Switch Theme:

Psychic Awakening N&R  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
»
Author Message
Advert


Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
  • No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
  • Times and dates in your local timezone.
  • Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
  • Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
  • Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.




Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut





If people want something to mindlessly argue about why not some rumours from /tg/ seems about as fruitful as the last like 5 pages of ghaz vs ragnar talk

The rumour post with the usual "my friend works at gw hq"

These are what the next releases are going to be in order, we're going to get official confirmation at Adepticon.
>Unnamed Book (Working Title "The Deathmarch"
>Deathguard, Crons, and Deathwatch
>Talons of the Emperor book (Name subject to change) Sisters, Talons (replacing custoes, next custodes book will just be Talons) and Harlies, sets up the next big conflict which is...
>The War of the Spider
>Every faction represented, most with very little (A relic or wlt, tops, most just get fluff) the Emperors Children beseige Terra, ushering in Fulgrim (we will get a tease of his model at the end of Adepticon). The book will function as "Index: Emperors Children". A lot will be carried over from Faith and Fury but expanded to be equivalent to DG and T Sons. Will NOT have Fulgrim, he will come with his rules when he is released and shortly after the start of 9th a true EC dex with his rules will be released. New Noise Marines on their way, new "Primaris" equivalent coming, created by Fabius. Not all the new units will have datasheets in War of the Spider, they're using this to justify the codex coming out a few months after the PA book. Will be much larder than previous PA books, lots of fluff. Closer to Vigilus than not, lots of narrative and campaign rules. Full fledged global campaign like at the start of 8th.

Think part of what makes me think last section is atleast possibly true

we have a floating slaanesh thing (matches syllesskes backpack thing, and due to amount of heads its scale seems decently big, could be base piece for fulgrim though more likely an aos slaanesh mortals piece

overall the way GW have promoted PA is kind of weird, we get teasers for stuff thats 2 books down meaning very little hype for current book, we have known about the admech stuff for a while now and already teasing further ahead stuff with fabius before beast and engine war are out yet. Feels like their marketing is going faster than production.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2020/03/12 01:16:06


 
   
Made in us
Archmagos Veneratus Extremis




On the Internet

blaktoof wrote:
The story is just a vehicle to make Ragnar Primaris(don't read into that out of every faction to get new units in 8th Marines got the most and they are all primaris that cant mean anything....) and release a large Ghaz model.

It will be interesting to see any rules.

Rules are what I'm waiting on so I can find out if they fixed the Kulturs finally.
   
Made in us
Mekboy Hammerin' Somethin'




Alaska

I don't think many details of the actual fight beyond Ghaz mortally wounding Ragnar and Ragnar beheading Ghaz have been revealed yet, have they? It could easily have been an unfair fight rather than some sort of duel, with Ghazzy taking Ragnar, a Deathwatch Watch Master and their respective entourages simultaneously.

Heck, Ghazzy might have even killed Logan Grimnar as part of that fight and GW might just be waiting to release that as a bombshell. (I doubt it, but I'm just saying we don't really know yet.)

I'm excited to see what orks get. My preference would be for something different than "build your own clan" as the ork clans aren't really the same as regiments and chapters, but I also wouldn't be angry if that's the way they go with it.

YELL REAL LOUD AN' CARRY A BIG CHOPPA! 
   
Made in us
Terrifying Doombull




 Mothman wrote:

>The War of the Spider
>Every faction represented, most with very little (A relic or wlt, tops, most just get fluff) the Emperors Children beseige Terra, ushering in Fulgrim (we will get a tease of his model at the end of Adepticon). The book will function as "Index: Emperors Children". A lot will be carried over from Faith and Fury but expanded to be equivalent to DG and T Sons. Will NOT have Fulgrim, he will come with his rules when he is released and shortly after the start of 9th a true EC dex with his rules will be released. New Noise Marines on their way, new "Primaris" equivalent coming, created by Fabius. Not all the new units will have datasheets in War of the Spider, they're using this to justify the codex coming out a few months after the PA book. Will be much larder than previous PA books, lots of fluff. Closer to Vigilus than not, lots of narrative and campaign rules. Full fledged global campaign like at the start of 8th.


