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I came to hear about 'Ard Boyz and I got a soap opera...

I expected to see SW and IG place high but Daemons are a surprise. Credit to all the players in the Finals, just getting there is a feat. I'm hoping to see some good reports from the players involved.

thehod wrote:BBF does have a point. Florida has a high # of quality players. Infact 2 ard boyz winners came from Florida Clark: Welch and Gareth Hunt.

Nick Rose said a couple pages ago that he came from FL as well, b4 going to Texas. So that makes 3 ard boyz winners from FL when counting this years results. Although winning 1 overall event is more impressive that the1/3 win of this year.

Regardless, GO FLORIDA! I may live in NY but I still have home state pride!

Blackmoor wrote:

mortetvie wrote:
to all about best players, I think there are a lot good players not represented by the gt crowed. Not to brag but to give some "credentials" so to speak I usually place in top 3 in every tournament I go to and have beaten blackmoore several times, beat Jason whitt who placed 3rd in the 2005 lvgt(with old school thousand sons, was only one to win all 5 games at that gt). I beleive I've beaten Dave Fay at an ard boys tournament too when he was using old nids.

That is why I do not believe in the "Who is the best" arguments. There is no way to really tell because the USA is so huge that the best players will never play each other. Also the regional meta games are very different.

Even when you compare past records over time some people get better, and some people get worse. I know that I am not as good of a player as I have been in the past because Phoenix has a bad 40K scene and I now only play in major tournaments and that makes me rusty without the constant practice.

I have a general idea of who some of the best players are, and then there are people like Mortetvie who is one of the best players I have come across, but he does not leave the LA Battle Bunker.

Allan what qualities/characteristics does mortetvie have that make you see him as a top player? Based upon your experience around the country that is saying a lot. Where would you rank someone like Hulksmash in comparison?

G

Ok, I really don't care about "Who's the best" argument, take it somewhere else.

Can anyone show me the winning 'Ard Boyz lists? I'm really interested in what the 1st place Chaos Daemons and 1st place CSM had for their lists.

SamplesoWoopass wrote:Why do you people actually care whether or not Cali or FL have better players? Are you people getting government grants or something?!?!?

Evidently the ratio of self avowed good players is somehow tied to the level of mortgage delinquencies.

We should get the stats and do a Chi Squared test.

Back on topic, too many posts are getting personal about different characters being Top Playa or not.

This is not relevant to the core discussion and violates rules about commenting on non-members.

So stop it.

Please.

Gavo wrote:Ok, I really don't care about "Who's the best" argument, take it somewhere else.

Can anyone show me the winning 'Ard Boyz lists? I'm really interested in what the 1st place Chaos Daemons and 1st place CSM had for their lists.

For the East Coast finals, the winning chaos list was (from memory- might be off a bit):

2x Daemon Prince, wings, MoS, LoS
1x Summoned Greater Daemon

2x units of Bezerkers w/ icon/PF in Rhinos
2x units of Noise Marines, w/ icon, blastmaster in Rhinos
2x units of Plague Marines, w/ icon, meltaguns in Rhinos
20x Summoned Lesser Daemons

9x Oblits

I played him first round- very good game, competent player.

@Mike and theHod

The missions were fun overall, although the peace talks one needed some clarifications.

+having kill points be a factor in buffing an objective's value was kind of nice, as it made it less likely that someone could force a draw with fast moving vehicles on the latter turns
+the flaming/smoking ruins added a small facet to the round without being over-bearing. Now, if either of us had been playing a gunline, I could see my opinion wavering, but, as it was, that turned out to be the most fun of the three missions for me (even with it being my sole loss).

-no clarity on what MUST be versus MAY be deployed in Peace Talks mission. This mission also uniquely hosed some lists (Necrons without a sacrificial scarab swarm comes to mind)
-MAKE SEIZE THE INITIATIVE STANDARD FOR ALL GAMES. I think that it's one of the most simple ways of making the "I got first turn, I win" style lists ('alpha strike' lists) at least manageable, as it gives a player some small incentive not to stack heavily in favor of a guaranteed first turn.

=variable turn length- I think it's vital for making objective missions playable
=round time limits. East Coast ran at 3 hours/round-- this was PERFECT for these size games. I run horde orks. I manage to finish 90% of my games normally, but when I travel for tournaments, this seems to dwindle quickly with 2 hour/2.5 hour rounds. I'd have to check with Mike, but I think all of the games at the East Coast location went to a natural end (all mine did at least, and I had the second most if not most models with my Ork horde).

Cool, thanks for the list. Wait, he used Lesser Daemons?! This is really not what I expected in 2500 points. The 9x oblits I can see, but I don't think anyone saw lesser daemons, or the noise marines.

Does anyone have the winning Daemon list?

Anyone got a rough draft of the winning Daemon list?

kartofelkopf wrote:

Gavo wrote:Ok, I really don't care about "Who's the best" argument, take it somewhere else.

