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Hey all

Just messing around with army builder and Eldar seer councils, I came up with this list and wanted to see what you all thought.

2000 Pts - Eldar Roster - Unnamed

HQ: Eldrad Ulthran (1#, 210 Pts)
1 Eldrad Ulthran @ 210 Pts
Psyker; Doom ; Eldritch Storm ; Fortune ; Guide ; Mind War ; Divination; Fleet; Independent Character; Ghost Helm (GH); Rune Armour (RAmr); Runes of Warding (RofWard); Runes of Witnessing (RofWit); Spirit Stones (P:SpStn); Shuriken Pistol (Sp); Witchblade (WB); Staff of Ulthamar (SofU)

HQ: Warlock Unit (8#, 340 Pts)
1 Warlock Unit @ 340 Pts
1 Warlock @ [25] Pts
Psyker; Fleet; Rune Armour (RAmr); Shuriken Pistol (Sp); Witchblade (WB)
1 Warlock @ [25] Pts
Psyker; Fleet; Rune Armour (RAmr); Shuriken Pistol (Sp); Witchblade (WB)
1 Warlock @ [25] Pts
Psyker; Fleet; Rune Armour (RAmr); Shuriken Pistol (Sp); Witchblade (WB)
1 Warlock @ [25] Pts
Psyker; Fleet; Rune Armour (RAmr); Shuriken Pistol (Sp); Witchblade (WB)
1 Warlock @ [30] Pts
Psyker; Embolden ; Fleet; Rune Armour (RAmr); Shuriken Pistol (Sp); Witchblade (WB)
1 Warlock @ [40] Pts
Psyker; Enhance ; Fleet; Rune Armour (RAmr); Shuriken Pistol (Sp); Witchblade (WB)
1 Warlock @ [25] Pts
Psyker; Fleet; Rune Armour (RAmr); Shuriken Pistol (Sp); Witchblade (WB)
1 Wave Serpent @ [145] Pts
Energy Field (Wave Serpent); Spirit Stone (V:SpStn); TL Shuriken Catapult (TL-Scat); TL Bright Lances (TL-BL)

HQ: Farseer (1#, 160 Pts)
1 Farseer @ 160 Pts
Unit Type: Jetbike Infantry; Psyker; Doom ; Fortune ; Turbo-boosters; Ghost Helm (GH); Rune Armour (RAmr); Spirit Stones (P:SpStn); Eldar Jetbike (EJB); Shuriken Pistol (Sp); Witchblade (WB); TL Shuriken Catapult (TL-Scat) (x1)

HQ: Warlock Unit (8#, 383 Pts)
1 Warlock Unit @ 383 Pts
1 Warlock @ [45] Pts
Unit Type: Jetbike Infantry; Psyker; Turbo-boosters; Rune Armour (RAmr); Eldar Jetbike (EJB); Shuriken Pistol (Sp); Witchblade (WB); TL Shuriken Catapult (TL-Scat) (x1)
1 Warlock @ [45] Pts
Unit Type: Jetbike Infantry; Psyker; Turbo-boosters; Rune Armour (RAmr); Eldar Jetbike (EJB); Shuriken Pistol (Sp); Witchblade (WB); TL Shuriken Catapult (TL-Scat) (x1)
1 Warlock @ [45] Pts
Unit Type: Jetbike Infantry; Psyker; Turbo-boosters; Rune Armour (RAmr); Eldar Jetbike (EJB); Shuriken Pistol (Sp); Witchblade (WB); TL Shuriken Catapult (TL-Scat) (x1)
1 Warlock @ [45] Pts
Unit Type: Jetbike Infantry; Psyker; Turbo-boosters; Rune Armour (RAmr); Eldar Jetbike (EJB); Shuriken Pistol (Sp); Witchblade (WB); TL Shuriken Catapult (TL-Scat) (x1)
1 Warlock @ [48] Pts
Unit Type: Jetbike Infantry; Psyker; Turbo-boosters; Rune Armour (RAmr); Eldar Jetbike (EJB); Shuriken Pistol (Sp); Singing Spear (SSpr); TL Shuriken Catapult (TL-Scat) (x1)
1 Warlock @ [50] Pts
Unit Type: Jetbike Infantry; Psyker; Embolden ; Turbo-boosters; Rune Armour (RAmr); Eldar Jetbike (EJB); Shuriken Pistol (Sp); Witchblade (WB); TL Shuriken Catapult (TL-Scat) (x1)
1 Warlock @ [60] Pts
Unit Type: Jetbike Infantry; Psyker; Enhance ; Turbo-boosters; Rune Armour (RAmr); Eldar Jetbike (EJB); Shuriken Pistol (Sp); Witchblade (WB); TL Shuriken Catapult (TL-Scat) (x1)
1 Warlock @ [45] Pts
Unit Type: Jetbike Infantry; Psyker; Turbo-boosters; Rune Armour (RAmr); Eldar Jetbike (EJB); Shuriken Pistol (Sp); Witchblade (WB); TL Shuriken Catapult (TL-Scat) (x1)

