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Aloha everyone! I'm posting this on several forums to see what kind of answers I get, so here goes...

Since I'm more of a painter and teacher and not much of a gamer, I've got a question I've been wondering since I WAS a gamer 10 to 15 years ago.

Why is 40K a more popular game than Warhammer Fantasy? I'm not saying that one is "better" than the other, I'm just curious as to the popularity.

I'm serious about this now, so please don't just answer with something like, "cause fantasy sucks and 40k rules"...that doesn't help anyone.

I've got a couple of theories, but I'd like to see what you guys come up with as well.

Here are my ideas:

1) Fantasy, from what I've heard is a more complex game that requires a lot more thinking and a lot more strategy. Additionally, it takes longer to play. Therefore, 40k is more popular because new players can more quickly pick up the game than they can fantasy.

2) 40K is more popular because as people come into game shops, they see people playing 40K. They then ask if anyone plays fantasy, and most of the people there playing 40K say "no", so they figure that if they want to have someone to play with, they need to play 40k as well. Then, the cycle continues as more and more players come into the local game stores.

I'm leaning towards theory 2. When I first got into the hobby, I picked up several Fantasy boxed sets (back when they were only $12.50 for a box of 8 figures) and when I got to the register, the guy behind the counter told me that more people played 40k and if I wanted to have some people to play with, even though I liked the fantasy figures better, I should look into getting some 40k stuff instead.

Anyway, if you have any other theories, I'd love to hear them.

Thanks in advance!

You might like this thread

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/261576.page

I think it's more to do with the theme and aesthetics.
Really, I LOVE fantasy settings, with magic, dragons and swords. But I dont play WFB cause it is a really generic fantasy setting imo. It's got elves, dwarves, nasty boogiemen, and doesnt really set itself apart from other traditional fantasy settings, and as a result kinda bores me.

Now in 40k, not only do I still have my magic, dragons and (chain)swords, I have a fantasy/sci-fi setting with rich and interesting fluff and background (which is so full of grimdark). Despite all the sci-fi cliches one can see, that, along with the aesthetics of 40k (which are quite unique and recognisable) is I think the reason why 40k is more popular.

Chainswords, nuff said!

well that and tyranids everyones seen Aliens and Starship troopers and 40K excells in recreating stuff like that only with added super engineered meta humans

Basically what Ronin said. It seems like there are far more Fantasy settings out there than there are Sci-Fi settings, so people just stick to what's fresher and more interesting. Plus, I think a big part of it is also that 40k is very grimdark, with almost no 'good guys' out there (Other than Tau) and the constant threat of a Tyranid swarm coming in to wipe out an entire race.

1) Its easier to mix match / scratch build in 40k
2) Teens relate to 40k easier due to guns and tanks ( just like video game! ) Fantasy = lord of the ring + d&d , its the geeky.
3) Space Marine + Ork > any Fantasy race in popularity.
4) When was the last time red shirt persuade you to buy anything other than marines and orks?

40k rewards more conversions, as you can see every model in a unit.

LunaHound wrote:1)
4) When was the last time red shirt persuade you to buy anything other than marines and orks?

What do you mean Red Shirt?

Don't get her started on that AG

But like Ronin said:

There's a saturation point of Fantasy related material, and there's also the fact that it just doesn't hold the same interest that tanks, genetically engineered shock troopers and daemons can have.

AGProductions wrote:

LunaHound wrote:1)
4) When was the last time red shirt persuade you to buy anything other than marines and orks?

What do you mean Red Shirt?

Oops i forgot they are different color in different continent.
I meant the GW store staff.

I have both (started with fantasy), and while the fantasy game is better, 40k has more life to it. There are some interesting armies in fantasy, but the 40k theme is just so much more unique.

LunaHound wrote:

AGProductions wrote:

LunaHound wrote:1)
4) When was the last time red shirt persuade you to buy anything other than marines and orks?

What do you mean Red Shirt?

Oops i forgot they are different color in different continent.
I meant the GW store staff.

When I see the term "Red Shirt" I think expendable crew member.

I no longer think it might be cool to work in a GW store.

Well, I play both, and the game I most prefer is...Battlefleet Gothic! But Specialist games aside which are awesome. (You never have a dull game of Mordheim, ever) I prefer 40k because Fantasy is too static. Wheel right march 2 inches. Refrom to deal with the gyrocopter...

Is it really more popular?
My impression is that this is not the case.

The problem with fantasy is yes, it's difficult, but it's like a secondry-stage game, see, most players are from 13-16, male and like big blasty thingies.

or, 20-40, also like big blasty thingies.

The big blasty thingies in 40k include ork big blasty thingies.

The SM also have nice big blasty thingies, hence everyone plays SM,

I like 40k over fantasy because it's easier, the fluff is interesting, and with SM, CSM, IG, Tyranids and orkz, you get to paint how you want to paint, which is awesome.

I'm not sure w/ fantasy, but it does look more restrained to 40k, and that probably off-puts 90% of potential players.

AGProductions wrote:
Here are my ideas:

1) Fantasy, from what I've heard is a more complex game that requires a lot more thinking and a lot more strategy. Additionally, it takes longer to play. Therefore, 40k is more popular because new players can more quickly pick up the game than they can fantasy.

I hear this but I don't think it's accurate. I play both systems and I have to say that Fantasy is both more predictable and repititious than 40k. I have high hopes that the rumoured new 2010 edition of Fantasy will introduce a more dynamic game.

Othewise I'd agree with most that say it comes down to fluff. pew pew.

