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what we have now?

GW reduced the retailer discount, but because GW is a buisness and the retailers are a hobby, they will just suck up the increase and not change the retail prices?

GW in addition increase the prices because "inflation" but this time the "with 20% discount it is still fine" does not apply as those greedy retailers don't give 20% discount any more?

tneva82 wrote:
Ever heard inflation?

yeah, this is an oil company level of excuse

- need to double the prices because of inflation
- need state aid because of bad economy
- Jobs are in danger if we don't raise prices and get aid
end of the year: making double the profit of last year

so being on the edge of bankruptcy and therefore not being able to swallow the "inflation" just means not being able to double the profit compared to last year

but of course, workers cannot get double the wages of last year because this would just increase inflation even more

this neo-liberal bs how the poor companies are and have hard times to double profits and therefore we need to accept the prices is one of the most stupid things I have seen in the last years

lost_lilliputian wrote:

 Sledgehammer wrote:

I'm willing to pay a premium if its desirable and the alternatives are not as appetizing. GW miniatures are quickly becoming more and more expensive (many miniatures are now double the price they were in 2014 when I started) while their direct and indirect competitors are quickly catching up in terms of quality. GW miniatures will sooner rather than later become valuable not for the quality in and of themselves, but for the IP that they are attached to. The only reason that the individual would care about that is if GW had a means with which to bar entry from the game to those that did not use official models. Hence GWs continued meddling in the tournament scene and "narrative" events. The rhetoric around "the hobby" is also psychologically designed in order to make you believe that GW is THE HOBBY.

Yep I can see an added value to an official GW miniature too. It guarantees a player entry to a tournament that runs a GW game.

Even where I live, in a regional area, there is one hobby store in town, an independent store, not a GW. Any tournament they run for a GW game, WH40k, Warcry, Kill Team, Blood Bowl etc they insist only GW miniatures are allowed. They refuse to allow non GW miniatures at all. Even a conversion must be from actual GW miniatures. They have even inspected minis for pick up casual games on a weekend to check for 3rd party parts, shoulder pads etc.

So for sure when an independent store (the only store in a whole town) holds such high standards and a huge commitment to GW, some people don't even think outside of GW for 'the hobby'.

Unfortunately after 5 years the store I've mentioned has now sadly decided to close down. By the end of Feb they will be gone. Will be interesting to see where our local gaming community go to play and how they respond.

That’s a lot of effort to tell people not to be in your store honestly, just knowing enough about GW miniatures over the years would be full time job for that.

But it is I think all feeding into a big GW divide, prices is only one thing. It’s also the whole ecosystem of the game. 40k is pricy and they want to sell a bunch of books, and terrain and everything. Even if the minis are good for plastic, the game I think is suffering as a rather lame product for its costs.

 kodos wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
Ever heard inflation?

yeah, this is an oil company level of excuse

- need to double the prices because of inflation
- need state aid because of bad economy
- Jobs are in danger if we don't raise prices and get aid
end of the year: making double the profit of last year

so being on the edge of bankruptcy and therefore not being able to swallow the "inflation" just means not being able to double the profit compared to last year

but of course, workers cannot get double the wages of last year because this would just increase inflation even more

this neo-liberal bs how the poor companies are and have hard times to double profits and therefore we need to accept the prices is one of the most stupid things I have seen in the last years

Pretty much.

After looking through the US prices, knight models seem to have taken a hammering with a whopping 19% on the big guys.

To any who haven't looked the combat patrols are another big causalty with a 17% increase.

Dudeface wrote:
After looking through the US prices, knight models seem to have taken a hammering with a whopping 19% on the big guys.

To any who haven't looked the combat patrols are another big causalty with a 17% increase.

They were clearly not priced correctly, then [/s]

 Albertorius wrote:

Dudeface wrote:
After looking through the US prices, knight models seem to have taken a hammering with a whopping 19% on the big guys.

To any who haven't looked the combat patrols are another big causalty with a 17% increase.

