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I just started 40k and I'm pretty darn bad at mathhammer, but I went ahead and put together this list, just to see what it might look like... opinions? Bear in mind I've never used Wraithguards OR Wraithlords, and though I have a slew of fantasy games under my belt, I only have about 4 40k games, and none at this point level.

Wraiths of Athag Anaris

HQ

Farseer - Doom, Guide, RoWitnessing, Spirit Stones, Jetbike, Warlocks (3x) (Conceal 1x, Enhance 1x)

TROOPS

7x Pathfinders
6x Pathfinders
6x Pathfinders
10x Wraithguard, Spiritseer, Conceal
10x Wraithguard, Spiritseer, Conceal

HEAVY SUPPORT

Wraithlord, scatter laser, wraithblade
Wraithlord, star cannon, wraithblade
Wraithlord, twin-linked bright lances

TOTAL: 1998 points

42 Models, 54 wounds, 3 Monstrous Creatures


Alright, I got tired of my normal attempts at creating lists, and wanted to try something that just seemed a tad more... pushy instead of... dance-y. I feel like my previous attempts at lists applied a "dance around the enemy and try to figure out how to beat them" type of strategy, whereas this list more obviously is like, let's march right up to the enemy and take them the feth out. The seer council on jetbikes allows me to guide different units of pathfinders each turn depending on who has the best shot at my most desirable target. It also allows me to jet over to a wraithlord who might have needed to wander a little too far from the spiritseers in the wraithguard units not to mention being a decent unit in combat to assist the wraithguards.

The hope of course is that assaults will be mostly avoided - the wraithcannons, combined with the scatter laser and flamers (I've opted to have the shuriken cannon/flamer combo on each wraithlord, though it's not noted here*) is supposed to handle any infantry that before it engages, whilst my three units of infiltrated pathfinders hopes to pick off any pesky shooty troops as my wraithforce advances. Add to that the use of Conceal in each of the wraithguard units, and the hope is that I'll actually be able to make it out there before I'm shot to gak. The twin-linked brightlances and star cannon are, of course, for tanks from a distance. Theoretically the wraithcannons should also function as anti-tank, since they always glance on a 3-4, and always penetrate on 5+. Anyone know how this rule works in relation to a monolith?

Oh, also, apparently common wisdom says the wraithguard will be shot to death, but with the Wraithlords out in front (if that's not too dangerous) blocking LOS, and a 5+ cover save, maybe I can get them and the wraithcannons up enough.

This list pretty much does exactly what I complain about from so many lists, but it does seem QUITE fun to play, if it works.

*Flamers can't be used in assault, right? If flamers can be used in the assault phase, I think I'll go for the dual flamer option and probably get rid of those wraithblades... though maybe I should just go dual flamers anyway on at least one of them...

I like your list. It sounds fun to play, or even fun to play against. It also incorporates all my favorite models from the Eldar army list. I think it's a gamble though. Please let us know how the list works out in practice.

It looks like it would be a fun list to play. I don't see it winning any competitive tourneys though. Also the purchase cost of those 20 wraithguard is going to hurt.

Yeah, def. seems fun. I think it'll fair better against armies where the 3 pinning tests from the pathfinders (provided there are wounds) are difficult to avoid. If I can lock down three of your better shooting units and stop them from taking aim, better for me! I'll probably proxy this army next time I play a larger game, and I'll let you know how it works out!

sI would love to play a list like this, i really like the entire wrait army, the only thing that kept me from playing it is the high $$$$$$ for the wraitguards, but the second they start making plastic kits ill be a happy guy. the list looks good though fun to play and play against.

Ok, hold it! Don't listen to those other posters! It is not that good of a list, it will cost you $300 just to fill out your troops section, which is quite an outlay for such a limited build.

This list will never beat a mobile, mechanized opponent. Your anti-tank is very limited, and your mobility moreso. A fast enemy will either be able to assault you, or just shoot you. Your firepower is incredibly limited. 3x Wraithlords are the basis for a firepower army, but you've got them serving as almost all the firepower by themselves. The enemy won't have to get shot by WG unless he's just as slow as you, or kind of dumb. And rangers are almost useless against mechanized foes.

I have an Iyanden army myself, so let me tell you how it works: The basis for a good Wraithzilla list is one block of 10 WG troops, guarded by an Avatar and 2-3 Wraithlords with swords. This normally requires Eldrad to be effective. You want to Fortune both the Avatar and the WG. Otherwise they really aren't survivable enough. The Avatar will bite the dirt instantly without Fortune, but will absorb infuriating amounts of fire when Fortuned. Not to mention how he'll dance through combats unscathed most of the time. And the WG are simply too easy to kill unless their Conceal is backed up with Fortune.

So, you've got your block of 10xWG, Eldrad, Avatar, and WLs (I call this the wraith phalanx). Its goal is typically to advance aggressively to bring the WG to bear, as well as crush all opposition with 'zilla assaults. It absorbs insane amounts of fire -- You can take fire from an entire IG army for a whole turn and only lose a wound here or there, typically. The advantage of the Wraith phalanx is that it really doesn't have a weakness, other than mobility. There's nothing WG can't kill with shooting (and they hit a lot when Eldrad guides them), and a Fortuned avatar backed up by sword-wielding WLs can roll over almost anything in the game.

