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The top 5 sellers of 2006 were, in order:

1. Warhammer 40,000

2. WarMachine

3. Hordes

4. Warhammer Fantasy Battles

5. Confrontation

 

per: http://www.icv2.com/articles/home/10315.html

 

 

Nice find. Well, I suppose we can shift the arguments that PP is rapidly growing in popularity in the US from "anecdotal" to "supported by evidence."

I really should finish my Menoth army. And by finish I mean, start.

Thanks for the news, but what bothers me is "ICv2 interviewed game retailers, distributors and publishers for its 2006 market overview published in ICv2 Guide to Games #41." I wouldn't expect any retailer, and certainly not distributors, to lie, but is there any chance to get some numbers?

That's wonderful news. TELL THEM TO START MAKING PLASTICS SO I CAN PLAY!!!

I still wonder if WM+HORDES > 40K+WHFB sales....

I guess this is when the complaining about PP prices commences? *wince*

Very, very interesting. I'm actually surprised it's Confrontation and not FOW or LOTR (yes I know, bubble etc., but it DID sell well for a time, especially among non GW-enthusiasts).

Posted By Breotan on 03/28/2007 1:09 PM
That's wonderful news. TELL THEM TO START MAKING PLASTICS SO I CAN PLAY!!!

Afraid you might start to develop some muscle moving your metal army around the table?

That's some really interesting info, and it doesn't really surprise me.  However, I would definitely be interested in seeing some more solid numbers.

PP certainly has done a good job and have a very strong following. Two companies dominating the top five... would be nice to see others breakthrough too.

I wonder how distant a 5th Confrontation is too. All the game stores around here have their Confrontation stock marked down 33% - 50% off and it still doesn't move at all.

Posted By Crimson Devil on 03/28/2007 1:27 PM

Posted By Breotan on 03/28/2007 1:09 PM
That's wonderful news. TELL THEM TO START MAKING PLASTICS SO I CAN PLAY!!!

Afraid you might start to develop some muscle moving your metal army around the table?

I just don't like hauling metal figures around on public transportation.  Lighter is better.

Besides, I enjoy working (modifying) plastic so much more.  Dremel's are so noisy.

I'm waiting for Flames of War to start making an impact...

Edit:  Just notice Yu-gi-oh was #1 in cards sales.  In my area, the game was dead by October 2006.  Strong initial sales followed by a complete die off?  Or was my area an exception and not the rule?

The other lists are also quite interesting.  Your RPG classic, D & D is #1, the #2 is a "darker" classic RPG, the fourth is a superhero RPG (not suprising with all the blockbuster superhero movies) but most interesting is there are two manga-themed RPG's in the top 5.  I was expecting ShadowRun or one of the LARP systems to make it in.

Thanks Ed, this gives me some things to think about.

These type of press releases always make me laugh, because they have so little actual information in them. They are a few opinions lumped together, with no numbers.

Nice to see those results across the board for all games mentioned. Also good to see Hordes outsold WHFB.

Serves GW right. (even though WHFB seems to be a better game than 40K)

Odd to see yugioh as the top seller. Thats okay though, pokemon was for a short time as well.

Horrorclix made an outstanding showing considering all the other CMG's were presnt the entire year for 2006 while horrorclix wasnt really available untile mid to late october. Good to see it has a strong showing. Kinda sad to see Pirates! didnt make it into the top 5, but considering that they have jumped the shark, cest la vie.

Mikhaila, I thought that was interesting as well. However, it doesn't look like the complete article was included. Did you (or do you) get ICV2 from your distributor by any chance?

Posted By mikhaila on 03/28/2007 3:09 PM

These type of press releases always make me laugh, because they have so little actual information in them. They are a few opinions lumped together, with no numbers.

Pretty much. They "interviewed" people and "concluded" that the games market "stabilized and improved." Uh-huh. So yea, without actual number it all seems spank to me.

These are among the best stats available. But they also mainly use what retailers chose to report in.

The big issue I have with them is that they do not count GW's own distribution network.

This is huge. GW runs lots of stores in malls in multiple countries. These make up a huge portion of their sales. So do direct sales from their website.

These numbers aren't included in the report.

GW's own direct sales from their stores and site for WFB may well exceed Warmachine/Hordes total sales.

This list probably goes a long way towards explaining why Rackham is radically revising Confrontation (basically, it is gone!) and Rag'Narok (basically, it'll be a lot closer to WFB, with pre-painted plastics (for grunts) coming).

Confrag'Narok anyone?

Probably not.

I think Rackham's underestimated the popularity (I know, I know - maybe not!) of Confrontation and overestimated the market's desire for another fantasy battle system. With pre-painted miniatures.

Time will tell...

Does anyone know how well AT-43 is doing?

Around here every FLGS has their Confrontation stock discounted between 33-50% off and it still doesn't move.

One of them hasn't sold a model in the two years I've been living here. On the other hand, the Lions of Alahan Knights are tempting my at $20 for the box, but I know I'd never game with them.

Posted By Furious on 03/28/2007 3:02 PM

I'm waiting for Flames of War to start making an impact...

