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Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Omadon's Realm

The internet, the great leveller. On the internet you can be as anonymous as you care to be, you can adopt any persona you like.

Now, in the course of playing mmos and communicating on forums I have encountered many people but the one that has puzzled me is the GIRL (Guy In Real Life), who masquerades as female.

Why is it do you suppose that certain men pretend to be women on the internet? To elicit support and freebies in these games or forums? To explore issues of sexuality they cannot examine or enjoy in real life? Several I spoke to just liked the look of the female characters better, but are they misleading others in the mmo if they are usually assumed to be female on first being encountered? One guy on our server kept up the fiction of a female personality not only in the game but across into the server forums until he slipped up and was revealed to be a guy, folks were very angry but did they have a right to be?

Do women ever pretend to be men? I did know one woman who played eq2 using a male character in order to evade the sexual advances of some of the male majority. I would like to hear from dakka's female population, many of whom I know play computer games.

Is it wrong to pretend in this way? How honest are people obliged to be on the vast and anonymous interwebs?

What are your thoughts dakkites?



 
   
Made in gb
Plummeting Black Templar Thunderhawk Pilot






Worcester, UK

I use second life and I am actually use to people doing this. I think you are right, they are either trying to explore a sexual side they cannot do normally, or they find that people are far more likely to talk to them because their AV looks female.

Its nowhere near as common, but I have seen girls with male AV's too.

 
   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Omadon's Realm

See, I get the playing of a computer game using a female toon, a hot lookin highelf chick turned to ebil shadowknight and wearing platemail riding a nightmare steed looks good.

But second life doesn't have any 'rules' per say? It's like real life yes? With jobs and parks and so on, it looked very boring to me since there isn't anything to sword up or fireball. So a man impersonating a woman there would be doing so for the purpose of roleplay and possibly entering into personal relations with male users whilst pretending to be female. This to me seems very wrong and deceptive, especially for the guy the sexual imposter is 'cyboring' with.

Is anyone here brave enough to say that they have pretended to be a gender they are not over the internet and why they did it?




 
   
Made in gb
Plummeting Black Templar Thunderhawk Pilot






Worcester, UK

For Dakka purposes, I can only imagine that they are praying on the people that don't tend to flame females for fear of appearing sexist yada yada etc.

Personally, its not really an issue with me as I'm very open minded about such things and know that people get their kicks from many different and sometimes unexpected ways.

 
   
Made in nl
[MOD]
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Cozy cockpit of an Archer ARC-5S

For the records, I am a bloke. Not that it stops the dirty PM's I get every now and then..



Fatum Iustum Stultorum



Fiat justitia ruat caelum

 
   
Made in au
Killer Klaivex






Forever alone

BrookM wrote:For the records, I am a bloke. Not that it stops the dirty PM's I get every now and then..

What?

All my (rather perverse) hopes and dreams have been crushed. Feth you man.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/08/20 13:26:24


People are like dice, a certain Frenchman said that. You throw yourself in the direction of your own choosing. People are free because they can do that. Everyone's circumstances are different, but no matter how small the choice, at the very least, you can throw yourself. It's not chance or fate. It's the choice you made. 
   
Made in gb
Plummeting Black Templar Thunderhawk Pilot






Worcester, UK

For those unfamilier, Second Life is a virtual world, much like World of Warcraft but isn't combat orientated

Yep, I tried it on Second life, it was simple as clicking an option from male to female and your AV changes appearence. I messed around with it a little and saw the attraction of why people do it. I will also add that when i did this my AV had a male name so anyone wise enough wouldn't have been fooled during the trial and i only did it for a single evening during my three years on SL. And yes, I did recieve a lot more PM's than normal which confirms what you said.

Personally that experience alone was enough to put me off the concept, but hey, I'm open minded so I at least tried it before hashing it.

When you play things that you are able to get involved with to a great depth such as SL, then its easy to get hurt when you find out that someone you thought was female was actually male (I've had people do this a lot). It might be virtual but you can still get attached to someone and once you know about it, its hard to act the same around them.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2009/08/20 13:29:07


 
   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Omadon's Realm

@ BrookM
You aren't that segsah girl in your pics...

