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Made in us
The Last Chancer Who Survived





Norristown, PA

Thinking aloud again I think I may have come full circle with my packaging dilemma. Since I am going to be having 5 of each type of werebeast, 1 Monster and 4 Fiends, it’s really the same as the current gang sets that are 1 Hero and 4 Professionals now. Maybe it would be better to skip the 3-pack / 2-pack idea, and instead stick to the same 5-man starters sets like now?

So, to start off with we’d have all 5 werewolves in 1 pack, followed by 5 werebears, and so on. It will be slightly cheaper to pack them all together, rather than 2 separate products.. and if the format ain’t broke, don’t fix it?

So then, we’d have 5-man starters, 3-man henchmen/minion packs, and 1-man Hired Gun / unique beast packs. They would all come in clamshells though, and without cards to keep costs down.

The only drawback though is it would mean that the stretch goals to unlock the next beast in the campaign would be higher, however due to the beasts all starting with the same basic 3D model, they are a little cheaper to sculpt overall than humans who all need to be unique, so maybe it won’t be so bad.

   
Made in us
Been Around the Block




Pittsburgh, PA

I'm not married to any particular idea packaging-wise. I always presumed the less SKUs at retail the better. Unless you plan on most sales going through your own web-store, in which case you can package them however you want. Although if you go with no cards in the retail packages you should definitely call that out on the back or somewhere, so people don't freak out. (And to repeat what I said earlier: Think about a printer-friendly card solution.)
   
Made in us
The Last Chancer Who Survived





Norristown, PA

We're pretty much selling direct to customers right now, but there's some stores still ordering here and there. I'm not really worrying about retail at the moment, but when I get the beasts up and running I will start pursuing that again. Problem is boxes are more store-friendly, but I don't want to get boxes because they drive up the retail cost more than I think a few minis should cost.

So, the old box sets will still come with the cards they were packed with, and you can still play with those if you're new to the game, and don't want to look up the newer rules. When the minis repackaged and for new releases going forward clamshells insert will say something like "Visit us online at BlackwaterGulch.com for free rules and downloadable character cards!" .. maybe I can stick one of those QR code thingies next to it, so folks with phones can scan it and go right to the site.

Been thinking about the releases some more, I think what might be easier to do is have the 5 werewolves as the main starter set for beasts, but for other skinwalkers sell them separately. So there will be an Alpha Werebear sold by himself, and maybe a pair of werebats after that. Thinking that might give folks a lot more options since it will take quite a while to get enough beasts to even come close to the amount of human characters we have so far. So we'll get a lot more diversity sooner and can eventually expand into more beast starters later on when we have more beasts done.

   
Made in us
The Last Chancer Who Survived





Norristown, PA

Part of the production process I rarely get to see Iron Wind sent me some pics of the molds. Here is the master mold for the Werewolves



And the beginning of the master mold for the Chupacabras


We're looking at 4 parts per mini, so eventually that will be 4 production molds per mini.

my master figures should finally be shipping out to me on friday So I'll have something fun to do while everyone else is having fun at GenCon.

And, ShipNaked should finally have the new items (dice & stuff) ready for me to sell on my store after they get back from GenCon.. so I guess around 2 weeks?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
And I just now realized the werewolf mold pic is upside down. Just spin your monitor around so it looks right

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/07/22 23:19:12


   
Made in us
The Last Chancer Who Survived





Norristown, PA

Got some updates for the new werewolf sculpts They're still not done, but we have some more stuff added in.

Here's the archer again.. still not done, but we're thinking of having it be like he just shot his bow and he's about to grab a new arrow.



And here's the Werewolf Ranger. I was going to give him a shotgun, but I think he'll look better with the bigger repeater. Still need to add detail to the shirt and belt and other stuff, but here he is so far


   
Made in us
The Last Chancer Who Survived





Norristown, PA

More sculpt updates




   
Made in us
The Last Chancer Who Survived





Norristown, PA

So, some good news... Master minis for the werewolves and chupacabras are scheduled to be delivered tomorrow! It will take me a little while to build and paint them (especially since I can’t prime them till this weekend since it’s going to be so humid here in Philly this week). After they’re painted the plan will be to finish the new rulebook and add in a bunch of photos, so that will be ready to show off in the campaign. If all goes well, I plan to launch the campaign around the end of August. Again it will be a 2-week campaign aimed at fulfilling quickly so we can jump right into the next mini-campaign

This week I’m also going to be submitting my first batch of the new character cards to wargame vault so I can get some test prints and make sure they look good. During the campaign I’ll be offering a full deck with all characters, or you can order just a 5-man gang deck separately, or print out the PDFs free. I’ll look into doing a more printer friendly card though soon.

