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This is simple, just pick your favorite LOYALIST First Founding Chapter and explain your reasoning. Personally, I'd go for Blood Angels, because they're Primarch is just utter amaze-sauce. And if the Ultrasmurfs win, I shall be shocked.

I added Alpha Legion because it is debatable whether or not they are Loyalists, and I have met many who believe that they are.

You are missing quite a few First Founding Legions up there. I don't see any of the ones who turned traitor except the Alpha Legion.

My choice would be for the Emperor's Children. Before they all started touching themselves inappropriately, I mean. They were pretty darn hard-core when they only had a couple hundred guys they could field. Purple and gold is a pimp color scheme, and their Primarch had the best hair out of all 20 of his brothers. Plus, they exterminated an alien race that was so advanced, the Imperium was considering letting them live because wiping them out would be too difficult and costly... and they (the EC) only lost 700 guys in the whole campaign.

Dark Angels because what they were on doing on Caliban was basically Dark Souls... in SPAAAAACE! Their introspective and brooding nature also appeals to me.

I like how they put their own set of rules and traditions first while pretending to conform on the surface. They've also mostly kept their cohesion as a legion.

All Unforgiven first companies fight exclusively in terminator armour.

Plus they tend to wear hooded robes over their power armour.

They also float around space in a massive planet-turned spacecraft fortress monastery. They literally took their planet with them because they couldn't let go of the past. And then there's the Watchers in the Dark, which add an element of mystery. What's not to like?

And secretssss

which leads to my second choice, the Alpha Legion. I'll not go into them too much but they're pretty badass. I like how they can function as individual cells while still maintaining a galaxy-wide network. And the whole Alpharius-Omegon and we are all Alpharius thing.

Kinda dissapointed you didn't include traitor legions, otherwise my vote would fall on either Thousand sons cause psykers, or Iron Warriors due to their gritty trench warfare ideals, and both because they kinda got screwed for no good reason in the end

Regardless, Vulkan was a pretty nice guy and so is his legion/chapter, so Salamanders it is

I really like the Ultramarines. I've never understood the smurf-hate. I've never had a good reason for disliking them explained to me.

Why I do like them:
- Classical neo-Roman styling, which I like.
- Color scheme (though I could have done without the 'ultramarine' pun)
- No discernible gene seed corruption.
- Less obsessive-compulsive than Pain Gloves and Cybernetics and Unforgiven and Red Thirst/Black Rage.
- Robute wrote the Codex Astartes. It fixed the issues that led to the Horus Heresy by dispersing power and forcing different forces to work together. After 10,000 years the Codex is still the premier guide to Imperial tactics, techniques and procedures. The main gripe about the Codex Astartes - that people follow it blindly - is kinda like complaining because people worship the atheist Emperor as a God. The fault is not in our Emperor, or in our Codex, but in ourselves.
- Not focused blindly on combat, but excel in administration and rulership. Their rule over the 'Realm of Ultramar' is enlightened and prosperous.

There are other Chapters I like as well, for different reasons. I like the Dark Angels 'sinister monk' vibe. I like the Salamanders living and working among their fully human Promethean brethren. I like the Blood Angels aesthetic vibe, which counterbalances to the whole Thirst/Rage thing. Heck, I like something about just about every First Founding Chapter.

I even like the culture of the Space Wolves, whom I generally dislike. The reasons for my dislike of the Space Wolves could fill a post, but I do like the roaring camaraderie of their heroic neo-Norse culture.

And I agree with Flame-Rage, I'd probably vote for the Thousand Sons if all the Traitors were included. But they weren't.

My two teef.

If I had to choose, I'd take the Ultramarines.

No hoodie bathrobes getting in the way.
No Furries with Wolfy Wolf Wolf Wolf and Wolf Cavalry and Wolf Chariots Because We're Vikings in Space, Get it? Get it? And Freeze Rayz because it makes sense that we live on an ice planet so we developed a weapon that makes stuff even colder.
No Space Vampires and temper tantrums.
No bionics fetish (flesh is weak? Have you seen Imperial mechanics?)
No Edgar Allen Poe references.