Do you know her then, can you link her facebook? /stalk

Just how many of those pms do you get?

lulz

Hellsguardian, I was supprised to learn that a male half elf bruiser I had often gone dungeonbashing with was a girl IRL, I found that out a full year past our first meeting and conversations incharacter on the roleplay server of eq2. Her dps was tré Ub3r.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/08/20 13:30:15




 
   
Made in nl
[MOD]
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Cozy cockpit of an Archer ARC-5S

WAR wasn't that bad thankfully, I had one guy constantly bugging my female witch hunter Genevieve Dieudonne (I love those books okay) until I told him that I had a tackle box. A site like Gaia on the other hand.. gak. Though that's another case all together.



Fatum Iustum Stultorum



Fiat justitia ruat caelum

 
   
Made in gb
Fresh-Faced New User




UK

The internet....

Where guys are guys, 'girls' are guys and children are undercover police...!

"War does not determine who is right - only who is left."

"A stupid man's report of what a clever man says can never be accurate, because he unconsciously translates what he hears into something he can understand."

-Bertrand Russell 
   
Made in gb
Wrathful Warlord Titan Commander





Ramsden Heath, Essex

Sorry, I'm not a gurl and don't play online games either, but I thought I would ask a question. Do you not also think that there could be a further roleplaying reason to this? I.e. you also get people that also change sex for pen and paper RPGs. Not considered too weird I don't think.

BrookM who is the lady in question? She looks like she should be famous and known to me but quite frankly I know little of pop culture especially whether it involves Holland?

EDIT - punctuation corrected, I am no longer sorry I am not a gurl (don't want to open that door thank you very much!)

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/08/20 13:58:21


How do you promote your Hobby? - Legoburner "I run some crappy wargaming website " 
   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Omadon's Realm

BrookM wrote:WAR wasn't that bad thankfully, I had one guy constantly bugging my female witch hunter Genevieve Dieudonne (I love those books okay) until I told him that I had a tackle box. A site like Gaia on the other hand.. gak. Though that's another case all together.


I loved reading Drachenfels, I have never read any of the other Genevieve books, were they any good?



 
   
Made in us
Hangin' with Gork & Mork






Usually my main in a MMO is male but if I make a secondary character it could be female. I never lie about it though.

The animation and graphics determine it oftentimes as well. If a models animation are not aesthetically pleasing to me I might take the female route if they are better. If I have to watch a sword swing a million times I at least want to not be annoyed by it. In WAR I picked a female Zealot because the male animations annoyed me for some reason. My main is a Choppa so there wasn't really an issue of gender.

My wife plays MMO's and the free stuff she gets w/o having to ask or even show any kind of interest is really embarrassing.

Amidst the mists and coldest frosts he thrusts his fists against the posts and still insists he sees the ghosts.
 
   
Made in gb
Plummeting Black Templar Thunderhawk Pilot






Worcester, UK

notprop wrote:Sorry, I'm not a gurl and don't play online games either, but I thought I would ask a question. Do you not also think that there could be a further roleplaying reason to this? I.e. you also get people that also change sex for pen and paper RPGs. Not considered too weird I don't think.


For roleplaying purposes I don't have any issues with it as generally its known that the person is male during the roleplay as its something that has been agreed with various people such as your clan or friends etc. What we are detailing is people who use a female avatar and pretend to be female in reallife as well. Decieving poeple into thinking they are something they are not.

I can't comment on World of Warcraft to much as I have never actually played it. WOW differs from Second Life because SL is more a virtual chat room whereas WOW is virtual combat game so the laws and accepted unofficial code of conduct will differ greatly between games. I can only assume that female WOW aren't flaunting there avatars around in an attempt to become popular as they are their to game, whereas SL is more so like that.

Perhaps I'm reading to much into it
If I'm talking boll@cks about WOW then please feel free to call me out on it, as I said, I've never played so my assumptions are based on what I have seen on the game only

 
   
Made in us
The Last Chancer Who Survived





Norristown, PA

in WoW my main char was a guy, but I had an alt night elf hunter chick, cuz it the character looked good. In games like that when you get in a guild and everyone is using voice chat for raids, you learn who the RealGirls are pretty quick. And then all the guys start hitting on em.

I do know of a few gals that played guy characters just because they were tired of always being hit on when they played.

 
   
Made in gb
[DCM]
Coastal Bliss in the Shadow of Sizewell





Suffolk, where the Aliens roam.

Pretty much all my MMO characters are female, to be blatently honest as Meangreen said, if you're going to watch a toon all day, it might as well have a cute behind.