The trick after that is adding mobility. There are a lot of things you can do, but typically what you want to support your phalanx is Fire Dragons, DAs, Guardians, or Banshees riding waveserpents. Rangers are ok in smaller numbers (not a whole 3 squads), but I really don't recommend them at all come 5th edition because everyone now maxes out on flamers and there are plenty of cover-ignoring ordnances (like the thunderfire and the whirlwind, and I think the IG have quite a few now).

Also, don't take 2x WG squads. It doesn't work. WG are good, but too many of them will slow you down far too much. And you'll never beat horde enemies if a full 800 points of your army is dedicated to single-shot wraithcannons.

Looks not bad.
But I'd drop one unit of Pathfinders and beef up the Jetseer Council.
The Farseer needs runes of warding, while the other runes are not mandatory.
Warlocks should have embolden twice (making runes of withnesses redundant) and enhance, while conceal is totally useless.

BladeSire,if your going to run a WraithZilla you need the Avatar in there Wraithlords when paired with Avatar make a great MC combo.

That looks like a fun list. I like the wraithsword wraithlords: I just love the idea of a close-combat oriented wraithlord.

Oh, and listen to Farmer. you need an avatar.

Don't wraiths need to stay within 6" of a Farseer or risk deactivating? I suppose the obvious weakness would be that an enemy could target your ICs and leave your army dark and turned off while they auto-hit it.

Honestly, on your first point of not wanting to 'dance around the enemy'... That is how Eldar are (and are meant to be) played. You get hyper-specialized units that do extremely well when acting as a team.

As an example, your fire dragons would be placed to pop a transport, with a unit of dire avengers ready to rush in and finish off what's left of the unit. Alone, neither will suceed. You have to draw elements of your opponents army off and play to your strengths.

The way you want to play, it seems like you would be more comfortable with a Dark Angels Deathwing army, for example.

Ixe has the right idea. If you are really set on this path, go for it, but I think you will really end up disappointed with how poorly a list like perform.

Dashofpepper wrote:Don't wraiths need to stay within 6" of a Farseer or risk deactivating? I suppose the obvious weakness would be that an enemy could target your ICs and leave your army dark and turned off while they auto-hit it.

Normally, yes, but his warlocks leading the Wraithguard are spiritseers, so he can be 12 inches away. With all the psykers and warlocks, he should be fine.

Edit:

I`d always recommend against twin-linking weapons on a Wraith Lord. Give em EMLs and Bright Lances, but not twin linking. they`re hitting like space marines anyway, and when guided, they`re almost always going to hit.

Personally, I`d have two Wraithlrods with EMLs and Bright Lances (both with flamers), then if absolutely needed, a third with scatter lasers, and star cannons. Wraithblades are nice, but you`ll get more kills opening up with a star cannon, or your flamers.

I used to LOVE the blades, now...I`d rather just give them a heavy weapon so they can be more useful at range.

And to answer the OPs question, the flamers are Assault weapons, so you can use them, THEN assault. But during assault, no, you can`t use them in melee.

You have a decent start to an Eldarzilla list, but there are some major problems, too.

You definatelty need the Avatar and Eldrad as your 2 Hqs. Eldrad stays atached to a squad of Wraithguard with Conceal and fortunes his unit and the Avatar.

Your Lords need some work, too. 2 of them should be EML+BL so that you have longe range firepower (that Eldrad can guide), and the third Lord should have nothing but a Sword/Flamers and run along side the Avatar making for a great one-two CC punch.

I don't think you need two Wraithguard units; one should suffice. That will either let you run DAs or Flamer Stormies in WSs as fast, protected scoring units that can hop on objectives in the late game, while the WSs help out with longe range shooting in the early/mid game.

Pathfinders are pretty much a waste in an Eldarzila list, unfortunately.

Hope that helps

Fearspect wrote:Honestly, on your first point of not wanting to 'dance around the enemy'... That is how Eldar are (and are meant to be) played. You get hyper-specialized units that do extremely well when acting as a team.

As an example, your fire dragons would be placed to pop a transport, with a unit of dire avengers ready to rush in and finish off what's left of the unit. Alone, neither will suceed. You have to draw elements of your opponents army off and play to your strengths.

The way you want to play, it seems like you would be more comfortable with a Dark Angels Deathwing army, for example.

Ixe has the right idea. If you are really set on this path, go for it, but I think you will really end up disappointed with how poorly a list like perform.

I chose the eldar because I like the dancing around the enemy - but at the same time, I want to pursue all possible paths for them, you know? Additionally, as a relatively new player, I'm a fan of experiments. Because this seemed like a very different eldar list, it attracted me. So, really, it's not that I WANT a straight up assault army, or want to push forward relentlessly - I just wanted to try doing it with the Eldar.

Well, if that's the case, I think you need Dire Avengers over Pathfinders for an added killing punch. The problem with Wraithguard is that they are hard to kill, but they don't really do anything to the opponent either.

Wraithlords need help, personally I only think there are two maybe three worthwhile Wraithlords setups.

Anti-Tank - EML/BL
Anti-Infantry - Scatter Laser/Starcannon
CC/Infantry - Wraithsword/Scatter Laser

Always have flamers.

I think in this list, you would be best served to make all your wraithlords EML/BL because anti tank is what you will be needing most, especially with the number of MECH lists now.