Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

 Crazy_Carnifex wrote:

 Easy E wrote:
Finally saw it so now I can participate.

Spoiler:

I walked out to the movie happy, but it slowly dawned on me once the credits started rolling that I had been sold a bill of goods. if i wanted to see Star Wars: A New Hope, I could go back and watch my DVD of it whenever I wanted. Why did I just spend money to come see this? It was a cut up version of the original one, with the scenes swapped around.

To me, the only interesting parts were with Han and Chewie dealing with the gangs. Why? Because that at least showed me something potentially new, a different story for Star Wars than I had seen before. Hate on the Prequels/Clone Wars all you want but at least those were new Star Wars stories in the Star Wars Universe.

This is coming off harsher than it should. I had fun at the theater and was excited to see Tie Fighters and Storm Troopers in action again. It was fun seeing new quasi-jedi in action. However, I just wish I could have seen something less safe, less by committee, and more original. In a way, Abrams did exactly what he always does. He teases something new and different but in the end it is the same old genre cliches.

In the end, my money is on Rey being Ren's Brother and a secret twin that Luke hid away as Yoda and Ben had done to Leia and himself. He sensed the danger. I hope I am wrong. Since I had the rest of the "big twists" figured out and i avoided spoilers and trailers like the plague.

Hey, Rey being Rens Brother would, in fact, count as a twist.

And even more of a twist if they're twins, considering there's supposed to be a 10-year age gap.

Where do we get the age gap from?

So Leia banged Lando after she seperated from Han? Theres a theory going around that Lando is Finn's father...

 Easy E wrote:
Finally saw it so now I can participate.

Spoiler:

I walked out to the movie happy, but it slowly dawned on me once the credits started rolling that I had been sold a bill of goods. if i wanted to see Star Wars: A New Hope, I could go back and watch my DVD of it whenever I wanted. Why did I just spend money to come see this? It was a cut up version of the original one, with the scenes swapped around.

To me, the only interesting parts were with Han and Chewie dealing with the gangs. Why? Because that at least showed me something potentially new, a different story for Star Wars than I had seen before. Hate on the Prequels/Clone Wars all you want but at least those were new Star Wars stories in the Star Wars Universe.

This is coming off harsher than it should. I had fun at the theater and was excited to see Tie Fighters and Storm Troopers in action again. It was fun seeing new quasi-jedi in action. However, I just wish I could have seen something less safe, less by committee, and more original. In a way, Abrams did exactly what he always does. He teases something new and different but in the end it is the same old genre cliches.

In the end, my money is on Rey being Ren's Brother and a secret twin that Luke hid away as Yoda and Ben had done to Leia and himself. He sensed the danger. I hope I am wrong. Since I had the rest of the "big twists" figured out and i avoided spoilers and trailers like the plague.

That my feeling TBH, Abrahms and disney didnt need to play it safe, the movie was gonna make mone anyway, kids where gonna beg their parents to see it. hell, on pre-sales alone the movie made 1 billion in PROFIT alone. The movie didnt need to feel so safe.

Thats just stupid. The only two black guys in star wars end up being related.

 Easy E wrote:
Where do we get the age gap from?

Spoiler:

Bigger twist, FINN is Rey's fraternal brother and also the unknown son of Han and Leia!

 Grey Templar wrote:

Spoiler:

Thats really dumb. How would Han and Leia not know they actually had twins?

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:

 Grey Templar wrote:

Spoiler:

Thats really dumb. How would Han and Leia not know they actually had twins?

Spoiler:

Because Han was off smuggling at the time of birth, and Leia was knocked out on some good meds?

 Grey Templar wrote:

Spoiler:

In order for that to happen she would need to have been abducted or something. And why not just take both babies? And does nobody in Star Wars do some examinations of the baby during pregnancy where they would have discovered there were twins?

 Grey Templar wrote:
Thats just stupid. The only two black guys in star wars end up being related.

 Easy E wrote:
Where do we get the age gap from?

Spoiler:

Bigger twist, FINN is Rey's fraternal brother and also the unknown son of Han and Leia!

Spoiler:

Thats really dumb. How would Han and Leia not know they actually had twins?

