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My first 'N1Dz1LLa' army:

=====================
HQs:
-Hive Tyrant (2TLD,ES,TS)
-Tyrant Guard (LW)
-Tyrant Guard (LW)
-Hive Tyrant (2TLD,ES,TS)
-Tyrant Guard (LW)
-Tyrant Guard (LW)

Elites:
-carnifex (2TLD,ES)
-carnifex (2TLD,ES)
-carnifex (2TLD,ES)

Troops:
-8x Gaunts (FB,WoN)
-8x Gaunts (FB,WoN)
-8x Gaunts (FB,WoN)
-8x Genestealers (FT,EC)
-8x Genestealers (FT,EC)

Heavies:
-carnifex (VC,BS,ES)
-carnifex (VC,BS,ES)
-carnifex (VC,BS,ES)

==========================
2TLD= Two Twin-Linked Devourers
ES= Enhanced Senses
TS= Toxin Sacs
FB= Fleshborer
WoN= without Number
VC= Venom Cannon
BS= Barbed Strangler
FT= Feeder Tendrils
EC= Extended Carapace
LW= Lash Whip
==========================

How does it look? Any suggestions? Should I change one of the tyrants to winged?

For the TG, leave one with Scy Tal, to abuse wound allocation.

Consider Swapping the Extended Carapace on the Stealers for Scuttlers, which I find much more useful. Other than that, looks good!

Only 3 things I can really say about the list.

1. Put shadow in the warp on one of the tyrants.
2. Give one of the stealer broods scuttlers (take of EC).
3. Try out boomfexes instead of dakka fexes. Your tyrAnts have enough dakka and the boomfexes will make the army more balanced.

You could get away with dropping one gaunt brood IMO
good list even without my suggestions but playtest what I suggested and see if you like it.

Looks tough. I do like to run a Winged Tyrant for the 'scary' factor.
I'm not sure how well the Gaunts will do as they won't be in Synapse if they come back on the board, but lot's of people seem to be doing similar things these days, so what do i know......
Personally I'd drop all the Gaunts in favour of Stealers, outflanking & otherwise. But hey, if it works for you, run with it.

Yea I second the winged Tyrant idea. I give mine warp field and he usually takes a ton of solid fire on turns 1 & 2. In big games I also run a 160 pt. God-Fex with claws and make it a point to let the opponent know what he does...up to 10 or 11 attacks on charge at S9 & I2. Between these two models nothing else gets shot at by anything scary. Leaving about 30-40 genestealers,5 fexxes and my HT's to be close to full health after two turns.

I'd drop the three gaunts squads, make 2 of the elite fexes boomfexes, and change a hive tyrant to winged. With the points left, add in more genestealers with feeder tendrils. I also only run one sniperfex, the extra points it saves you lets you drop more points into stealers which I think are the "nail in the coffin" of an army like this.

Line your MC's up and run your stealers behind them. Keep walking forward until you get to the enemy or until the enemy charges a carnifex thinking they can kill it (usually orks) then counter-charge. I'm undefeated with this tactic so far against a variety of opponents.

--I'd make a more long range support tryant (eg VC and other weapon of choice) to play catch for your WoN gaunts.
--Winged Tyrants can be great but the way 5ed works I really prefer walking tyrants with guard. YMMV.
--I like scytal/barb strangler more then twin dev carnifexes but it is all about preference. I just prefer the higher S and range and also the extra cc attack. I think they are better with the current focus on mech also.

Another vote for strangle fexes instead of dakka fexes. Transport opening is a priority.

And scuttlers instead of extended carapace.

And like Winterman is saying, at least one tyrant should be longer ranged, to scoop up recycled gaunts.

You could invest a bit more in the heavy fexes, toughness 7 is cool, an extra wound would be great. You could try dropping a unit of gaunts for the points. I don't know if that will gel well with your play style.

I bet you are using fleshborers because those are the models you have. If that is not the case, there is no reason not to run spinegaunts.

These are all meta-game specific nitpicks. You've made a great list.

I second what Shep said except I would put an extra wound on the carnifex before the extra T. I also thing that only one of the stealer squads should outflank and one should be a counter charge unit. I don't know about the ranged tyrant I usually just take Zoanthropes instead of going full Zilla (I run Nuke Choir instead). It's still a good list like I aid in my first post.

Thank you for the suggestions. I will consider them carefully.

I'm not a big fan of this for 2 reasons;

1) your victory points are very, very high. WoN is a great, and nifty, trick. But honestly I've found that troops of 20+ spinegaunts works better. Takes most people a few turns to knock em out, focusing fire away from other stuff.

2) Dakkarants are great, but you need some psych powers I reckon!

3) I'm not a fan of sniperfexes... yeah, they can glance stuff into uselessness... but their BS is sooooo poor I cannot justify it. And the fact everything under the sun gets saves from tyranid weapons. I normally only run 1 at 2000+ points in case I face off vs dark eldar, orks, or IG.

