Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I have a nice little eldar force and 4,000 points of bugs... I want to start another army but I don't want a popular one. I've been looking around at DE and observing them play. In all the games against them it's been very interesting and I'm seriously thinking about starting one up. I love high ballistic skill, love decent (but fragile) troops, I love all the fast skimmers and heavy weapons they carry, and all the nasty CC guys in there make me happy.

So, with that in mind, what do you guys suggest I start with? Like everyone I have a limited budget and probably wouldn't need more than 1500 points worth of them. I would like to have wych cults as I've seen how effective they are and have skimmers just because I like them and would like to paint them. I don't really want the battleforce because I don't want jetbikes... I'm just not a fan of them for how expensive (in both ways) they are. So DE players, give me your advice and give me your opinions!

Well, then you need a Wych Lord (HQ) and 19 wyches, along with two raiders. That's an HQ and two troops. Beyond that, get more as you can afford it. A third raider + 10 more wyches. When you can afford it, get a retinue for your wych lord. Then two ravagers. Then either a talos or a third ravager.

Beyond that...either more wyches + raiders, or expand into your elite slots to make warrior sniper squads carrying a couple dark lances.

Humm I would probably hold off on the pure wych cult. Rumors of an eventual redo may alter the dynamic of the DE enough to make wych cult either obsolete or impossible.

I myself really want to start a DE army, but I believe they will be redone in the next 6-12 months, so IMO you might as well wait for that.

So is this 6-12 months thing set in stone? If this is true I think I will just hold off... And Pepper, I'm not looking for a pure wych cult, but that's an excellent idea with the wych lord. I definitely want wyches, but I always play balanced lists. But there definitely will be warrior squads with lances because they're just so incredibly nice!

Alert! Nothing is set in stone, it is mere rumor and/or conjecture.

It should be soon, but I guess you never know.

Either way I'm not going to risk myself getting an army which may be redone before too long. No guarantees unfortunately on the redo though.

Purchase/wait at your own risk

Well, the phrase 'redone before too long' means something to me. I think perhaps I might wait for a bit. More time to actually finish my swarm!

I hate to throw cold water here, but DE has been "6 to 12 months from a refresh" for the last 6 to 12 years.

If you like them, I'd take the plunge rather than waiting for the new hotness.

I know what you mean... Just look at their history. Or just look at my sig. I know there has to be at least a dozen new marine codexes out before xenos get one, and I'm pretty sure that tyranids will get one before DE just due to popularity. Since we're only at a scant 8 imperial codexes I'm well aware of the fact it might take another 5 years.

In your professional opinion though, do you believe there is any real truth to the rumours? I mean honestly, is there a chance of it?

Well if you're thinking mounted and wyche cult, I would recommend something like this.

Arcite: agoniser/spliter pistol/shadow field/combat drugs
Retinue: 9 wyches/wyche weapons/2 blasters 1 Succubus/Agoniser

Raider/night shield

Troops:

9 wyches/wyche weapons/2 blasters 1 succubus/agoniser
Raider/night shield

9 wyches/wyche weapons/2 blasters 1 succubus/agoniser
Raider/night shield

9 wyches/wyche weapons/2 shredders 1 succubus/agoniser
Raider/night shield

9 wyches/wyche weapons/2 shredders 1 succubus/agoniser
Raider/night shield

Ravager 3 dissy's/night shield

Ravager 3 dissy's/night shield

Ravager night shield
----------------------------------------------------------------------

The DE models, particularly the plastics are pretty bland in terms of detail for painting, but that'sthe worst thing you can say about DE. Other than that I enjoy their play style as an army over every other race I've had the pleasure to play as.

IMHO the ability to hit hard and fast outweighs durability point for point in units costs. This gives you bang for yer buck when played correcty in a skilled players hands. Where are more durable units would start hemmoraging value when used by a player who doesn't need the 'forgiveness' those tougher units cost points for. it's an army that is mediocre in an average gamers hands, and brutal in an advanced players hands.

Grunt_For_Christ wrote:I know what you mean... Just look at their history. Or just look at my sig. I know there has to be at least a dozen new marine codexes out before xenos get one, and I'm pretty sure that tyranids will get one before DE just due to popularity. Since we're only at a scant 8 imperial codexes I'm well aware of the fact it might take another 5 years.

In your professional opinion though, do you believe there is any real truth to the rumours? I mean honestly, is there a chance of it?