I have a couple of males, a Rakarth wannbe B/Elf Hunter, and a Tauren DK just because they look mean, but in general aye female.
All those noted in my sig are females for example, and the three characters I've been testing this week in Champions Online have been female also.

I do have a Roleplay side to this call however, as DM I run alot of games. I control a hell of a lot of female PC's.
So many that now some nineteen years after I began, I can throw a pretty convincing female voice. Some of the strongest female characters in my games are female, not sure why but I'm drawn to a strong female lead.
It also probably has something about the fact I play a lot of those RPG game's with my wife and her 'in game' friends are run by me. Okay I also can do all the other stuff if needbe, and its rare for her characters not to be involved with someone once they've reached forty of fifty sessions, but thats another story.

As for using my female toon to get stuff, nope not at all.
I have had male toons help me for no apparent reason, offer me items etc, but its lessened off in the last year. I think folks are getting more wise to the fact that although a lot of women do indeed play games like WoW, many of the females walking around are infact males behind the keyboard.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/08/20 15:30:43


"That's not an Ork, its a girl.." - Last words of High General Daran Ul'tharem, battle of Ursha VII.

Two White Horses (Ipswich Town and Denver Broncos Supporter)
 
   
Made in gb
Avatar of the Bloody-Handed God






Inside your mind, corrupting the pathways

I usually play female characters in RPG's because I play RPG's to get away from the world, and there is nothing more away from the world than being a different sex

It is one of the reasons that I will often choose to play some crazy monster/alien character if the DM/game lets me. I get the chance to be something utterly different and live through that character.

Plus, as has been mentioned, male avatars are often bloody ugly. The ladies usually look fantastic

I have, on occasion, created female personas on t'internet. Almost exclusively on a single forum that I used to (and still occasionally do) post on a lot and where I was well known.

It was refreshing to just try thinking like someone different for a change and just to get away from it all. Almost like a holiday in a way.

It always used to interest me the different way that people treated me as a "girl" than as a guy. Even people that I had known a while did it. I usually gave myself away with my lack of spelling and rather distinctive grammar. But when I motivated myself to run my posts through a spell checker etc, I could often go undetected until people checked my IP.

I think I did it because I don't always want to live my life as me... sometimes it is good to be someone else, even for a while.

Plus it is great to have people be interested in you (not even in a sexual way, just talking to you etc), which I do not often get just being me.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/08/20 17:37:34


   
Made in gb
Pulsating Possessed Chaos Marine




UK

I've read afew discussions on forums about this in the past and I'm still of the opinion that it's like crossdressing.

People have said about it being because they like watching their female avatar's ass wiggling up and down (and I respect that), but the novelty I think would wear off, as well as the fact you'd be PM'ed by confused horny teenagers.

I prefer seeing things from a male perspective (and that is the key word) as you are treated as how you look. And I prefer not to be hit on by other blokes.

This subject got quite heated on another forum and there was a counter argument by serial "GIRLs" that if you have a male avatar you must be gay

I see my avatar in rpgs as a representation of myself, rather than something to give me the horn.
   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Omadon's Realm

Skarwael wrote:I've read afew discussions on forums about this in the past and I'm still of the opinion that it's like crossdressing.

People have said about it being because they like watching their female avatar's ass wiggling up and down (and I respect that), but the novelty I think would wear off, as well as the fact you'd be PM'ed by confused horny teenagers.

I prefer seeing things from a male perspective (and that is the key word) as you are treated as how you look. And I prefer not to be hit on by other blokes.

This subject got quite heated on another forum and there was a counter argument by serial "GIRLs" that if you have a male avatar you must be gay

I see my avatar in rpgs as a representation of myself, rather than something to give me the horn.


So, is it about whether or not you are roleplaying in the mmo? Cos I tell ya, every witchelf bar one that I talked with in vent on WAR during warbands in RvR areas were dudes enjoying seeing a mostly nude elf lady running round their screen all day.

Then again, is it about engaging in 'adult roleplay' a'la cyboring emotes and tells to other players?



 
   
Made in gb
Pulsating Possessed Chaos Marine




UK

MeanGreenStompa wrote:
Skarwael wrote:I've read afew discussions on forums about this in the past and I'm still of the opinion that it's like crossdressing.

People have said about it being because they like watching their female avatar's ass wiggling up and down (and I respect that), but the novelty I think would wear off, as well as the fact you'd be PM'ed by confused horny teenagers.

I prefer seeing things from a male perspective (and that is the key word) as you are treated as how you look. And I prefer not to be hit on by other blokes.