They were clearly not priced correctly, then [/s]

They're products that largely dodged the previous rises, so not a huge shock, but it's a big number on big items. Some people might stomach 19% on a comparatively cheap box, but the bigger prices going up the largest amount is just going to gate some people out of those. Like I said before, not a whinge, just an observation and it's down to the individual if they can or want to afford it.

The combat patrols have not existed long enough to dodge too many price rises, though.

 Albertorius wrote:
The combat patrols have not existed long enough to dodge too many price rises, though.

Coming up 3 years?

Dudeface wrote:

 Albertorius wrote:
The combat patrols have not existed long enough to dodge too many price rises, though.

Coming up 3 years?

As opposed to how many for the knights, now?

How about the Baneblades? Those did not dodge many price hikes, and just got a new one a couple months ago.

Warnings have been issued, kindly stay on topic and remain polite, thank you.

 Albertorius wrote:

How about the Baneblades? Those did not dodge many price hikes, and just got a new one a couple months ago.

Goes from $170 to $200.

 Undead_Love-Machine wrote:
Nobody *likes* the price increases, but this year they seem more justified than they normally are (to me, at least), mostly due to inflation.

On the flipside it's really easy to disregard the given justification because GW has a long history of raising prices frequently and above inflation regardless of the circumstances. You just know that if the current economic situation was all sunshine and lollipops, GW would still announce the same increase just without the pretext.

It's a part of why this price increase is bound to get so many negative reactions no matter how much it fits with the current climate. If GW was in the habit of keeping prices reasonably steady and only increased them sparingly and out of economic necessity, I expect you'd see a lot more people accept that GW has to respond to the current troubles to remain profitable. But with the company acting as it does, it's just business as usual with a plausible excuse tacked on for a change.

mikhaila wrote:Someone saw the canadian increases, and they were closer to 7%.

Canada has always been closer to UK pricing.

So either someone really, really screwd up the US pricing chart, or the article is only about the UK.

I'm also seeing price increase to 9.60 on the formerly 7.80 paint pots, and yet they specifiy that paints weren't going up. Who the feth knows.

A ten to twenty percent price rise does sound crazy, but as you say it doesn't match what we have already heard so I'm going to wait before passing judgement.

H.B.M.C. wrote:
"But GW is a business!"
"But these are luxury goods!"

I love how you think that you are scoring points by mocking facts. What next, the earth is flat?

H.B.M.C. wrote:
"It's not as expensive as gold collecting/diamond creation/amateur asteroid mining, so the prices are fine!"

Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Geifer wrote:

 Undead_Love-Machine wrote:
Nobody *likes* the price increases, but this year they seem more justified than they normally are (to me, at least), mostly due to inflation.

On the flipside it's really easy to disregard the given justification because GW has a long history of raising prices frequently and above inflation regardless of the circumstances. You just know that if the current economic situation was all sunshine and lollipops, GW would still announce the same increase just without the pretext.

It's a part of why this price increase is bound to get so many negative reactions no matter how much it fits with the current climate. If GW was in the habit of keeping prices reasonably steady and only increased them sparingly and out of economic necessity, I expect you'd see a lot more people accept that GW has to respond to the current troubles to remain profitable. But with the company acting as it does, it's just business as usual with a plausible excuse tacked on for a change.

Everything that you say is true, GW do increase prices year after year.

I'm just trying to be realistic about it, rather than get too emotionally involved.

They act as they do because they have to please shareholders, the only thing that matters to them is making money. I've accepted this, I don't see them as being some kind of altruistic being. EDIT: I'm not saying that you do.

I've justified the price rise this year because it seems more in line with inflation.

EDIT #2: Maybe I need to clarify again, nobody likes the price rises, but I've accepted what GW is.

Let's say inflation is, on average, 9%.

GW increasing prices on average 6%.

If your wage increased by 9%, you're getting a 3% discount.

If your wage didn't increase by 9% to match inflation, at least... then who is taking advantage of who and making their hobby harder to afford?

drbored wrote:
Let's say inflation is, on average, 9%.

