Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I just received this email as part of the monthly newsletter:

On the day we signed the agreement to license Warhammer from Games Workshop, I promised them that we would create a great and glorious game, a truly next-generation MMORPG. Today, I have news to report; we are going to delay the release of WAR until Fall 2008. While we do not expect this announcement to be met with fanfare and cheering crowds; the additional time will be spent hammering WAR into an even better game that it is today.

During the most recent phase of beta testing, two things have become clear. One was that our key innovations - Public Quests, Tome of Knowledge and Realm vs. Realm combat - were all coming along extremely well, as was the first stage of our innovative crafting system. The second, that the game would benefit from additional iteration time as well as adding a layer of polish or two. Fortunately, as part of Electronic Arts, we are able to do just that.

While I have no doubt that the community will experience a wide range of emotions over this decision, I urge you to remember one thing (and to keep the tar cold and the feathers on the birds), that our goal has never been to release a game by a certain date but to release a great Warhammer MMORPG. We have not wavered from this goal and with the full support of Games Workshop, GOA and Electronic Arts we intend to release a glorious next-generation MMORPG.

As always, I thank the community for its support, patronage and its patience.

Mark Jacobs
VP, GM EA Mythic

Well I have mixed feelings about it...but i guess i am glad they want a quality product before they release it.

Hey I don't mind if it becomes a better game in the end. Usually when these things occur I'm the beta though so I would know how much help its gonna be. Unfortunately this beta is one of the few I have missed out on and so I can't draw my own conclusions. :(

But look at it this way. EA is known for not supporting their games after launch so as far as I am concerned the more time they take to get it right before release, the less I have to worry about EA leaving me hanging with an unsupported buggy game in a universe I love.

Keep up the hard work Mythic I'll still be buying the game whenever it comes out.

Does anyone know if Mythic has optioned the 40K MMORPG? If so, I really hope this sort of "unexpected extension" doesn't risk a 40K MMO ever getting developed.

http://www.gamespot.com/news/6166560.html

Anyway, this gives me more time to paint minis and
level a guy in WoW. I can live with that.

I'm fine with this. I'm sick of MMO's launching and having a ton of bugs. More of an extended BETA testing where people pay to test the game. See: SWG

A little polish goes a long way toward making a sharp game.

Korcheski wrote:Fortunately, as part of Electronic Arts, we are able to do just that.

*falls off chair laughing*

Yeah, ok. EA sure never rushes incomplete beta versions of games onto shelves. Nup. Never...

BYE

I don't recall EA producing anything incomplete from the past few years, HB. Sims, Sims 2, Battlefield/2/2142, and Societies worked pretty well out of the box.

As long as it's before Christmas. Need that Jolly Fat Man to bring me something!

Who cares if it is being delayed?

Why Bother with it when Fallout 3 is coming soon...

er...nevermind, it has been delayed just a long and will probably be delayed just like W.H.O.

I still think they should call it World of Warhammer.

And I cannot wait for the comments of 'They ripped off WOW' to come about when the game's released. They're almost as funny as the 'They ripped off Starcraft' comments you get when SC fans whine about 40K...

BYE

H.B.M.C. wrote:I still think they should call it World of Warhammer.

And I cannot wait for the comments of 'They ripped off WOW[i]' to come about when the game's released. They're almost as funny as the '[i]They ripped off Starcraft' comments you get when SC fans whine about 40K...

BYE

Obligatory response:

EA may own Mythic, but Mythic is still making the game. The simple fact that Mythic is pushing the game back shows that EA does not have the control over this game that people think they do.

If it was EALA, they would have a set date and have to meet it, little moving it back (if at all). Friend of mine works for EA and that's certainly the way he makes it sound.

Yeah, I had a friend of mine who worked for EA as well and he had similar stories. I'm sure the EA project managers overseeing Mythic's work on this were NOT thrilled about the news.

Ahtman beat me to it! Darn getting distracted and delayed by work...

Korcheski wrote: The second, that the game would benefit from additional iteration time as well as adding a layer of polish or two. Fortunately, as part of Electronic Arts, we are able to do just that.

