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Made in us
Nimble Ellyrian Reaver



Longmont, Co

With the core upgrades we got more fun. Not more better. My metta thought that day of.

More units got synergy to make them playable. Doesn’t fix our weaker mechanics such as protocols and reanimation.

We were never going to jump up a tier, was quality of life.

The points drops will help but really we should be hoping for a supplement. Would be easy to fix some things that cannot be fixed with a points drop.

Crusher stampede is giving me a half chub. Gw just slapped on two of the biggest buffs in the game of -1dmg and 5++ across the board. Massive game changer. Well not the biggest buffs (-1 to wound) but very substantial.

Core is good, points drops will be good, a supplement is going to be our game changer.

In the meantime we get to git good with our uphill battles.

Honestly not having to wait 5+ years for a new book has me optimistic about our current power level. Things will get fixed. Hopefully. Reasonable to expect imo.

All of the things. Most of the time. 
   
Made in us
Freaky Flayed One






Cauthon wrote:
Honestly not having to wait 5+ years for a new book has me optimistic about our current power level. Things will get fixed. Hopefully. Reasonable to expect imo.


Not to be a debbie downer but I honestly don't think it's reasonable to expect much of anything from GW. Their track record for correcting imbalance is woefully underwhelming and slow. They seem to be of the opinion that it's just easier not to try and instead to wait for a new edition. I definitely want to see a serious revisit to some of the most basic and fundamental parts of our codex that are lacking but I seriously doubt that anything of note will happen in 9th edition.

8000 
   
Made in us
Nimble Ellyrian Reaver



Longmont, Co

There was this thing that came out pretty recently called a data slate. There are also these new things called armies of renown.

I don’t think opinions can be wrong but you’re pretty close.

All of the things. Most of the time. 
   
Made in de
Prescient Cryptek of Eternity






Germany

The core change didnt help at all.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/01/14 08:25:38


 
   
Made in pl
Been Around the Block






A lot of Necron unit got "core" keyword. How it did not help? Seriously.
For example Technomancer can now reanimate Wraiths, and all type of Destroyers.
With 1CP can reanime two models (one per different unit) per turn.
   
Made in de
Prescient Cryptek of Eternity






Germany

He can only reanimate when at least one model is still there. No reanimation when the unit is gone. Only dumb opponents will kill models from multiple units, which are in range of a technomancer. The goal is to wipe out one unit, to prevent reanimation.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/14 12:00:17


 
   
Made in ch
Irked Necron Immortal




Switzerland

 p5freak wrote:
He can only reanimate when at least one model is still there. No reanimation when the unit is gone. Only dumb opponents will kill models from multiple units, which are in range of a technomancer. The goal is to wipe out one unit, to prevent reanimation.

correct

Necron abilities are upside, not strategies.
   
Made in pl
Been Around the Block






So you got large bonus but still are upset that core army mechanics can be negated and call it "no help at all". ok, got it.
   
Made in ch
Irked Necron Immortal




Switzerland

 Xyxel wrote:
So you got large bonus but still are upset that core army mechanics can be negated and call it "no help at all". ok, got it.

it's not a large bonus... the core mechanic is only relevant if you take things like Overlords...
The Destroyer Lords don't really care about core in the first place, they mostly do their own thing.
And the Technomancers/Anrakyr I mentioned.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/14 15:15:31


 
   
Made in de
Prescient Cryptek of Eternity






Germany

 Xyxel wrote:
So you got large bonus but still are upset that core army mechanics can be negated and call it "no help at all". ok, got it.


What large bonus ? Its no problem to wipe out any core unit (except 20 warriors) in two turns. Some even die in one turn.
   
Made in us
Nimble Ellyrian Reaver



Longmont, Co


If it takes two turns.....what exactly is the problem with that? Nightbringer can be killed in two turns, does that mean necrodermis is trash because your opponent can play around it? MAKE THEM play around it. MAKE THEM have to focus fire one squad at a time. TELL him that if you don’t wipe that squad I’m bringing dudes back, you can make that work for you.

Just because an opponent is smart or not doesn’t mean they can always just one shot all of our units every time.

What CANT be killed in two turns?

Saying strategies don’t work because opponent arnt dumb is extremely defeatist.

What does it take to wipe a 6 man wraith unit?

Warriors have 20’wounds at t4 and are lucky to get a save.

Wraiths have 18 wounds at t5 with a 4++.

The wraiths are cheaper.

Saying smart opponents pick up a squad at a time is assuming YOURE not a smart opponent either.


If you push wraiths up a flank he may not be able to shoot them with much of his army.

If they wipe one squad of wraiths do they just call that a shooting phase? Are they not going to put any shots into your other squad because they might not 1 shot the squad?

You could hide one or two in terrain, if they killed four wraiths they can no longer target the last two that are hidden.

If you can’t keep a unit of wraiths alive it’s your own fault. 14” move on turn one means they can deploy back and still get where they need to.