GW's whole "DE are just about to get a new codex!" cocktease has been going on for as long as I can remember (late 3rd edition I think). It was supposed to be right after the Craftworld Eldar, then after the new (now old) IG codex, then after Codex: Armageddon, then...

I don't know what's up with it, and I don't pay much attention to the rumor mill. I will say that I'm not sure how much mass appeal there is for new DE stuff. I think it's going to end up being a SoB-type army, with a small, devoted fanbase (and eyepoppingly awful applications of Rule 34 on 4chan) but without enough market appeal for a large-scale rollout.

Of course, I could be wrong. And I probably will be. And if I am, you can thank me for it, because it will have been my awesomely bad prognosticating power that caused it. Like opening Schrodinger's box, but in reverse.

yo guys something diffenrnt... it doesn't say it in the codex, but are characters allowed 2 have a tormentor helm or can only the incubi have one???
coz if they can have one, IM SO GONNA PLAY DARK ELDAR WITCHKULT!!!!MADDEST AL EVA!!

I would advise against helions (unless you surf) and talos thing. A pure wych army is good. Give the,m skimmers and you're in the clear with a solid killy-killy army. Mabye some normal troops to consolidate (as wyches can be shot easily)

I love playing DE, I have so many models I get the chance to try out all sorts of neat lists!


The flavor of the month for me is a semi-mobile horde!

here is a sample list:

1750 Pts - Dark Eldar

1 Archon @ 386 Pts
Combat Drug Dispenser; Shadow Field; Tormentor Helm; Trophy Rack; Punisher; Animus Vitae
1 Retinue @ [231] Pts
2 Warriors @ [36] Pts
Splinter Cannon (x2)
2 Incubi @ [140] Pts
Tormentor Helm; Punisher (x2)
1 Drazhar @ [90] Pts
Disembowler Blades; Tormentor Helm
1 Raider @ [55] Pts
Dark Lance

1 Haemonculi @ 45 Pts
Scissorhand; Destructor


1 Haemonculi @ 45 Pts
Scissorhand; Destructor

10 Warrior Squad @ 100 Pts
Splinter Rifle (x8); Dark Lance (x2)

10 Warrior Squad @ 100 Pts
Splinter Rifle (x8); Dark Lance (x2)

10 Warrior Squad @ 100 Pts
Splinter Rifle (x8); Dark Lance (x2)

10 Warrior Squad @ 100 Pts
Splinter Rifle (x8); Dark Lance (x2)

9 Wyches @ 223 Pts
Close Combat Weapon; Splinter Pistol; Wych Weapons; Combat Drugs; Plasma Grenades
1 Succubus @ [42] Pts
Agoniser; Splinter Pistol; Wych Weapons; Plasma Grenades (Squad)
1 Raider @ [55] Pts
Dark Lance

5 Warp Beasts @ 75 Pts
Beastmaster
1 Beast master @ [15] Pts
Agoniser; Splinter Pistol

8 Raider Squad @ 134 Pts
Blaster; Splinter Rifle (x6); Splinter Cannon; Raider
1 Raider @ [55] Pts
Dark Lance

9 Raider Squad @ 142 Pts
Blaster; Splinter Rifle (x7); Splinter Cannon; Raider
1 Raider @ [55] Pts
Dark Lance

1 Talos @ 100 Pts
Talos Claw; Talos Sting

1 Talos @ 100 Pts
Talos Claw; Talos Sting

1 Talos @ 100 Pts
Talos Claw; Talos Sting

Total Roster Cost: 1750



For a good starting list just go with 16 normal warriors 4 DL warriors, 1 Archon, 1 squad of wyches, 1 squad of warp beasts. It adds up to 500pts and is rather solid. Add raiders to make it 750, then go from there!


And as an answer for what you should buy, I suggest 1 Archon, 60 warriors, at least 1 squad of wyches, 1 squad of warp beast (seriously the best 75pts ever spent!), Drazhar (best Character ever! he really goes in every DE list), Lilith (because its the best looking DE model), a bunch of raiders, and some talos, or ravagers.

What on Earth do people use units of warp beasts for? I look at the codex and it doesn't appear that the beastmaster has access to the armory, so is the single calvary mounted power weapon really that great?

Warp beasts are lame.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/242427.page

That should pretty much be required reading for Dark eldar players.

Thank you Pepper! This was a really great article and has me reconsidering whether or not I'll be getting the boxed set. It seems like the jetbikes get very high marks and I definitely have a better idea of what HQ I would like. At this point, since money is tight, I don't think I'll be getting anything, but once I get my new job I think I'll definitely be getting a battleforce, a few ravagers, and some lords. Clthomps, thanks for the list. I've never seen one quite like this and has given me some ideas.