Dont understand how layers of polish people can make this game better.
Yeah, its always the polish people. Sick of those silly jokes about my country.

My personal opinion is that WAR will need to be a spectacular game upon release in order to get a sizable share of the market. Most other MMORPGs that have been released are so poor in quality or lack large amounts of content upon release that they are basically still born. Tabula Rasa is a prime example of a game that was released with too many bugs and not enough content. WAR is also an EA game, which as with Blizzard, gives the association of slow and/or poor post release support. EA doesn't put out quality games like Blizzard and therefore, won't get as much slack as Blizzard is given by the player base.

With the upcoming release of the WoW expansion WotLK and Age of Conan coming out, WAR has to avoid several pitfalls that could cause the game huge problems and thus a lack of player base. WoW took advantage of a stagnent mark and made a quality game that was easily accessable by most players. Most MMOs at WoWs release were huge grind and campfests that took forever to level to max. They also were still bug and raft with imbalance.

WAR needs to accomplish all of the following in order to be successful from what I can tell.

- Released with no game breaking bugs. Players need to be able to play easily and not be stopped by bugs or instability.
- Released either 2 months or more prior to WotLK or 4 or more months after WotLK. Releasing closer to WotLK's release date will drastically drop the market share as most people won't buy both games as the same time. I don't think WotLK will be good enough to extend beyond the 4 month mark in have to play popularity. Either way, releasing before WotLK will be the best.
- Release with a clearly defined end game and with the content in the game.
- Casual friendly in leveling speed and item reward.
- Hardcore friendly in that effort spent getting an item is reflected in it's usefulness/power (currently broken in WoW).
- Carrot doesn't move drastically every quarter (currently a WoW problem)
- Class balance within 3 months of release in all aspects of the game, it is a PvP game after all
- Ability to run on the "average" system.
- Classes need unique and diverse abilities as well as being fun to play and not overly complicated. Player knowledge of the class and game mechanics should have some aspect in their performance, but there shouldn't be huge gaps between really good players and average players.
- Crafting system that's not trivial (Tabula Rasa) or overly important (SWG)
- Auction House
- Good customer service

It's a long and rather detailed list, but with the current state of WoW, any MMORPG that wants to pull a large portion of the WoW player base is going to have to touch all these points. Failure to do so will result in failure.

From what I've seen in Beta so far, WAR looks to be the only MMORPG coming out any time soon that has even a remote possibility of being a WOW killer ( well, competitor, there is no killing it). There are things I dont like about it, but it actually may be those very things that will appeal to people. Also, I've never liked WoW so my observations may be as much due to bias as anything else....I don't claim perfect objectivity here.

Some reasons:

First and foremost, WAR has a background that is already familiar to some gamers. I doubt that it has no where near the recognition that the Warcraft universe has, but it does matter.

Mythic has a very long history. They have some very popular MUDs that are still running today, and have been running for over 10 years I believe. When it gets right down to it, a MMORPG ( at least in the tradition of Everquest, which is the same model WoW uses ) is essentially a MUD with more props.

There is already a solid player base from DAoC.

DAoC was one of the few games of this type ever produced that launched without any major glitches. UO had them, Everquest had them, and I understand that WoW had them. That means that the company has a history of releasing a polished and complete product from the get-go.

There will be consensual PvP.

Without going into too much detail, I think that the RvR in WAR will change some of the things in DAoC that could occasionally make it tedious.

WAR has a ad campaign that is viral in nature. I believe it will simultaneously reach a large number of potential customers while feeling more "indie" than something else like a superbowl commercial.

The background is ultimately similar to what people are used to from WOW.


One thing that I wonder about is what sort of hardware they are going to expect the customer to have. I honestly think that was one of the big reasons that WOW was so successful; They produced a game that could run on an average computer that was still visually appealing.

If WO is as good as WOW, it'll die a painful death. For an MMO to work nowerdays it can't be as good as WOW, it has to be better than WOW, in every way.

BYE

H.B.M.C. wrote:If WO is as good as WOW, it'll die a painful death. For an MMO to work nowerdays it can't be as good as WOW, it has to be better than WOW, in every way.

BYE

How so?

