guardsmen, or even Space Marines.

Although it entirely depends on the time. If this is The Old Republic time-framed then the IoM would lose. If this is Episode 4 (and indeed Galactic Empire) and onward time-framed, then the IoM would probably win, although I haven't read any of the Star Wars books. (I do recall there being lightsaber proof armor, which would probably equate to power-sword-proof armor).

Also, the basic soldier weapons of the SW universe are a heck of a lot more powerful than the weapons of the Imperial Guards lasgun.

I would give it to the Galactic Empire, simply because their tech is better and more powerful. and Jedi don't have the possiblity of having their brains explode when they use their powers. Force Lightning FTW.

Logistically, the Galactic Empire is simply far superior than the Imperium of Man.

However, in most other aspects, the IoM is superior, IMHO.

However, logistics is probably the single most important aspect of prolonged warfare, so it may give the Galactic Empire the win.

While the Imperium has, indeed, a million worlds... it's only got one race. The Galactic Empire, the Republic, the Old Republic, the Sith Empire, whatever, has a million worlds (or more) of a thousand or more species, all of which bring their own special xeno abilities and technologies to the art of warfare and, like the IoM, are versed in the strategy of "total war". While both Librarians and Psykers can be (and are) rather powerful, the SW universe contains far more examples of "alpha-plus" than the 40K universe does. Also, the SW "psykers" don't risk warp corruption, daemonic incursion or rampant insanity.

Lightsabers can only block bullets. Let's see how they do against Noise Marine weapons.

The Imperium of man have fleets of planet killers, each of which is really hard to destroy.

The GE had one...which was blown up by a kid.

Not to mention that the IoM ships are way larger and more destructive than Star Wars Ships.

The IoM will just steam roller over them.

And don't bring up jedis. There were no Jedis during the time of the GE. Well...ok there were like 4 or five. That's not enough.

The Galactic Empire has far superior ftl drives, far superior weapons ( at least if we go by the calculations on Stardestroyer.net and compare them to what we see in the warhammer fluff), including various planetkillers, shields which protect a planet from all conventional bombing, and possibly even comparable numbers as well as superior production capabilities ( when was the last time that the Imperium of Man built two moonsized stations, alongside a huge conventional fleet, in less than twenty years? ).

KingDeath wrote:The Galactic Empire has far superior ftl drives, far superior weapons ( at least if we go by the calculations on Stardestroyer.net and compare them to what we see in the warhammer fluff), including various planetkillers, shields which protect a planet from all conventional bombing, and possibly even comparable numbers as well as superior production capabilities ( when was the last time that the Imperium of Man built two moonsized stations, alongside a huge conventional fleet, in less than twenty years? ).

What do you mean various planet killers? There has only been one, and that was the deathstar.

And superior weapons? Really?

CthuluIsSpy wrote:

KingDeath wrote:The Galactic Empire has far superior ftl drives, far superior weapons ( at least if we go by the calculations on Stardestroyer.net and compare them to what we see in the warhammer fluff), including various planetkillers, shields which protect a planet from all conventional bombing, and possibly even comparable numbers as well as superior production capabilities ( when was the last time that the Imperium of Man built two moonsized stations, alongside a huge conventional fleet, in less than twenty years? ).

What do you mean various planet killers? There has only been one, and that was the deathstar.

And superior weapons? Really?

They built two deathstars in the movies as well as various other superweapons in the various books.
The superior firepower comes from the nice calculations found here: http://www.stardestroyer.net/tlc/Power/index.html
So far no Imperial Frigate, the closest equivalent to a stardestroyer in size, managed to show something comparable.

All your opinions in the end really.
And we do NOT need to be discussing this again.

Close Shut the Jaws of Oblivion


Please not this thread again

THIS THREAD IS THE REPETITION OF ANOTHER, AND AS SUCH IS DEEMED HERETICAL BY THE ORDO DAKKANAUTUS!

/thread

Leonus Cohol wrote:
/thread

And yet the tiny Stardestroyer seems to have comparable or even more firepower than the much larger battleship.

Hmm... I used to love Star Wars. Then episode 1 came out.

