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Made in au
Regular Dakkanaut




Ok, so i decided to build a ork army, fearing DE might not be around much longer. I mainly play 1000 point matchs.
Im a In your face, assault you sorta person
So i will list a few questions

Sluggas and Choppa or Shootas?
Power klaw or Big chopper on nobs?
Take a sag?
Would a Weird Boy/Warphead be worth the points?
Are Bikes worth the points or would i be better with more boyz on truckz?
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




Hmm you raise a number of questions I'll do what I can to answer them.

the question about bikes.. don't bother!!! they're just terrible all the way around (I have a bunch and they're sidelined unfortunately due to their poor LD and losing the fearless goodness)

as far as nobz.. power klaws 100% of the time... big choppa allows armor saves.

now for the rest of it there are a couple of schools of thought here.

do you want to go shooty or do you want to go hand to hand?? would you like to do a mix?

the other question is if you want to footslog it or do you want to take trukks.... this decision matters more than you think.

the SAG PWNS I mean it really does. I can't stress enough how good ap2 ordinance is for orks.

lootas are also really really strong!!!!

if you are going on foot.. take shootas. stormboyz will do plenty of assault killage for you with their CRAZY movement.

if you are going in trukks.. you could do either. I play KOS and have had success in new codex with 2 trukks of sluggas, one of shootas, and one of nobz.

here are a couple suggested 1000 pts lists that you can build without having to go far on the conversion list (i.e. warboss on bike.. great unit but expensive in points and no specific model)

foot sloggage:

Mek With SAG,

Lootas (15)

Shoota Boyz (25) 2 rokkits, nob w/ klaw

Shoota Boyz (25) 2 rokkits, nob w/ klaw

Stormboyz (20) Nob Klaw, bosspole

81 models, 1000 pts exactly

you could try to figure out some math with trukk mobz.. but I find taking less that 4 is troublesome due to anti tank and that is hard to fit into 1000 points neatly. this force above should give you plenty of models and TONS of firepower which is unusual for orks.

NaZ



This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2008/01/14 04:35:27


 
   
Made in us
Ragin' Ork Dreadnought




Monarchy of TBD

Given your preferences, I'm not sure the SAG will fit your style. Coming as you are from a DE background, I imagine that Kult of Speed, or a mostly mounted force, will be the smoothest transition. At 1,000 points, probably 1 squad of stormboyz and 2 trukks will be a pretty assaulty in your face army. I'm not a fan of the shooter. They are worlds better than they were in the last codex, but they still play to the weakest part of the ork statline. A unit of boyz in trukks can advance 24" one turn to suitable cover, then pop out on turn 2, Waaagh! and cover 21-26 inches to get into assault. With the reinforced rams, you can basically ignore the dangerous terrain checks, letting you ride the trukks right through any cover your opponent's hiding behind.
The disadvantages to this tactic are that you don't have a lot of boyz to absorb mistakes. A mob of shootas will slowly and implacably walk towards the enemy, generally losing most of the unit on the way in. That being said, even without most of the unit you'll probably reach the enemy lines with as many boyz as you would on the trukk assault.
If you are running big foot slogger units, then the warpheads are a must. The extra waagh speeds you up 1/3 of the time, although you do have to sacrifice your shooting to take advantage of it. I have yet to run the SAG.
I highly recommend building a warboss on bike. While he may be a heft hunk of points, he is a nightmare in CC, and ridiculously fast. With careful positioning, he can usually avoid a hidden powerfist on the charge and devastate a unit.
That's my own, very biased opinion.

Klawz-Ramming is a subset of citrus fruit?
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Made in us
Dakka Veteran




warboss on bike is a KILLER model. incredible move and killyness in close combat.

