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Spartacus wrote:
T6 and a 5++ are pretty big durability factors in favour of War Walkers (vs Vypers). And because they can battle focus the difference in movement isn't very big either.

Its so close though, and they cost the same points. Probably the better question is what fits in the theme of your force, and your personal preference of the model itself (war walkers are a far newer kit).

A factor against the war walker is the lack of ability to fall back and fire if they get dragged into combat and maybe the fact it's heavy support where we do have some pretty tasty options to compete with but it's an extremely close call.

Fly is rather huge.

Vypers also have "They die to a stiff breeze, but that breeze cost more than the Vyper", when fielded cheaply.

Does anyone have any experience with the forgeworld cobra or scorpion? I have the opportunity to get one semi cheap (150$ us for a 260$ model...) and i dont know if its worth it or not. They look awsome but points wise seem expensive.

Azuza001 wrote:
Does anyone have any experience with the forgeworld cobra or scorpion? I have the opportunity to get one semi cheap (150$ us for a 260$ model...) and i dont know if its worth it or not. They look awsome but points wise seem expensive.

Of all the eldar super heavies I feel they are the only ones currently in an okay place (phantom is to but its 2.5k solo) they cost a decent chunk of points a d the scorpion more than the cobra but those pulsars will put stuff down pretty quick.





I've put up a list in the army list forum trying to utilise both avatars in a footdar list I'd appreciate some help there if anyone has advice. I'm running a reaper block with avengers and shining spears primarily.

Yeah, but the cobra scares me a bit, d6 shots has me worried of that dreaded 1 or 2. Then the enemy gets a 3++ and well, thats not gonna do much.....

Azuza001 wrote:
Yeah, but the cobra scares me a bit, d6 shots has me worried of that dreaded 1 or 2. Then the enemy gets a 3++ and well, thats not gonna do much.....

Yeah I prefer the scorpion in terms of output but it does have like a 100 point increase over the cobra with upgrades it's just over 700.

Titanicus wrote:

Azuza001 wrote:
Yeah, but the cobra scares me a bit, d6 shots has me worried of that dreaded 1 or 2. Then the enemy gets a 3++ and well, thats not gonna do much.....

Yeah I prefer the scorpion in terms of output but it does have like a 100 point increase over the cobra with upgrades it's just over 700.

Which is the other side of that coin. At 700+ pts for 3+/5++/6+++ it has some toughness to it for sure but its still really kinda all eggs 1 basket. At 550 pts the cobra is a little easier to swallow....

Azuza001 wrote:

Titanicus wrote:

Azuza001 wrote:
Yeah, but the cobra scares me a bit, d6 shots has me worried of that dreaded 1 or 2. Then the enemy gets a 3++ and well, thats not gonna do much.....

Yeah I prefer the scorpion in terms of output but it does have like a 100 point increase over the cobra with upgrades it's just over 700.

Which is the other side of that coin. At 700+ pts for 3+/5++/6+++ it has some toughness to it for sure but its still really kinda all eggs 1 basket. At 550 pts the cobra is a little easier to swallow....

Yeah the cobra is for sure the easier add to a list at 700 in on 1 model (cause you do want some upgrades) you need a lot of other high priority armour targets I think fireprisms work there. At least it then mutually forces one set to at least make it through or you to achieve something. I still prefer the scorpion though just because if I make this huge investment it should at least produce consistently good results and the pulsar does.

The Scorpion is now 700 pts standard I believe, its gun is terrifying but only really works against certain armies, mostly things like knights or other super heavy units, although it can also work against things like big custodes units.
If you can arrange a game against certain opponents it can work brilliantly but it's not a great choice in an army where you don't know your opposition.

Well in the FW Index the Scorpion is prized with 650pts and the weapon with 0 pts.

Battle Sribe says 710 pts. incl. weapon.

Don't know what is correct resep. do I over see an update?

I think Chapter Approved 2017 adjusted the price up a fair amount.

Maxamato wrote:
Well in the FW Index the Scorpion is prized with 650pts and the weapon with 0 pts.

Battle Sribe says 710 pts. incl. weapon.

Don't know what is correct resep. do I over see an update?

Chapter Approved 2017

Ah, ok thx.

kingheff wrote:
The Scorpion is now 700 pts standard I believe, its gun is terrifying but only really works against certain armies, mostly things like knights or other super heavy units, although it can also work against things like big custodes units.
If you can arrange a game against certain opponents it can work brilliantly but it's not a great choice in an army where you don't know your opposition.

It's pretty dang terrifying. It will pretty much nuke anything off the table in 1 round except a 3++ save knight. Also with -1 to hit trait it's never going to be less than -2 to hit turn 1 (basically indestructible) then you can fortune it. It's cost is quite high though for a unit that can't threaten more than 1 unit in a turn. When deepstrike was actaully playable - this unit basically took deepstrike away from your opponent because with forwarded - you would just get a free turn off shooting with a unit that auto destroys anything it shoots lol. It's even less valuable now that DS has been almost removed from the game with it's restrictions.

 Xenomancers wrote:

kingheff wrote:
The Scorpion is now 700 pts standard I believe, its gun is terrifying but only really works against certain armies, mostly things like knights or other super heavy units, although it can also work against things like big custodes units.
If you can arrange a game against certain opponents it can work brilliantly but it's not a great choice in an army where you don't know your opposition.