   
Made in us
Been Around the Block




Pittsburgh, PA

The minor changes you made to the archer/shotgun sculpts actually make them look a lot better. I wasn't really sure about the first set, but I like the updated look much better.
   
Made in us
The Last Chancer Who Survived





Norristown, PA

Yep they look much better now I like the gunner the best right now, even though it’s a more static pose. I asked for some different heads, less teeth showing so they don’t look like a copy of the first 3. They’ll have the same kind of connector in the back so you could mix & match all 5 heads. Same thing with the tails. The gunner will probably have his gun and hand as a separate piece, and maybe his other arm too. For the archer we’re going to move his quiver hand up a little and stick some arrows in it so it’s more like he’s reaching for a new arrow rather than shoving his hand inside. I think we’ll probably have to have the quiver + hand attached to arrows as a separate piece that glues onto the back and wrist. I’ll see if we can add a bracelet or something where the joint is.

   
Made in us
The Last Chancer Who Survived





Norristown, PA

Woohoo! Masters are finally here, time to get busy!

I'm putting the chupacabras together first, and it kinda got me thinking (again). I have 3 different poses, and was planning to sell all new minions and henchmen in packs of 3. I'm gonna keep it that way for the Kickstarter to make everything easy.

But, if you were just ordering online or buying in a store, would you rather have to buy 3 all the time (probably around $10-12), or would you rather be able to buy them separately, $4-5 each? (slightly cheaper altogether since you're just using 1 clamshell pack & insert card for the whole set)

Just thinking some folks might not want to be forced to buy a whole pack if they can get one separately, but at the same time that creates 3 new SKUs rather than 1... unless we did it like 1 random pose per pack?

Just thinking out loud.. any thoughts?

   
Made in us
The Last Chancer Who Survived





Norristown, PA

Next little issue.. trying to decide if the Skinwalkers should go on 30mm bases or 40mm? I'm leaning toward the latter. Here’s a quick pic I took with the chupacabras, 2 wolves and sergeant wilde for size comparisons (can’t see the good details on the bare metal unfortunately…)



The wolves are taller and bulkier than the average human in the game, I kind of feel like 30mm looks too small and I’m concerned they may fall over easier if it’s a top heavy model (these wolves aren’t too bad, but who knows how other sculpts will end up)… but, 40mm feels too big. The wolf on the left is on a 30mm, and the one on the right is 40mm. Should I make them all 40mm just to play it safe? I’m sure the werebears & bulls will be much bulkier, bats may have big flappy wings sticking out, etc. Since minions will be smaller, they can still go on 30mm bases.

Drawback is it’s a whole new size of bases I need to order, and they can only be ordered in batches of 1000 (when I’ll only need a couple hundred), the larger bases are also a little more expensive, but only by a few cents so I don’t think it will impact the price, and I should be able to use the same size clamshells.

   
Made in us
Airborne Infiltrating Tomcat




Central Ohio

Hmmm... I would go with the 40mm.... even If I had to buy my own separately, they just look better and more secure on the larger bases.

We should silence anyone who opposes the right to freedom of speech.

Sir Boyle Roche 
   
Made in us
The Last Chancer Who Survived





Norristown, PA

Finished building everything I think what I'll do for now is use the 30mms and paint them up. I'm going to paint 2 versions of Croatoan, since he comes with an alt right arm without the staff so that folks can build him as a generic alpha werewolf instead, and I'll use the 40mm for that one. It'll be easier to compare when they're all painted up.

Finished building, priming tomorrow




   
Made in us
Been Around the Block




Pittsburgh, PA

 Necros wrote:
But, if you were just ordering online or buying in a store, would you rather have to buy 3 all the time (probably around $10-12), or would you rather be able to buy them separately, $4-5 each?
Since we're dealing with beasts, I think trios are fine. If there are any plans for unique "named" beasts, then maybe do those solo. But otherwise threesomes are fine & dandy.
   
Made in us
The Last Chancer Who Survived





Norristown, PA

Yeah that was the plan. minions and henchmen are generic types and come 3 in a pack. Ideally, being cannon fodder types I’d want them to be cheaper, but since my cost is based on weight and they will weigh as much as any other mini, they’re gonna have to cost the same as anything else.. so a pack of 3 minis is gonna be in the $10-12 range (I don’t have any costs for the new minis yet). So thats why I was thinking some folks might want to be able to buy just 1 or 2 separately. But the plan right now for the KS is to have them in the full pack of 3.

I’m planning out the KS now, and I decided to go forward with these 6 minis as the “Savage Beast Starter Bundle”, my original plan all along. So a starter set for a pack of beasts will have 3 skinwalkers and 3 minions. The Fame points in the game should match a human gang since 3 minions starting at 50 points each come out about the same as 2 human professionals starting at 75 points each.