World PvP is a start.

I meant the better than wow statement.

H.B.M.C. wrote:If WO is as good as WOW, it'll die a painful death. For an MMO to work nowerdays it can't be as good as WOW, it has to be better than WOW, in every way.

BYE

I disagree. While I'm sure any developer would *like* to see their product sell as well as WoW did, it isn't necessary to have that level of success to have a viable, profitable project. Ultima online and Everquest were both considered shockingly successful and I think they peaked at around half a million subscribers. There are several good, fun MMORPGs out there that are still turning a profit but don't have near the numbers WoW has. Everquest II, DAoC, City of Heroes, Eve Online ( Especially that one).

WAR is going to do just fine. The guys at Mythic know what they are doing and now that they have an EA sized budget they can really put together a masterpiece. The games that have been released lately were done either by people new to the industry (Turbine, you bastards) or bitter angry little men (Vanguard, I'm looking at you). As successful as WoW is it's still not anywhere near the biggest MMO out there. There's almost 16 million people playing Lineage II and China has an MMO (forget the name) that has over 10 million subscribers. WoW is just very successful here in the states.

The only thing that is going to drive me nuts is all the people who are going to claim that the world/creatures/everything is a rip-off of the Warcraft world, but oh well. I'll be ordering the Collector's Edition.

Stormtrooper X wrote:WAR is going to do just fine. The guys at Mythic know what they are doing and now that they have an EA sized budget they can really put together a masterpiece. The games that have been released lately were done either by people new to the industry (Turbine, you bastards) or bitter angry little men (Vanguard, I'm looking at you). As successful as WoW is it's still not anywhere near the biggest MMO out there. There's almost 16 million people playing Lineage II and China has an MMO (forget the name) that has over 10 million subscribers. WoW is just very successful here in the states.

The only thing that is going to drive me nuts is all the people who are going to claim that the world/creatures/everything is a rip-off of the Warcraft world, but oh well. I'll be ordering the Collector's Edition.

I believe the name of the Chinese MMO is something like MU online.

stonefox wrote:World PvP is a start.

I seem to remember reading something that the main emphasis on the game is coordinated group/world pvp.. whereas WOW is a linear adventure/level up etc, I believe that PVP will be a main factor in leveling in WAR.. now, that info is a year old, so who knows now.

two_heads_talking wrote:

stonefox wrote:World PvP is a start.

I seem to remember reading something that the main emphasis on the game is coordinated group/world pvp.. whereas WOW is a linear adventure/level up etc, I believe that PVP will be a main factor in leveling in WAR.. now, that info is a year old, so who knows now.

That is true. WAR is almost all about PvP. You can level exclusively off of PvP if you want. Now there will be PvE content as well. Mythic stated that PvE has been done before and doesn't need to be "perfected" like PvP does.

My question is how much instanced pvp
will go on that will draw away from world/
realm pvp.

GrimTeef wrote:EA may own Mythic, but Mythic is still making the game. The simple fact that Mythic is pushing the game back shows that EA does not have the control over this game that people think they do.

I work in the video game field (Designer) and I can attest that it doesn't work that way. Honestly, it SHOULD, but it doesn't. If they were SMART they wouldn't. The controlling parent will always have producers that want to leave their mark; so management can say, "*I* came up with that idea". Many producers don't play games. It's meddeling but it happens ALL the time. You would think that if a company bought another company because they liked what was being produced (a lot), then they wouldn't screw with it. Yet that's exactly what happens.

Summary: Yes, Mythic is making the game, but EA's management will have it's input. It's just a matter of how much and what it is.

That said, I've preordered the CE edition. If for nothing else, I'll get an artbook (!) and a ltd. ed figure (!!!).

The reason WAR has to be better than WOW is that all MMOs are in direct competition with eachother.


People play more than one console or PC game at a time.

The vast majority of people only play one MMO at a time, so you have to tear people away from WOW to get them to have even a chance of staying with your game. Current players have so much invested in their current MMO it's hard to pull them away, so other games syphon off the discontent first and even that's not easy.

As for the Lineage numbers, I'm pretty sure those are exaggerated but it is very hard to tell.