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every event i have played in has put winners against winners.

DarthDiggler wrote:You can not compare Magic the gathering deck building to 40k army list building. Most people agree with this. I also think we are getting past the point of hoping you come out to a tournament to play us. I really believe the moment you drop a hint as to where you play there will be some people who will make the journey to you to see first hand how the game should be played.

I already said I was going to attempt to make it to adepticon in march.


Also, my profession has nothing to do with how I play games. Believe me, my MTG, WoW and WC3 background has much more to do with my gaming than my being an accountant.
(also, your perception of accountants is way off base and seems to be based on an old 70s stereotype made popular by hollywood.)

Timmah you have made some interesting points but at the end of the day seeing you have no real tournament experience you are simply running at the mouth to put it saliently. It is just your opinion based upon what you have read and to be honest you come across as quite susceptible.

G

Timmah wrote:When someone wins, you should look to see what they could do better. That is how competitive formats grow, evolve and ultimately get better.

All 60 people last weekend wanted to win all 5 of their games. You'll hear a lot of quotes like "I'm just here to have fun." or "I'm more of a hobbyist." But I've never had a guy let me win in a tournament.

Your analysis about army lists is welcome. I do it to. When it is solicited. But on a message board unsolicited criticism is fair game of course. What isn't welcome was the humor you attempted with the "were there any competitive armies there?" comment.

lets switch over to some pure army list analysis here for this discussion. I have a pretty good insight to Blackmoor's list, especially how it pertains to a heavily mech "5th edition" tuned IG list. Without talking about the competitiveness of my army (I'm too sensitive ) I have 13 armor 12 vehicles, lots of meltaguns, plasma guns, and autocannons.

The reason i don't just sweep Blackmoor's list off the table is because all of his fragile elements are "strike first" and the rest of his army doesn't lose effectiveness until it is almost completely eliminated.

on a turn by turn analysis, what you see with the 2-3 warwalker units, is that they show up and put a handful of shakens and stuns on my threat tanks. There are enough anti-infantry shots in his army to make debarkation a non-option. So any vet chimera that gets shaken gets shut down, when my hydra battery takes 6 glancing hits, its shut down. All these shutdowns don't necessarily kill my vehicles, but they push the game very quickly into the later turns. i eventually take out his hard hitters, once i recover from being shaken, and with my stuff that goes untouched. But then its bottom of 4 and I can't figure out why there are so many troops left on the table. There is the avatar, standing right between where your troops are and where you want to go, there is the guardians, battered but fearless, standing on the objectives. His bikes are dead, his falcon is dead, his warwalkers are dead, his harlequins are dead, his fire dragons are REALLY dead, but eldard is chilling in a guardian unit, the avatar is a massive roadblack, and you are down on objectives.

Offensively, Blackmoor's list appears to be light on anti-tank. But with the resiliency of his guardians being the battery for it, he just gets enough chances to shoot things that things go away. those two gunners in a ten man guardian unit are almost always the last to go. Against my 11 heavy flamers, Allan had to fortune the harlies, but usually he is rocking two guides. I've watched him fire his platforms, miss, or hit then fail to pen, countless times. but if 4 platforms with 2 guides roll on your troop chimeras for 4 turns, you are going to pick up an immobilized and a destroyed or two over the course of the game. And with fire dragons/falcon/war walkers engaging my heavy stuff for the first 4 turns, thenit becomes two games in one.

Basically, his war walkers/falcon/fire dragons, fight against everything I have that isn't a mechvet. They lose that fight every time. But it takes time for me to knock out those elements, and they certainly damage me significantly before they go. Then my 3 mechvet chimeras are left facing Eldrad, harlequins, 3 guardian units and a guardian jetbike unit. He hurts me faster and more effectively than i hurt him, on account of me being essentially three models and him being close to 40. the chimeras get peppered with mid range strength 8, and then end up facing two fusion pistols, two singing spears and a meltagun at that crucial turn.