The thing that always appeals to me about 40k is that everything moved like skirmishers in fantasy and getting through a turn with all of your units is nearly hassle free. Even when the mistakes are made in deployment or after moving is done our poor positioning can be remedied with relative ease in subsequent turns. No one here really cares if their flanks are exposed as long as they are moderately obscured from the railguns parked on that hill in the corner.

Movement in fantasy can be entirely cumbersome and you can not get away with the same sort of positioning mistakes that you can in 40k..

On the other hand, every experience I have had with fantasy prior was always using a different spare army belonging to one of my friends. I am a noob fantasy player who just started playing my own Skaven army exclusively. Maybe my perception here is mostly due to lack of experience with Fantasy.

Some people say fantasy is more complex than 40K, I'd say it's more fiddly. They're both good games as systems, but Fantasy has more problems these days because of army book creep.
I think people tend to like sci fi more and hate painting whole models who never get to fight.

People like 40k more then fantasy because 40k has the

Personally, I can say that I strictly play 40K. There are a couple of factors at work here.

First, there's a much larger 40K community in my area. There are Fantasy players about, but they tend to be a smaller group with larger armies. If nothing else, 40K is the common gateway game around me.

Second, there is more to the Fantasy rules. I'm not going to say that it's a bad more, but getting things done in Fantasy is definitely a longer road than in 40K. There's a lot of interesting things in that longer road, but there it is.

Third, I seem to be able to do an average 40K army with fewer miniatures than Fantasy. Fantasy just seems to lend itself toward larger armies in terms of miniatures and larger point value games. I'm not sure how accurate this perception of mine is, but it is there regardless. I do realize that I could do a 'small' army by going with something like Ogre Kingdoms, but if I want anything else, I seem to be looking at a lot of minis. I've already got my horde army in terms of my 40K Orks, I don't need another.

Finally, I just haven't found a range of miniatures I like for Fantasy while I've found several for 40K. Such is life there.

Two words: Flying Tanks.

In 40k, you can have a huge fricking daemon monster that actually works like a huge fricking daemon monster because your opponent has space lasers and flying tanks to fight against it.

In fantasy, you have a dragon that cannot even fight a bunch of goblins without running away.

There's less of a difference these days as 5th edition 40k is all about getting close and getting into melee range, the same as fantasy with some ancilliary shooting between melee phases.

40k is easier to move around in since every figure is basically using the old fantasy rules for skirmishing...but then movement trays made moving in fantasy a lot less of a pain.

I lost my train of thought, I'm going to go back to my corner....

I think it's because Fantasy is more about movement/angles and not forgiving when mistakes are made.

40K is alot more approachable I guess to new people ruleswise.

____________

As for looks...Power Armor, Chainswords, Automatic Rocket Propelled hand guns...
Terran, Protoss, Zerg look-a-likes...

Apoc, Planet Strike, Titans, Bikers/Jetbikes, ANime Tau, Treadhead army.

CCCCCRRREEEEEEEEEEDDDDDD!!.

Because the rules aren't as fethed up!
There are a lot less contradicting rules in 40k than there are in fantasy...
Mick

Mick A wrote:Because the rules aren't as fethed up!
There are a lot less contradicting rules in 40k than there are in fantasy...
Mick

That scares me, it really does.

Having played both, 40K is just more flexible and fun. Fantasy battle is a rigid, formation-based affair with fiddly magic systems and less room for tactical improvisation. 40K, because it's small-unit and skirmish-oriented, plays much more fluidly and fun, IMO. I would still prefer it if 40k turns were divided by unit turns, not player turns, but I realize that creates more problems than it probably solves.

Frankly, 40k has the most unique fluff, it's really an individual setting I think many players can come to love.

HAVING SAID THAT, I think Fantasy, as a game, is probably superior. The reason I have never collected a Fantasy army and don't intend to do so in the near future is the lack of players that I know, I believe I only know of one Fantasy player in my gamer group so I'm really not all that inclined to spend moneys that could be wasted on Guardsmen!

The reason I am attracted to fantasy is, as the OP said under his reason 1, the depth of the game... It just seems far more realistic and easy.

Mind you, 40k you can just "jump into", so it's great for new players like myself.

For me I was initially attracted to Fantasy because of its model, formation combat, and my love of high fantasy.

But once you start delving into the fluff, fantasy could be any of a thousand other fantasy worlds and there would be no different. It is rather dry. It is just like every other fantasy world. There just isn't a lot of magic there.

40k has a vibrant enthusiasm to the fluff I have never encountered in other fiction. It is silly, dark, gritty, funny, and over the top while still managing to take itself seriously, and get me to suspend my disbelief.

Space elves? Orks with cars that go faster because they paint them red, and guns that work because they think they should? 8ft super humans who spit acid, drink poison, sleep with one eye open, and fire rocket propelled armor piercing fully automatic grenade launchers, wielding chainswords, against an army of necrons who devoured all life in the galaxy and are rising up to do it again and say "I'll be back" (yes i know they don't actually say it) as they RISE FROM THE FRIGGIN GRAVE TO SHOOT GUNS THAT FLAy FLESH ONE MOLECULE AT A TIME IN A DUNGEON TOMB BENEATH AN OPPRESIVE HIVE CITY, AND WE BETTER WIN OR OUR OWN GOVERNMENT WILL DECLAIR EXTERMINATOS THE WHOLE FRIGGIN PLANET?!?!?!

Really? You're going to tell that story with a strait face? And do it so well that I will totally be willing to suspend my disbelief and root for the chainsaw wielding maniac serving a corpse god?

Holy crap! That is the definition of epic.

I think tha is a big reason why 40k is more popular.

40k is only more popular based upon location.
i'm fairly certain that i remember it being shown that overall fantasy does better than 40k.