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notprop wrote:To be fair Fraz the Battery power car (based upon a Lotus I believe) went into production this year and was featured on Top Gear as well.

It is also worth noting that they went through tree of them during testing because the batteries either failed or didn't last even half the time stated by the manufacturers.

Hydrogen will produce the most similar results to petrol, electric is still too limited.

Hybrids still seem like the first best step to a new cleaner power source to me.

Go Toyota! (if only they did brakes!)

500 not out! Well done me!

Technically it was released in 2008 (as was that episode of top gun if I recall) and the top gear guys either got a defective model or forgot to charge the car correctly because they were getting significantly under average with those vehicles (under the actual reported average which is 15-20% under the stated capacity of the company which is likely under ideal conditions). I love top gear, but they are far from a scientific or realistic testbed for vehicles (at least they didn't drive it across africa).

Heh, a hydrogen/electric flamewar. That's pretty cool.

In a real flame war, hydrogen always wins.

Toyota have released a hydrogen fuel cell car in Japan but it's very expensive.

"Little people" eh ..?

... I wasn't aware you had so many midgets over there...

..what a remarkably stupid thing to say in the circumstances.

notprop wrote:To be fair Fraz the Battery power car (based upon a Lotus I believe) went into production this year and was featured on Top Gear as well.

It is also worth noting that they went through tree of them during testing because the batteries either failed or didn't last even half the time stated by the manufacturers.

Hydrogen will produce the most similar results to petrol, electric is still too limited.

Hybrids still seem like the first best step to a new cleaner power source to me.

Go Toyota! (if only they did brakes!)

500 not out! Well done me!

Exactly. in the future batteries may be just fine, and the same infrastructure can generally support (MORE POWER!!! MUAHAHAHA!!!). At the current time hydrogen most replciates autos and maintains the lifestyle and is here, now. Its the infrstructure network that is the key.

Until that is mandated its all irrelevant. Cap and tax won't do it-its not designed to.

Vladsimpaler wrote:

Orlanth wrote:

Tyras wrote:With recent disclosures of BP internal e-mails from the ongoing investigation there have been several revelations that really make BP indefensible. While my previous posts backed up BP with my experience in the oilfield and how nobody knew exactly where fault laid, I have to retract my support for BP given this latest information.

What emails? I havent read them, and cant find them.

I think that he's quoting those emails that are often forwarded. Kind of like chain mail in a way.

No I'm talking about the internal e-mails referrenced here:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704324304575306800201158346.html

Edit: Circulating drilling fluid prior to coming out of hole is standard procedure. Even on small terrestrial wells they do it, why sombody to decided against circulating on a well a mile beneath the surface of the ocean is beyond me. A long string casing string doesn't make the well all that more dangerous on it's own, but combined with the choice to essentially go without cetralizers makes the casing an accident waiting to happen. Why bother hireing a third party contractor if you're not going to take their advice? I'm not going to say that these companies don't try to pull one over on each other from time to time, but it's a simple thing to figure out how many centralizers one needs for a given distance. Six centralizers over the course of a well that is probably 15K or so feet in total measured depth (curved length of the well) is a joke. These amongst other decisions made would probably get more attention in the press if more people understood the jargon and what the function of the equipment and processes mentioned and risks for skimping on them, other than the obvious 11 deaths and the worst environmental disaster in US history anyways.

The OPEC gas stations portion of the e-mail did come from one of the forwarder e-mails, but it is accurate, so I included it, as it was relevent to the discussion when people are talking about how they choose where they buy their gas from.