This subject got quite heated on another forum and there was a counter argument by serial "GIRLs" that if you have a male avatar you must be gay

I see my avatar in rpgs as a representation of myself, rather than something to give me the horn.


So, is it about whether or not you are roleplaying in the mmo? Cos I tell ya, every witchelf bar one that I talked with in vent on WAR during warbands in RvR areas were dudes enjoying seeing a mostly nude elf lady running round their screen all day.

Then again, is it about engaging in 'adult roleplay' a'la cyboring emotes and tells to other players?


Probably the latter, but still, blokes that have female characters all seem slightly dubious to me in that they might enjoy being treated like a woman.
   
Made in gb
[DCM]
Coastal Bliss in the Shadow of Sizewell





Suffolk, where the Aliens roam.

SilverMK2 wrote:I usually play female characters in RPG's because I play RPG's to get away from the world, and there is nothing more away from the world than being a different sex

It is one of the reasons that I will often choose to play some crazy monster/alien character if the DM/game lets me. I get the chance to be something utterly different and live through that character.


Aye I can dig that, the very few times (and it is few, almost count on one hand) I've not been the Dm/ST in A RPG game I've picked something outlandish, often female to play something different. Tbh that has a lot to do with my choices in computer games, I've never been one to play 'myself'


Of course as the Dm/ST there is the flip side of the situation when I have to RP romantic stuff as female npc's towards male PC's, that can feel kind odd when your having a relationship building IC conversation with a good mate.


I should probably note I do have a slightly different situation in that I play most MMO's with my wife, so folks will see two girls going around together. We've played twins a couple of times due to the fact we are always together on those characters, we also have siblings on some servers, shes even played males to my female on others.



This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/08/20 19:47:31


"That's not an Ork, its a girl.." - Last words of High General Daran Ul'tharem, battle of Ursha VII.

Two White Horses (Ipswich Town and Denver Broncos Supporter)
 
   
Made in nl
[MOD]
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Cozy cockpit of an Archer ARC-5S

MeanGreenStompa wrote:
BrookM wrote:WAR wasn't that bad thankfully, I had one guy constantly bugging my female witch hunter Genevieve Dieudonne (I love those books okay) until I told him that I had a tackle box. A site like Gaia on the other hand.. gak. Though that's another case all together.


I loved reading Drachenfels, I have never read any of the other Genevieve books, were they any good?
I like them, one of the few series that ends with a happy ending and a marriage. The third book is a bit of an odd one, with Genevieve only getting a quick cameo, but it is a great read, especially the Dirty Harry rip-off "Filthy Harald" found there with his big ass Magnin throwing knife.

/ threadjack



Fatum Iustum Stultorum



Fiat justitia ruat caelum

 
   
Made in us
Wrack Sufferer





Bat Country

MeanGreenStompa wrote:
Why is it do you suppose that certain men pretend to be women on the internet? To elicit support and freebies in these games or forums? To explore issues of sexuality they cannot examine or enjoy in real life?


The exploration of sexuality one cannot examine in real life with the assumed belief that one is in fact female is a motivating factor behind it. The freebies that one is sometimes showered with act as a bonus and further incentive to explore ones sexuality. I won't lie, I've done it. But I believe I'm more comfortable in a male persona than a female one, although I am not pleased with the cultural expectations that are heaped upon me as a male.

I'm also not a fan of the hyper masculinity in many of the depictions of the male character models that goes on in video games and advertising. You see a male underwear model on a billboard, that isn't what the human form really looks like. I prefer a form closer to myself, slender, lithe, not overly muscled. When I see other men I prefer them to be similar to my body structure but with more weight on them (I have inferiority issues with my body). Because of my distaste of a perceived false interpretation of the male human form I often choose the female model because it is closer to my perception of myself in the raw physical build of the character, slender and lithe. It might also be that there is some discrimination going on when considering how much time gets put into the male models as opposed to the female models in games.

tl;dr: I've pretended to be a chic and play as a chic in video games. You'd probably think I'm gay.

MeanGreenStompa wrote:Do women ever pretend to be men? I did know one woman who played eq2 using a male character in order to evade the sexual advances of some of the male majority. I would like to hear from dakka's female population, many of whom I know play computer games.

Is it wrong to pretend in this way? How honest are people obliged to be on the vast and anonymous interwebs?

What are your thoughts dakkites?