Just to be clear, here:
The Emperor's Children will get temporary rules in War of the Spider to replace the temporary Faith and Fury rules which propped up the Chaos 2.0 rules, which replaced the Chaos 1.0 rules that came down in the first codex after the Index. All so they can shortly thereafter get a real codex shortly after their _fifth_ iteration of temporary rules in the 3 years since the start of 8th edition, with War of the Spider intentionally avoiding some new models/units in order to sell the '9th edition' codex.


Efficiency is the highest virtue. 
   
Made in us
Archmagos Veneratus Extremis




On the Internet

Voss wrote:
 Mothman wrote:

>The War of the Spider
>Every faction represented, most with very little (A relic or wlt, tops, most just get fluff) the Emperors Children beseige Terra, ushering in Fulgrim (we will get a tease of his model at the end of Adepticon). The book will function as "Index: Emperors Children". A lot will be carried over from Faith and Fury but expanded to be equivalent to DG and T Sons. Will NOT have Fulgrim, he will come with his rules when he is released and shortly after the start of 9th a true EC dex with his rules will be released. New Noise Marines on their way, new "Primaris" equivalent coming, created by Fabius. Not all the new units will have datasheets in War of the Spider, they're using this to justify the codex coming out a few months after the PA book. Will be much larder than previous PA books, lots of fluff. Closer to Vigilus than not, lots of narrative and campaign rules. Full fledged global campaign like at the start of 8th.


Just to be clear, here:
The Emperor's Children will get temporary rules in War of the Spider to replace the temporary Faith and Fury rules which propped up the Chaos 2.0 rules, which replaced the Chaos 1.0 rules that came down in the first codex after the Index. All so they can shortly thereafter get a real codex shortly after their _fifth_ iteration of temporary rules in the 3 years since the start of 8th edition, with War of the Spider intentionally avoiding some new models/units in order to sell the '9th edition' codex.


I'm not buying it to be honest. It doesn't work with Bile's lore on any level, and it doesn't fit the fact we just saw EC updated rules a couple books ago. GW does some boneheaded things at times, but this would be taking the cake even for them.
   
Made in ca
Commander of the Mysterious 2nd Legion





if Logan was dead Ragnar would be getting billed as "the great wolf"

Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two 
   
Made in fr
Hallowed Canoness





 ClockworkZion wrote:
The Canoness is irrelevant to the discussion (and still misses if she rerolls 1s into 1s, Ragnar has a +1 hit hit rolls in the first round of combat so auto hits).

Uh, even if it worked that way, going from "2+ reroll" to "autohit" definitely doesn't make up for reroll to wound lol.
And it would work for any canoness in range of the Triumph of Saint Katherine too lol.
 ClockworkZion wrote:
Put that in perspective though: Ghaz took a Mary Sue down with him. That rarely happens in the lore when GW goes out of their way to make Space Marines look good.

This will happen exactly once for each marysue that GW wants to upgrade to primaris mary sue, so expect more of it in the future .

"Our fantasy settings are grim and dark, but that is not a reflection of who we are or how we feel the real world should be. [...] We will continue to diversify the cast of characters we portray [...] so everyone can find representation and heroes they can relate to. [...] If [you don't feel the same way], you will not be missed"
https://twitter.com/WarComTeam/status/1268665798467432449/photo/1 
   
Made in us
Archmagos Veneratus Extremis




On the Internet

 Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:
 ClockworkZion wrote:
The Canoness is irrelevant to the discussion (and still misses if she rerolls 1s into 1s, Ragnar has a +1 hit hit rolls in the first round of combat so auto hits).

Uh, even if it worked that way, going from "2+ reroll" to "autohit" definitely doesn't make up for reroll to wound lol.
And it would work for any canoness in range of the Triumph of Saint Katherine too lol.
 ClockworkZion wrote:
Put that in perspective though: Ghaz took a Mary Sue down with him. That rarely happens in the lore when GW goes out of their way to make Space Marines look good.

