Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

So i got REALLY bored today and figured out the page listing for the IG Codex based on that reference sheet. I'm sure there's nothing here that hasn't already been hammered out in the 26 pages of reference sheet discussion, but interesting to look at it all together...

p30 - Company Commander
p31 - (Command HQ) Bodyguard, Astropath, Master of Artillery, Fleet Officer
p32 - Commissar, Commissar Lord
p33 - Primaris Psyker
p34 - Techpriest, Servitor
p35 - Priest
p36 - Platoon Commander
p37 - (Infantry Platoon) Guardsman, Conscript, Sergeant
p38 - Heavy Weapons Team
p39 - Chimera
p40 - Veteran, Veteran Sergeant, Veteran Heavy Weapons Team
p41 - Penal Legionnaire, Penal Guard (maybe a Sgt?)
p42 - Ogryn, Ogryn Bonehead - Ripper Gun
p43 - Ratling
p44 - Rough Rider, Rough Rider Sergeant
p45 - Sentinel, Support Sentinel
p46 - Stormtrooper, Stormtrooper Sergeant - Hellgun
p47 - Mentor, Sanctioned Psyker
p48 - Leman Russ and variants - Battlecannon
p49 - Punisher Cannon, Nova Eradicator, Plasma Executioner, Vanquisher Cannon, Demolisher Cannon
p50 - Hellhound, Bane Wolf, Devil Dog - Chemical Cannon, Fusion Canon, Inferno Cannon
p51 - Hydra - Hydra Autocannons
p52 - Basilisk, Griffon, Medusa, Colossus
p53 - Griffon Heavy Mortar, Colossus Siege Mortar, Medusa Siege Cannon, Earthshaker Cannon, Fortress-breaker Shells (?)
p54 - Manticore - Storm Eagle Rockets
p55 - Deathstrike - Deathstrike Missiles
p56 - Valkyrie, Vendetta - Multiple Rocket Launcher, Hellfury Missile, Hellstrike Missile
p57 - Ursarkar Creed, Jarran Kell
p58 -
p59 - Lukas Bastonne
p60 - Colonel Straken
p61 - Sly Marbo - Ripper Pistol
p62 - Artillery Sergeant Harker
p63 - Commissar Yarrick
p64 - Captain Al'Rahem
p65 - Commander Chenkov
p66 - Moghul Kamir
p67 - Nork Deddog
p68 - Autocannon, Bolter, Heavy Bolter, Demo Charge, Flamer, Heavy Flamer, Grenade Launcher, Boltpistol, Hellpistol
p69 - Lascannon, Meltagun, Lasgun, Shotgun, Sniper Rifle, Missile Launcher, Plasma Gun, Plasma Cannon, Mortar, Multimelta, Plasma Pistol
p70 - Heavy Stubber, Multilaser
p71 - Stormbolter

p47 - Mentor, Conscripted/Inducted Psyker (??) = Sanctioned Pskyer
p61 - Sly Marbo - Flayer Pistol (?) = Ripper Pistol
p70 - Heavy Stubber (?) = Yes, Heavy Stubber
p71 - Stormbolter (?) = Yes, Storm Bolter

Guessing 70-71 is tank upgrades.

I'd follow that Commissar anywhere!

It doesn't look like entries are doubling, though the page notes rarely give both entries anyway. 30 pages seems pretty thin for putting in all the per unit fluff and the background info together though. We could be seeing a return to the fluff/rules/points omni page that everyone once loved.



If not I foresee people "reviewing" the codex and knocking it down a few points for having the standard codex layout.

Heavy plasma gun? umm what in the emperors name is that?

Now I wish I had registered as H.B.C.M. to add to the confusion.

Jarran wrote:Heavy plasma gun? umm what in the emperors name is that?

It's what 2E / Necro called what we now know as a regular Plasma Gun.

Although, sometimes it gets moved around as a Plasma Cannon.
____

lord_blackfang wrote:Now I wish I had registered as H.B.C.M. to add to the confusion.

Yes, do it!

JohnHwangDD wrote:

Jarran wrote:Heavy plasma gun? umm what in the emperors name is that?

It's what 2E / Necro called what we now know as a regular Plasma Gun.

Although, sometimes it gets moved around as a Plasma Cannon.

No, in the early days we had Plasma Guns and Heavy Plasma Guns. Plasma Cannons were huge vehicle-only weapons more akin to what you would find on a massive vehicle or planetary defence platform. You used to get Heavy Plasma Guns in IG and SM heavy weapon squads. GW later retconned the original Plasma Cannons out of existence (although one could argue they have become Plasma Blastguns) and renamed the Heavy Plasma Gun to Plasma Cannon.

The Heavy Plasma Gun on the French summary should be Plasma Cannon in English game terms.

BOY!

In RT, we had Plasma Gun (PG), Heavy Plasma Gun (HPG) and Plasma Cannon (PC).

I agree that rules-wise, the RT-era HPG is now the PC, and the RT-era PC is now the PBG.

I also agree that the FW Titan PlasmaBlastGun are something different, along with the gun on the Leman Russ Executioner, and can fairly represent the RT-era PC.


Plasma modeling has been a real mess, until more recently. The human 2E/Necro HPG looks *exactly* like the current PG as carried by the 3E SM. I have an Escher with a HPG, and she's carrying a SM PG. It is much smaller than the PC that my SM Devs carry.

JohnHwangDD wrote: I have an Escher with a HPG, and she's carrying a SM PG. It is much smaller than the PC that my SM Devs carry.

