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I'm posting this on behalf of a friend who plays Nids.

He Runs a Swarm Army, Led by a Flyrant (seems a bit strange to me, but ohwell...), and a few warrior squads. Don't know exactly what he takes, cause i don't like bugs.
He can generally deal with most things fine, and just eats it all up, But he has one big Problem. Tanks. People keep running Land raider Crusaders, and Redeemers and monoliths against him, and hes completely incapable of destroying them. So, what stuff can a Swarmy Nid army take to deal with big AV14 [insert better word than thingies]????

There are two options AFAIK.

1. Godfex, have it run every turn and try to hit the tank with S10, against most tanks that will be overkill, against the monolith it's a good start.

2. Venom cannon, is horrible, it can only glance unless the vehicle is open topped. and the cannon is not AP1, so it has a hard time killing things.

Other than that...there isn't very much (maybe nids will get an AP1 gun next codex )

Whats the strength of a tyrant? its a monsterous creature, doesn't it have a chance at popping av14?

Broodlord can try rending =\ although he could probably be terrorizing something else more effectively...

Tyranids have a big problem dealing with tanks.

They're getting a new codex soon, which might help.

Until then, he could try putting Warp Blast on his Flyrant. It might help a bit. Other things that work okay are shooty fexes- barbed strangler plus venom cannon. He'd want more than one though- to reliably deal with them.

For Land Raiders, getting a strength boosted Hive Tyrant onto it might help. But it's risky, and whatever is inside stands to pwn your friends Tyrant afterwards.

Da Boss wrote:They're getting a new codex soon, which might help.

starbomber109 wrote:(maybe nids will get an AP1 gun next codex )

Hopefully, I hate to see army's failing do to poor design. (I am a DE fan lol)

About the only thing I've ever gotten to work is flying my hive tyrant in and charging land raiders/monoliths to try to destroy them.
This is a suicide tactic, especially against the land raiders full of chaos lords and terminators...

It is kind of disappointing that we have to design our HQ's and essentially 'shoot' a several hundred point MC torpedo at AV14 in an attempt to destroy it while most other armies can hand their infantry a couple of meltas to do the same thing.

I too run swarm nids which I think are AWESOME! Tell your friend to try to fill out his force organization and put as many models on the table as possible.

At 1500 points I can usually get over a hundred models including 2 or 3 MCs. Maybe not as efficient as Nidzilla (you'll lose your 70ish spine gaunts crossing the table without a bit of luck and maybe some terrain) but its really fun to play. Flyrants, elite fexes and 3 Zoanthropes will help you bring them down! At the very least, nids are fast enough to tie up that big tank (this is what gaunts are for!) while destroying the smaller, elitest units other armies rely on.

My dad fields some bloody nasty Fex's on me. Ol' One Eye, ect.
What you want here, becasue you dont get the extra D6, is lots of attacks and the +1 str.
str10. Sything Claws, Crab-Claws, and the extra Str will get you D6+1 Str10 attacks.
Thats on average 5 attacks, with a 1/3 chance of penetrating. You should make 1 or 2 penetrating hits a turn and a glance if your lucky.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, a rediculous amount of genestealers with the +1 str can do it, (prefferably with the brood lord, becasue of its Str) becasue if they roll a 6 to penetrate, they get an extra D3. That and they have a rediculous number of attacks, you should get enough glancing hits to imobilise, destroy weapons, and when tehres nothing left, it counts as Destroyed. (I did this once to a pred using 10 Lesser Daemons)

Has he thought about using Zoanthropes with the super-balst. The new rules mean it's mich easier to screen then till they get in range - crappy BS but they are better than nothing. A walking tyrant with guard and blast can also do the job.

I use 3 melee fexes, +1 str +1 ini +1 wound +1 sv, 2 sets of claws, tusks, and spine banks. I rarely send my flyrant into combat with transports as they usually dont make it out.

Zoanthropes can work, S10 works as well as can be expected. But you do have an extra fail chance and short range.

All in all I dont mind nids being a weak anti vehicle army, with all the lascannon around its nice to see vehicles being above the curve once in a while.

Slam forward,suck it up, shoot vehicles as and when practical while youi eat up all the infantry, yum yum.

Thanks for the help
I'll pass all this on.

Off topic: ?

If the guy running landraider spam calls any of that cheese, it's really pot calling kettle black.

ManwithIronHands wrote:I use 3 melee fexes, +1 str +1 ini +1 wound +1 sv, 2 sets of claws, tusks, and spine banks. I rarely send my flyrant into combat with transports as they usually dont make it out.

