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Apparently there is a post to spikey bits that 40k is getting the following

Generals handbook
Movement stat back
Charging units swing first no matter what (As if thunderwolves with thunder hammers was not BS enough)
Armor save modifiers
Mortal wounds

Discuss?

We'll see, not looking forward to giving up the AP system, especially since rend values tend to be on the (too) low side.

One thing I see a lot of people misunderstanding is that there wont be a 40k End Times, in terms of the entire fluff exploding. They never said 8th wont follow suit in terms of rules. That being said, I can see them doing a hybrid of AoS rules and current rules.

 Bobthehero wrote:
We'll see, not looking forward to giving up the AP system, especially since rend values tend to be on the (too) low side.

Im just wondering since there are so many wepaons in 40k how are there going to be any variance is some of the weapons like the 5 different versions of bolters. Or laz cannon vs Auto cannon

I'm willing to bet there will be some modifier that unwieldy weapons will swing last.

Or Thunderhammers and such will be nerfed somehow.

CaptainSomas wrote:
One thing I see a lot of people misunderstanding is that there wont be a 40k End Times, in terms of the entire fluff exploding. They never said 8th wont follow suit in terms of rules. That being said, I can see them doing a hybrid of AoS rules and current rules.

I dont think anyone was questioning weather an end times rule wise was on the table, i just think no one thought GW would have the balls to do it.

The thing im worried about is the charging and strikeing first, that makes my terminators viable again, but also is going to make a lot of units really strong. Maybe even put orks back on the map.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Crazyterran wrote:
I'm willing to bet there will be some modifier that unwieldy weapons will swing last.

Or Thunderhammers and such will be nerfed somehow.

They would have to, else i cant get the image of a terminator doing a crow hop into a power fist punch out of my mind.

This isnt a problem.

TheDinosaur wrote:
This isnt a problem.

That remains to be seen.

I'd love the aosification.

Movement values are going to be HUGE. I look forward to them.

 Quickjager wrote:
Movement values are going to be HUGE. I look forward to them.

Can you elaborate what this means in terms of gameplay? I don't play AoS but my assumption is that instead of infantry moving 6" or w/e, they are going to have different/varying movement values? Like Eldar would be able to move farther on foot than say guardsmen? Wouldn't this complicate the ruleset further (not that I mind)?

 Crazyterran wrote:
I'm willing to bet there will be some modifier that unwieldy weapons will swing last.

Or Thunderhammers and such will be nerfed somehow.

They didn't swing last in 2nd ed. It shouldn't be a massive problem.

Instead of the run and shoot rules they could simply have Eldar move 9". Necrons being slow on the fluff can be represented on the tabletop in their movement, etc.

It allows them to make more meaningful differences between factions and units. They could vary Space Marines more (Salamanders move slower, White Scars move faster, etc.)

These new changes alone are piquing my interest. I wonder if the implementation of ASF in 40K will work with unwieldy weapons like PK? Orks finally getting to hit first on the charge is going to be a godsend and make us feel like we can actually do something in CC again without losing half of our guys before hitting home.

 Gargantuan wrote:

 Crazyterran wrote:
I'm willing to bet there will be some modifier that unwieldy weapons will swing last.

Or Thunderhammers and such will be nerfed somehow.

They didn't swing last in 2nd ed. It shouldn't be a massive problem.

To be fair there wasn't a you swing I swing dynamic in that game.

 Grimskul wrote:
These new changes alone are piquing my interest. I wonder if the implementation of ASF in 40K will work with unwieldy weapons like PK? Orks finally getting to hit first on the charge is going to be a godsend and make us feel like we can actually do something in CC again without losing half of our guys before hitting home.

yes please

This is terrifying and a kick in the balls to anyone that just bought a codex that recently came out to fix their army. *cough* Traitor Legions *cough*

Here's the link if anyone's interested.
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/03/23/warhammer-40000-news-from-adepticon/

 KingmanHighborn wrote:
This is terrifying and a kick in the balls to anyone that just bought a codex that recently came out to fix their army. *cough* Traitor Legions *cough*

Assuming Decurions/Formations are still a thing, the recent supplements should still work.

I'm going to say probably not as it changes all the stat lines to the 'I'm too stupid to learn rules and charts' version of AoS.

I think this should be interpreted as positive news.