I will probably have them packaged separately though. 3 minions in a pack, 2 fiend-level skinwalkers in a booster pack, and solo Monsters / alpha skinwalkers. The werewolves with the ranged weapons will be the first stretch goal and count as a booster pack, so depending on how many stretch goals we can unlock, backers can create their own beast pack bundle by selecting any unlocked minion pack, booster pack and monster to lead them. And the bundle will be cheaper than if you were to select each pack separately.

For humans though we will have to stick to the usual 5 man gangs since they’re already packaged that way. Once the old minis are sold out and I need to start getting new copies made I’ll look into splitting them up the same way as the beasts. So far I have 4 different henchman packs planned, and eventually I’d like to start doing gang boosters with 2 new characters for each gang, but those are a ways off.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oh and also, for the human gangs, after the KS is done and as the old box sets get sold out, I’m going to go forward with changing them over to the solo gang leader pack, 2-man gang booster pack and 3 man henchman pack format just like the beasts. So there won’t be any box sets for a while, but I’ll have cheaper gang bundle options on my online store. Once BWG 2.0 rolls around I plan to have 1 retail-box style starter set for each faction. So there will be a new gang of humans, and a beast pack that has more of a variety of different things rather than all werewolves.

I haven’t really shared a lot of details for the undead faction yet, but I’ve decided to split them up a little. At first I was going with zombies, ghouls, wendigos (vampires), witches and creepy demony things. But I’ve been thinking it might be better to have the actual undead things as the undead faction, and the witches and demons would become a 4th faction. Demons are more like creepy posessed people though, not crazy malifaux stuff or 40k bloodthirtsters.

So in the end I hope to have a nice retail-friendly printed rulebook, 4 different starter sets, and a whole lot of different blisters/clamshells to add to each faction. As far as 2.0 rules go, I decided I’m not going to change it to the Mechadrome rules where stamina = actions and speed = how many inches you move. Rules will stay the same overall, 2.0 will just be more like a facelift. It’ll take a while to get to that point, probably a year or more, that’s why I decided to do the updated BWG1.7 book now as a kind of baby step along the way and work my way up to it with a series of small KS campaigns to get the new minis funded. And then, much later, I plan to copy off of Privateer and release new stuff for all factions in different themed campaign books/settings.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/07/31 15:58:37


   
Made in us
Been Around the Block




Pittsburgh, PA

Dude, you HAVE to make some stats for this gang of cowboy orcs (on Kickstarter right now):

   
Made in us
The Last Chancer Who Survived





Norristown, PA

hehe maybe some day. I always wanted to do fantasy races in a western setting ever since I saw this little guy

http://victoriaminiatures.highwire.com/product/billy-bagshot-halfling-cowboy

I don't think it would fit with BWG right now but maybe something I could do later on as a new game. At first I originally planned to have lots of different games all using the same rules, that was before I knew how much work went into just 1 game

   
Made in us
Been Around the Block




Pittsburgh, PA

Well, if CMON can port Zombicide to medieval times then I have faith you can take the Gulch to wherever you want it to go.
One step at a time, of course.
   
Made in us
The Last Chancer Who Survived





Norristown, PA

Who knows where we will go in the future I could slowly mix in some dwarf prospectors and miners some day and see what people think and then take it from there. Right now I have 4 factions planned, we have humans, beasts, undead. For the 4th I'm just calling them the Wicked right now, they will be witches and demons.. not 40k bloodthirsters, but more like posessed people. I also had plans for a gobliny faction of Tommyknockers, much later.

After the KS is done I'm going to invest in a copy of zBrush and start sculpting a lot of the minis myself, so that will be a big help in getting new stuff done a lot faster. I'll probably start with some terrain things first though till I learn the ropes.

   
Made in us
Lurking Gaunt






just for fun it would be cool to have an alien faction. But it would be more of a "lol" factor, because of Aliens vs Cowboys and whatnot.

   
Made in us
Airborne Infiltrating Tomcat




Central Ohio

Oddly enough, whatever will work, go for. I'm fairly close to the Corvus Belli Infinity folks (mostly through my Brother), they borrow quite proudly from multiple sources and weave all this into a fairly decent plot line; much like the addition of the parody minis in BWG. the old TV movie "Salem's Lot" might have some interesting ideas for adding Vampires and the undead. Mexico should be a geographical origin site for much of the mischief as well as areas occupied by portions of the Native population. The incoming settlers would be the source of awakening this supernatural threat.

We should silence anyone who opposes the right to freedom of speech.

