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So after some research (wiki) I kinda like the idea of the squats, i had heard about them before but never looked into them. After reading up on them i want to know do you think they should bring them back?

As you know squats were the Dwarfs of the 40k world and they were removed from the game because they felt like they were a joke army and did not really pay omega to the dwarf race in the 40 universe.

But with out squats The imperium of man would not have most of the items they have today. such as the engines that drive their ships or the exo-armor that they wear into battle and lets be honest SM would be kinda lame if they did not have terminator armor,

So How do you think they could bring them back?

Cloned from squat gene seeds? A hidden group of squats that survived all these years that finally decided to make a comeback?

more races is more diversity which is more fun

As an army, no. As an abhuman regiment in IG, go for it.

-cgmckenzie

Thats what i wanted them back as. not an army, but a unit for IG or maybe even SM. They would have a few HQs and then like a troop and an elite. The main reason for taking them in an army would be that you can attach them to Vehicles. so I could attach a squat squad (hah fun to say) to lets say a LR. That LR is now being piloted by squats and gets some sort of bonus, like increased movement, BS, armor or a 4 or 5 saving throw for having a better driver.

Hmm i wish they did, but they wont.

Squats live on!
They inhabit the Fortress Monastary of the Dark Angels known as "the Rock"

These squats all wear robes and call themselves: the watchers in the dark!

jk, but really what are the watchers in the dark?

Honestly, I hope not, for the sole reason that it'll cause more of the "OH I REMEMBER THIS OLD THING WHY ISN'T IT BACK" bleating that Squats get all the time.

Squats have some interesting premise and character, I'd be all for bringing them back, but I don't think they should be their own army, rather they should be an ally for Imperial armies in general, remnants of the Squat homeworlds fighting on in spite of the death of their civilization.

I don't think they should be an army in their own right, but I would like to see them brought back as an abhuman unit for the Imperial Guard. (Much like the Ratlings and Ogryn.)

cgmckenzie wrote:As an army, no. As an abhuman regiment in IG, go for it.

-cgmckenzie

This. The idea behind the squats as an independent army was stupid, midget bikers is space with guns?

Are Squats now viable with 6th edition?

^^ agree like i said not as a army but as ally units

Buttons wrote:

cgmckenzie wrote:As an army, no. As an abhuman regiment in IG, go for it.

-cgmckenzie

This. The idea behind the squats as an independent army was stupid, midget bikers is space with guns?

*DWARF* bikers.



To be fair, back when they actually *were* an army, in the days of RT and the early era of 2nd, they weren't all that out there next to other 40k stuff. Especially in RT, where 40k was a whole lot more "Heavy Metal"/cyber-punk, and less "Dark Ages in Spaaaaace", back when marines were T3 with a 4+ power armor save (only a 5+ against Lasguns!) and the game had rules for dinosaurs and air to air dogfighting, and people were sent to concentration camps for late library books.

Backspacehacker wrote:Thats what i wanted them back as. not an army, but a unit for IG or maybe even SM. They would have a few HQs and then like a troop and an elite. The main reason for taking them in an army would be that you can attach them to Vehicles. so I could attach a squat squad (hah fun to say) to lets say a LR. That LR is now being piloted by squats and gets some sort of bonus, like increased movement, BS, armor or a 4 or 5 saving throw for having a better driver.

Absolutely not. The IG codex already has ratlings, which are still too many dwarves for me to handle.

And why should they get to be back and have fancy rules? I'm still waiting on my Mordian Officer and doctrines. I hate squats and if they are in the Imperial Guard codex, then it is just taking away from the potential of the rest of the army.

Ignatius wrote:

Backspacehacker wrote:Thats what i wanted them back as. not an army, but a unit for IG or maybe even SM. They would have a few HQs and then like a troop and an elite. The main reason for taking them in an army would be that you can attach them to Vehicles. so I could attach a squat squad (hah fun to say) to lets say a LR. That LR is now being piloted by squats and gets some sort of bonus, like increased movement, BS, armor or a 4 or 5 saving throw for having a better driver.