Troops: Guardian Squad (12#, 242 Pts)
0 Guardian Squad @ 242 Pts
Fleet
10 G Storm Squad @ [92] Pts
Close Combat Weapon; Shuriken Pistol (Sp); Flamer (x2)
1 Warlock @ [35] Pts
Psyker; Destructor ; Fleet; Rune Armour (RAmr); Shuriken Pistol (Sp); Witchblade (WB)
1 Wave Serpent @ [115] Pts
Energy Field (Wave Serpent); TL Shuriken Catapult (TL-Scat); TL Scatter Laser(TL-SctL)

Troops: Guardian Jetbike Squadron (3#, 66 Pts)
3 Guardian Jetbike Squadron @ 66 Pts
Unit Type: Jetbike Infantry; Turbo-boosters; Eldar Jetbike (EJB); TL Shuriken Catapult (TL-Scat) (x3)

Heavy Support: Fire Prism (1#, 115 Pts)
1 Fire Prism @ 115 Pts
TL Shuriken Catapult (TL-Scat); Prism Cannon (PC)

Heavy Support: Fire Prism (1#, 115 Pts)
1 Fire Prism @ 115 Pts
TL Shuriken Catapult (TL-Scat); Prism Cannon (PC)

Heavy Support: Fire Prism (1#, 115 Pts)
1 Fire Prism @ 115 Pts
TL Shuriken Catapult (TL-Scat); Prism Cannon (PC)

Elite: Harlequin Troupe (10#, 254 Pts)
8 Harlequin Troupe @ 254 Pts
Fleet; Flip Belts; Furious Charge; Hit & Run; Holo-Suit (H-S); Close Combat Weapon (x3); Harlequins Kiss (Hkiss) (x5); Shuriken Pistol (x8); Hallucinogen Grenades
1 Harle Shadow Seer @ [52] Pts
Psyker; Veil Of Tears ; Fleet; Flip Belts; Furious Charge; Hit & Run; Holo-Suit (H-S); Harlequins Kiss (Hkiss); Shuriken Pistol (Sp); Hallucinogen Grenades
1 Harle Troupe Master @ [38] Pts
Fleet; Flip Belts; Furious Charge; Hit & Run; Holo-Suit (H-S); Close Combat Weapon; Shuriken Pistol (Sp); Hallucinogen Grenades

Total Roster Cost: 2000

Everything is pretty self explanitory. Pick a flank and run up. Harlies steal the SG serpent, while the owners sit back on my objective waiting to flame.

I have a feeling some might say the generic seer is overkill on powers with eldrad but we will see.

Thanks!

Its hard to read. A Seer Council needs embolden and enhance (twice). Keep in mind that a Seer Council is an anvil unit, its not a hammer unit. This is where the Harlies come in. However, you are low on troops.

Well I figured the storm guardians sitting on home base with three flamers would be good for defending it, then the three bikes could at some point run out if they needed to. They are just there to grab home again if somehting back happens.

I have no doubts I can contest the other objective with this list and thats all I need to do.

Two troop units may suffice for scoring purposes. But then you need to mount them in Serpents for protection. A small Jetbike squad is a gamble since it can hardly be hidden.

Hmm that will take some juggling then.

Do you feel its even worth working with or should I start over.

I'd say drop the harlies. With two councils, you have loaded a ton of points into elite HtH units already, you need more troops. Perhaps even get rid of a prism as well.

Grab some Dire Avengers, and if you plan on a ulthwe army, just call them black guardians.

Yes, replace the Harlies by a Serpent mounted Storm Guardian or Dire Avenger squad.

I think it's more than mildly inaccurate to call a council an "anvil" unit as opposed to a "hammer" unit. They are versatile and choppy enough to perform either role effectively.

My group has played a LOT of Eldar games recently. Here are some details:

GUARDIANS:

Regular Guradians are only bad in 3 settings, shooting assault and taking objectives...

Guardians are complete junk, Guardians without the avatar to make them fearless are even worse. Never play foot guardians ever. Especially not a 240 point squad of them, yikes. Get guardian jetbike squads instead with a warlock that has destructor, and a shuriken cannon, much better for OBJ grabbing, a very important thing.

Are those 10 T3 5sv 3 flamer guys worth 240 points and 2 KP? Nope, for those 240 points you could field about 4 basic 3 man jetbike squads, or 2 nice ones with warlocks with spears and destructor, still have the movement and flamer powers and be way better off with an extra scoring unit or more.

PRISM CANNONS:

Eldar tanks have totally flipped around, get rid of all 3 prism cannons, they have nowhere near the combat ability they use to, they use to be nearly imune to assault, now they get rear armor hits on 4s most of the time. They use to be very durable, but now, they just go down right away, if they move fast enough to get a decent save they dont get to shoot which is as good as stunning them anyway, take anything else.