Unknown to the viewers, not Han and Leia.

Maz Kanata asks han "Who's the girl?". Then the film cuts away from Han. Moments later, Maz is dashing off to find Rey, and out of breath, she tells Rey "The Force is calling to you".

If she's not Han and Leia's daughter, she's Luke's daughter, and they know exactly who she is.

Yeah, Maz definitely knows exactly who Rey is. I am just going to go on record as Rey is NOT Luke's daughter. That is my speculation.

Finn and Rey are secretly twins from that time Han convinced Leia to allow a three way with Lando, and they'll both be Jedi.

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:
So Leia banged Lando after she seperated from Han? Theres a theory going around that Lando is Finn's father...

Finn talks about being torn from his family.

Billy Dee Williams is alive and well, and played Lando in a 2015 episode of Star Wars Rebels.

In response to "only two black dudes in Star Wars"...you guys forget about Mace Windu? There are at least 3!

 timetowaste85 wrote:
In response to "only two black dudes in Star Wars"...you guys forget about Mace Windu? There are at least 3!

Of course. How could I forget him

He's probably Lando's great uncle though

Wasn't there a brief shot of a black pilot at the battle of Endor or did he bite it there too?

Hmm, maybe. Most of those close ups were of pilots dying.

Most of the pilots shown died I think. Grizz Frix was this guys name in the book. Dies hitting the super star destroyer (just before the Asian kicks it I think).

Someone from Lucasfilm spilled the beans regarding the age.

http://www.jedinews.co.uk/news/news.aspx?newsID=24935

Rey is clearly not meant to be 29 or 30. So it appears that the characters' actual ages are in the ballpark of their actors' ages.

Rey might very well be a younger daughter. Han appears to know her, and in fact it's strongly suggested he tells Maz who she is. But while he appears to be warm to her, do you really think that it's the warmth of a father meeting his long-lost daughter? It's clearly less weighty than that, and compare the lack of intensity there to what went down on the bridge with Ren.

It could be uncle-y warmth, perhaps. Or even something a little less than that...the warmth toward a friend's daughter?

But the way I see it, the closing scene was FAR more confrontational and intense than Han and Rey's meeting. That scene was all about the past (represented by the lightsaber but embodied in Rey) arriving to confront a man who's spent years hiding from the world, plagued by guilt. Also consider how she saw Luke's location in her dreams. It's him she's being drawn to, not Han or Leia. And note that Leia for some reason sends Rey on the mission to find Luke. She's sending the girl to go meet her father.

And it sure seems to me that Rey's climb and confrontation has strong parallels in intensity, theme, and certain details to Luke's climb up the steps in Cloud City to finally confront his long-lost father, with the same lightsaber in hand (albeit with different intent). Don't be surprised if we get something like "I am your father" in the next film.

 gorgon wrote:


It could be uncle-y warmth, perhaps. Or even something a little less than that...the warmth toward a friend's daughter?

But the way I see it, the closing scene was FAR more confrontational and intense than Han and Rey's meeting. That scene was all about the past (represented by the lightsaber but embodied in Rey) arriving to confront a man who's spent years hiding from the world, plagued by guilt. Also consider how she saw Luke's location in her dreams. It's him she's being drawn to, not Han or Leia. And note that Leia for some reason sends Rey on the mission to find Luke. She's sending the girl to go meet her father.

And it sure seems to me that Rey's climb and confrontation has strong parallels in intensity, theme, and certain details to Luke's climb up the steps in Cloud City to finally confront his long-lost father, with the same lightsaber in hand (albeit with different intent). Don't be surprised if we get something like "I am your father" in the next film.

Yup. I expected some divergence, but figured they would somewhat follow print canon regarding the Skywalker and Solo family lines.

I don't even think they need a quote. Just like in ESB when Luke sees himself in the Vader helmet on Dagobah.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
That my feeling TBH, Abrahms and disney didnt need to play it safe, the movie was gonna make mone anyway, kids where gonna beg their parents to see it. hell, on pre-sales alone the movie made 1 billion in PROFIT alone. The movie didnt need to feel so safe.