I'm personally an advocate though of running him with a nob squad and a painboy. its like hitting someone with a roundhouse punch and they are DURABLE.. even when the trukk gets popped they can waagh and still get in 13-18 inches of move into assault. its hard to get away from them. w/ eavy armor, cybork bodies you're looking at 4+ 5+inv FNP and multi wounds. great stats in CC and a few klaws. hasn't failed me so far

I play KOS.. and use a bunch of trukks rather than a footslogging hoard. I will tell you if you make mistakes KOS loses BADLY.

however, I have yet to be displeased by a squad of lootas, a SAG, and a 20 man squad of stormboyz. they do a substantial amount of damage. in a smaller game, you are better off with the smaller mobs of shootas rather than 3 trukks.. since you're not fielding a tank or something it ends up being a better move. (a battlewagon draws a lot of fire.. even if you lose the ordinance it gives your trukks time to close with the enemy)

if you wanted, you could scrap out some of the boyz to put in a warphead (take the shoota mobs down to 20) or scrub an additional few stormboyz and add a mek with KFF to cover your shootas moving upfield. (I don't think you need to)

this army has 4 rokkits as you advance, stormboy nob is str 9 on the charge and can handle a tank easily. the lootas will put out a TON of str 7 shots to wipe out smaller squads or put the hurt on transports, skimmers, etc.

and never underestimate the AP 2 goodness of a SAG. you drop that on a squad and even at low str your chances to wound are good. a bit unpredictable but what can you do.

I just ment this as a starting point. a footslogging hoard will give you plenty of flexibility and a high model count. if you want to sqeeze in a mek with KFF or a warphead it shouldnt be hard to do.

if you do plan on going trukks, good luck figuring out how to make it even points, but what I find really successful:

trukk w/ ram, red paint, rokkit
slugga boyz (12) (or shoota boyz)
1 w/ rokkit
nob w/ pklaw, bosspole

2 rokkits to shoot at dreads or whatnot. I've taken a trukk squad and beaten down oblits, dreadnaughts, some other stuff. take your 25" fast move into area terrain (remember you get to reroll dangerous tests with the ram) then move your 13" get out and assault something.

now honestly I have almost equal success with the shootas or the sluggas and I run some of each.

sometimes shootas coming out of a trukk are BETTER because of that glorious shooting range. not to mention that being open topped you don't have to get out of the trukk to blast someone if they are beyond assault range... something sluggas CAN'T do.

I would NOT take sluggas if you are going to walk upfield.. the stormboyz should do plenty. In several games recently I've been able to assault on TURN 1 because they moved towards me and I rolled a 5 or 6 for my movement. coming within 24" of stormboyz (within up to 30!!! after the first turn because of waagh) is flatout dangerous.

hope this is helpful. at the very least get yourself the lootas and the stormboyz. you'll use both squads A LOT no matter how you go with your army and they'll win you plenty of games.

NaZ

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2008/01/14 04:11:19


 
   
Made in au
Regular Dakkanaut




Thanks for all the Info. Now i'm used to using some heavy weapons, as i normally run 2 to 3 Dark Lance Snipe squads. I'm not a foot slogger sort of person either, i run wychs in raiders and hope for some 1s (12 inch assault move)

Now, i was looking in the ork codex, and i noticed the boyz have the same leadership as bikerz when in smaller groups, would a nob with a boss pole and being at max strength help?

Another question is - What are good heavy support choices Killer Kans or Deff Dreads?
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




the LD issue is why you need to take 20+ shoota boyz if you are going to footslog.

I have great success with my trukk boyz, but you have to be VERY careful with them. if the trukk gets popped before the squad can get close enough to assault they're pretty much dead.

stormboy rules let you roll a D6 and add that to movement every turn. including the waagh move after turn 1 they have the ability to assault a MINIMUM of 20" a max of 30" in a single set of moves.

if you are running foot sloggers, its a 2 wave approach so your stormboyz hit first, then the sloggers come up for seconds.

as far as heavy weapons goes. the lootas may be an elite slot.. but they're one of your best shooty options. they have CRAZY range and up to 45 str 7 shots
(note you'll be lucky to get 10-15 hits on the deal)

beyond that, orks don't really have a single super shooty squad (flash gitz don't count) to make up for that you either footslog and take as many rokkits as you're allowed, or you take a rokkit on the trukk and one in the squad. it may take you 3-4 shots to hit something but thats orks for you.


if you are going to footslog then kans are better than dreads, use the KMB on two and equip one with a big shoota and extra armor, give em all grot riggers.

if you are going to take trukks, then deffkoptas are actually a better choice. they have GREAT movement and can have TL rokkits which is better firepower.

if you are taking a SAG, having a battle wagon with killcannon is a great addition. ordinance gets around the low BS so its all good

this may sound odd but orks are actually almost better at dealing with armor in CC than shooting. a warboss or a nob can and will tear a tank in half if they get to assault it.

if you're not going to take the mek w/ SAG, build a warboss on bike and he'll tear stuff up on his own.