Thanks for everything guys
B

I would be aware that the only people posting that I know currently play DE are seven and I. You will get a lot of advice from people that read primers like the one posted and then think they are experts...


Warp beasts are fantastic, for 75 points you get 20 Str 4 attacks, and 3 poison 4+ PW attacks on the charge (which is more often than not first turn since they have a 12" charge) at Init 5 and 6.


Most of the advice you will receive will beg you to run a list like this:

2500 Pts - Dark Eldar Roster - DE Sample 'ard boyz list

1 Archon @ 331 Pts
Combat Drug Dispenser; Shadow Field; Tormentor Helm; Trophy Rack; Punisher; Animus Vitae
1 Retinue @ [176] Pts
2 Warriors @ [36] Pts
Splinter Cannon (x2)
2 Incubi @ [140] Pts
Tormentor Helm; Punisher (x2)
1 Drazhar @ [90] Pts
Disembowler Blades; Tormentor Helm

1 Haemonculi @ 45 Pts
Scissorhand; Destructor

1 Haemonculi @ 45 Pts
Scissorhand; Destructor

1 Haemonculi @ 45 Pts
Scissorhand; Destructor

9 Wyches @ 218 Pts
Close Combat Weapon; Splinter Pistol; Wych Weapons; Combat Drugs
1 Succubus @ [46] Pts
Agoniser; Splinter Pistol; Wych Weapons; Tormentor Helm
1 Raider @ [55] Pts
Dark Lance
9 Wyches @ 218 Pts
Close Combat Weapon; Splinter Pistol; Wych Weapons; Combat Drugs
1 Succubus @ [46] Pts
Agoniser; Splinter Pistol; Wych Weapons; Tormentor Helm
1 Raider @ [55] Pts
Dark Lance

9 Wyches @ 218 Pts
Close Combat Weapon; Splinter Pistol; Wych Weapons; Combat Drugs
1 Succubus @ [46] Pts
Agoniser; Splinter Pistol; Wych Weapons; Tormentor Helm
1 Raider @ [55] Pts
Dark Lance

9 Raider Squad @ 142 Pts
Blaster; Splinter Rifle (x7); Splinter Cannon; Raider
1 Raider @ [55] Pts
Dark Lance

9 Raider Squad @ 142 Pts
Blaster; Splinter Rifle (x7); Splinter Cannon; Raider
1 Raider @ [55] Pts
Dark Lance

9 Raider Squad @ 142 Pts
Blaster; Splinter Rifle (x7); Splinter Cannon; Raider
1 Raider @ [55] Pts
Dark Lance

9 Raider Squad @ 142 Pts
Blaster; Splinter Rifle (x7); Splinter Cannon; Raider
1 Raider @ [55] Pts
Dark Lance

9 Raider Squad @ 142 Pts
Blaster; Splinter Rifle (x7); Splinter Cannon; Raider
1 Raider @ [55] Pts
Dark Lance

9 Raider Squad @ 142 Pts
Blaster; Splinter Rifle (x7); Splinter Cannon; Raider
1 Raider @ [55] Pts
Dark Lance

1 Ravager @ 115 Pts
Dark Lance (x1); Disentegrator (x2)

1 Ravager @ 115 Pts
Dark Lance (x1); Disentegrator (x2)

1 Ravager @ 115 Pts
Dark Lance (x1); Disentegrator (x2)

Total Roster Cost: 2317

Extra points are spent on Raider wargear or bikes with blasters

I find that the online opinions change when ever someone innovative brings a "new" list to a major tourney and wins. Look at orks for an example, Nob bikers were all the rage and kans were never taken as a serious option, but now Kan list are doing better at tourneys so the court of online opinion is swinging there way.


So to end my rant I will just advise you to proxy the expensive metal parts of your new army until you find what you like.

Cheers!
Chris

So is there anything wrong with said list? You put the beginning of the post in a light that would suggest it isn't a good list... Are you suggesting something different? I mean, there's only so much you can do with a codex that only has about 16 entries.

Everyone has a different playing style and I'll most certainly be proxying as you suggest, but my question was more; What should I start with? You have to start with something and have a general direction of where you'd like to go. Personally I generally favour balanced lists.