If you start up and have a 6 inch pregame move to either hide in terrain or move up the board... if you have 20 inches of move and can’t find some cover that’s a you problem.

Smart opponents are not able to counter every strategy every time.

Being able to be veiled, orb’d, rerolling charges, relentless March, technomancer’d and prismatic dimensional breach is a large bonus. That’s a fact.

Saying everything gets picked up every time is non sensical. Ppl have to roll dice, play objectives, shoot at what they can get in range of, target priority.

So if a unit of Tsons termies can one shot a unit of wraiths, that sucks. You got to roll your invulns and it didn’t work out. No reanimation. Sucks.

If he can do the same to say a tyranofex does that mean a 5+ fnp and -1 dmg are rules that arnt worth having? Is the tyranofex trash because it can get one shot? Maybe you just need to be careful? Maybe some games it will do great and others it will just disappear? Maybe take 2!


The game has to be played.

People have better things to do than worry about making sure we can’t reanimate.

All of the things. Most of the time. 
   
Made in us
Big Mek in Kustom Dragster with Soopa-Gun





Nebraska, USA

Issue is vast majority of the core benefits are still blocked by that stupid command phase.
Virtually every dirty tactic i can think of falls flat on its face when i remember the timing doesnt work, because for some stupid reason all buffs happen in the command phase BEFORE anything moves, disembarks, or arrives from reserves.
So next to nothing involving Core actually matters unless it sat there for a turn and somehow is both A) still in range to do the nasty deed and B) didnt get obliterated before the nasty deed could happen.

i hate the command phase so much.

An ork with an idea tends to end with a bang.

14000pts Big 'n Bad Orkz
6000pts Admech/Knights
7500pts Necron Goldboys 
   
Made in us
Nimble Ellyrian Reaver



Longmont, Co

Plus my will be done. Pretty good buff.

All of the things. Most of the time. 
   
Made in us
Big Mek in Kustom Dragster with Soopa-Gun





Nebraska, USA

Thats like the ONE real boon, as Lokhusts generally are always on the table and out of danger so easily buffed.
Other being the +1Str applies to Core, which is massive for Flayed Ones.

Outside that...either not really a benefit or cannot happen until a full turn too late.

An ork with an idea tends to end with a bang.

14000pts Big 'n Bad Orkz
6000pts Admech/Knights
7500pts Necron Goldboys 
   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




Cauthon wrote:
Plus my will be done. Pretty good buff.


The Core buff was definitely a help. However Necrons have precious little access to reliable S8+, reliable damage weapons and their weapons generally do not have great damage output. I still maintain that what Necrons need is to have their equipment reviewed so they have better access to none damage 1 weapons. Making the Doomstalker damage D3+3 would be a good start but really we need some affordable S8+ guns which aren't mounted on costly units like Monoliths, Doomscythes etc. Command Protocols needs reworking, some units (Reanimator) need a serious reboot. So yeah, core was good but it does not fix the faction.
   
Made in us
Nimble Ellyrian Reaver



Longmont, Co

If nothing that has core really matters what are you building a list out of?

There are definite flaws in the book. Things that havnt been fixed with core and won’t be fixed with points alone.

That would be the end of story but the possibility of a supplement is real.

You guys act like you’d just rather not even have the core buff and it’ll be 5 years before we get a new rule.

It got my praetorians on the table. That’s dope

Wraiths are amazing now.

Is there one single person that thinks we are a tournament winning army now? Nobody is arguing that.

Be happy with what you got and hope for more. .


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Cheers

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/15 01:14:28


All of the things. Most of the time. 
   
Made in ch
Irked Necron Immortal




Switzerland

Cauthon wrote:
If nothing that has core really matters what are you building a list out of?

Cheers
Destroyers for example, some do C'Tan spam
   
Made in us
Big Mek in Kustom Dragster with Soopa-Gun





Nebraska, USA

i'm not saying its totally worthless im saying in the end it barely did anything due to the stupid command phase.

An ork with an idea tends to end with a bang.

14000pts Big 'n Bad Orkz
6000pts Admech/Knights
7500pts Necron Goldboys 
   
Made in ch
Irked Necron Immortal




Switzerland

So core is relevant for:
- Lord of the Pyrrhian Legions (1 per Army)
- The Lord's Will
- My will be done
- Relentless March
- Rites of Reanimation
- Adaptive Strategy
- Veil of Darkness (1 per army)
- Various Transports
- Some Stratagems
- The Phaeron of the Stars/Blades
- Mechanical Augmentation (best on Praetorians)

Some of the HQ buffs come at a hefty point cost. Veil of Darkness got the biggest buff I think, since its 0 points.

Overlords are expensive.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/01/15 09:05:27


 
   
Made in gb
Proud Triarch Praetorian





I've only played one game since the Core changes, and I must say a CCB + a Cloak Technomancer following & bufing a 6-man unit of Lokhusts up the board was ridiculous.