I suppose you could look at tankbustas, but they can't take a transport and have glory hogs which limits their effectiveness.

there is a thread in the tactics forum dakka ork tactica development. I'd go read it.. its a good evaluation of all of the units.

NaZ
   
Made in au
Regular Dakkanaut




Thanks NaZ and Gitzbitah for your input, and I'm having a look at the tactics forum now.
   
Made in ie
Joined the Military for Authentic Experience






Nuremberg

Just pointing out that the Stormboys can't use the waaagh as they are jump infantry. But they are still a fantastic unit.

I love trukk mobs. Take them 12 strong, and with a Nob. After that there's a few ways to equip them. I favour red paint job and rokkits on your trukks. This gives your opponent something to worry about with the trukk. If you're going in trukks, I reckon sluggas are better, but there are arguments both ways.
The biker boss is great, and it's not too hard to convert. I basically slapped extra wheels on the side of one of the new warbikes to make it a trike, and gave him Ghaz's powerklaw. (I used the warboss with the squig, because in that configuration he gets 7 attacks on the charge!) I had to clip off his loin cloth thing, but after that he sits nicely on the bike. Minimal effort and it looks good, and adds much needed tank hunting ability to your army.
I hope you enjoy playing with the new orks, and don't sell your Dark Eldar yet, there may be hope!

   
Made in au
Regular Dakkanaut




i am keeping my DE, but preparing just in case. Anyway, this is what i'm looking at so far

WarBoss
Warbike
Power Klaw
Attack Squig
(thinking twin linked shooter but does bike have weapons?)

140 Pts

Weird Boy
55 Pts

Elites

2 * Loota Boyz (5 Boyz)
150 Pts

Troops

Shooter Boyz (20 Boyz)
120 Pts

2 * Trukkerz (12 Boyz)
Nob
Power klaw
Boss Pole
Red Paint Job
Reinforced Ram
314 Pts

Fast Attack

Storm Boyz (15 Boyz)
Nob
Power klaw
Boss Pole

Pts total 999
Model Count = 73

Any Advice? Is it Balanced?
   
Made in us
Battlefortress Driver with Krusha Wheel






Frankly I would drop one of the trukk units and max out your loota squad at 15 (dont put them in groups of 5, they will run on the first casualty) and use the rest of the points left to either buy 3 deffkoptas, or some kannons for grots to shoot with. If you go that route spend the rest on more shoota boyz.

warhammer 40k mmo. If I can drive an ork trukk into the back of a space marine dread and explode in a fireball of epic, I can die happy!

8k points
3k points
3k points
Admech 2.5k points
 
   
Made in us
Impassive Inquisitorial Interrogator





Hooper

I would give the boss a cybork body for that 5+ save in close combat. I agree about the lootas they need to be bigger to be effective.

Same with the storm boys they should be 20 strong if your gonna only run one squad. The shootas i would drop cause everything but them and the wierd boy is mobile and they will be left behind. You could drop the lootas and throw the shootas in a trukk if you want to keep them, that would leave you with some points left over for some rokkits with the shootas or something else. Also the boss doesnt need a shoota the bike has the dakkaguns.

Also i think stormboys are classified as infnatry but move like jump infantry. Not sure though im at work and dont have the dex with me?


This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2008/01/16 16:42:07




This is silly! Buttons are not how one escapes dungeons! I would smash the button and rain beatings liberally down on the wizard for playing such a trick!


 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Cherry Hill, NJ

As the others have said loots any smaller than 12 is a waist. They need to be in large numbers to be effective and to be able to soak up some shooing before they run off the board.
   
 
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