(As an aside, I'm favourable to warp beasts. From what I've seen they just need to be placed and charged very carefully, otherwise they'll get cut down pretty quickly. But there's a lot of high initiative attacks that can contest objectives in a last turn push... Definitely useful.)

Dark Eldar!
Gotta get em all!

Let me qualify my statement.

I've been playing dark eldar lately with a loaner army so I can get a feel for what I like and what I don't.

Warp beasts are lame.

1. They're expensive for what you get.
2. They have horrible saves, and die as easily as ork boyz with their papershirt saves.
3. Taking them requires that you have a Wych lord as an HQ. That means you're running a Wych army. Wyches are fun in close combat, but they're not awesome in close combat. Their talents don't bring ownage, they help prevent getting owned. Its different. Cutting an enemy's weapon skill in half doesn't help much when 95% of everything you attack will be WS4. When you're WS4 and they're WS4, and you cut them down to WS2...they still need 4s to hit you. =p
4. You can't protect them in a vehicle, and if you're running a mechanized list (wyches or warriors in raiders) that probably means that the only thing on the ground, out in the open that can draw fire from troop killing weapons are your 6+ save warp beast pack. They'll die in turn 1.
----------------------------
Now, I'm trying to buy or trade for DE to get my *own* army, but warp beasts don't figure into anything effective for what I want to play. If you're not going to play a raider list....then they might work better as you can deliver multiple foot slogging threats. But in the kind of raider list I plan on, warp beasts have no place.

@Dashofpepper

Actually you just need a witch squad to run the warpbeasts. They don't count toward your elite's either which is pretty nice.

As for lists as a whole you mostly see mechanized DE because it's the only way to keep the warriors from being blown to bitz and running off the board. DE have unparalled mobility I personally feel your doing a disservice to the army if your not almost exclusively mounted. Also a codex w/only 16 entries but where only about 6 of those are useful also hurts the variety train.

I will say that I haven't played as DE in over 3 years but I have played against them quite a bit lately (local guy has been playing them up while he paints) and it can be nasty though the only foot troops worthy of being in a mech list are sniper darklance squads of DE (normally just 1 or 2 to hold rear objectives) and warp beasts. The vehicles screen the warpbeasts well enough if there is no other cover and when they hit they are pretty nasty for the total point cost. Heck, even if they get wiped it's one turn they aren't shooting at your raiders

so one of the armies I've been wanting to try lately is a web way portal assault wych cult army. Haven't played it yet but this is the only instance I could think of to try and make warpbeasts work. Take a few squads, have them come out of the portal and have a guaranteed charge. Aside from this (foolish) idea I can't think of a good one.

To the OP I have 3 suggestions.

1) Get ravagers. They are a fantastic HS choice. Good at killing MEQ and small groups of models.

2) Don't knock jetbikes. DE jetbikes are pretty good and a a lord on a bike is a monster in cc. Also like all jetbikes DE ones are a good way to context objectives at end game since only a miracle will keep all your raiders alive. With the right loadout the lord can be an str 6 character with 6 attacks on the charge. You can actually potentially make him str 7 but then you are gonna have to ditch another piece of wargear.

3) If you are running a wych list take lelith helsprex. She great for her point cost and GW faqed her so that she does benefit from the combat drugs her special retinue gets to choose at the beginning of the game. AKA give them 12" charge. Just think 12" move with raider + 2" deployment from raider + D6 inch fleet move + 12" charge. This pretty much allows you to get to anything you want.

Grunt:

So is there anything wrong with said list? You put the beginning of the post in a light that would suggest it isn't a good list... Are you suggesting something different? I mean, there's only so much you can do with a codex that only has about 16 entries.

There is nothing tacticly wrong with the list. In fact it is very competitive. I only suggest that it is stale, and that you play(proxy) a little bit of everything to create you own style of play.

What should I start with? You have to start with something and have a general direction of where you'd like to go. Personally I generally favour balanced lists.

I would start with 1 archon and 3 squads are warriors, and a 2 raiders . Since the HQ and Troop sections are very light that is the way to go. If you see them for sale buy Blasters, since GW does not sell them anymore and every raider squad carries one they have become insanely rare.

Here is what I suggest you buy to start. It is all plastic except the Archon, DL, and Blaster models.