A big culprit here is GW's recent trend to give IG super-bulky equipment. While I'd certainly allow the Escher with HPG to count as a plasma rife, she is carrying a gun that is much beefier than, say, the metal 2nd. Ed. Cadian with plasma rifle. Plus, she has that beefy plasma backpack.

I actually like the extra-bulky weapons - they're easier to see and discern from one another. If they were all little, like the dinky 2E Cadian PG, then it's not as cool.

JohnHwangDD wrote:In RT, we had Plasma Gun (PG), Heavy Plasma Gun (HPG) and Plasma Cannon (PC).

I agree that rules-wise, the RT-era HPG is now the PC, and the RT-era PC is now the PBG.

I also agree that the FW Titan PlasmaBlastGun are something different, along with the gun on the Leman Russ Executioner, and can fairly represent the RT-era PC.


Plasma modeling has been a real mess, until more recently. The human 2E/Necro HPG looks *exactly* like the current PG as carried by the 3E SM. I have an Escher with a HPG, and she's carrying a SM PG. It is much smaller than the PC that my SM Devs carry.

The thing you've got to remember is that the size of the Heavy Plasma Gun used to vary according to the model that was carrying it. In IG and SM heavy weapon squads in Rogue Trader days, it was a two handed or shoulder-mounted Devastator style weapon:

http://www.solegends.com/citcat88/4003imperialguard.htm
http://www.solegends.com/citcat88/4103marines.htm
http://www.solegends.com/citcat911/c2109chaosrenegadeheavie.htm

Yet as a special weapon (and in Necromunda) it was significantly smaller*. However, it was still bigger than the Plasma Gun of the day. And on the whole, all the Necromunda "heavy" weapons were on the small side.

http://www.solegends.com/citcat89suml/c89suml-070121-2-03.htm

Still in 2nd/3rd ed the bulky shoulder mounted Devastator weapon was called the Heavy Plasma Gun.

http://www.solegends.com/citcat9x4/c93476-03.htm

Then GW just changed the name to Plasma Cannon for no apparent reason in 4th ed I think it was.

*Edit: And one could argue that these "3/4 size" Heavy Plasma Guns were aberrations.

BOY!

Agreed with all above.

I believe the name change was in 3E, when GW revamped 40k overall.

JohnHwangDD wrote:Agreed with all above.

I believe the name change was in 3E, when GW revamped 40k overall.

Yeah, I always forget where the specific editions change over, i.e. the 2nd/3rd and 3rd/4th divides. I think it's because Dark Millennium always throws me off.

lord_blackfang wrote:Now I wish I had registered as H.B.C.M. to add to the confusion.

Seriously, I bugged out when I thought that was MC's HB's new avatar

Oh right, also new IG book. Have I mentioned how much I dislike the deathstrike being in non-APOC games? Luckily nobody will use it with all those hot liquid sex russ variants and not-basilisks ...

- Salvage

Heavy stubbers! Yay! :executes adjutant in glee: Also, H.M.B.C. that's a hell of a commissar. :whistles marching music:

Are the commissar lords any better? or do they just give bonuses?

I have to wonder if releasing the French reference sheet was a sort of joke by some GW developers. They're now sitting back and watching threads like this, laughing non-stop as a page is analyzed to death.

Jarran wrote:Are the commissar lords any better? or do they just give bonuses?

Well, they're WS5 BS5, three-wound commissars with Ld10. So yes, they're probably better than the standard ones.

Balance wrote:I have to wonder if releasing the French reference sheet was a sort of joke by some GW developers. They're now sitting back and watching threads like this, laughing non-stop as a page is analyzed to death.

In theory one of those sheets would be pretty damn easy to photoshop up as a fake. I could do it fairly quickly.

ShumaGorath wrote:

Balance wrote:I have to wonder if releasing the French reference sheet was a sort of joke by some GW developers. They're now sitting back and watching threads like this, laughing non-stop as a page is analyzed to death.

In theory one of those sheets would be pretty damn easy to photoshop up as a fake. I could do it fairly quickly.

Theoretically, yes, though you'd have to put in things like the page numbers for each troop type and weapon, making sure they follow some kind of logical pattern (which they appear to be doing). And I suspect a fake sheet would not have confirmed all those outrageous rumors such as the Punisher and the Deathstrike.

Credo quia absurdum

Then there's the fact that the link came from GW's French Website, and the fact that they took it down not a half hour after it was up.

Ok, EDITED to include any changes. Thanks guys. Of course, I should have relised that it was meant to say Plasma Cannon - that's my 2ed brain for you...

One of the real interesting things is the potential difference between Sanctioned and Primaris Psykers, and the fact that the Mentor entry is on the same page as the Sanctioned ones.

I imagine we'll be seeing a Primaris Psyker as a more Librarian-like battle psyker, since he seems to be quite a high-level character.

I'm guessing we'll then see 'squads' of Sanctioned Psykers who function kind of like an Inquisitor's Bound Psyker, led by some sort of 'security' character called a Mentor...

Yeah, I think its a real sheet, I just wonder if GW is enjoying the controversy it has caused.

It is a good way to build some interest.

Is John Hwang not finding it a little strange that he can read HMBC's posts? And is agreeing with him on pretty much everything?

Not at all.

HMBC is like Mirror Cartman - smooth & sexy, pleasant to deal with.

I *like* Her Majesty's Buxom Commissar!

Well, the Buxom part probably helps...

It never hurts.