Survivability is a force multiplier in regards to anti-tank. And rather than say "Blackmoor's eldar list is underpowered" I would say that it is much more of a grinder. It establishes its table position, loses some localized firefights, watches the turns speed by, and then defends its table position in the last two turns of the game. it plays a lot like my kan wall ork army (another one that pundits are incorrectly convinced has lost its competitive edge) there is no flash, no "leaf-blower" effect. It just grinds out wins.

Shep you do have to admit that some of Allan's opponents made decisions that left you thinking WTF? Like the falcon tank shocking into his gun line... that just seemed like a very bad decision very early in the game.

G

Timmah wrote: I already said I was going to attempt to make it to adepticon in march

Like every year, I will fly out there and I hope to see you then. The odd thing is that most accountants are upset at its scheduling because it is right before April 15th, and the busiest time of the year for them and they can’t show up.

Green Blow Fly wrote: Shep you do have to admit that some of Allan's opponents made decisions that left you thinking WTF? Like the falcon tank shocking into his gun line... that just seemed like a very bad decision very early in the game.

He rammed me with a Fire Prism that had its gun blown off. To me that seemed like one of the only good uses for it at that point since my army is fearless and can’t be tank shocked.

He also rammed me with a stunned Wave Serpent into my War Walkers. It was stunned so he could not shoot it, and the War Walkers were tearing him up, so not only was it was a way to take one out, it had the added bonus of providing cover for his army, and it also was a way of getting his Dire Avengers up to where they can start to shoot things.

They seemed like logical decisions to me.

Blackmoor wrote:

Timmah wrote: I already said I was going to attempt to make it to adepticon in march

Like every year, I will fly out there and I hope to see you then. The odd thing is that most accountants are upset at its scheduling because it is right before April 15th, and the busiest time of the year for them and they can’t show up.

That would be auditors.

It didn't come across that way while reading your report. Thanks for the clarification. : )

G

Very nice battle reports. I like how you are still quite mobile despite the limited mechanization of your army. I think this is the number one thing to keep in mind when playing a foot army. Too many players get side-tracked shooting heavy weapons and such.


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Also, I just joined Dakka Dakka and I'm astonished that you guys even reply to the blatant trolling going on here. Try ignoring him and I'll bet he just moves on to find a different thread.

What's tough about Timmah is that I think he is sincere about wanting to improve lists and whatnot. He's just too coarse about it. I know he put some advice in one of my threads. I would just ask that he put out some Batreps, win or lose, so we can see what he's talking about with his tuned lists. Once again, great Batreps and I would love to get a chance to get some pointers from any of you tourny regulars.

/brown-nosing off

Since he does not play in tournaments it all comes across as rubbish to be honest. He hijacked one thread he no clue what he was talking about and it was really uncool to the OP.

G

Green Blow Fly wrote:Since he does not play in tournaments it all comes across as rubbish to be honest. He hijacked one thread he no clue what he was talking about and it was really uncool to the OP.

G

Uh, I do play in tournaments. Just not in tournaments across the country.

Besides, its not like you magically get more experience from playing people when they are in a tournament vs an outside pickup game...(some of us play competitive games all the time)

Yes you do quite often plus you are playing outside the local meta.

G

Green Blow Fly wrote:Yes you do quite often plus you are playing outside the local meta.

G

Yea...I thought it was agreed 40k didn't have a meta game...

Anyways, its not like me and my local opponents cannot vary our lists to learn against different styles of armies.
Anyways I'm done in here. You guys sure get mad when someones opinion differs from your own.

Timmah wrote:
Anyways I'm done in here. You guys sure get mad when someones opinion differs from your own.

Dakka dakka or just this thread

Bye bye!



G

I will miss the highly stimulating intellectual coversations you provide farewell Timmah.

So is Timmah gone for good then? Please say yes XD

At any rate great bat reps blackmoor Its nice to see that gaurdians are still useful. Also love the trophy you got.

come on over and introduce yourself.

And when you do make sure you do it like South Park's Timmy. "TIMMAH!"

Nice win! Hope you like Necrons or know someone that does

Did the drop pods have any weapons on them? I dont remember seeing them shoot anything.