This will happen exactly once for each marysue that GW wants to upgrade to primaris mary sue, so expect more of it in the future .

To be fair, in most cases they haven't basically killed the character first.
   
Made in au
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.

I have to admit, the background fluff to this book is really wierd:

"Once these two titans faced each other in single combat... and both were killed. Now, it's time for round two!"

Wait, what? Why is the background to this big fight between Ragnar and Ghaz that Ragnar and Ghaz already fought???

Industrial Insanity - My Terrain Blog
"GW really needs to understand 'Less is more' when it comes to AoS." - Wha-Mu-077

 
   
Made in au
[MOD]
Making Stuff






Under the couch

Because that lets them fast-forward to the point where Ragnar is already a Primaris, and gives them a hook for the battle beyond just 'Ghaz! Ragnar! Fight!'

 
   
Made in fr
Hallowed Canoness





 ClockworkZion wrote:
To be fair, in most cases they haven't basically killed the character first.

Haven't they? They did for Calgar iirc, and they did for the dark angel guy. Maybe they didn't for Mephiston?
Who else got primarized?
 H.B.M.C. wrote:
I have to admit, the background fluff to this book is really wierd:

"Once these two titans faced each other in single combat... and both were killed. Now, it's time for round two!"

Wait, what? Why is the background to this big fight between Ragnar and Ghaz that Ragnar and Ghaz already fought???

Yeah, weird and sounds incredibly forced.

"Our fantasy settings are grim and dark, but that is not a reflection of who we are or how we feel the real world should be. [...] We will continue to diversify the cast of characters we portray [...] so everyone can find representation and heroes they can relate to. [...] If [you don't feel the same way], you will not be missed"
https://twitter.com/WarComTeam/status/1268665798467432449/photo/1 
   
Made in au
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.

 insaniak wrote:
Because that lets them fast-forward to the point where Ragnar is already a Primaris, and gives them a hook for the battle beyond just 'Ghaz! Ragnar! Fight!'
They could have made him a Primaris without that.

Remember that GW's fluff is 100% arbitrary, and can be written to justify, create or destroy anything. The lead-up short stories were about finding Ragnar, so they could have just as easily said that Ragnar was found nearly dead after defeating a small Tyranid splinter fleet/a Red Corsair incursion/putting down an Alpha Legion revot/smashing some blueberries - whatever, it wouldn't matter because the reasons who him becoming Primaris are unimportant.

Industrial Insanity - My Terrain Blog
"GW really needs to understand 'Less is more' when it comes to AoS." - Wha-Mu-077

 
   
Made in us
[DCM]
.







I vote for "smashing some blueberries"!
   
Made in au
[MOD]
Making Stuff






Under the couch

 Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:

Haven't they? They did for Calgar iirc, and they did for the dark angel guy. Maybe they didn't for Mephiston?

They didn't for Calgar. They just said 'Hey, he's a Primaris now. Surgery was a bit touch and go, but he's OK!'



 
   
Made in au
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.

Which is kinda my point. How Ragnar became a Wulfaris Marine is immaterial, and yet GW chose to make the event that caused it a fight between the two people who are now about to have a big fight... again...

Why?

Industrial Insanity - My Terrain Blog
"GW really needs to understand 'Less is more' when it comes to AoS." - Wha-Mu-077

 
   
Made in au
[MOD]
Making Stuff






Under the couch

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
 insaniak wrote:
Because that lets them fast-forward to the point where Ragnar is already a Primaris, and gives them a hook for the battle beyond just 'Ghaz! Ragnar! Fight!'
They could have made him a Primaris without that.

Remember that GW's fluff is 100% arbitrary, and can be written to justify, create or destroy anything. The lead-up short stories were about finding Ragnar, so they could have just as easily said that Ragnar was found nearly dead after defeating a small Tyranid splinter fleet/a Red Corsair incursion/putting down an Alpha Legion revot/smashing some blueberries - whatever, it wouldn't matter because the reasons who him becoming Primaris are unimportant.