GW increasing prices on average 6%.

If your wage increased by 9%, you're getting a 3% discount.

If your wage didn't increase by 9% to match inflation, at least... then who is taking advantage of who and making their hobby harder to afford?

Stop making logical arguments and challenging peoples indignant rage!

Just to be sure what GW is:

a greedy company that rather raise prices to keep the profit margin >40% rather than care fore "the hobby" or "the community" and let the margin decrease below 40%

can people stop caring about all those greedy customers and think at least once of all those poor shareholders and CEO's out there that are now on the edge of poverty because of the inflation and really those 40% margin to make a living

 kodos wrote:
Just to be sure what GW is:

a greedy company that rather raise prices to keep the profit margin >40% rather than care fore "the hobby" or "the community" and let the margin decrease below 40%

can people stop caring about all those greedy customers and think at least once of all those poor shareholders and CEO's out there that are now on the edge of poverty because of the inflation and really those 40% margin to make a living

I'm not sure who you are trying to convince here?

GW only cares about the community because without it they wouldn't make any money. Yes, of course.

There's nothing eye-opening about this.

 Undead_Love-Machine wrote:

 kodos wrote:
Just to be sure what GW is:

a greedy company that rather raise prices to keep the profit margin >40% rather than care fore "the hobby" or "the community" and let the margin decrease below 40%

can people stop caring about all those greedy customers and think at least once of all those poor shareholders and CEO's out there that are now on the edge of poverty because of the inflation and really those 40% margin to make a living

I'm not sure who you are trying to convince here?

GW only cares about the community because without it they wouldn't make any money. Yes, of course.

There's nothing eye-opening about this.

It's not surprising, I actually agree some companies could realistically make less money and still function better than they are now, but I'm not going to get angry about GW doing it when our energy providers have doubling record profits year on year.

GW is just one among many
but this is not a reason to exclude GW or have any sympathy here as "just accept what they are and go on"

because unlike the energy providers, GW is luxury

 Undead_Love-Machine wrote:

 kodos wrote:
Just to be sure what GW is:

a greedy company that rather raise prices to keep the profit margin >40% rather than care fore "the hobby" or "the community" and let the margin decrease below 40%

can people stop caring about all those greedy customers and think at least once of all those poor shareholders and CEO's out there that are now on the edge of poverty because of the inflation and really those 40% margin to make a living

I'm not sure who you are trying to convince here?

GW only cares about the community because without it they wouldn't make any money. Yes, of course.

There's nothing eye-opening about this.

On the flip side, the bargain bins at the hobby store and the ebay listings are absolutely littered with what remains of companies that 'cared for the community' but sadly never got quite around to caring for the bottom line. Miniature wargaming is still a tiny market, even as far as hobby markets go, and a couple of failed predicitions, missed launches or overly-high investments in the wrong product line can easily wipe out a company. I'd take an overly aggressive and greedy GW that exists over no GW at all, at least for now.

 kodos wrote:
GW is just one among many
but this is not a reason to exclude GW or have any sympathy here as "just accept what they are and go on"

because unlike the energy providers, GW is luxury

I need one of them to live and work, the other is a luxury product I don't have to buy if I can't afford it, they are not the same. One is gouging money and price out of human necessity and requirement, the other is milking a little extra for some toys, the level of reaction should not be the same.

kodos wrote:

because unlike the energy providers, GW is luxury

Oooh, be careful, HBMC might mock you for stating a fact!

Tsagualsa wrote:

 Undead_Love-Machine wrote:

 kodos wrote:
Just to be sure what GW is:

a greedy company that rather raise prices to keep the profit margin >40% rather than care fore "the hobby" or "the community" and let the margin decrease below 40%

can people stop caring about all those greedy customers and think at least once of all those poor shareholders and CEO's out there that are now on the edge of poverty because of the inflation and really those 40% margin to make a living

I'm not sure who you are trying to convince here?