The rules team is connected to the tournament scene, this is literally "news from adepticon". So they'll probably be paying very close attention to the experiences of players.

They're also addressing a few glaring issues (unstructured comp play, army construction, all-or-nothing move stats and AP values) so they're on the right track for now.

Morale

"Its no longer all or nothing, and it affects everyone. We’re thinking of replacing break tests with a simple mechanic. Roll a D6, add that to the number of models your unit has lost this turn, subtract your Leadership and take that many additional casualties."

So lets say I have a squad of 50 conscripts with a Commissar, lose 25 of them to enemy shooting and make a leadership test. Roll a 1 + 25 (-9 from Commissar), so I take an additional 17 casualties? hahaha NO. Lets hope its a little more complicated than that, otherwise Orks/Nids/Guard can just sit out 8th edition.

You have to figure that abilities like Stubborn, Fearless, Summary Execution will all be updated accordingly.

Yeah that mechanic sounds worse. I don't think it's ever been all or nothing on the move stats. blocks of movement sure, but infantry could always move 1" to 6" in the movement phase for example. AP doesn't need to be redone, army construction would be nice, love to see all formations thrown in the fire and go back to mandatory 1 HQ, 2+ Troops, 0-3 Elites, Fast and Heavy, style.

So...you know roll it back to third and we are good. Don't AoS it, and ruin everything. It's literally throwing the baby out with the bath water.

Commissar Benny wrote:
Morale

"Its no longer all or nothing, and it affects everyone. We’re thinking of replacing break tests with a simple mechanic. Roll a D6, add that to the number of models your unit has lost this turn, subtract your Leadership and take that many additional casualties."

So lets say I have a squad of 50 conscripts with a Commissar, lose 25 of them to enemy shooting and make a leadership test. Roll a 1 + 25 (-9 from Commissar), so I take an additional 17 casualties? hahaha NO. Lets hope its a little more complicated than that, otherwise Orks/Nids/Guard can just sit out 8th edition.

There are no break tests vs shooting. They're basically nerfing sweeping advances. Will probably be something like current demonic instability.

Sweeping advances have been nerfed since 4th, is that REALLY necessary?

 KingmanHighborn wrote:
I don't think it's ever been all or nothing on the move stats. blocks of movement sure, but infantry could always move 1" to 6" in the movement phase for example.

There's some issues with 12" move assault units, versus everything else.

Or look at something like Tzaangors against Cultists, where it's either a 6" move or GW tries to compensate with formation bonuses.

I'm cautiously pessimistic about this. While there are certainly problems with the rules to 40k right now, I'm of the very strong opinion that about 80% of the imbalance in the game comes from poor codex balance, not anything to do with the main rules. Sure, there are some problems with the main rules (The all-or-nothing way that D weapons and Stomps work, vehicles are generally designed in such a way that making them cost-effective is challenging without just making them incredibly cheap, and the Psychic phase is cluttered and overcomplicated,) but most of the complaints about the game stem from poor codex balancing.
For example - Morale not having any effect on the game? Well, that's because there are too many codices that completely or partly ignore Leadership, not because the core morale rules are broken. The problems with unit durability balancing? (That is, that units can become indestructible with rerollable saves, but regular armor is nearly useless in most circumstances?) A problem of codex balance making 2+3++ Eternal Warrior models with re-rolling saves and FNP far too common. Even assault isn't necessarily weak in a vacuum, it's just that most assault units lack the mobility options that they need to get into combat, while shooty armies seem to be able to move more quickly than ever.


I love 40k because of the fluff and the models, but also because the core ruleset is one that I really enjoy. I want to see the problems fixed and the rules streamlined, I don't want to see a complete overhaul, because then I won't be playing Warhammer 40k anymore. I've been playing since the very beginning of 5th edition, and while the rules have certainly changed since then, outside of the way Psychic Powers work, the rest of the game is still very recognizable as 40k. I don't want to see everything I've spent years playing get completely uprooted and thrown out for the sake of 'Updating'.

And i want to see an aos overhaul. It's a good one.

 KingmanHighborn wrote:
This is terrifying and a kick in the balls to anyone that just bought a codex that recently came out to fix their army. *cough* Traitor Legions *cough*

I was hoping that 8th when it came would just be 7th with a few gentle tweaks such that existing codices would remain usable. It is looking like a forlorn hope now.

I may just give up on 40k and do something else.