Just no-nonsense Big Guys in Big Armor with Big Guns in Space. They wrote the Big Book of Space-Marining.

Second might have been the White Scars before the Horus Heresy series went full Genghis Khan on them.

I voted Iron Hands, but Clan Raukaan really butchered them bad lore-wise.

My secondary would probably be Dark Angels or Salamanders.

Salamanders cause of the caring and just how awesome they are. Or the wolves for the general f you attitude

Dark Angels. They have enough of the knight theme like the Black Templars to be a fun medieval space fantasy, but they don't focus so much on melee it gets ridiculous. Plus their characters are good, the plot of their story is a fun read, and the robes look cool.

And they also have the most badass looking gear. They look like Polish Hussars instead of boring Roman Legionnaires or Werewolf Vikings.

Salamanders.

Green is the best color. They're in general good guys.

FIRE!!!

I like the Blood Angels because they've got Vampire Jesus as a primarch, and if you don't think that's the tightest gak then get the feth up out of my face

No special snowflake bs, no edgy secrets, doesnt' smell like wet carpet. Gotta be the Ultramarines.

squidhills wrote:You are missing quite a few First Founding Legions up there. I don't see any of the ones who turned traitor except the Alpha Legion.

My choice would be for the Emperor's Children. Before they all started touching themselves inappropriately, I mean. They were pretty darn hard-core when they only had a couple hundred guys they could field. Purple and gold is a pimp color scheme, and their Primarch had the best hair out of all 20 of his brothers. Plus, they exterminated an alien race that was so advanced, the Imperium was considering letting them live because wiping them out would be too difficult and costly... and they (the EC) only lost 700 guys in the whole campaign.

dusara217 wrote:This is simple, just pick your favorite Loyalist First Founding Chapter...

Anyway, Ultramarines or Raven Guard. I prefer the UM before the heresy though.

Gotta go with the space wolves, why?

-They aren't Mary sues who are literally perfect in everything they do, essentially have no wrong or faults and any engagements they participate are not an auto win for the chapter (here is looking at you Ultra-smurfs <3).
-In a grim dark galaxy that each faction constantly tries to struggle for survival the Space Wolves home world mimics this perfectly in even the humans that live here are the best of the best.
-While space vampires are cool and the constant threat of giving into blood is ever present, I prefer Space Wolves both chapters are awesome I prefer blue to red.
-Imperial fist are pretty solid i love siege warfare and heavy fortifications.
-They are like furries in space that don't get heretic thrown at them for it.
-When a entire planet throws itself in the meat grinder of chaos in order to help the space wolves (Armageddon). they actually helped the humans and raised war with the inquisition (like space marines should)
-Their Primarch out drank and out ate the EMPEROR OF MANKIND, you know that you are destined for greatness when you can beat the emperor at...well anything.
-Best of all they aren't Ultramarines

Raven Guard because:
1. They are the most reasonable legion
2. Paint scheme is cool (who does't love black)
3. They hate tyrants and slavers
4. After the Dropsite Massacre, the Raven Guard were the only ones who seriously managed to get back into the fight.
5. Shrike is awesome, he doesn't care about what would strategically be better. He only cares about helping those in need.

Sabor wrote:
Gotta go with the space wolves, why?

-They aren't Mary sues who are literally perfect in everything they do, essentially have no wrong or faults and any engagements they participate are not an auto win for the chapter (here is looking at you Ultra-smurfs <3).
-In a grim dark galaxy that each faction constantly tries to struggle for survival the Space Wolves home world mimics this perfectly in even the humans that live here are the best of the best.
-While space vampires are cool and the constant threat of giving into blood is ever present, I prefer Space Wolves both chapters are awesome I prefer blue to red.
-Imperial fist are pretty solid i love siege warfare and heavy fortifications.
-They are like furries in space that don't get heretic thrown at them for it.
-When a entire planet throws itself in the meat grinder of chaos in order to help the space wolves (Armageddon). they actually helped the humans and raised war with the inquisition (like space marines should)
-Their Primarch out drank and out ate the EMPEROR OF MANKIND, you know that you are destined for greatness when you can beat the emperor at...well anything.
-Best of all they aren't Ultramarines

Have you ever read a SW novel? Any SW novel refutes point 1

And the Lion knocked Russ out with one hit.