You can only take 1 pair of crushing claws.

Also good luck with the whole "wasting 900 points" thing.

Orlanth wrote:Zoanthropes can work, S10 works as well as can be expected. But you do have an extra fail chance and short range.

All in all I dont mind nids being a weak anti vehicle army, with all the lascannon around its nice to see vehicles being above the curve once in a while.

Slam forward,suck it up, shoot vehicles as and when practical while youi eat up all the infantry, yum yum.

Zoanthropes sound good on paper, until...

Psychic test.
18" range.
To hit with BS3.
Vehicle penetration.
Vehicle damage table.

In other words, in order to damage a land raider with our most effective ranged option, you have to pass Ld10 (easy, but Perils sucks with a 6 invulnerable save), 4+ to hit (bad), 5+ to penetrate (really bad), and then hope you don't botch the damage table roll (really REALLY bad).

Don't even consider meleeing a land raider, because supposing you do, all you do is guarantee a free charge for the berzerkers/wolf guard/assault terminators/initiates/whatever inside that you were hoping to keep away from your pricey HQ/HS units. Even in the case that you run, say, 6 melee fexes, you're still stuck chasing the damn thing like a 4th edition broodlord swiping at marines. Even with Run, you can never assault a land raider that drives away from you-- the maximum Run roll is the same as your assault distance, which is equal to the vehicle movement range, so he either starts away from you and stays away from your or he starts away from you and gets further away from you.



OP: Your friend is screwed. Tell him to wait until January and spend the meantime painting and assembling all his unfinished models. Tyranids have absolutely no practical way of dealing with AV14.

Don't take Zoes for anti-mech. They have roughly a 12% chance of taking out a...Rhino...when it is NOT in cover. Against LR, you are looking at a whopping 5%, again, not in cover.

The problem is, when it comes to shooting, nothing is much better. Which leaves you with CC. Awesome, right? Up untill you realize you have to weather 2 turns of shooting only to blow up a couple 35 point transports and have thier contents pound what remains of your list.

Now I won't say Nids can't win against Mech. I will just say it is an uphill battle that relies on your opponent making mistakes and you making none.

My advice, play deamon and ork lists till 2010.

take 3 fex's with claws in close combat!
THEY KILL EVERYTHING

In Apoc I saw three carni's take down a Baneblade

Presuming they get there first. Apoc is not a source of accurate tactical info.

A Carnifex with Venom Cannon/Barbed Strangler actually isn't bad 2 str 10 shots. 1 usually hits and glances for me. Hopefully stopping enemy light transports and raiders or taking of the heavy weps off which hurt you. I usually run 3 of them but seeing he plays swarm i won't suggest it.

*edit* everything besides Genestealers are fail at close combat, sure yeah my carnifex just axed your land raider, oh wait how many power attacks from the terminators inside. So i destoryed a 250pt LR and lost a 200+ Carnifex(assuming it has all the defensive upgrades which if it didn't well have fun with missle lauchers and plasma....

You mean 2 S10 glancing only shots. You left out a very important detail. Not to mention the whole "50% chance to hit" deal despite the 150-point price tag. Hey, at least it's a near-guaranteed glance, even if glances are ABSOLUTELY WORTHLESS.

Broken Loose wrote:You mean 2 S10 glancing only shots. You left out a very important detail. Not to mention the whole "50% chance to hit" deal despite the 150-point price tag. Hey, at least it's a near-guaranteed glance, even if glances are ABSOLUTELY WORTHLESS.

note that i say 1 usually hits and glances for me.... read please.

the point of tyranids anti tank is really to stop them moving or take of the weapons. Half the time destorying tanks can be a pain. Why last game i got my friend's raider immobile first turn that made him have to disembark meaning he lost moving 6inches towards me with his termiantors in theory, he actually cheated and moved them because it was my 3rd game ever.

PRO TIP new players read the rules extra careful and don't let people who have played for longer twist them.

The only real anti-tank Nids have are Melee carnifexes. Sniperfexes (venomcannon/Barbed strangler) CAN blow up anything below AV14 pretty reliably (due to 2d6 pick the highest from the BS), but its a long shot. Honestly, Str 10 carnifexes are the only way you will kill monoliths and the best way to kill raiders (because Hive Tyrants are only str 6 so you need at least an 8 on the 2d6 (20% chance) to at least glance av14. genestealers are another option, but much more flagile and much more risky.

Barbed stranglers are not ordnance so they don't get the 2D6. Taking out vehicles you have very few options. Melee with MC's, VC's or warp blast. All suck.

BS use the large blast template and cause pinning, however, they are not ordinance.