I know women who roll male characters because of the reason that men play female characters given above. They also play male characters in video games to avoid the kind of favoritism that goes on.

I don't think it's wrong at all. It just opens you up to learn yourself a little better by both fooling others and being fooled oneself about someones sexual orientation and physical sexual persuasion.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/08/20 19:53:46


Once upon a time, I told myself it's better to be smart than lucky. Every day, the world proves me wrong a little more. 
   
Made in gb
[DCM]
Et In Arcadia Ego





Canterbury

Just a quick query, and it's not a pop or anything I assure you.

..do any of the people who play as the opposite gender only play as "hawt" characters, or do you/they sometimes play as more .."normal"... looking women ? I appreciate in your average RPG there's not many "normal" or unhandsomeboymodellingschool types around as other options.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/08/20 20:03:51


The poor man really has a stake in the country. The rich man hasn't; he can go away to New Guinea in a yacht. The poor have sometimes objected to being governed badly; the rich have always objected to being governed at all
We love our superheroes because they refuse to give up on us. We can analyze them out of existence, kill them, ban them, mock them, and still they return, patiently reminding us of who we are and what we wish we could be.
"the play's the thing wherein I'll catch the conscience of the king,
 
   
Made in gb
[DCM]
Coastal Bliss in the Shadow of Sizewell





Suffolk, where the Aliens roam.

I've played Tauren females.


Hehe, but aye, yes I have in Werewolf, had a scabby little Bone Gnawer girl, who wanted to be a black Fury, hated Men, actually she hated women as well because they wouldn't let her join up.

Good times.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/08/20 20:03:33


"That's not an Ork, its a girl.." - Last words of High General Daran Ul'tharem, battle of Ursha VII.

Two White Horses (Ipswich Town and Denver Broncos Supporter)
 
   
Made in nl
[MOD]
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Cozy cockpit of an Archer ARC-5S

My WAR character was more a minger than a minx, with a scarred face and an eye patch. Funny enough when I went back to T1 locations as a level 20 character to look for tome entries and to explore a bit I was treated like a benevolent matron of sorts. All the formal saluting and bowing and the over the top banter of "fair lady, please help us slay the giant" which died very quickly under a barrage of pistol shots.

But it was odd. The guy I mentioned before seemed normal compared to that.



Fatum Iustum Stultorum



Fiat justitia ruat caelum

 
   
Made in jp
[MOD]
Anti-piracy Officer






Somewhere in south-central England.

Surely any intelligent person must wonder what it is like to be a member of the opposite sex, and role-playing (in table top games or on the Internet) is a limited way to explore that.

Plus if you have a girl name people don't call you cigarette and colourful and lighthearted, or interested in musical theatre, in online games.

I'm writing a load of fiction. My latest story starts here... This is the index of all the stories...

We're not very big on official rules. Rules lead to people looking for loopholes. What's here is about it. 
   
Made in gb
[DCM]
Et In Arcadia Ego





Canterbury

Kilkrazy wrote:Surely any intelligent person must wonder what it is like to be a member of the opposite sex,


.... does watching lesbian pron fulfill this criteria ? It's just for research purpose. Honest.

The poor man really has a stake in the country. The rich man hasn't; he can go away to New Guinea in a yacht. The poor have sometimes objected to being governed badly; the rich have always objected to being governed at all
We love our superheroes because they refuse to give up on us. We can analyze them out of existence, kill them, ban them, mock them, and still they return, patiently reminding us of who we are and what we wish we could be.
"the play's the thing wherein I'll catch the conscience of the king,
 
   
Made in us
Hangin' with Gork & Mork






reds8n wrote:
Kilkrazy wrote:Surely any intelligent person must wonder what it is like to be a member of the opposite sex,


.... does watching lesbian pron fulfill this criteria ? It's just for research purpose. Honest.



Amidst the mists and coldest frosts he thrusts his fists against the posts and still insists he sees the ghosts.
 
   
Made in gb
[DCM]
Et In Arcadia Ego





Canterbury

No one takes my research seriously !


The poor man really has a stake in the country. The rich man hasn't; he can go away to New Guinea in a yacht. The poor have sometimes objected to being governed badly; the rich have always objected to being governed at all
We love our superheroes because they refuse to give up on us. We can analyze them out of existence, kill them, ban them, mock them, and still they return, patiently reminding us of who we are and what we wish we could be.
"the play's the thing wherein I'll catch the conscience of the king,
 
   
 
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