Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I am going to start a Chaos Demons army in a couple of months so I want to be sure I understand the deployment for them in Apocalypse games. For Chaos Demons in normal games, you divide your army in 2 parts, and then roll for which part comes in first via deep strike, with the second part being placed in reserves and then coming in on later turns via deep strike, rolling for each unit in reserve. However, Deep Strike is part of the Reserves rule and Apocalypse replaces the normal reserve rule with "Strategic Reserve" in which everything that is not deployed at the beginning of the battle is placed in strategic reserve. In turn 2, half of your reserves come in, and then in turn 3 the remaining part of your reserves come in.

So that leaves at least 3 possible ways of deploying demons.

1. Divide your army as normal, roll for which part comes in first, then the rest comes in via deep strike on later turns by rolling the appropriate number on the current turn for each unit in reserves.

2. Divide your army as normal, roll for which part comes in first, then place the rest in Strategic Reserve. On turn 2, half of those in reserve come in via deep strike, and on turn 3 the remainder comes in via deep strike. No dice rolls involved (except for scatter).

3. Deploy what you want at the beginning of the battle, and anything that is not deployed during the allotted time is placed in Strategic Reserve. In turn 2 half of your reserves come in via deep strike, and in turn 3 the remainder arrive via deep strike. No dice rolls involved (except for scatter).

4. Some other method?

Which is the correct way?

Deep Strike isn't a part of the Reserves rule, it's a separate Mission Special Rule.

Going by the rules as you've presented them (I don't have the Daemons codex yet) you would Deep Strike the first half as listed in the Daemons book, and then the Strategic Reserves would apply to the rest.

What I mean is that they are both a form of "reserve" and use the same "Reserves Table" to determine when units arrive, which is something that Strategic Reserves in Apocalypse doesn't follow.

Deep strike requires you placing the unit in reserve. As such, yes, T1 you'd roll for the first half. T2 half of the rest comes in. T3 the rest comes in. They scatter like normal. Simple enough! However, remember, demons cannot assault when they come in (unless apoc has some crazy rule like PS does). So if they cannot assault the first turn your in for a very painful battle in many cases in apoc... I cannot say I've seen demons in apoc, but I wouldn't imagine they'd be much fun lol!

Zid wrote:Deep strike requires you placing the unit in reserve.

Nope. Deep Striking is generally done by units in Reserve, and because of this the Deep Strike rules are written with Reserve units in mind, but there are special cases were units are given the ability to Deep Strike without being in reserve first (Necron Lord's teleporting ability, Space Marine Gate power... and in this case, Daemons' first turn Deep Strike.

insaniak wrote:

Zid wrote:Deep strike requires you placing the unit in reserve.

Nope. Deep Striking is generally done by units in Reserve, and because of this the Deep Strike rules are written with Reserve units in mind, but there are special cases were units are given the ability to Deep Strike without being in reserve first (Necron Lord's teleporting ability, Space Marine Gate power... and in this case, Daemons' first turn Deep Strike.

The demons FIRST turn DS is an exception, with the other half of your army in reserve as normal (still roll, but everything has to deep strike). Thats what I was saying haha. Demons don't do crazy teleports like Librarians or Necron Lords!

insaniak wrote:

Zid wrote:Deep strike requires you placing the unit in reserve.

Nope. Deep Striking is generally done by units in Reserve, and because of this the Deep Strike rules are written with Reserve units in mind, but there are special cases were units are given the ability to Deep Strike without being in reserve first (Necron Lord's teleporting ability, Space Marine Gate power... and in this case, Daemons' first turn Deep Strike.

Actually the *entire daemon army* starts the game in reserve, but alters the usual reserve rule to ensure half the units come in first time. Exactly the same as Drop Pods are in reserve but modifies this to make half come in first turn.

Thus it works exactly as presented above for Apoc - half the units come in first turn, as normal for Daemons, half the remainder come in 2nd turn, final quarter in the 3rd turn. Unless of course you but the faster reserve table, in wqhich case 3/4 the army appears first turn...

nosferatu1001 wrote:Actually the *entire daemon army* starts the game in reserve, but alters the usual reserve rule to ensure half the units come in first time. Exactly the same as Drop Pods are in reserve but modifies this to make half come in first turn.

Fair enough. Like I said at the start, I was just going by how Mortis said it works.

Thus it works exactly as presented above for Apoc - half the units come in first turn, as normal for Daemons, half the remainder come in 2nd turn, final quarter in the 3rd turn.

I would question that, though. Does the Daemon Codex refer specifically to their set-up rules being for Standard Missions?

Whether it does or not, though, Strategic Reserve replaces the standard mission reserve rules and applies to any models not set up on the table. So I would think that would over-ride the Daemons' rule allowing them to come on first turn. They're not on the table, so are bound by the Strategic Reserve rule in an Apocalypse Mission.

It simply states they are placed in reserve - it does not dictate how those reserves work in terms of timings, roll required etc. As such it works perfectly well in any system.

The Daemonic Result states that they must appear on turn 1, and specifies how you determine which half turns up. This is a more specific rule than the one used for Apocalypse, therefore it overrides the expansion rulebook.