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During Xavier's seizure at the hotel, didn't anyone else find themselves holding their breath the whole time? It was an odd sensation realizing that as the effect ended....

I wonder if originally the clone Logan was written to be Sabretooth. There were several points where he (both of them) looked a bit like Liev Schrieber's version of Logan's brother. Even if it wasn't as the clone there seemed like he might be somewhere in there.

In all fairness, Wolvy and Sabre had similar cuts in Origins to underscore the familial resemblance. Likewise, Creed was a more violent counterpart to Logan who urged his brother to give in to his savage side. In terms of function, he was a more cerebral version of X-24, which represented a more direct incarnation of violence, a dark mirror image to be confronted directly.

 AduroT wrote:

 Galef wrote:
Can someone help answer a plot point for me:

Spoiler:

The Logan clone was killed by an adamantium bullet to the head. Isn't that how the original Logan lost his memories?
So why is it considered fatal to the clone? Wouldn't his head just heal, albeit with a very large hole left in his adamantium skull?
Was it just that this bullet/gun was more explosive and thus did more damage that could not be healed?

No, it's a stupid plot hole that pretty much everyone immediately recognizes.

Actually

But the kiddies weren't a failure because of lack of mutation; indeed the telekinetic, pyrokinetic, and X-23 all seem to demonstrate powers comparable to "full power" mutants. X-23 would have to have Logans healing factor to survive the adamantium grafts. Even Sabretooth level wouldn't have survived the more extensive grafting she seemed to have according to the movie lines.

So I don't know if it is a question of X-24's abilities- he seemed to be healing on his own much faster than Logan could recover (though perhaps not as fast as Origins Wolverine is depicted- the movies get kind of inconsistent in this regard). I think 24's biggest issue was he was stuck/impaled, preventing him from effectively healing. The serum just provided additional speed of recovery and a doping effect to counteract X-24's lack of experience.

Really, the bullet is just a plot device and should be accepted as such. They stated early it could kill Logan, and since 24 is a metaphor for Logan's rage, it works there too since they literally told us that from the beginning of the movie. It is a Chekhov's gun.

I understood the adamantium bullet as a nod to the classic "need a silver bullet to kill a werewolf" as that is what Logan essentially is.

Something that bugged me terribly was Logan sustaining massive damage yet still living though his healing powers were not working. In his fight with X-24 - he would have been killed if he wasn't able to heal injuries to his vital organs.

He still heals, just not nearly as fast as he used to. At least that's what it seemed to be. And he lived thru the farm because X-23 got him to a doctor.

 jmurph wrote:
But the kiddies weren't a failure because of lack of mutation.

No, but they weren't out and out clones either, they were more ivf babies, so their creation wasn't through the same process.

The rest of your post I mostly agree with.

Yeah, the irony is that the babies "weaknesses" was their humanity...

So was the drug they used Kick?
That was a good message: "Kids, use drugs."

 Hulksmash wrote:
He still heals, just not nearly as fast as he used to. At least that's what it seemed to be. And he lived thru the farm because X-23 got him to a doctor.

Yeah that was what was said/shown in the film; Wolverine could still heal but not as fast as he could in the past.

 Ahtman wrote:
It seems only a plot hole when looking at the other films and not this film alone. I don't think they cared to much about X-Men III or Origins.

The Director said, on the Empire Film podcast spoiler special episode, exactly that - he's not going to get too worried about "following canon" when the comics themselves change everything every few years anyway. After X-Men: The Last Stand, it all seemed to be a bit vague even within the films series.

In the context of this film, it's made clear that Logan is holding Chekhov's adamantium bullet so he can commit suicide - the idea that it'll kill him (and his "clone") is laid out pretty early on.

The best part is, if you take out X-men origins: Wolverine from the overall cannon of the movies, it actually clears up like 90% of the X-men movie inconsistencies, including new ones like Logan's bullet being fatal
Further proof that particular movie is the worst of all the X-men movies

 Galef wrote:
The best part is, if you take out X-men origins: Wolverine from the overall cannon of the movies, it actually clears up like 90% of the X-men movie inconsistencies, including new ones like Logan's bullet being fatal
Further proof that particular movie is the worst of all the X-men movies

Mmm... not really. We know from Days of Future Past that Logan's brain is supposed to heal instantly from constant, relentless damage. An adamantium bullet shouldn't be a problem by comparison. Taking Origins out doesn't really address that particular inconsistency.

 creeping-deth87 wrote:

 Galef wrote:
The best part is, if you take out X-men origins: Wolverine from the overall cannon of the movies, it actually clears up like 90% of the X-men movie inconsistencies, including new ones like Logan's bullet being fatal
Further proof that particular movie is the worst of all the X-men movies

Mmm... not really. We know from Days of Future Past that Logan's brain is supposed to heal instantly from constant, relentless damage. An adamantium bullet shouldn't be a problem by comparison. Taking Origins out doesn't really address that particular inconsistency.

Actually it might. Without the "bullet" from Origins being the reason he lost his memories, we are left to assume it was the process of grafting the adamantium to his skeleton being the cause, thereby showing that his mind can't always heal from physical damage. Days of Future Past shows mental damage being healed, not physical damage.

Side joke: Why did Magneto stop wearing his purple outfit:


-

To bring an element of real life to the fantastic, the "brain" isn't one consistent organ, but multiple different subsections with different functions and abilities.