Absolutely not. The IG codex already has ratlings, which are still too many dwarves for me to handle.

And why should they get to be back and have fancy rules? I'm still waiting on my Mordian Officer and doctrines. I hate squats and if they are in the Imperial Guard codex, then it is just taking away from the potential of the rest of the army.

How on earth does it take anything away from the rest of the army if they are included? Simply by being an option they take something away?

Squats are a distinct race with a distinct culture and their own distinct technology base, much different than the distinctions between IG regiments. The Doctrines thing wasn't really a huge deal, they were there for *one* book, and are largely replicateable through other means.

-Yes to the concept of 'dwarves in space' (which I guess is what the poll is asking? I voted yes in that case)
- No to the original, twenty year old conception of beer guzzling trike riders.

Although, TBH I think GW have missed the boat in any case, Mantic have released a really cool force called the Forge Fathers. A nice range already, very cheap, and there are a load of new releases lined up for the rest of this year (got an example of one below in the spoiler tags, for any old time Squat fans!)

GW range on the way? Then they should have fething let me know about it...

Vaktathi wrote:

Ignatius wrote:

Backspacehacker wrote:Thats what i wanted them back as. not an army, but a unit for IG or maybe even SM. They would have a few HQs and then like a troop and an elite. The main reason for taking them in an army would be that you can attach them to Vehicles. so I could attach a squat squad (hah fun to say) to lets say a LR. That LR is now being piloted by squats and gets some sort of bonus, like increased movement, BS, armor or a 4 or 5 saving throw for having a better driver.

Absolutely not. The IG codex already has ratlings, which are still too many dwarves for me to handle.

And why should they get to be back and have fancy rules? I'm still waiting on my Mordian Officer and doctrines. I hate squats and if they are in the Imperial Guard codex, then it is just taking away from the potential of the rest of the army.

How on earth does it take anything away from the rest of the army if they are included? Simply by being an option they take something away?

Squats are a distinct race with a distinct culture and their own distinct technology base, much different than the distinctions between IG regiments. The Doctrines thing wasn't really a huge deal, they were there for *one* book, and are largely replicateable through other means.

Doctrines were my favorite aspect of 40k in any codex ever, so I'm not backing down on that one. And yes, if you spend time developing rules and models for a new (and ugly) model range (squats) then some other aspect of the codex and models is going to be short changed. Where would they fit in the FOC? Elites? Troops? Supplements? If they are put in any place, then another potential unit other than the squats looses its chance to be in it.

I represent the extreme in this arguement. I hate the squats more than any other concept of 40k that I can think of right now. Hate their fluff, hate their models, hate their idea, hate hate hate. And I am usually a pretty forgiving and accepting guy.

Ignatius wrote:
Doctrines were my favorite aspect of 40k in any codex ever, so I'm not backing down on that one.

They were cool yeah, but most of it was "I take one or two cool things and the rest I spend on getting unit options back". They're exactly the kind of thing that lasts one edition and then gets laid by the wayside. I liked them too, but never felt they were essential to the core of the army.

And yes, if you spend time developing rules and models for a new (and ugly) model range (squats) then some other aspect of the codex and models is going to be short changed. Where would they fit in the FOC? Elites? Troops? Supplements?

As an Allies FoC they'd be great actually.

If they are put in any place, then another potential unit other than the squats looses its chance to be in it.

Not necessarily, GW basically puts in what it feels like, GW doesn't always add stuff either. The Imperial Guard went over a decade without a change to the Fast Attack options IIRC.

I represent the extreme in this arguement. I hate the squats more than any other concept of 40k that I can think of right now. Hate their fluff, hate their models, hate their idea, hate hate hate. And I am usually a pretty forgiving and accepting guy.

Are you familiar with anything else of the era in which they existed?

If you dont like them thats cool this is just a Thread to see who wants them back or a revamped version of them back. Something with the idea of them not being a joke. It can easily be done and make it fit into the grim dark world of 40k.