'Need to'? Not per say, but they were always going to. They paid 4 billion for the franchise, but that's nothing compared to the billions they (Disney) are planing to make over the next few decades. They weren't going to risk screwing the pooch in their opening play, however small that risk may be. And with the prequels hanging over their heads it's hardly surprising they where so keen to 'get back to the roots' of the franchise. It was a safe film with the primary goal of reminding the audience how much they enjoyed the originals, and I'm not gona hate Disney for that.

 gorgon wrote:
Someone from Lucasfilm spilled the beans regarding the age.

http://www.jedinews.co.uk/news/news.aspx?newsID=24935

Rey is clearly not meant to be 29 or 30. So it appears that the characters' actual ages are in the ballpark of their actors' ages.

Rey might very well be a younger daughter. Han appears to know her, and in fact it's strongly suggested he tells Maz who she is. But while he appears to be warm to her, do you really think that it's the warmth of a father meeting his long-lost daughter? It's clearly less weighty than that, and compare the lack of intensity there to what went down on the bridge with Ren.

It could be uncle-y warmth, perhaps. Or even something a little less than that...the warmth toward a friend's daughter?

But the way I see it, the closing scene was FAR more confrontational and intense than Han and Rey's meeting. That scene was all about the past (represented by the lightsaber but embodied in Rey) arriving to confront a man who's spent years hiding from the world, plagued by guilt. Also consider how she saw Luke's location in her dreams. It's him she's being drawn to, not Han or Leia. And note that Leia for some reason sends Rey on the mission to find Luke. She's sending the girl to go meet her father.

And it sure seems to me that Rey's climb and confrontation has strong parallels in intensity, theme, and certain details to Luke's climb up the steps in Cloud City to finally confront his long-lost father, with the same lightsaber in hand (albeit with different intent). Don't be surprised if we get something like "I am your father" in the next film.

That all makes sense.

Now, to argue a point because.... reasons! Jedi aren't supposed to have family as it leads to problems, as Luke himself can attest too. Therefore, why would he make the same mistake as his father by having a kid?

What are you basing this "Han seems to know her" stuff on? I watched the film and he didn't seem to know her from Finn at first. Now, after they have had an adventure or two things look a bit different. He can recognize talent.

Of course Luke is haunted by the past when he sees that Lighsaber. It is full of history for him, and anyone carrying it would have gotten the same response. He could just as well be flashing back to his first meeting of Yoda for all we know. (On a side note, they should have ended the film with them leaving the Resistance Planet and saved the rest for the next movie). Everything you pointed to is based on your interpretation of what you saw, not what we actually saw on screen.

To summarize, there is no more evidence that Rey is Luke's daughter than there is of her being Leia's daughter.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Grey Templar wrote:

 timetowaste85 wrote:
In response to "only two black dudes in Star Wars"...you guys forget about Mace Windu? There are at least 3!

Of course. How could I forget him

He's probably Lando's great uncle though

Maybe 3 black guys. But we all know that Mon Calamari was related to Ackbar and that Sullustian pilot was related to Nien Nub. It is the Star wars way!

The Mon Calamari and Sullustain were Ackbar and Nubn, actually...

Which incidentally means Nien fought and survived both the Second Death Star and Starkiller Base! Who's the best pilot in the Resistance now, Dameron?

Maz is force sensitive no? Explains why she comes running after super force vision exposition happens.

 Paradigm wrote:
The Mon Calamari and Sullustain were Ackbar and Nubn, actually...

Which incidentally means Nien fought and survived both the Second Death Star and Starkiller Base! Who's the best pilot in the Resistance now, Dameron?

Wow, the truth is even lamer than what I came up with.

Ackbar doesn't look a day over 30, much less having fought in the Battle for Endor 30 years ago! Who does his Nip/Tuck?

Akbar moisturises a lot.

I saw the fiilm today and enjoyed it, though I felt it was a bit long. The ending scenes with the fight in the forest were a necessary antidote to the "death star" scene being the final major fight scene. Maybe they should have cut one of the earlier acts shorter.

I liked all the characters and actors except Hux, who simply was too young and timid to have the gravitas necessary to be a top ranking general.

The silver plated captain could have been used more. She was only in about three short scenes.

Every time I heard the name Po I envisaged the famous Tellytubby.

