Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

The latest SM FAQ from GW has this Q&A:

Q. Shrike has 'a pair of master-crafted' lightning claws'. Does he get two re-rolls for these, or just the one?
A. Just one.

My problem with this is that in the SM Codex pg 98 it states, "A master-crafted weapon allows the bearer to re-roll one failed roll to hit...".
And in the rule book pg 42 under lightning claws it states, "...it also allows the wielder to re-roll any failed roll to wound."
So isn't this in fact one re-roll to hit because of the master-crafted weapon, and one re-roll to wound because of the lightning claws?

I know you can't re-roll a re-roll but this seems to me to be two completely separate rolls of the dice.

I think you misunderstood the question.

They were referring to the Lightning Claws specifically. In past Editions, I could have, for example, a Master Crafted Bolt Pistol, AND a Master Crafted Power Sword. I would get one re-roll to hit for each, as they are two seperate Master Crafted Weapons.

What the FAQ has cleared up is that essentially, a Pair of Lightning Claws counts as a single Weapon. Hence only one re-roll to hit, not one per Claw.

And Lightning Claws re-roll ALL failed to wounds, hence why they are so damned tasty!

Hope this helps and hasn't instead muddied the waters more.

i always saw a pair of lightning claws as a single weapon.

It is nowadays. IIRC, it's a seperate entry in the Wargear for characters.

In past Editions, I could have, for example, a Master Crafted Bolt Pistol, AND a Master Crafted Power Sword. I would get one re-roll to hit for each, as they are two seperate Master Crafted Weapons.

I thought that particular case was one of those issues that needed an FAQ, for several reasons: couldn't take a wargear selection more then once, couldn't use both re-rolls in close combat, couldn't reroll shooting and close combat with a BP.

Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:It is nowadays. IIRC, it's a seperate entry in the Wargear for characters.

I could be mistaken, but isn't a Lightning Claw always listed singly? For example, a sergeant or chapter master/whatever can choose to "replace his bolt pistol and/or chain sword with one of the following: ... Lightning Claw +15 pts"

Meaning they are bought individually? I don't have the codex to refer to right now... maybe dual Claws are listed specifically for the Master/Captain who have further option for taking the masterwork upgrade.

Does someone have a link to the FAQ?

G

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/content/article.jsp?categoryId=1000018&pIndex=1&aId=3400019&start=2

Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:In past Editions, I could have, for example, a Master Crafted Bolt Pistol, AND a Master Crafted Power Sword. I would get one re-roll to hit for each, as they are two seperate Master Crafted Weapons.

Actually that was not the case in 3rd or 4th edition. You only used the special rules for one weapon. The other only provided an extra +1 Attack in close combat, nothing more.

So they (a pair of MC lightning claws) +1A for having two CCW (being specials they have to be a dual setup), a re-roll to hit for being MC & a re-roll to wound as per the lightning claw rule?

Ghaz wrote:

Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:In past Editions, I could have, for example, a Master Crafted Bolt Pistol, AND a Master Crafted Power Sword. I would get one re-roll to hit for each, as they are two seperate Master Crafted Weapons.

Actually that was not the case in 3rd or 4th edition. You only used the special rules for one weapon. The other only provided an extra +1 Attack in close combat, nothing more.

Actually, the way Master-Crafted was written and then FAQ'd/Clarified in 3rd was that if you had a Master Crafted Pistol, you COULD re-roll its ONE(that +1) attack in close combat regarded you used your base stat-line for the rest of that attack and gained no benefit from any other CCWs you may have had on that same attack(the rest of your attacks used whatever CCW you were armed with).

I happen to have a copy of the old 3rd edition FAQ on my computer:

Q. Can I master-craft more than one than one weapon?

A. No. Whilst on the subject master-crafting pistols will not give you re-rolls in close combat.

I stand by my previous statement that you would not benefit from master-crafting if it's not on your 'primary' weapon.

Ghaz wrote:I happen to have a copy of the old 3rd edition FAQ on my computer:

"Happen" to? Nonsense - you have it because you are Ghaz, and you wouldn't be Ghaz if you didn't have it.

Older version of Chaos Space Marines could get 2 rerolls in a turn, between a combination of Master-crafting and Spiky Bits. Maybe people are misrembering?

Actually it's not until GW's recent changes to their website that I started to save them. Previously I just kept a link to them, even if they did not 'officially' show up on the website