Can anyone show me the winning 'Ard Boyz lists? I'm really interested in what the 1st place Chaos Daemons and 1st place CSM had for their lists.

For the East Coast finals, the winning chaos list was (from memory- might be off a bit):

2x Daemon Prince, wings, MoS, LoS
1x Summoned Greater Daemon

2x units of Bezerkers w/ icon/PF in Rhinos
2x units of Noise Marines, w/ icon, blastmaster in Rhinos
2x units of Plague Marines, w/ icon, meltaguns in Rhinos
20x Summoned Lesser Daemons

9x Oblits

I played him first round- very good game, competent player.

This is almost it. Only one squad of berserkers, 10 strong. The other cult squads were all 5 models.

I played him in round two. Good guy, and he played a very solid game, smartly giving me turn 1, and I could not catch any breaks early, either with shooting or saves for my Oblits. My terminators unfortunately Drew his Berserkers in the round zero assault, giving him a chance to retreat with them and making me have to extend to kill them with Abbaddon on turn 2, or let them retreat. Then he managed to drop Abby with his oblits shooting. I was never able to catch up and wound up with a Minor loss on VPs.

kartofelkopf wrote:[The missions were fun overall, although the peace talks one needed some clarifications.

+having kill points be a factor in buffing an objective's value was kind of nice, as it made it less likely that someone could force a draw with fast moving vehicles on the latter turns
+the flaming/smoking ruins added a small facet to the round without being over-bearing. Now, if either of us had been playing a gunline, I could see my opinion wavering, but, as it was, that turned out to be the most fun of the three missions for me (even with it being my sole loss).

-no clarity on what MUST be versus MAY be deployed in Peace Talks mission. This mission also uniquely hosed some lists (Necrons without a sacrificial scarab swarm comes to mind)
-MAKE SEIZE THE INITIATIVE STANDARD FOR ALL GAMES. I think that it's one of the most simple ways of making the "I got first turn, I win" style lists ('alpha strike' lists) at least manageable, as it gives a player some small incentive not to stack heavily in favor of a guaranteed first turn.

=variable turn length- I think it's vital for making objective missions playable
=round time limits. East Coast ran at 3 hours/round-- this was PERFECT for these size games. I run horde orks. I manage to finish 90% of my games normally, but when I travel for tournaments, this seems to dwindle quickly with 2 hour/2.5 hour rounds. I'd have to check with Mike, but I think all of the games at the East Coast location went to a natural end (all mine did at least, and I had the second most if not most models with my Ork horde).

I agree on all points. Three hours was great. Seize the Initiative and Random Game Length really should be standard for all missions.

The first and third missions were good. The Peace Talks mission was flawed. Forcing (the rules said "must") the players to deploy an HQ and two troops definitely hurt in some matchups. Having this mission give a big VP bonus for the center objective (thus giving an advantage for going second) should have been counterbalanced by Night Fight on turn 1; as it was, going second was a huge advantage because you also got the first real turn of shooting. I also was not very happy with there not being any clarification regarding Monstrous Creature HQs or on whether Lesser Daemons could be deployed in the center, since Chaos Daemons could.

I had a very good time, and was psyched to finally play at Showcase. They run a great event, and have gorgeous terrain, with enough real LOS-blocking terrain stuff to be appropriate for 5th edition, unlike a lot of local storesout there.

I had three very good games. Mike (Twitchell?) in rd 1 with a shooty Logan wolfguard list (six WG squads led by WG termies w/cyclone) supported by long fangs and two units of thunderwolves. Great guy, tough game, managed to pull an Major Win +1 (18pts). He and I actually played on the other table from one another when our teams met in Round 4 of the Adepticon Team Tournament this year, so I've gotten to play against 3/4 of that team now. Very cool.

Second game was against the eventual winner Clark, as I mentioned above. I was behind from the start and he never took his foot off the pedal. I played hard and kept to a Minor Loss + 2, for 9pts.

Third was against Brad Park's Necrons (Deceiver, 7 immortals, 15 destroyers, 3x min warriors, 3 monoliths). Brad was another fun and pleasant opponent, who only made one real error, in charging Abaddon with the big D. Abby smacked him down, and from there I was able to roll over most of the rest of the army. Brad kept 20 warriors hidden in a corner after they came in from reserve, and I wasn't able to get around or through the wall of monoliths fast enough to get to them. Brad also jetted a squad of destroyers to my side of the table on turn 5, and I couldn't kill them before the game ended, costing me a bonus point which didn't matter in the end. Massacre +3 for 23pts.

That was enough to get me 4th of 18, which was tantalizingly close to a golden ticket, but sadly not quite there. Also not quite as good proportionately as last year's performance. But it was definitely a good time, and three more good games.

Mosg wrote:Anyone got a rough draft of the winning Daemon list?

something like this is my guess since this is what he had earlier in hard boyz

4 Heralds so of Tz on Chariots ( Jet Bike )
3 units of Fiends ( Beasts )
3 Winged Demon Princes ( Jump Pack )
1 unit of screamers ( Jet Bike )
1 unit of Flesh Hounds ( Beasts )
Assorted troops ( all slow )

The demon list in the west coast tourney kinda came out of nowhere. The top 2 got just the right result to let the guy from the 4th or 5th table to place =). I was 1" away from getting a minor win over a minor loss which would have put me in first rather than third but that is life and dice =).