Edit:  Just notice Yu-gi-oh was #1 in cards sales.  In my area, the game was dead by October 2006.  Strong initial sales followed by a complete die off?  Or was my area an exception and not the rule?

The other lists are also quite interesting.  Your RPG classic, D & D is #1, the #2 is a "darker" classic RPG, the fourth is a superhero RPG (not suprising with all the blockbuster superhero movies) but most interesting is there are two manga-themed RPG's in the top 5.  I was expecting ShadowRun or one of the LARP systems to make it in.

Thanks Ed, this gives me some things to think about.

I am glad to see that M&M has taken hold a bit.  It really isn't a bad system but I would love to see more miniatures for such games.

Yeah, Rackham has some pretty models, great catalogs. I keep starting to order myself a bunch, but I know I'll never play the game much, if at all.

I'll try to get a copy of the entire article to post , and find out how they did their survey. I've seen lots of these over the years, they pretty much amount to "We asked 20 retailers what they though about stuff, and off the top of their heads they said...."

I used to fill out the surveys in Comics Retailer Magazine every few months. My numbers added in caused huge changes in what was hot each month. Turns out there were less than a dozen people sending in info. Small sample, worthless data.

It's kind of laughable to think that Hoardes might have outsold WFB. Hoardes has been very slow for most distributors since the first big rush when it came out. I'm sure PP wished it sold as many hordes books as Skull Pass. )

PP is doing good, and if they keep going like they are, and pay attention to their business, they will continue to do good. But their sales aren't in GW's ballpark yet, by any stretch of the imagination.

Interesting that FOW is not on there.

 As noted this doesn't include GW's own network.

I wonder what the actual revenue numbers are. There could be a steep decline between one and two (or two and three of course). If anyone knew US sales for WFB you could correlate at least a bottom for what Warmachine has.

Don't think too many stores will voluntarily give up their sales figures...

I'll also bet some of these stores do not have accurate records.

I was going to ask mauleed to sight his source, because for some reason i missed the link .. then i went to the link and well, while the source sells magazines, the article is hardly crdible.. no numbers, no hard info, just a list.. 

nice find by the way, but hardly factual.

HA!

No, in fact very, very few stores have accurate breakdowns of sales numbers. It's possible to gain the knowledge by going back over purchasing invoices, or to break out your sales if your using a multi department cash register. Most stores have a register with 10 or so departments, but with broad categories for "Games", "comics", etc, and don't worry about breaking it down further. If a shop uses a computerized register that scans UPC codes, and keeps up with the inventory system, they can get excellant knowledge of sales.

If this survey was like the others I've seen, it was more like:

1. List your top five miniature games. 2. List your top 5 card games...6. How much do you think you are up ar down for the year?....

So more like agragate ancedotal evidence than actual numbers. This breaks down, because with a lack of numbers, it's just adding up rankings. For example:

Say my shop sells 50k in WFB, and 5k in Hoardes. Two other shops just started up, don't carry GW, but sold a 300 in Hordes each. 50, 000 in WFB is better than 5,600 in hordes, but Hoardes gets 2 votes for top game, and WFB gets 1.

The results of this survey are kind of helpful in some ways. If your store didn't sell boardgames, and you wondered what some good ones are, you probably couldn't go wrong getting in one of each of those games.

As an indicator of overall sales in actual numbers for the year, it's pretty poor. GW's numbers are a matter of public record, but PP, FOW, and others are not, and we generally won't see those numbers posted anywhere.

You all are asking for evidence, but are pretty quick to dismiss the results and condemn the methodology without any evidence to support your opinions about it either.

Posted By jfrazell on 03/29/2007 5:12 AM

 As noted this doesn't include GW's own network.

Not sure that it would be relevant. Independent game stores probably don't care that GW sells a lot of their own minis in their own stores. They care what other independent sellers are moving.

So from that perspective the GW sales aren't important. If gamers are coming into non-GW stores and asking for Hordes more than WFB then sellers want to know that.

Posted By Gubs on 03/29/2007 10:02 AM
You all are asking for evidence, but are pretty quick to dismiss the results and condemn the methodology without any evidence to support your opinions about it either.

sounds about par for the course doesn't it?  who needs evidence when you have mobs and torches.. ?

Not me that's for sure!
I get the pitch fork.

Yes, it is interesting considering that as far as I have heard from many channels was that Horrorclix was an utter failure.

I heard that about HorroClix as well. Heck, I even heard rumors of WizKids ending the game after the first release. In my area it sells out but no one is playing it at the FLAGS - even when there are sponsored events (given, the prize support is crap...and just you wait HeroClix line, you're getting the same crappy prize support very soon). But I digress.

From what I've read, Privateer Press is at the precarious point where they can expand to "big company" status or continue to be a small company. I wish for their continued suceess and I hope they'll continue to expand. With any luck they'll go public and we'll have some numbers to view.

Until then, I really appreciate mikhaila's time and information on how the real retail world works. By the way mikhaila (and anyone else who may have knowledge of this stuff), are there any resources for the current state of the gaming industry? Would GAMA have that info? Is there a game/comic retailer's association with info?