1 Archon @ 137 Pts
Combat Drug Dispenser; Shadow Field; Tormentor Helm; Punisher; Plasma Grenades

10 Warrior Squad @ 100 Pts
Splinter Rifle (x8); Dark Lance (x2)

5 Raider Squad @ 115 Pts
Blaster; Splinter Rifle (x3); Splinter Cannon; Raider
1 Raider @ [60] Pts
Disentegrator

9 Raider Squad @ 147 Pts
Blaster; Splinter Rifle (x7); Splinter Cannon; Raider
1 Raider @ [60] Pts
Disentegrator

Total Roster Cost: 499


Pepper:

Warp beasts are lame.

While I agree the models are not great looking I will not agree that they are not a viable option in a DE list.

1. They're expensive for what you get.

At 75 points for 6 models that breaks down to 12.5 points each. Lets look at it what you get through the prism of a tyranid player. At 10 points a hormaguant is the closest thing to a warpbeast pack, but to give him the same stat lines you need to add 2 x adrenal glands ( I know this is illegal but just humor me), and 1 Toxin sac, that brings them up to 13 points, yet they are sill lacking +1 attack(at least worth 2 points each), and a leader with a poisoned Power weapon attack.

2. They have horrible saves

When has this stopped you from taking any other DE.

, and die as easily as ork boyz with their papershirt saves.

I would beg to differ. When was the last time you had a 6 model Ork boyz unit? With True line of sight it is really easy to remove line of sight with a raider , not to mention 4+ cover saves, there is not reason they should be getting shot at in the first place, and even if they do you are drawing fire away from your paper airplanes.

3. Taking them requires that you have a Wych lord as an HQ. That means you're running a Wych army. Wyches are fun in close combat, but they're not awesome in close combat. Their talents don't bring ownage, they help prevent getting owned. Its different. Cutting an enemy's weapon skill in half doesn't help much when 95% of everything you attack will be WS4. When you're WS4 and they're WS4, and you cut them down to WS2...they still need 4s to hit you. =p

Wrong. On multiple accounts, You do not need a wych lord to run them. Wyches are awesome in close combat, as long as you know what you are charging. And as for the last part warp beasts don't get wych weapons, so it doesn't matter.

4. You can't protect them in a vehicle, and if you're running a mechanized list (wyches or warriors in raiders) that probably means that the only thing on the ground, out in the open that can draw fire from troop killing weapons are your 6+ save warp beast pack. They'll die in turn 1.

If you can't screen a 6 man unit or get them into cover on deployment you should just stop playing wargames. At this point I think you are just grasping at straws to find something negative to say since you mentioned there saves and whatnot in point 2.



Hulk: You are correct. Yay!




Dumpling:

I think you are still running the original codex. Does your book have a fake stamp on it that says second edition?

With the right loadout the lord can be an str 6 character with 6 attacks on the charge. You can actually potentially make him str 7 but then you are gonna have to ditch another piece of wargear.

This would be correct under the old codex but not under the new one. Bikes no longer add +1str, while it is included in the stat line of normal bikes it was taken out of the bike entry in the war gear section. Also you can no longer take a punisher on a warbike. So the max str on a bike is 5.



Well hope that helps,

Cheers,
Chris

@ Grunt:
Given that no one knows when the " new DE release"might occur,it may be in your best interest,if you want to purchase models now,to only purchase those models that you can be sure will be usefull after the "revamp,release".
For example,models like raiders,IMO I cant see a DE list with out them,and you can get a feel for your color scheme with out buying models you may never use.

Clthomps.

In the offical GW 5th edition faq for dark eldar they clarify the jetbike rule. It explicitly states that you get +1 S while riding a DE jetbike and it removes the 2H weapon and extra ccw restriction.

http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1180149_Dark_Eldar_FAQ_2004-08_5th_Edition.pdf

You know, there are certain units that I particularly like in other armies that hardly anyone else uses, and I defend them to the death. =p

Props to you for sticking to your guns.

Clthomps wrote:Grunt:

So is there anything wrong with said list? You put the beginning of the post in a light that would suggest it isn't a good list... Are you suggesting something different? I mean, there's only so much you can do with a codex that only has about 16 entries.

There is nothing tacticly wrong with the list. In fact it is very competitive. I only suggest that it is stale, and that you play(proxy) a little bit of everything to create you own style of play.

What should I start with? You have to start with something and have a general direction of where you'd like to go. Personally I generally favour balanced lists.

I would start with 1 archon and 3 squads are warriors, and a 2 raiders . Since the HQ and Troop sections are very light that is the way to go. If you see them for sale buy Blasters, since GW does not sell them anymore and every raider squad carries one they have become insanely rare.

Here is what I suggest you buy to start. It is all plastic except the Archon, DL, and Blaster models.