In that regard, it is eminently possible that damage to a part of the brain not concerned with managing Logan's healing factor would allow full recovery, whereas catastrophic damage to that area, say the brain stem, would kill him.

Even normal real people have survived horrendous brain injuries, but damage to certain parts will result in essentially instant death.

 Azreal13 wrote:
To bring an element of real life to the fantastic, the "brain" isn't one consistent organ, but multiple different subsections with different functions and abilities.

In that regard, it is eminently possible that damage to a part of the brain not concerned with managing Logan's healing factor would allow full recovery, whereas catastrophic damage to that area, say the brain stem, would kill him.

Even normal real people have survived horrendous brain injuries, but damage to certain parts will result in essentially instant death.

That's a good point. Is Wolverine's healing factor regulated by the brain, like the heart and lungs, or is it something that just happens, like hair growth?

Well, promoted by your question, I found this..

Wikipedia wrote:The Xavier Protocols, a series of profiles created by Xavier that lists the strengths and weaknesses of the X-Men, states that Wolverine's healing factor is increased to "incredible levels" and theorizes that the only way to stop him is to decapitate him and remove his head from the vicinity of his body.

So that would suggest it must be, or you'd end up with two Wolverines!

 Azreal13 wrote:
Well, promoted by your question, I found this..

Wikipedia wrote:The Xavier Protocols, a series of profiles created by Xavier that lists the strengths and weaknesses of the X-Men, states that Wolverine's healing factor is increased to "incredible levels" and theorizes that the only way to stop him is to decapitate him and remove his head from the vicinity of his body.

So that would suggest it must be, or you'd end up with two Wolverines!

What if we bisected him top to bottom?

 feeder wrote:

 Azreal13 wrote:
To bring an element of real life to the fantastic, the "brain" isn't one consistent organ, but multiple different subsections with different functions and abilities.

In that regard, it is eminently possible that damage to a part of the brain not concerned with managing Logan's healing factor would allow full recovery, whereas catastrophic damage to that area, say the brain stem, would kill him.

Even normal real people have survived horrendous brain injuries, but damage to certain parts will result in essentially instant death.

That's a good point. Is Wolverine's healing factor regulated by the brain, like the heart and lungs, or is it something that just happens, like hair growth?

Logan healed back fully from being burned down to a pile of ash, once. He wouldn't have under normal circumstances, but he can come back from pretty much anything as long as he is exposed to the right kind of radiation.
No single part of his body is necessary for his healing factor to function. I don't even think it's a case of cellular regeneration, as much as just plain physical reconstitution.

It's weirdly inconsistent though as comic books tend to be. There was the time Hulk ripped him in two and he had to crawl up a mountain to retrieve and reattach his lower half.

Kovnik Obama wrote:

 feeder wrote:

 Azreal13 wrote:
To bring an element of real life to the fantastic, the "brain" isn't one consistent organ, but multiple different subsections with different functions and abilities.

In that regard, it is eminently possible that damage to a part of the brain not concerned with managing Logan's healing factor would allow full recovery, whereas catastrophic damage to that area, say the brain stem, would kill him.

Even normal real people have survived horrendous brain injuries, but damage to certain parts will result in essentially instant death.

That's a good point. Is Wolverine's healing factor regulated by the brain, like the heart and lungs, or is it something that just happens, like hair growth?

Logan healed back fully from being burned down to a pile of ash, once. He wouldn't have under normal circumstances, but he can come back from pretty much anything as long as he is exposed to the right kind of radiation.
No single part of his body is necessary for his healing factor to function. I don't even think it's a case of cellular regeneration, as much as just plain physical reconstitution.

Hmm, that's disappointing. I'll accept the impossible, but not the improbable.

AduroT wrote:It's weirdly inconsistent though as comic books tend to be. There was the time Hulk ripped him in two and he had to crawl up a mountain to retrieve and reattach his lower half.

Hulk could have saved Logan a lot of time and effort if he would have incinerated his legs for him.

Finally watched it, and I think this is the most non X-Men movie, and also the best X-Men movie, they have made so far. I think the story itself was great, and they really gave a great ending to the Logan/Wolverine portion of the X-Men franchise. A few of my particular thoughts:

- Patrick Steward was simply fantastic. I don't think I really need to expand on that.

- I think they really handled Laura really well. They gave her these glimpses of humanity, of childlike innocence, throughout the movie. But then they go right back and have her go on a murdering rampage, drive Logan to the doctor to get patched up, drive them to Eden, be in charge. They made it very easy for us to see her the same way that the corporation saw her: a potent weapon. And then, at the end, there she is, tears and snot on her face, very quietly saying "daddy..." as Logan dies. And I was reminded, with a sucker punch to the gut, that she really is just a little girl who is now alone.

- Did the kids make it? I'm okay with not knowing if the kids made it. I think too often movies try to send a deep message of sadness or struggle, only to wash it all away with a quick "and everybody made it and is happy now" montage at the end. I really appreciate that Logan didn't do that. When the lights came on and the theater was silent, I was one of the people you could hear sniffling in the silence. And in the end, I think the fate of the kids doesn't really matter for this movie. This was not their story, this wasn't even Laura's story. It was Logan's story, and while Laura was important it wasn't about Logan saving her, it was more about her saving Logan along the way.

Would watch again.