I don't believe that the best players will never play each other.

Just have to go to enough tournaments. I've made some pretty decent friendships traveling around to different events and there is always the same few people on the top tables if they're there. It's not a coincidence.

Who has two thumbs and is the best 40k player in the country?

<-- this guy

Adamah wrote:Chicago placings were

1. Guard
2. Orks
3. Space Wolves

Someone from our shop came in 5th out of 46

Are you talking about Twitch?

Post lists pls.

Daemons are definitely a surprise, it says something about the quality of the player and the ability of an old codex; which as a Dark Angels player I am glad to see. Nobody from our shop got past the Semi's but the prelims were quite fun. I'm definitely going to make sure the resident daemon player sees how well they did on the west coast to raise his spirits a bit after having to tie against me

Besides one of the events do people have the names of the winners just not the lists or the armies?

Or did i miss that somewhere between "the who is greatest debate"?

Frazzled wrote:

SamplesoWoopass wrote:Why do you people actually care whether or not Cali or FL have better players? Are you people getting government grants or something?!?!?

Evidently the ratio of self avowed good players is somehow tied to the level of mortgage delinquencies.

Unfortunately, I think that comment went way over the heads of most of the readers here

(Being in the lending industry, I totally get it.)

Can anyone post the ork list?

I think it was something like:

2 warbosses on bikes
10 warbikers
150 slugga boyz w/ pk nobs
Some small squads of lootas
Some deff koptas

I don't know the exact composition of any of the units.

tastytaste wrote:Besides one of the events do people have the names of the winners just not the lists or the armies?

Or did i miss that somewhere between "the who is greatest debate"?

East Region
1) Ben Mohlie
2) Clark Welch
3) Stephen Fore

Not sure of the others.

I will see if I can ask Stephen for his list and post it.

Philly results were

1) Clark
2) Ben
3) Stephen


Just wanted to correct it.

Clark Welch

Found this:

http://www.baldandscreaming.com/news/results-from-2010-ard-boyz-finals/

Seems to have lists.

If anyone can fill in the gaps on the Space Wolves lists send me a PM or email. I heard one was razorback spam and the other was foot-slogging, but that's about it.

the one that got third at chicago was:

6 Drop pods all with 7 grey hunters and a wolf guard in termy armour with chain fist. The squads all had melta guns,and combi meltas.

He had 2 rune preists that went with 2 squads.

1 Squad had Arjac instead of the chainfist termy.

1 wolf guard unit in drop pod with 4 combi plasma, 4 combi meltas, and a chainfist termy.

3 squads of 5 missle launcher long fangs.

1 squad of 3 speeders, all double H bolters.

Thanks! And congratulations on your win.

tastytaste wrote:Besides one of the events do people have the names of the winners just not the lists or the armies?

Or did i miss that somewhere between "the who is greatest debate"?

I just got called in to ref. I handed all the paperwork over to James Bell after the event.

My name is Adam I got third in west coast with the following list:
eldrad
yriel
8 harlequins with shadowseer, 7 kisses
2X 5 firedragons in wave serpents with stones/twin linked cannons
10 man wraithguard squad with enhance
2X5 dire avengers with wave serpents with stones with twin brightlances
10 man stormguardian squad with 2Xflamers warlock with destructor in wave serpent with stones and twin scatter

2X wraithlords with EML/BL

1 falcon with stones, holofields, scatter laser, cannon.

The guy that got second was named Andy (I played him 3rd round) was space wolf razorback spam and as best I can remember he took:

2 runepriests with the cover save power and something else, a grey knight psychic hood ally

3X elite spacewolf squads in rzorbacks that had twin las and HK missile

6X grey hunter squads (plasma gun and flamer) with 6 razorbacks that had las and twin plasma

3X longfangs squads ,2 with 5X missiles and 1 with 3X missile and 2X plasma cannon with a wolfen and all with razorbacks with las and twin plasma

3X landspeeders with the 2X missile launchers and heavy bolters.

End of game all he had was 1 razorback, 1 longfang squad and 4 greyhunters (claiming the super objective) and I had eldrad, yriel, a DA squad claiming an objective and a virtually untouched wraithguard squad 1" from contesting the super objective. Took a minor loss which put me in third rather than first, good game =).

The demon payer who took first had a bunch of old cold one riders from fantasy proxied as some other stuff so I am not sure what his list was exactly supposed to be.

BladeWalker wrote:I came to hear about 'Ard Boyz and I got a soap opera...

I expected to see SW and IG place high but Daemons are a surprise. Credit to all the players in the Finals, just getting there is a feat. I'm hoping to see some good reports from the players involved.

Welcome to Dakka, where tournaments are seriouz bizznizz.