1 Archon @ 137 Pts
Combat Drug Dispenser; Shadow Field; Tormentor Helm; Punisher; Plasma Grenades

10 Warrior Squad @ 100 Pts
Splinter Rifle (x8); Dark Lance (x2)

5 Raider Squad @ 115 Pts
Blaster; Splinter Rifle (x3); Splinter Cannon; Raider
1 Raider @ [60] Pts
Disentegrator

9 Raider Squad @ 147 Pts
Blaster; Splinter Rifle (x7); Splinter Cannon; Raider
1 Raider @ [60] Pts
Disentegrator

Total Roster Cost: 499


Pepper:

Warp beasts are lame.

While I agree the models are not great looking I will not agree that they are not a viable option in a DE list.

1. They're expensive for what you get.

At 75 points for 6 models that breaks down to 12.5 points each. Lets look at it what you get through the prism of a tyranid player. At 10 points a hormaguant is the closest thing to a warpbeast pack, but to give him the same stat lines you need to add 2 x adrenal glands ( I know this is illegal but just humor me), and 1 Toxin sac, that brings them up to 13 points, yet they are sill lacking +1 attack(at least worth 2 points each), and a leader with a poisoned Power weapon attack.

2. They have horrible saves

When has this stopped you from taking any other DE.

, and die as easily as ork boyz with their papershirt saves.

I would beg to differ. When was the last time you had a 6 model Ork boyz unit? With True line of sight it is really easy to remove line of sight with a raider , not to mention 4+ cover saves, there is not reason they should be getting shot at in the first place, and even if they do you are drawing fire away from your paper airplanes.

3. Taking them requires that you have a Wych lord as an HQ. That means you're running a Wych army. Wyches are fun in close combat, but they're not awesome in close combat. Their talents don't bring ownage, they help prevent getting owned. Its different. Cutting an enemy's weapon skill in half doesn't help much when 95% of everything you attack will be WS4. When you're WS4 and they're WS4, and you cut them down to WS2...they still need 4s to hit you. =p

Wrong. On multiple accounts, You do not need a wych lord to run them. Wyches are awesome in close combat, as long as you know what you are charging. And as for the last part warp beasts don't get wych weapons, so it doesn't matter.

4. You can't protect them in a vehicle, and if you're running a mechanized list (wyches or warriors in raiders) that probably means that the only thing on the ground, out in the open that can draw fire from troop killing weapons are your 6+ save warp beast pack. They'll die in turn 1.

If you can't screen a 6 man unit or get them into cover on deployment you should just stop playing wargames. At this point I think you are just grasping at straws to find something negative to say since you mentioned there saves and whatnot in point 2.



Hulk: You are correct. Yay!




Dumpling:

I think you are still running the original codex. Does your book have a fake stamp on it that says second edition?

With the right loadout the lord can be an str 6 character with 6 attacks on the charge. You can actually potentially make him str 7 but then you are gonna have to ditch another piece of wargear.

This would be correct under the old codex but not under the new one. Bikes no longer add +1str, while it is included in the stat line of normal bikes it was taken out of the bike entry in the war gear section. Also you can no longer take a punisher on a warbike. So the max str on a bike is 5.



Well hope that helps,

Cheers,
Chris

This is exactly what I was looking for... A recommendation of what to buy in the beginning without getting myself too deep in. Looks like the bikes do gain +1S thanks to the FAQ. I really don't care about what anyone says in regards to what units are poop and what are good because all I'm looking for is a solid base of models from which to discover my playing style. So thank you for the sample list and the recommendations. I'm definitely looking for all plastic with a few metal pieces just because you have to.

In your estimation do you think a battleforce would be worth it? Bikes do seem like a valid choice, the raiders are basically mandatory, warriors are obvious, and having 20 of them seems like a decent start. Is it worth it or is there something else out there that I can buy in bulk? Obviously there aren't any apoc sets like the tyranid assault brood for DE and the only other set is the raider w/8 warriors... But do you know of anything else that might work, or maybe something that comes with a ravager?

GW did release some DE apoc sets,IIRC there was a set with several Raiders as well as one with 3 Ravangers.

Like I said though, I'm looking for something that's currently available...

Grunt_For_Christ wrote:Like I said though, I'm looking for something that's currently available...

Yes,I attempted to locate the availabilty of the DE apoc sets and came up empty,thought they may still be some available someplace.
A battle force may be a good choice,Raider,Bikes & warroirs should all be viable after the "update".