Well... where to begin. I'll start with my take on SW.
Star Wars is 3 movies known as episodes 4, 5 and 6. It was also a wonderful series of books that enriched the background and explained much about the SW universe.
Then one day some jerk with the initials JL felt he needed more money and completely destroyed the SW universe. After his evil masterplan (episode one) a huge army of newbs overwhelmed the universe of SW and it switched from a beautiful universe to a silly piece of junk.
I'm an ol' fassion SW fan. In my eyes, nothing exists outside of the original 3 films and the entire series of books up until the Jedi Academy novels (which almost coencided with the release of episode 1).
I feel that Jedi are over-rated. If you like the newer SW stuff then you like the idea of Jedi being killed by mass firepower (Episode 2).

The Imperium outclasses the empire in every way. The Empire is a racist force of humans trying to enslave or execute any non-human race. The common folk of the galaxy don't like Palpatine. The fleets of the empire require the Emperor to make their forces work in tandem. Star Destroyers are relatively small in comparison to IoM ships. GE ships are armed with lasers, laser cannons, ion cannons, tractor-beams and topedoes. They also have a large number of TIE craft and onboard stormtrooper formations. Star Wars space battles happen at incredibly close range. Unrealisticly close. The GE protects it's ships with energy sheilds, complicated manuvers overlapping feilds of fire and smaller fighting vessels.

The Imperium is also racist. However, they want the complete destruction of all non-humans and humans with different ideology. The citizens of the Imperium love the Emperor. The fleets of the Imperium need the Emperor to help them move great distances. Imperium ships are colossal vessels that dwarf any of the Empires ships barring the Eclipse Class star destroyer and the Death Stars (of which there were 3 btw). The IoM ships are armed with lasers, laser cannons, torpedoes, nova cannons and (If including Space Marines) drop pod assult transports and thunderhawks. They also have onboard defensive forces as well as possible armies in transport. The Imperial space battles happen at great range (hundreds of kilometers). The IoM defends its vessels with energy sheilds, complicated manuvers, overlapping feilds of fire and smaller fighting vessels.

The Empire could put up a fight but would ultimately fall. The Imperium can attack from longer range and upon reaching close quarters would be smashed under the firepower of the 40K ships or the unrelenting waves of boarding craft.

On the matter of land engagements it's also no contest. Everything the GE can bring to battle the IoM can bring aswell... only bigger and covered with more weapons.

On the matter of super weapons again it is no contest. The GE has the Death Star II (and technically the Darksaber) both fantastically powerful weapons that can shatter a ship or a planet.
The IoM has planet killing capabilities on most of the larger vessels in the form of Exterminatus payloads. Thou, Exterminatus isn't used on enemy starships but, that's what nova cannons are for.

The basic troopers of the armies (Guardsmen and Stoormtroopers) are quite equally matched but the IoM has a greater range of support for the troops on the ground.

Super soldiers... well we all know Space Marines. The Empire really doesn't have something on par with the Astartes. Perhaps a Jedi... but, we're talking about the "after Hoth" timeline. So we have Luke, Vader and a few other unknown Jedi at the time.

The Imperium is superior but, I'd actually see them teaming up if anything.

I still love Star Wars. It doesn't matter to me how bad Eps 1-3 were, they don't take away from the awesomeness of the setting for me. In fact, I think I like the EU more than the holy trilogy, over all, because the greatest thing Lucas ever did with Star Wars was give us a setting as a background in which to write original stories.

Star Wars is fine without canon-characters or original-movie-characters making any appearances. You can still have Jedi and Sith and droids and space ships and everything else and, so long as you don't go too way-out-in-left-field with the writing, still have a kick-ass Star Wars story.

Heck, as much as I dislike what the prequels established, I still love the current Clone Wars cartoons. They're better than the movies, that's for damn sure.

Though we've had this discussion before... Nova Cannons are great, but found on only a handful of IN vessels. Titans are cool, but there's only so many of them, and most of them seem to be smaller than an AT-AT. Space battles in SW seem to be at short-range only because we have very little to go by as a frame of reference. It's also a concession to a movie audience. What good is a space battle if all you see is one ship shoot a laser at... nothing, because the enemy ship is so far away you can't see it? If you want to know the actual ranges at which SW ships are in combat, check Wookieepedia or any of the SW tech books for the ranges of their weapons and Imperial tactics and such.

Also... yes, keep launching your boarding torpedoes and such at deflector shields. That's what the hundreds-to-thousands of point-defense turrets on Imperial starships are for. Boarding parties exist in SW, too. Shoot, I think there's a lot of one appearing in the other, and it's pretty well designed or intended that way. It's artistic inspiration... and artistic method, at this point. The two are so very similar.