Vaktathi wrote:

Ignatius wrote:My hate

Your disection of my hate

Doctrines for me are a way to have my own personal army. I don't want to have my guardsmen be like everyone elses, it takes a little bit of the game away from me. I like the idea of my own army, personalized the way I want it to be. I was devestated when they took them out. With all the diversity of the guard, it is now all bland and the same.

Eh, it's all a matter of opinion and personal tastes. I know what the units looked like back in 2nd sure, none of them even come close to the squats. Despite your best efforts, and probably reasonable defences, I will still hate them. It's irrational sure, but I can't help it. I just hate them.

I'd be tempted to have a Guard squad of them.

Although I am still waiting for the next time Tau comes out. Part of me hopes we'll see Demiurg added as another 'allied' race for the army.

Vaktathi wrote:

Ignatius wrote:
I represent the extreme in this arguement. I hate the squats more than any other concept of 40k that I can think of right now. Hate their fluff, hate their models, hate their idea, hate hate hate. And I am usually a pretty forgiving and accepting guy.

Are you familiar with anything else of the era in which they existed?

Perfect answer. Type 'warhammer rogue trader miniatures' into google, and the Squats don't look half bad by comparison. They were completely suitable for the time in which they were made, and the game they inhabited. The 40k game universe, miniature designs and overall aesthetic of the game have changed massively over the last 20 years.

Pacific wrote:

Vaktathi wrote:

Ignatius wrote:
I represent the extreme in this arguement. I hate the squats more than any other concept of 40k that I can think of right now. Hate their fluff, hate their models, hate their idea, hate hate hate. And I am usually a pretty forgiving and accepting guy.

Are you familiar with anything else of the era in which they existed?

Perfect answer. Type 'warhammer rogue trader miniatures' into google, and the Squats don't look half bad by comparison. They were completely suitable for the time in which they were made, and the game they inhabited. The 40k game universe, miniature designs and overall aesthetic of the game have changed massively over the last 20 years.

Again, I am aware of what existed at the same time. And again they are still stupid and ugly to me. More so than any other unit

I hate Squats with a vengeance. They need to stay dead.

Ignatius, just purely out of interest what do you think of the model/concept in the post I made about halfway up the page (in the spoiler tags)?

Just curious really whether you dislike just the biker/beer swelling side of things, dwarves in space, or just dwarves generally? Or if there was some other event in your life that made you dislike them (perhaps you were 'touched by a dwarf' ) (so sorry, just joking with the last bit! )

Dakka should ban squats. It's fething irritating having this bs come up time and time again.
Almost as bad as reading what I have to say...

Pacific wrote:Ignatius, just purely out of interest what do you think of the model/concept in the post I made about halfway up the page (in the spoiler tags)?

Just curious really whether you dislike just the biker/beer swelling side of things, dwarves in space, or just dwarves generally? Or if there was some other event in your life that made you dislike them (perhaps you were 'touched by a dwarf' ) (so sorry, just joking with the last bit! )

I'll just say this. I like my humans to be the way I perceive humans to be. So like we are now. I hate dwarves of all kinds. Warhammer, squats, lord of the rings. All them. I don't think it's a very good concept at all. Bikers and beer swellers are fine by me though

I'd like to see them as a minor bit of fluff, and maybe a single IG unit. Rather than bikes (since when do dwarves use cavalry?) I'd suggest maybe their terminator-wannabes, although that treads on Ogryn territory. Or perhaps it could be a HWT variant, using weapons that used to be Squat in origin (and are currently not in the codex) like the Thudd gun and Mole Launcher.

Testify wrote:Dakka should ban squats. It's fething irritating having this bs come up time and time again.
Almost as bad as reading what I have to say...

Why should they ban the topic? you dont have to click on the form if you dont want to read about it. no one is forcing you to read this haha

I wouldn't want them back as a full army unless they were given the treatment Dark Eldar got with their release, and had a comprehensive range of great figures to go along with it. I'd like to have them as an allied sublist or as part of another army though.