Sir Boyle Roche 
   
Made in us
The Last Chancer Who Survived





Norristown, PA

Yeah even though I don't play it or own a single model, I love infinity Some day when I actually have time I'll get into it. My long term plans are to get the 3 main factions set up (humans, beasts and undead) and then advance the game world and storyline in campaign books a lot like Warmachine does. Each one will have new characters for all factions and some will introduce new factions too.

For the Wendigo tribes, I am planning to give them a Mayan kind of theme since they liked to cut out hearts and stuff, and steal a little from the Dusk till Dawn movies, and mix in regular natives and some other cannibal stories like the Donner party, or the "bloody benders"

I think, as far as the fantasy races go, I might try and mix in some dwarf-looking prospectors or moonshiners some day and see how folks like it. I was hinting at that with the Traveling Zarconis circus gang, the ring master is a dwarf At first I was trying to base him on Sansom from Carnivalle, but the art came out looking more dwarfy.

For aliens, maybe, but they would be a ways off and I'd have to find a good way to balance them since they would have crazy advanced technology. Not ruling anything out, as long as we can work it in without it being dumb I liked the alien models that Wild West Exodus did, but I didn't feel like they fit with the westerny theme.. they just looked like sci fi aliens. So I'd want to do something different that will fit the game world and western theme better.

   
Made in us
The Last Chancer Who Survived





Norristown, PA

more sculpt updates





Just about done. I just asked to add some detail to the arrow feathers and also the belts then these should be done

   
Made in us
Been Around the Block




Pittsburgh, PA

We really are on the same wavelength: I saw the archer and said, "Why does the fletching look like an airplane rudder?" Then I looked at the shotgun-toting dude and said, "Why is he wearing a bracelet for a belt?" So you're clearly on top of things.
Quick, what am I having for dinner?!
   
Made in us
The Last Chancer Who Survived





Norristown, PA

Fricassee of jackalope over a bed of mustard greens topped with a brown butter sauce?

   
Made in us
Been Around the Block




Pittsburgh, PA

OMG, HOW DOES HE KNOW?!?
   
Made in us
The Last Chancer Who Survived





Norristown, PA

Here's a WIP shot of the chupacabras and Croatoan so far


   
Made in us
Airborne Infiltrating Tomcat




Central Ohio

Just because they're chupacabras, I would want them... seeing them makes that double!

We should silence anyone who opposes the right to freedom of speech.

Sir Boyle Roche 
   
Made in us
The Last Chancer Who Survived





Norristown, PA

These guys are pretty easy to paint there’s no guns or belts or pocket watches to worry about. There’s some fine details in the faces, but they’re easy to drybrush. I should have everything painted by this weekend, then I just need to take some photos and start building the KS page. I’m thinking it would be good to make a new how to play video though, so that might take some time to put together.

So I’ve been racking my brain over some of the Beast rules lately, mostly character creation. I’m feeling like it might be a little confusing for new players, so I think I’m going to change it up. We’ll keep the combat abilities that can be added instead of weapons, but I think I’m going to remove the “Animal Affinity” rules and replace them with professions. So, a Werewolf and a Werebear are basically the same, they get the same Beast traits, and then they choose a profession.

I was thinking of changing up the names of some of the professions for the beasts though, but they would have the same ability. So a human would be a prospector, but a beast would be a scout. Preacher would become Shaman, Doctor = Healer, Wrassler = Savage, Bounty Hunter = Manhunter, gunslinger = marksman?

And it will be the same way for other factions too, so it’s all more streamlined and easier to follow. Pick your faction, pick a profession, raise your attributes, add some skills and weapons or abilities and you're done.

Plus it would be cool to make some more detailed beast minis that could be shamans and healers and stuff, I think it will add a lot more character.

   
Made in us
The Last Chancer Who Survived





Norristown, PA

Going to start putting together the beast professions, they will be “Callings”, as in call of the wild. Later on when we get around to developing them, the Wendigo professions will be called a Caste. Also decided to make a couple new ones that will be more unique to each faction. Infamous Gangs can have Engineers, Savage Beasts have Stalkers (+1D6 to hit from behind), and I’m thinking Ravenous Dead will have Necromancers (turn an out of action enemy model into a zombie).

In other news, I’m just starting to plan it out now but I’m going to try and get my first real official con booth at Origins next year. ShipNaked (Game Salute) can transport all of my products from their warehouse so I can sell em there so that will make transporting a lot easier for me. If I’m able, I’m hoping to have a store + demo booth combined into 1 so I’ll have plenty of space for demos… A little worried though, I’m definitely going to need to find some help. I’m a 1-man show and I’m gonna need to take occasional potty breaks

I don’t think I can afford a GenCon booth too, so if I do go there I would probably just run some official demos on friday and saturday like I did before.

   
 
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