Space marine fires standard bolter at Jedi, Jedi tries to deflect, the bolt explodes on impact with light saber, Shrapnel hits jedi. NEXT!

Don't deflect the bolt round, let it sail wide, or stop dead (like, in the barrel) with telekinesis.

... deja vu.... we've had this conversation before.

Psienesis wrote:Don't deflect the bolt round, let it sail wide, or stop dead (like, in the barrel) with telekinesis.

Jedi's can stop 50 high speed explosive projectiles in mid air?

Jedi's can stop 50 high speed explosive projectiles in mid air?

Jedi can pull starships out of orbit with telekinesis.

50 bullets isn't such a big deal.

Can all Jedi do this? No. Then again, not every SM is Logan Grimnar.

Psienesis wrote:

Jedi's can stop 50 high speed explosive projectiles in mid air?

Jedi can pull starships out of orbit with telekinesis.

50 bullets isn't such a big deal.

Can all Jedi do this? No. Then again, not every SM is Logan Grimnar.

Lolwut? Since when could they do that?

Since "Force Unleashed".

We've had this conversation before, I would suggest finding the previous thread on it.

Psienesis wrote:Since "Force Unleashed".

We've had this conversation before, I would suggest finding the previous thread on it.

Is that even canon? And even then, I'm calling BS.

If they were really that powerful...how did they get slaughtered? No really, why didn't they just force push the Clone Troopers away against the walls when they turned traitor?

If they are powerful enough to pull a friggen starship out of orbit then they should be able to take out a bunch of foot soldiers without any difficulty.

It all comes down to how good are jedi against IoM forces when in "reality" the SW universe couldn't field jedi in a force that would counter a IoM battlefleet. Sure, 1 jedi can beat 1 SM (maybe), but let's say there are 3 companies of space marines sent the Hoth portal. That's roughly 300 space marines plus various vechiles and eqipment. Pretty sure there weren't 300 jedi during the GE era. Let's not forget the numerous IG regiments that would be sent there also. And while the GE may have stronger fleet weapons, their numbers pale in comparision. You would have something similar (in terms of space warfare) to the Battle of Thermopoly (spartans vs persians), eventually numbers will win.

There wasn't 300 Jedi during the GE era. There were, at most, 3. There were, however, a fethload of Sith-trained Force Users (Emperor's Hands... think Death Cult Assassins with throat-crushing, head-exploding, laser-and-explosion-dodging, lightning-throwing, red-lightsabre-wielding Force powers) running about bringing the unrighteous, stone cold secret Force-Ninja-Kill to anyone Palpatine pointed them at.

Is that even canon? And even then, I'm calling BS.

Yes and I don't care. Unlike GW, the Star Wars franchise has an established canon. Force Unleashed, as with any SW video game, is rated only S-Canon... but that establishes it as true within the SW universe until another source comes along and says that it, specifically, is not.

So, yeah, Galen Starkiller pulled a Star Destroyer out of orbit and crushed a small army with it.

Also didnt they cloan star killer, so in theory they could make multiple cloans of him giving them any army of jedis with that level or near it of ability?

Also if this conflict would occur remember that the IoM still has all of its other fronts as well.

Also is the Warp even in the SW galaxy? Because if its not, then the GM has it hands down as they have FLT and the Iom would only have sublight.

Also is the Warp even in the SW galaxy?

The argument is made, from the 40K perspective, that since it supposedly exists in all times and places, it exists in the SW universe.

Which is fine to me, because that does not interact with the Force in any way. The Force is not "psyker power", it's an energy created by all living things and, for some, it is life itself. Be Warp-Resistant all you like, the Force is not warp-craft and cares not for your little glowy runes.

The SW universe's FTL transport is a hundred times, or more, faster than anything in the 40K universe. Crossing the galaxy (whatever galaxy they're in) in SW is a trip of a couple weeks, at most. That is months to years in 40K, with no guarantee you will ever arrive. Of course, we don't know if the SW universe is smaller than the Milky Way or what, but even still... hyperspace is really, really, really fast.

Psienesis wrote:
The SW universe's FTL transport is a hundred times, or more, faster than anything in the 40K universe.

Last words of a famous Captain, before a metric ton of Necrons popped up with their inertia-less drives.