Single-handedly that unit wiped roughly 900 points across three turns



Next time I intend on doubling down on that midgame lump, by adding a unit of Skorpekh to the mix, and adding a Chronomancer for the Skorpekhs

I might even try buying MWBD twice on the CCB if I do that.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I guess what I'm trying to say is I think unit wise Destroyers are the biggest winners of the Core change.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/15 12:58:12


Experience is something you get just after you need it
The Narkos Dynasty - 15k
Iron Hands - 12k
The Shadewatch - 3k
Cadmus Outriders - 4k
Alpha Legion Raiders - 3k  
   
Made in ch
Irked Necron Immortal




Switzerland

 IHateNids wrote:
I've only played one game since the Core changes, and I must say a CCB + a Cloak Technomancer following & bufing a 6-man unit of Lokhusts up the board was ridiculous.

Single-handedly that unit wiped roughly 900 points across three turns



Next time I intend on doubling down on that midgame lump, by adding a unit of Skorpekh to the mix, and adding a Chronomancer for the Skorpekhs

I might even try buying MWBD twice on the CCB if I do that.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I guess what I'm trying to say is I think unit wise Destroyers are the biggest winners of the Core change.

I think 9 Lokhust without HQ CCB would be more damage.
   
Made in de
Ladies Love the Vibro-Cannon Operator






Hamburg

But Wraiths and Lychguard could work very well in concert.
For this, use the 6'' pregame move such that Wraiths could charge asap with Lychguard behind.
Next round, Wraiths withdraw charging forward and let Lychguard
charge the unit left blank by the Wraiths to finish it off.

Former moderator 40kOnline

Lanchester's square law - please obey in list building!

Illumini: "And thank you for not finishing your post with a "" I'm sorry, but after 7200 's that has to be the most annoying sign-off ever."

Armies: Eldar, Necrons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights; World Eaters (30k); Bloodbound; Cryx, Circle, Cyriss 
   
Made in ch
Irked Necron Immortal




Switzerland

looking at the units I keep thinking what if I had 3 maxed units of dire avengers.
   
Made in de
Fresh-Faced New User




From my experience with this edition Wraith really suffer from the 4+ WS. Core buff allows you to buff them with the CCB at least, but then you need more or less to dedicate the ccb to it. Canoptek Control Node is way too slow to keep up with Wraiths.

I also agree on the fact that you have to plan with multiples of a unit to make it work. A lonely LHD will be erased within seconds f.e., Canoptek Spyders scale way too good with buffs to just use a unit of 1, Stalkers and DDA’s are not reliable enough with the Heavy D6 profile to hope that 1 can take down any tank.
   
Made in de
Prescient Cryptek of Eternity






Germany

charles_the_dead_lizzard wrote:
From my experience with this edition Wraith really suffer from the 4+ WS.


No, they dont. 3 attacks on 3+ is 2 hits. 4 attacks on 4+ is 2 hits.
   
Made in pl
Been Around the Block






5 attacks with Novokh stratagem
3+ to hit if flying Technomancer will advance after them for buff and ressurection and d3 healing.
+1 to Charge and +1 to AP if any charge (-3AP) in Novokh so they murder MEQs nicely. gakky thou if they fight with 3+W oponents or dreads with damage reduction.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2022/01/17 12:37:24


 
   
Made in de
Ladies Love the Vibro-Cannon Operator






Hamburg

 p5freak wrote:
charles_the_dead_lizzard wrote:
From my experience with this edition Wraith really suffer from the 4+ WS.


No, they dont. 3 attacks on 3+ is 2 hits. 4 attacks on 4+ is 2 hits.

Right.

Wraiths were never a killy unit, also not in previous editions.
But they can hold up enemy units and also withdraw without penalty.
This makes them a versatile unit.

Former moderator 40kOnline

Lanchester's square law - please obey in list building!

Illumini: "And thank you for not finishing your post with a "" I'm sorry, but after 7200 's that has to be the most annoying sign-off ever."

Armies: Eldar, Necrons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights; World Eaters (30k); Bloodbound; Cryx, Circle, Cyriss 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Is anyone using Praetorians and having even a small bit of success? I need to get on assembling my 20 lychguard/triarchs and want to make at least 5 of them.
   
Made in dk
Pyro Pilot of a Triach Stalker






caladancid wrote:
Is anyone using Praetorians and having even a small bit of success? I need to get on assembling my 20 lychguard/triarchs and want to make at least 5 of them.

2 wins and 1 loss in casual games with 2x10 rod of covenant Praetorians in a Silent King list. Silent King means a lot, especially against T5+. I think you should make 10 Praetorians, Lychguard are not a thing I would want to spam.
   
Made in ch
Irked Necron Immortal




Switzerland

caladancid wrote:
Is anyone using Praetorians and having even a small bit of success? I need to get on assembling my 20 lychguard/triarchs and want to make at least 5 of them.

point changes might come soon, just wait a week

Edit: Wraithguard is another reason for whips on wraiths

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/18 10:58:50


 
   
 
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