4) carapace on genestealers is useless bro... scuttlers are the way to go. if your genestealers don't tear apart a squad in CC in the first turn, you will probably lose a few with or without the carapace. And most of the time its a power weapon, so it doesn't help.

So for suggestions; make huge squads of gaunts instead of a bunch of smaller ones. Tyranids suffer because people get a LOTTA VP's while fighting us. Don't help em! Scuttlers on genestealers is a must. Otherwise not much else I can say, its pretty cookie cutter otherwise lol

winterman wrote:--I'd make a more long range support tryant (eg VC and other weapon of choice) to play catch for your WoN gaunts.
--Winged Tyrants can be great but the way 5ed works I really prefer walking tyrants with guard. YMMV.
--I like scytal/barb strangler more then twin dev carnifexes but it is all about preference. I just prefer the higher S and range and also the extra cc attack. I think they are better with the current focus on mech also.

Shep wrote:Another vote for strangle fexes instead of dakka fexes. Transport opening is a priority.

While I agree that transport opening is a priority (THANKS GW!) I personally feel that Strangle Fexes is a poor method of doing so:

Tank……. Weapon…….. Shot LDR Hit Pen Cover Destroy % Destry
Rhino…… Warp Blast…. 1.00 92% 50% 83% 50% 33% 6%
DakkaFex…… 8.00 100% 75% 17% 50% 33% 17%
Barb Strangler 1.00 100% 47% 50% 50% 33% 4%
Vindicator Warp Blast…. 1.00 90% 50% 50% 50% 33% 4%
Barb Strangler 1.00 100% 47% 17% 50% 33% 1%

How did I get a Hit % on Barbed Stanglers. They have a 1/3 of hitting straight up plus % of scattering onto the tank. I am feeling generous so assuming BS 2 and that you can scatter 2" in any direction from center and still hit, you can roll a 4 or less and still hit...that means there are 5 results on 2D6 that will give you an effective hit. Add them together amd you get 47%.

4% chance when the target is in cover is nothing but luck in my mind and I don't think I would leap for joy at a 17% chance from a DakkaFex either. Now you will likely bring up the plethera of AV 12 transports which nulifies the destructive power of DakkaFexes. Fair enough, but keep in mind that the strangle fex has even less of a chance (wonderfull isn't it?) of popping an AV 12 vehicle.

The lord giveth and he taketh away.

You are just a bit off on your calcs. For BS, it is actually worse then 47%. You are looking at a 4 in 9 chance of a hole under the vehicle, assuming 2" scatter. It is a 6 in 36 chance (or 1/6) of a 4 or less on 2d6 (1 result of 2, 2 results of 3 and 3 results of 4). So:

1/3 hit on scatter + (2/3 arrow * 1/6 Two inches or less scatter) = 4/9 chance (44.44%).

Also, devourers have a 1/6 chance at a destroy result, since they have no AP they are -1 on the vehicle damage chart.

So the odds still favor the dakkafex, but not nearly as much.
Dakkafex vs rhino in cover = 8.0% chance of at least one destroy result. This doesn't include the chance of stacking immobilize and weapon d results though.
Boomfex vs rhino in cover = 3.7% chance to destroy.

However that being said, range is a huge factor (and the main factor for my prefrence, beyond modelling considerations). With 18" you will be hampered in dawn of war, will require 1-2 turns to get in range, may need to chase your prey and will need to be in the threat range of melta guns inorder to hit that rhino. While a BS can sit back in relative safety, with more flexibility as to where it is placed and should be useable on turn 1.

The greater S also works in your favor against the higher AVs. Also those higher AVs are often times more sit and shoot, so again the range is important. Have fun getting a zoanthorpe within 18" of a leman russ or pred.

Lastly, you also have an extra CC attack on the boomfex, which is nice for late game objective clearing and whatnot.

These are just my viewpoints though. Dakkafex is still a workhorse and is by no means a bad choice.

Thank Winterman:

For some reason I thought Devourers had AP? Yep that makes Devourers worst than what I was thinking. How sad!

Anyways, what I was really getting at was the futility of destroying transports with ranged weapons. 3.7% might as well be 0%. And you are right in that I am not considering stacking 3 weapon/imobilized results = Destroyed. I haven't done the stastics (not sure how really) but it doesn't seam like it is really going to help the odds. I guess you could double the odds for the above list to represent the chance of scoring weapon destroyed/immobolized BUT you need 3 to add up.

Even stopping vehicles with a VC is iffy when they are in cover (and heah they can move 12" and still shoot special weapons out the top) so why shouldn't they get cover. 2 Shots...50% Hit...50% Cover...Auto Glance...2 results to stop movement = 1/3... nets you a 16%. Not to mention I am using a 100+ pt model to stop a 35 pt Rhino.

But Heah, you have a much better chance of destroying Orks Vehicles, Nob Bikes, and Green Horde in general! Nothing puts out the hurt on horde lists like Tyranid Dakka!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also found this little article about which is the more effective guant loadout
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/249986.page
I think someone pointed out it was the termagaunt without WON.