If you are stuck on playing the fire prisms (say you have the models) for the love of god play the spirit stone and the holofield on them so they have a chance to not explode, 2 dice pick the lowest on hits and ignoring no movve results is really worth the points.

HARLEQUINS:

In our games the no new assaults kill this unit completely, when they charge in and win, they sit there in the next turn after they obliterate what they charged and then they die. Way to expensive of a unit for that. Its a fun shock unit and it sure looks cool but is is incredibly difficult to play. Against the rhino armies, they just have no chance, they get blasted by a rhino dump flamer/bolter way to easily which is very common now.

Good luck, the Eldar players in my group (including me) have yet to win a game in our 5 test games or so in 5th. It's been a tough time none of the Eldar tricks seem to work so well anymore. The seer council is probably the only good (non character) unit in the book now...

PS

@ZMC agreed!

naked prisms are 115 pts; that's pretty cheap for a unit that can outrange most anti tank weapons and has anti: light infantry, heavy infanty and tank capabilities.

Agustus, I think you may have just had some bad experiences. I completely disagree with all of your statements.

Guardians are not useless at all. They have specific uses and I never hit the table without 30 of them as I play a mostly infantry horde eldar. When combined with the avatar fearless guardians can be a pain in the butt for armies that expect to kill whole squads based on combat results from a few good hits. Guardians when they get in range can do a serious amount of damage with 2 str 4 shots each and a charge with 2 st 3 attacks that go simo or before most opponents.

In this list I aggre with you and think the storm guardian squads are not the right choice though. Regular guardian squads or dire avengers are much better at holding a point and providng covering fire.

No grave tank is the uber that it used to be. That's a fact now. Upgrades were mandatory before, that hasn't changed either. All tanks but land raiders are now worse off in combat as well. However, fire prisms are still an awesome tank that can be used to devestating effect. Many armies are very uneasy about STR 9 templates. The general boosts to armor effect skimmers too, and while more vulnerable to combat they are now better at shaking off damage. They can get neutralized by weapon destroyed results, but they can then be used for tank shocking and enemy movement herding.

Harelquins are still an awesome unit. They need to be used with more skill now than their old point and click approach, but they can be vital at neutralizing potent enemy threats that are worth far more than they are. A unit of 6 harlies with kises is only around 150 or 160 points. They can kill 400 point teminator squads, nob squads, tough to kill things like plaguebearers of nurgle, MC, and any other host of expensive targets that your other units might struggle with.

Scorps are better than ever, and the ycan easily win and cause enough casualties to cause non fearless units to flee. Crack shot is the bane of models hiding in cover.. maugen ra is now better than ever before. And if you have viseted any oher threads in this forum you have seen seen steleks and many others overuse of the seer council. They are BROKEN GOOD. I don't favor that playstyle, but if winning is your goal there are a lot of options in the eldar codex.


Break the old point and click molds and you will find eldar is a very strong army in the new edition. Hopefully I have not come accros argumentitive as that was not my intention. I love the eldar army and it is fun and very viable in 5th edition, and I hope my perspective can help counter what you have seen in your local setting.

To the OP : I really have no idea how this army would run as I don't like the bike locks and have never used them. My guess is that it would own some armies that don't have enough shots or attacks to get through your re-rollable invul saves. If you try it I would suggest switching out the storm guardians for a defender squad with scat laser or for dire avengers, or like Agustus suggests bigger and more useful bike squads.

Fire prisms definitely require a more delicate touch than they used to. I always go x3 Fire Prisms in 5th though, since falcons got neutered (moreso than prisms) and wraithlords are only good if your whole army is tarpit themed.

After thinking about this list more, I agree with all of your negative points. Its got hard stuff but will probably hit like a kitten.

I will disagree about the holo field point though. I dont take them because its such an expensive upgrade and it just means your chances of having your gun blown up are higher.

I would normally keep them deep in cover anyway. If I cant shoot one turn I can always combine fire.

GMMStudios wrote:I will disagree about the holo field point though. I dont take them because its such an expensive upgrade and it just means your chances of having your gun blown up are higher.

Good God, people, why do I keep hearing this? It's like a 3.5% increase. Does that devalue 35 points that make the chances of it getting destroyed practically nil? Don't listen to everything you hear.

Harlies< just about everything in a mech list. Their strength is in the Shadowseer--the near impunity of being shot out of 24". After that, they're like paper. Scorpions are a much better buy for mech.

Just to let you know, the Flamers are a waste on the foot Storm Guardians. They'll get lit in a turn or so at this points level. Let them keep their transport, and let the Harlies footslog it if you feel you MUST keep them in the list.

Holo-field = mandatory.

A prism that is not destroyed is not giving up KP's, and can still contest objectives, whether or not it has it's gun.

A destroyed prism is...well....destroyed.

Weigh it.