GW only cares about the community because without it they wouldn't make any money. Yes, of course.

There's nothing eye-opening about this.

On the flip side, the bargain bins at the hobby store and the ebay listings are absolutely littered with what remains of companies that 'cared for the community' but sadly never got quite around to caring for the bottom line. Miniature wargaming is still a tiny market, even as far as hobby markets go, and a couple of failed predicitions, missed launches or overly-high investments in the wrong product line can easily wipe out a company. I'd take an overly aggressive and greedy GW that exists over no GW at all, at least for now.

Agreed. Cold, hard realism.

If GW's prices get too high they will have to adapt in some way, but until then they will not change their tactics.

GW are also not that aggressive either.

All their expansion is paid for from profits alone. This means they've expanded way slower than they could have if they'd taken out big loans and investors. They could have been hyper aggressive in the market and expanded like crazy.

Instead they choose to invest what money they earn into their various projects. Yes the profits they make go to managers and shareholders and staff pockets; but it also goes into their new factories, animations, models and such.

The result is that GW aren't sitting there with millions of debt repayments to make. It's one reason they are majorly resistant during economic slowdowns because they own and control so much of their operation internally. They can adjust to control their overheads and aren't left with a huge chunk that's at the whim of investors/banks.

drbored wrote:
If your wage didn't increase by 9% to match inflation, at least... then who is taking advantage of who and making their hobby harder to afford?

9%, hah. Over the last 5 years, I think my salary only went up by 3-4%, well below inflation.

Tsagualsa wrote:
On the flip side, the bargain bins at the hobby store and the ebay listings are absolutely littered with what remains of companies that 'cared for the community' but sadly never got quite around to caring for the bottom line.

There's little to suggest these failed companies didn't care about the bottom line. They were just worse at business, unlucky, or both. It's a difference in degree, not kind.

Time to buy now then, rush rush... Thats the Marketing speech here and happens every single year.
Not only in the past they increased prices above inflation they did it in a way to cash in extra sales before the hike. Win Win for them.

The only news here is that this time around (in the UK) its bellow inflation ( looks like US is going to take a hit).

I wonder why... Are they now feeling a slow return in sales in comparison with the covid period?
Have they crunched numbers and felt that saturation levels are to high?

I can imagine if they thought they could raise above inflation... they would!

Interesting.

They might finally feel comfortable after the previous price increase and the wholesale increase. This time, if they don't increase as much as inflation, people will forget that the other things happened.

 NAVARRO wrote:
Time to buy now then, rush rush... Thats the Marketing speech here and happens every single year.
Not only in the past they increased prices above inflation they did it in a way to cash in extra sales before the hike. Win Win for them.

The only news here is that this time around (in the UK) its bellow inflation ( looks like US is going to take a hit).

I wonder why... Are they now feeling a slow return in sales in comparison with the covid period?
Have they crunched numbers and felt that saturation levels are to high?

I can imagine if they thought they could raise above inflation... they would!

Interesting.

Not to go to far into the political, but the general cost-of-living-situation in the UK is absolutely dire due to the multiple impacts of Brexit, Covid, the War and ofc. the resulting energy prices. Going even as far as raising prices just in accordance with inflation would have meant an increase north of 11%, and could easily have led to a significant backlash. 6% is still a lot, but is probably seen as 'not so bad' compared to the numbers people are forced to getting used to.

Dudeface wrote:
After looking through the US prices, knight models seem to have taken a hammering with a whopping 19% on the big guys.

To any who haven't looked the combat patrols are another big causalty with a 17% increase.

Yikes..
17% for start collecting is absurd considering it IS the entry product.

 Robert Facepalmer wrote:

 Albertorius wrote:

How about the Baneblades? Those did not dodge many price hikes, and just got a new one a couple months ago.

Goes from $170 to $200.

Well then ^^

Not Online!!! wrote:
17% for start collecting is absurd considering it IS the entry product.

Well, GW's building a barrier to entry. And they're going to make us pay for it.