Yeah, the second part was more relevant. It's potentially more interesting, narratively, to play out the second meeting between two champions than the first. Particularly when you set it up so that the first was effectively a draw, and they both now have something to prove.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/03/12 03:01:10


 
   
Made in au
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.

I'd agree if such a rivalry was established in the fluff prior to this.

Say it wasn't the Woofs in this book. Say it was the Imperial Guard, and that GW were using this event as a reason to give us a big new plastic Ghaz and a nice new plastic Yarrick. That holds some weight. Their rivalry is fierce. They've faced each other at least 3 times from what I recall (2nd & 3rd War, plus Ghaz once captured Yarrick and let him go as he liked having the sport IIRC).

Their big meeting in this event would be a Big Deal™.

For Ragnar however they've had to invent a whole previous confrontation out of whole cloth just to set this one up. As Hybrid said, that makes this seem very forced.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/03/12 03:04:02


Industrial Insanity - My Terrain Blog
"GW really needs to understand 'Less is more' when it comes to AoS." - Wha-Mu-077

 
   
Made in us
Archmagos Veneratus Extremis




On the Internet

 Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:
 ClockworkZion wrote:
To be fair, in most cases they haven't basically killed the character first.

Haven't they? They did for Calgar iirc, and they did for the dark angel guy. Maybe they didn't for Mephiston?
Who else got primarized?
 H.B.M.C. wrote:
I have to admit, the background fluff to this book is really wierd:

"Once these two titans faced each other in single combat... and both were killed. Now, it's time for round two!"

Wait, what? Why is the background to this big fight between Ragnar and Ghaz that Ragnar and Ghaz already fought???

Yeah, weird and sounds incredibly forced.

Nah, Calgar nearly died afterwards to Abbadon. He "died" in the same way every Primaris upgrade does: on the operating table. He got better though.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 insaniak wrote:
 Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:

Haven't they? They did for Calgar iirc, and they did for the dark angel guy. Maybe they didn't for Mephiston?

They didn't for Calgar. They just said 'Hey, he's a Primaris now. Surgery was a bit touch and go, but he's OK!'

Officially that's the case for every upgrade (with a 60% chance of dying and not getting better) though apparently the surgery seems to do something to cause massive regeneration of tissue as well so it has a 40% chance of saving someone who would otherwise be dead. Too bad you can't do it to someone whose already a Primaris I guess?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 H.B.M.C. wrote:
I'd agree if such a rivalry was established in the fluff prior to this.

Say it wasn't the Woofs in this book. Say it was the Imperial Guard, and that GW were using this event as a reason to give us a big new plastic Ghaz and a nice new plastic Yarrick. That holds some weight. Their rivalry is fierce. They've faced each other at least 3 times from what I recall (2nd & 3rd War, plus Ghaz once captured Yarrick and let him go as he liked having the sport IIRC).

Their big meeting in this event would be a Big Deal™.

For Ragnar however they've had to invent a whole previous confrontation out of whole cloth just to set this one up. As Hybrid said, that makes this seem very forced.


Yarrick doesn't make sense in a straight duel because we've had that attempt and Yarrick was captured by Ghaz. Yarrick and Ghaz's fights have been using whole battlefields, not in a brawn to brawn fight (which better suits the Marines anyways).

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2020/03/12 03:28:35


 
   
Made in us
Lone Wolf Sentinel Pilot






Iowa

I definitely feel that Ghaz has just outgrown Yarrick as an opponent. He’d definitely be interesting to have a tactical battle with, but Yarrick facing Ghazghkull would just be a retelling of a done story.

If the truth can destroy it, then it deserves to be destroyed. 
   
Made in us
Archmagos Veneratus Extremis




On the Internet

 Apple Peel wrote:
I definitely feel that Ghaz has just outgrown Yarrick as an opponent. He’d definitely be interesting to have a tactical battle with, but Yarrick facing Ghazghkull would just be a retelling of a done story.