The silver plated captain could have been used more. She was only in about three short scenes.

She should have been the one to kick Finn's ass, not the nameless Stormtrooper. And then get blasted through the air by Chewie's bowcaster but survive, albeit severely wounded and angry, would have established her as a badass and popular villain. Then early on in Episode 8, we see her recovering from her wounds (broken back etc) but shes refusing to rest and take it it easy, wanting to rush her recovery and get back to duty. That would have helped set up a vendetta arc between Phasma and the traitor Finn, because now its personal.

So far the only cool thing about her is the chrome armour.

 Easy E wrote:

That all makes sense.

Now, to argue a point because.... reasons! Jedi aren't supposed to have family as it leads to problems, as Luke himself can attest too. Therefore, why would he make the same mistake as his father by having a kid?

Because banning love and marriage worked so well the last time around?

I'm not an EU guy, but wasn't it a thing in the EU that Luke did away with all of that in the rebooted Jedi because he thought that suppressing those relationships just led to more problems?

Everything you pointed to is based on your interpretation of what you saw, not what we actually saw on screen.

To summarize, there is no more evidence that Rey is Luke's daughter than there is of her being Leia's daughter.

All meaning ultimately lies with the reader/viewer. My views on the matter are formed from a combination of Occam's Razor, knowing how writers tend to craft storylines, the fact that themes of family -- especially fathers and children and the redemption that can come from those relationships -- are clearly themes in the overall franchise, and my sense that the movie's repetition of elements from the original trilogy is a very intentional decision by the creators to suggest that certain CYCLES are repeating.

So sure, that end scene could literally mean *anything*, including some kind of commentary on the Crimean War if that's how the viewer interprets it. But personally I think of all the possibilities, the one with the best chance of being what the writers intended is that this is Luke's lost daughter, a wild talent that grew up on a desert planet like he and his father did, sent by Leia to heal his soul and bring him back.

 gorgon wrote:
But personally I think of all the possibilities, the one with the best chance of being what the writers intended is that this is Luke's lost daughter, a wild talent that grew up on a desert planet like he and his father did, sent by Leia to heal his soul and bring him back.

I agree with all of that, EXCEPT being Luke's daughter.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:

The silver plated captain could have been used more. She was only in about three short scenes.

She should have been the one to kick Finn's ass, not the nameless Stormtrooper. And then get blasted through the air by Chewie's bowcaster but survive, albeit severely wounded and angry, would have established her as a badass and popular villain. Then early on in Episode 8, we see her recovering from her wounds (broken back etc) but shes refusing to rest and take it it easy, wanting to rush her recovery and get back to duty. That would have helped set up a vendetta arc between Phasma and the traitor Finn, because now its personal.

So far the only cool thing about her is the chrome armour.

Absolutely YES! As is Phatma is useless and eclipsed by nameless stormtrooper with a stun baton.

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:

The silver plated captain could have been used more. She was only in about three short scenes.

She should have been the one to kick Finn's ass, not the nameless Stormtrooper. And then get blasted through the air by Chewie's bowcaster but survive, albeit severely wounded and angry, would have established her as a badass and popular villain. Then early on in Episode 8, we see her recovering from her wounds (broken back etc) but shes refusing to rest and take it it easy, wanting to rush her recovery and get back to duty. That would have helped set up a vendetta arc between Phasma and the traitor Finn, because now its personal.

So far the only cool thing about her is the chrome armour.

This would have been brilliant. You need to be the writer.

 Frazzled wrote:

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:

The silver plated captain could have been used more. She was only in about three short scenes.

She should have been the one to kick Finn's ass, not the nameless Stormtrooper. And then get blasted through the air by Chewie's bowcaster but survive, albeit severely wounded and angry, would have established her as a badass and popular villain. Then early on in Episode 8, we see her recovering from her wounds (broken back etc) but shes refusing to rest and take it it easy, wanting to rush her recovery and get back to duty. That would have helped set up a vendetta arc between Phasma and the traitor Finn, because now its personal.

So far the only cool thing about her is the chrome armour.

This would have been brilliant. You need to be the writer.

And Snoke is Jar Jar in disguise.