It's pretty dang terrifying. It will pretty much nuke anything off the table in 1 round except a 3++ save knight. Also with -1 to hit trait it's never going to be less than -2 to hit turn 1 (basically indestructible) then you can fortune it. It's cost is quite high though for a unit that can't threaten more than 1 unit in a turn. When deepstrike was actaully playable - this unit basically took deepstrike away from your opponent because with forwarded - you would just get a free turn off shooting with a unit that auto destroys anything it shoots lol. It's even less valuable now that DS has been almost removed from the game with it's restrictions.

Like I think its playable it's not fantastic but you could win with one in certain match ups at least. Vampire hunter and revenant though got dumpstered and tbh they were much harder to win with.

My general meta has a lot of knights in it. Also in the tournaments we run where forgeworld is allowed its 2500 pt lists and no restrictions on anything. I think i will pick it up. For the cost of 150$ it seems like a good deal. I don't think i would run it alitoc though, for 1 i hate that trait with a passion, dont like playing against it or with it (personal preference, i know competitive wise its THE choice) but i thinik Iyandin fits really well with it, keeping it at almost fully funcional until almost end game. Finally whats the thoughts on keeping something like this alive t1? If you deep stike it is it consider moving at full speed when it comes in t2? Or should i just hope for t1 and get the cover bonus if not and hope it lives long enough to get used?

How did the 40-wraith list get to top 8 of Socal?

karandrasss wrote:
How did the 40-wraith list get to top 8 of Socal?

If all tables were like the table on stream.
By hiding inside buildings so they could not get shot at.

 Ordana wrote:

karandrasss wrote:
How did the 40-wraith list get to top 8 of Socal?

If all tables were like the table on stream.
By hiding inside buildings so they could not get shot at.

link to the stream? twitch?

 Ordana wrote:

karandrasss wrote:
How did the 40-wraith list get to top 8 of Socal?

If all tables were like the table on stream.
By hiding inside buildings so they could not get shot at.

I don't understand this. The one game I saw that people talk about, the Guardsmen got on top of a building (which is a common way to deny charging), not inside one. Or did I miss something? Also apparently the trick requires LOS-ignoring units, and there are no Wraith units that do.

There were house rules related to how terrain works, which were pretty easily cheesed to have invulnerable infantry units.

Playing a small game tonight vs. Sisters:

++ Patrol Detachment (Imperium - Adeptus Ministorum) [61 PL, 1000pts] ++

+ HQ +

Celestine [14 PL, 250pts]: Celestine, 2x Geminae Superia, Inspiring Orator, Warlord

+ Troops +

Battle Sister Squad [8 PL, 92pts]
. 8x Battle Sister
. Battle Sister w/ Special Weapon: Storm bolter
. Sister Superior: Bolt pistol, Boltgun

+ Fast Attack +

Dominion Squad [10 PL, 128pts]
. Dominion
. Dominion Superior: Bolt pistol, Boltgun
. Dominion w/ Special Weapon: Meltagun
. Dominion w/ Special Weapon: Meltagun
. Dominion w/ Special Weapon: Meltagun
. Dominion w/ Special Weapon: Meltagun

Seraphim Squad [8 PL, 122pts]
. 7x Seraphim
. Seraphim Superior: Bolt pistol, Bolt pistol
. Seraphim w/ Special Weapons: 2x Hand Flamers
. Seraphim w/ Special Weapons: 2x Hand Flamers

+ Heavy Support +

Exorcist [8 PL, 143pts]: Hunter-killer missile, Storm bolter

Exorcist [8 PL, 143pts]: Hunter-killer missile, Storm bolter

+ Dedicated Transport +

Immolator [5 PL, 122pts]: Twin Multi-Melta

++ Total: [61 PL, 1000pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe (https://battlescribe.net)

 Gangrel767 wrote:

 Ordana wrote:

karandrasss wrote:
How did the 40-wraith list get to top 8 of Socal?

If all tables were like the table on stream.
By hiding inside buildings so they could not get shot at.

link to the stream? twitch?

Frontlinegaming_tv on twitch.

karandrasss wrote:
How did the 40-wraith list get to top 8 of Socal?

To be fair, wraithguard are deceptively difficult to kill, especially if they get buffed up with things like protect, conceal, or fortune. I’ve personally had the displeasure of chewing through a 10 man unit a few times. I can hardly imagine what 4 of those would be like. You just kind of hit target saturation. Your strength 4 guns are not used to wounding on 5’s and having no infantry units that they want to shoot at. Same goes for your close combat, and all of your strength 5. Hope you strength 3 stuff likes wounding on sixes. It’s like Custodes bikes but with less range on their anti infantry, a worse armor save and no invuln, but cheaper per wound. And with much better defenses vs mortal wounds, which definitely are a weakness of primary Custodes armies.

Could we get the WG list copy-pasted here, for all those folks like me too internet-illiterate to find it?

Spartacus wrote:
Could we get the WG list copy-pasted here, for all those folks like me too internet-illiterate to find it?

It’s on the best coast pairings app, along with all of the other lists for this event

I love this ^

I'm curious how this list was run. With the 3 units of wraiths being too big to fit in transports I guess two would go in the webway but the third is left foot slogging?

kingheff wrote:
I'm curious how this list was run. With the 3 units of wraiths being too big to fit in transports I guess two would go in the webway but the third is left foot slogging?

Right, exactly -- and only 5 command points, so you're down to 2 off the bat with the webway. I don't want to call fluke on anybody doing well at a tournament, but I couldn't see how one would reproduce this. I bet this person benefited considerably from the tournament parameters.

I wonder what was the purpose of the DE patrol is? Stratagems? Would it not be better to flesh out the Supreme command detachment as a CW battalion?