Honestly I agree with that. Yarrick is someone who pushes Ghaz on an intellectual level and having them face off mano a ork wouldn't really work on any level. Yarrick is a boss, don't get me wrong, but he's not winning a fist fight with Ghaz.
   
Made in ca
Commander of the Mysterious 2nd Legion





 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Which is kinda my point. How Ragnar became a Wulfaris Marine is immaterial, and yet GW chose to make the event that caused it a fight between the two people who are now about to have a big fight... again...

Why?


because they ALSO needed an excuse to make Ghaz "Bigga, tougha and stronga!" and if you think people are complaining now how would they have reacted if the story went "Ragnar crosses the rubicon, kicked Ghaz around and now Ghaz has gotten an upgrade and come back"?

Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






BrianDavion wrote:
 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Which is kinda my point. How Ragnar became a Wulfaris Marine is immaterial, and yet GW chose to make the event that caused it a fight between the two people who are now about to have a big fight... again...

Why?


because they ALSO needed an excuse to make Ghaz "Bigga, tougha and stronga!" and if you think people are complaining now how would they have reacted if the story went "Ragnar crosses the rubicon, kicked Ghaz around and now Ghaz has gotten an upgrade and come back"?


There was existing fluff that as Orks fought longer and harder, they grew bigger. They could have just reintroduced Orkemedes and had Ghazkull outgrow his old armor, and need a new kustom suit from the big mek.
   
Made in ca
Commander of the Mysterious 2nd Legion





maybe but now we can call Ghaz "da 60 million toof ork"

Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two 
   
Made in au
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.

BrianDavion wrote:
because they ALSO needed an excuse to make Ghaz "Bigga, tougha and stronga!"...
Since when? Orks get bigger. Ghaz is the biggest. Him being huge isn't something that would take people by surprise. It would be welcome.

Industrial Insanity - My Terrain Blog
"GW really needs to understand 'Less is more' when it comes to AoS." - Wha-Mu-077

 
   
Made in au
[MOD]
Making Stuff






Under the couch

Yeah, Ghaz getting bigger is the one bit of scale creep that actually makes sense, given the advancing storyline.

 
   
Made in us
Terrifying Doombull




BrianDavion wrote:
 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Which is kinda my point. How Ragnar became a Wulfaris Marine is immaterial, and yet GW chose to make the event that caused it a fight between the two people who are now about to have a big fight... again...

Why?


because they ALSO needed an excuse to make Ghaz "Bigga, tougha and stronga!" and if you think people are complaining now how would they have reacted if the story went "Ragnar crosses the rubicon, kicked Ghaz around and now Ghaz has gotten an upgrade and come back"?


They really don't need an excuse for a bigger Ghaz. Its built into the lore already.
Botching the story your way doesn't make any more sense than GW's version that they both lose, get upgraded from Mostly Dead, and immediately come back for a Vegas Exclusive Rematch.

The _sensible_ version of the story is Ragnar goes up against Ghaz, gets splattered, goes into the Primaris bin, and vows vengeance... for a future storyline. Ghaz just gets a new model because his old model is woeful and out of date. It doesn't need a 'campaign book' explaining the upgrade any more than the new chaos space marine box or the new Sisters needed a story explanation.

And honestly Ragnar doesn't even need to get splattered. He could have gotten the Primaris upgrade at any point, as part of a new future for the Chapter. He and his company can fight Ghaz's armies without either character getting fake mortally wounded.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/03/12 04:33:11


Efficiency is the highest virtue. 
   
Made in us
Archmagos Veneratus Extremis




On the Internet

It may not -needed- to happen, but arguably that's what makes the story better. The best lore doesn't come to explain why something -has- to happen, but rather tells a story and moves on.

I'm almost willing to bet money round 2 doesn't even happen and Ghaz is back to doing his thing while Ragnar chases after him like he's the Pink Panther.