MarsNZ wrote:

Sabor wrote:
Gotta go with the space wolves, why?

-They aren't Mary sues who are literally perfect in everything they do, essentially have no wrong or faults and any engagements they participate are not an auto win for the chapter (here is looking at you Ultra-smurfs <3).
-In a grim dark galaxy that each faction constantly tries to struggle for survival the Space Wolves home world mimics this perfectly in even the humans that live here are the best of the best.
-While space vampires are cool and the constant threat of giving into blood is ever present, I prefer Space Wolves both chapters are awesome I prefer blue to red.
-Imperial fist are pretty solid i love siege warfare and heavy fortifications.
-They are like furries in space that don't get heretic thrown at them for it.
-When a entire planet throws itself in the meat grinder of chaos in order to help the space wolves (Armageddon). they actually helped the humans and raised war with the inquisition (like space marines should)
-Their Primarch out drank and out ate the EMPEROR OF MANKIND, you know that you are destined for greatness when you can beat the emperor at...well anything.
-Best of all they aren't Ultramarines

Have you ever read a SW novel? Any SW novel refutes point 1

And the Lion knocked Russ out with one hit.

Honestly space wolves are almost the mirror oppistes of the Ultramarines. the Ultramarines are awesome because they're as space mariney as space marines can be. space wolves are awesome because they're special and differnt from everyone else. Honestly I'd LOVE to read a novel where the two chapters have to work together, the culture clash would make for some really fun reading. that said, my fav is proably the ultramarines. I find something likeable about the by the book guys. maybe it's just my contrary nature rejecting the people who like the rebels.

I voted Scars after reading the novel by the same name - such an interesting contrast to the other Legions

Great book by the way.

MarsNZ wrote:
No special snowflake bs, no edgy secrets, doesnt' smell like wet carpet. Gotta be the Ultramarines.

Are you kidding me? the Smurfs have special snowflake written all over them, they're even the second most powerful Chapter in the Imperium!


Automatically Appended Next Post:

MarsNZ wrote:

Sabor wrote:
Gotta go with the space wolves, why?

-They aren't Mary sues who are literally perfect in everything they do, essentially have no wrong or faults and any engagements they participate are not an auto win for the chapter (here is looking at you Ultra-smurfs <3).
-In a grim dark galaxy that each faction constantly tries to struggle for survival the Space Wolves home world mimics this perfectly in even the humans that live here are the best of the best.
-While space vampires are cool and the constant threat of giving into blood is ever present, I prefer Space Wolves both chapters are awesome I prefer blue to red.
-Imperial fist are pretty solid i love siege warfare and heavy fortifications.
-They are like furries in space that don't get heretic thrown at them for it.
-When a entire planet throws itself in the meat grinder of chaos in order to help the space wolves (Armageddon). they actually helped the humans and raised war with the inquisition (like space marines should)
-Their Primarch out drank and out ate the EMPEROR OF MANKIND, you know that you are destined for greatness when you can beat the emperor at...well anything.
-Best of all they aren't Ultramarines

Have you ever read a SW novel? Any SW novel refutes point 1

And the Lion knocked Russ out with one hit.

There's a nerve right behind the jaw that will knock out literally ANYONE if hit with more than two pounds of force. You could have had an ordinary human being hit a Primarch on that nerve, and he would have gone down. It's a large part of the reason that boxers and kickboxers keep their chins tucked and one hand up by their jaw - if that nerve gets hit, the fight is lost, and they know it.

Salamanders.

Vulkan didn't exhibit a lot of the psychotic high-school behavior that afflicted other primarchs, and the chapter has carried on with that attitude. They approach the "reasonable marines" ideal, while maintaining a certain level of quirkiness (i.e., the preoccupation with burning things, and the Promethean cult). Some of the other founding chapters are really flanderized, falling into "mongolian bikers" or "bionic commandos with tanks" categories... I think the Salamander's fluff is a cut above the rest.

The Ultramarines hate is a little misplaced. Some of their characters get a little mary-sue-ish (Calagar and Tigurius, who are just the bestest, smartest, most awesomest), but some of them are cool (Telion, Cassius, and a lot of the forgeworld characters). The Ultramarines as a chapter don't just swoop in and win flawless victories either - e.g., getting munched on by hive fleet behemoth, getting tied up by Lorgar and failing to assist at the battle of terra, etc.

WORLD EATERS (Especially pre-Heresy)

What? No traitor legions? Lame.
Ah well, in that case, the Salamanders.

Space Wolfs because they where my first real 40k army, and that I love the art style of the older books, and a bit of the new one as well. Also I do enjoy their attitudes towards the Inqusition and their lap dogs

Easy one. Imperial Fists for me. Space Wolves at a close second.

Thousand Sons of course! We're the good guys...

MarsNZ wrote:


Have you ever read a SW novel? Any SW novel refutes point 1

And the Lion knocked Russ out with one hit.

They have lost multiple engagements, including one that was started with the imperium of man itself...thus point 1 is still valid and strong. The space wolves will lose on occasions, where as ultramarines, they have only ever lost a handful of engagements ever and even when they lose those small engagements they are retconned or made seem small for the much larger war which they crush the enemy. (I.e. hive fleet behemoth, Damnos, the ironblood campaign etc...)

Ultramarines
Imperial Fists
Dark Angels

In that order.

The rest are stagnant.

Vampire Knights are slowly dying, Viking werewolves can barely keep their numbers up, dropsite legions never recovered in 10,000 years.

White Scars I know next to nothing about, there should be a lot of successor chapters for them and more chapter specific units and characters for them. They're the forgotten chapter.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oh, Alphas, traitors, the whole bunch of 'em. Even if "loyalists", at best some of them are renegades, the rest out and out traitors and didn't most go to the Eye? So they'd be well and truly corrupted now.

DA and Space Wolves in the lead? Looks like we're going to have to have a duel over this.

Sabor wrote:

MarsNZ wrote:


Have you ever read a SW novel? Any SW novel refutes point 1

And the Lion knocked Russ out with one hit.

They have lost multiple engagements, including one that was started with the imperium of man itself...thus point 1 is still valid and strong. The space wolves will lose on occasions, where as ultramarines, they have only ever lost a handful of engagements ever and even when they lose those small engagements they are retconned or made seem small for the much larger war which they crush the enemy. (I.e. hive fleet behemoth, Damnos, the ironblood campaign etc...)

I'd argue that surviving a fight with the entire IoM puts them as firmly in the Mary sue camp as any other SM chapter

UM- Love them (bar the Ward OTT-ish stuff!)
Seriously, one of the only factions in the setting that actually does direct good for the Imperium, and has plenty of good plots I could expand on: Sicarius' arrogance? Threat of the Tau but grudging acceptance of their race? Codex ill-equipped to cope with Nids? Divisions as to how to interpret the Codex?
They are, for their size, one of the most interesting and curious Chapters of Space Marines, and the Greco-Roman theme is sweet!
SW- Nope. I'm sorry, but I can't love the Wolves. They just seem too SM+1, as if a newbie 12-year-old created a homebrew Chapter to defacate on everyone else's faction. Sorry, but that's an opinion!

 Sgt_Smudge wrote:

SW- Nope. I'm sorry, but I can't love the Wolves. They just seem too SM+1, as if a newbie 12-year-old created a homebrew Chapter to defacate on everyone else's faction. Sorry, but that's an opinion!

I think you just described half the fluff.