EDIT: The reason I say that regarding lore about things that "need" to happen. An example is the whole Primaris mess. Due to how they did it Cawl needed to happen to serve as a plot device to explain it. Meanwhile stories like Huron worked because they set up a character, told a story and moved on. They don't exist to serve as spackling covering up plot holes in the world building, but exist inside the world building and tell a stand alone series of events.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/03/12 04:46:20


 
   
Made in us
Storm Trooper with Maglight






H.B.M.C. wrote:I'd agree if such a rivalry was established in the fluff prior to this.

Say it wasn't the Woofs in this book. Say it was the Imperial Guard, and that GW were using this event as a reason to give us a big new plastic Ghaz and a nice new plastic Yarrick. That holds some weight. Their rivalry is fierce. They've faced each other at least 3 times from what I recall (2nd & 3rd War, plus Ghaz once captured Yarrick and let him go as he liked having the sport IIRC).

Their big meeting in this event would be a Big Deal™.

For Ragnar however they've had to invent a whole previous confrontation out of whole cloth just to set this one up. As Hybrid said, that makes this seem very forced.



Yeah, it would make a bit more sense if this was the telling of their first meeting, rather than making this about their second one while also revealing that they met in the past. Have the fluff end with the draw and Ragnar becoming primaris and swearing revenge while Ghazghkull heals up and then continues his grand plans. It then actually sets up the rivalry to be used in the future.

ClockworkZion wrote:
 Apple Peel wrote:
I definitely feel that Ghaz has just outgrown Yarrick as an opponent. He’d definitely be interesting to have a tactical battle with, but Yarrick facing Ghazghkull would just be a retelling of a done story.

Honestly I agree with that. Yarrick is someone who pushes Ghaz on an intellectual level and having them face off mano a ork wouldn't really work on any level. Yarrick is a boss, don't get me wrong, but he's not winning a fist fight with Ghaz.


To be fair, in a realistic in any way setting, duels between commanding officers would not be the norm (yes I know this is 40k). A Yarrick vs Ghazghkull story would be more of a campaign rather than a battle, with a series of battles with both asserting dominance regionally before a big clash. It would be Yarrick trying to hold the line vs a combined arms and sophisticated ork force holding out for reinforcements, with Ghazghkull rushing in to strike the killing blow. Less a duel and more a human trying to hold out.

Then the Space Marines land and force Ghazghkull to withdraw, as he doesn't have the forces on hand to deal with both the Guard and the Space Marines. Yarrick wins in the sense that his forces held out, but just barely and with a huge body count, and he personally took a beating, while Ghazghkull wins in that once again he defeated Yarrick, who was only saved by the timely arrival of the marines. Have the fluff note that due to the high body count,and material costs of the theater of war is deemed untenable and thus the remaining imperial forces are forced to abandon the system to the Orks for the time being.
   
Made in gb
Walking Dead Wraithlord






interesting points have been raised.

Do we really need any explanations why we getting new models? I say nay.. I don't care for some shoehorned weak sauce garbage telling my why my dudes suddenly have new sculpts (or are a bit taller and have 2 wounds...)

They seemed to have really got hanged up on this big time with the whole primaris thing. It really doesn't make an iota of a difference to a lot of the fan base why new models as long as we get new(and better) models for our faction of choice.

Seems GW still suffers from the rampant "relaunch" culture to drive sales rick priestly talked about.

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/772746.page#10378083 - My progress/failblog painting blog thingy

Eldar- 4436 pts


AngryAngel80 wrote:
I don't know, when I see awesome rules, I'm like " Baby, your rules looking so fine. Maybe I gotta add you to my first strike battalion eh ? "


 Eonfuzz wrote:


I would much rather everyone have a half ass than no ass.


"A warrior does not seek fame and honour. They come to him as he humbly follows his path"  
   
Made in nz
Trigger-Happy Baal Predator Pilot



New Zealand

Yarrick should be permanently retired (with the rest of Guard characters). He was pulled out of retirement for Armageddon 3, so by now he will be ancient. If the Indominus (spelling?) Crusade was a couple of centuries most humans would have retired (permanent or otherwise).
   
 
Forum Index » News & Rumors
Go to: