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 Co'tor Shas wrote:
Eh, at most they'll be pushed back to 2nd sphere levels. GW's stupid, but not that stupid. Such a massive loss in sales it not something they want.

True, but fluff-wise, when has the imperium ever just said "There, that's enough wholesale slaughter of Xenos. You blue-skinned guys just stick to your worlds way over there and don't stir up any more trouble, OK?"

I think it's more likely that they'd just keep things frozen with the space marines and all their friends forever about to show up and start handing out sanctioned beatings en masse... any minute now. Just like Abbadon's indefinite victory party on Cadia, they can't move the storyline forwards past this point without doing things that would have to be awkwardly retconned later. Then again, Mont'Ka may have some new crazy developments we could have never predicted (That I'm sure we'll be arguing about soon).

So what exactly comes in/with Mont'ka? Is it just new units?

No new units, but new formations for tau (probably FSE variant), and IG (probably their own decurion), plus baneblade variants new rules (probably the same with minor point changes), and assassins (unknown anything about them, how fitting.)
Also, cards for enclaves and cadians.

And perhaps some stuff beyond that, but nothing spoiled so far.

 Rainyday wrote:

 Co'tor Shas wrote:
Eh, at most they'll be pushed back to 2nd sphere levels. GW's stupid, but not that stupid. Such a massive loss in sales it not something they want.

True, but fluff-wise, when has the imperium ever just said "There, that's enough wholesale slaughter of Xenos. You blue-skinned guys just stick to your worlds way over there and don't stir up any more trouble, OK?"

I think it's more likely that they'd just keep things frozen with the space marines and all their friends forever about to show up and start handing out sanctioned beatings en masse... any minute now. Just like Abbadon's indefinite victory party on Cadia, they can't move the storyline forwards past this point without doing things that would have to be awkwardly retconned later. Then again, Mont'Ka may have some new crazy developments we could have never predicted (That I'm sure we'll be arguing about soon).

Well, that's what the imperium wants to do, who knows if they'll be able to. What I mean by "pushed back to 2nd sphere levels" is that's how far the imperium managed to get before running out of steam (as they have done pretty much every time Edit: run out of steam I mean, not pushed back to 2nd sphere). That would be much more that they have ever done (and a crushing blow to the tau), but that's all they'll be able to do most probably.

Or....

They could have a massive tau win and they make a massive tau push to allow tau to both be a player on the galactic scale and be able to take large losses without being destroyed. But, of course, that would offend the status-quo, and be an interesting, compelling advancement, and we can't have that now can we?

 BoomWolf wrote:
No new units, but new formations for tau (probably FSE variant), and IG (probably their own decurion), plus baneblade variants new rules (probably the same with minor point changes), and assassins (unknown anything about them, how fitting.)
Also, cards for enclaves and cadians.

And perhaps some stuff beyond that, but nothing spoiled so far.

As if Tau need more t be fair, I don't even play IG and I would love to see them get some great formations.

 jreilly89 wrote:

 BoomWolf wrote:
No new units, but new formations for tau (probably FSE variant), and IG (probably their own decurion), plus baneblade variants new rules (probably the same with minor point changes), and assassins (unknown anything about them, how fitting.)
Also, cards for enclaves and cadians.

And perhaps some stuff beyond that, but nothing spoiled so far.

As if Tau need more t be fair, I don't even play IG and I would love to see them get some great formations.

So would lots of armies.............

These 2 new minis (chaplain and tech priest) are really nice-looking. Ridiculous price though

Tau have so little compared to all the other factions. About time we got some cool stuff. We have some of the smallest unit selection around and lots of really useless units like Vespid. I'm always happy to see a new model here and there for us or a new formation that might make other models more useful.

That's an odd thing to say. Tau have gotten more than all the xenos except maybe vanilla eldar and orks. Definitely more than models and attention than the dark eldar, necrons, nids, and the perennial underdogs of the squat faction. The nids may have gotten more codexes but most of them have sucked and been largely rehashes similar to this Tau one. At worst, the tau have been in the middle of the pack when it comes to support since their introduction in 3rd edition.

Oh, Tau bashing started on its earnest! There's a thread for that, do you know?

We don't even have 30 codex units to choose from, while Eldar have more than 40. Please, let this "Tau do'nt need anything else!" argument die.

 Vector Strike wrote:
Oh, Tau bashing started on its earnest! There's a thread for that, do you know?

We don't even have 30 codex units to choose from, while Eldar have more than 40. Please, let this "Tau do'nt need anything else!" argument die.

This is the thread for discussing Tau. If you have a problem with my post, press the "yield" button on the upper right to notify the mods instead of pretending to be one and telling me to go elsewhere. Also, if you think that saying GW has supported tau with 3 codexes and 3 campaign books over 14 years counts as support is somehow "bashing" the faction, you are sorely mistaken. Also, feel free to click on my blog link to see my recent tau blog work or my pics here showing parts of my 3000pt fully painted Tau army that you think I'm "bashing". I said tau were in the middle of the pack when it comes to support and specifically said that they were beaten in that regard by the Eldar so I'm not sure why you think there is any sense in pointing out something about the Eldar as a "witty" comeback.

A quick glance at the GW page shows all the major factions have more than us. We're tied in unit choice with DE for crying out loud. And that's after our three new units joined the roster.

Middle of the pack we are not. Also this is not a thread for discussing Tau. It's for discussing Tau rumors.

 Gamgee wrote:
A quick glance at the GW page shows all the major factions have more than us. We're tied in unit choice with DE for crying out loud. And that's after our three new units joined the roster.

"All the major factions" also tend to have units with very little in the way of equipping entire units, with alternate loadouts becoming an entirely new unit type.

Middle of the pack we are not.

Uh yeah. You are, at the worst case scenario, "middle of the pack". Tau were a strong book before, with the changes they got? They're still pretty high up there.

Also this is not a thread for discussing Tau. It's for discussing Tau rumors.

Then maybe your first post back in this thread should not have been about how Tau have "so little compared to all the other factions"?
Yes. You have very little in the way of different units. You do, however, have some of the most variable loadouts in the game when it comes to those units with access to variable options(Crisis Suits, Broadsides, Riptides, and even Strike Teams).

Additionally, I think you need to understand that "not an automatic include" is not the same thing as a "really useless unit".

 Gamgee wrote:
A quick glance at the GW page shows all the major factions have more than us. We're tied in unit choice with DE for crying out loud. And that's after our three new units joined the roster.

Is that new math? Because:



The tau sure do seem to have alot more options than the 40 the Dark Eldar get... and of course that ignores the dozens of kit options that Forgeworld have given the Tau over the past 10 years. That doesn't mean that I think that one of MY armies doesn't need anything more nor that it is totally complete in any way. The point is that it's incredibly disingenuous to claim that they've been somehow ignored compared to the majority of other factions. At worst, they've been in the middle of the pack in terms of support IF you don't include the very above average support FW has given them.

 Co'tor Shas wrote:

 Rainyday wrote:

 Co'tor Shas wrote:
Eh, at most they'll be pushed back to 2nd sphere levels. GW's stupid, but not that stupid. Such a massive loss in sales it not something they want.

True, but fluff-wise, when has the imperium ever just said "There, that's enough wholesale slaughter of Xenos. You blue-skinned guys just stick to your worlds way over there and don't stir up any more trouble, OK?"

I think it's more likely that they'd just keep things frozen with the space marines and all their friends forever about to show up and start handing out sanctioned beatings en masse... any minute now. Just like Abbadon's indefinite victory party on Cadia, they can't move the storyline forwards past this point without doing things that would have to be awkwardly retconned later. Then again, Mont'Ka may have some new crazy developments we could have never predicted (That I'm sure we'll be arguing about soon).

Well, that's what the imperium wants to do, who knows if they'll be able to. What I mean by "pushed back to 2nd sphere levels" is that's how far the imperium managed to get before running out of steam (as they have done pretty much every time Edit: run out of steam I mean, not pushed back to 2nd sphere). That would be much more that they have ever done (and a crushing blow to the tau), but that's all they'll be able to do most probably.

Or....

They could have a massive tau win and they make a massive tau push to allow tau to both be a player on the galactic scale and be able to take large losses without being destroyed. But, of course, that would offend the status-quo, and be an interesting, compelling advancement, and we can't have that now can we?

Perhaps something like this:

The IOM fleets and forces push to the heart of them empire, scattering kroot tribes, completely destroying Vespid (SQUATTED!) and laying siege to the Tau home world. The Empire is shattered and Farsight returns just in time to see the Tau world sacked. He intends to go on some kind of suicidal ass kicking rampage, but Aun'Va sends him a message saying he must lead the Tau away, into the stars, to prepare to fight the coming Chaos threat (DUN DUN DUN). Shadowsun dies protecting Aun'Va long enough for him to get the message out. We'll say she gets beaten down by a Termie team while the new RG chapter master skewers Aun'Va.

Farsight is then contacted by a Grey Knights chapter master who say that yep, him, and the whole Tau race, are needed to defeat chaos because of the warp immunity thing. They retreat while the Kor follow Aun'Vas final instructions and fight to the last, ramming capitol ships, etc.

Meanwhile, the Eldar, being the meddling pricks they are, evacuate the rest of the Etherials and a bunch of Tau through the webway, knowing they'll be needed later. The lead Etherial left is, naturally, pissed about Aun'Va and swears vengeance against Farsight, for reasons, setting up a government in exile.

Now the Tau, the youngest of the races, are lost and scattered like the oldest of the races.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
As for the "WAAAAHHHHH! I've been playing Tau for like, TWO YEARS and I think we don't get enough love" stuff: Tau aren't supposed to have a bunch of different units. That's kind of their thing. They have XV-8s, which can do pretty much anything. They have one tank, which can be a tank, a better tank, an AA battery, or a transport. They have that one drone chassis that can be lots of different drones.

Also, holy crap, they got a new codex when last one still hasn't even stopped crapping its pants, AND their IA book reprinted, AND a suppliment, AND a campaign book, AND the suppliment is getting re-worked.

Just go whine to some Sisters players, I'm sure they'll want to hear it.

@maceria: I highly doubt any changes that dramatic at all will be occuring in this narrative supplement. Or any narrative supplement. The blurb and white dwarf text which has been translated seems to indicate it is based on the siege of Mu'gulath Bay and it is still a war zone Damocles book. Considering Farsight both appears on the cover, is the primary character of it and is getting new rules for his Enclaves he is also, most likely, heavily engaged in the story. So it seems unlikely he'll just show up to confirm the destruction of something and not be a major participant in whatever conflict is occuring. Not to mention I highly doubt Eldar will be appearing in this at all, it will most likely remain an Imperium/Tau Empire conflict.

More likely, like all the narrative supplements barring Shield of Baal, the book will most likely focus on a single planet (Mu'gulath) and the battle surrounding it. As for outcome, I don't know, I'd wager the Imperium based on past precedent but Farsight being main character does complicate matters as he is a character GW usually permits to succeed in most anything. To my knowledge he isn't fighting any of the big-name Chapters who barely ever lose so that also makes things more dubious. But we'll see. I hope for a Tau victory just to shake up the status quo, I think that'll make this the first war (not battle) of note the Imperium has ever been recorded to lose, but I'm to accustomed to the Imperium winning in these narrative supplements to feel confident of my hope. Regardless it's mostly speculation now.

I find it strange that the Assassins are targeting Farsight. Shadowsun slew the Chapter Master and has been actively attacking them for some time now so...why target Farsight? Unless I'm meant to imagine that something is going to happen in the book which motivates such a decision. Still one would think Assassins would have been dispatched after Shadowsun and Aun'va first.

I'm homely just curious to see if it synchs up at all with Fire and Ice, which was released so recently I'd assume they were made with each other in mind, and if so that could be very interesting.

 Vector Strike wrote:

Torchstar has MSS - the Ignores Cover ss. The worst place she could be is a flamer crisis unit.

maybe they thought of the instance she wasn't in range, or incapable of doing better than spreading the ss to the rest of the unit

Be warned, WD says they won't provide spoilers, but then they immediately write what I find to be a kinda spoiler.


I might actually get the limited. It's not awful at $205, seeing as Kauyon+Montka would be about $150 anyway. I almost regret not buying the Ghostkeel Limited Codex, since that and this would look pretty good on the shelf together, what with the matching cover schemes.
I guess The Eight, and any other Farsight formations will be in the basic Tau Empire booklet. I also wonder if Burning Dawn and Operation Shadowtalon's fluff/units/formations/missions would be folded into the LE.
Also, I am definitely looking forward to Pask vs Longstrike.

Via facebook.

 Gamgee wrote:
A quick glance at the GW page shows all the major factions have more than us. We're tied in unit choice with DE for crying out loud. And that's after our three new units joined the roster.

Middle of the pack we are not. Also this is not a thread for discussing Tau. It's for discussing Tau rumors.

Well don't whine about a perceived lack of models then..that's not a rumour either

Just go whine to some Sisters players, I'm sure they'll want to hear it.

This! We have not even got any new rules for 7th edition despite co-staring in the last campaign...........

Going back OT - I think this is juts a follow up to the last campaign book so there will be several participants as there was in Shield of Baal

Shield of Baal had as its starts: Tyranids, Blood Angels, Necrons, Fleshtearers, Imperial Guard and Adepta Sororitas
This one is likely (IMO) to have:Tau, Farsight, Imperial Guard, Adeptus Mechancium, Space Marines - not sure if just Raven Guard and White scars being focussed on again.

Of these only some may get new rules and formations - probably just Guard and Farsight - in a similar manner to Shield of Baal not giving all particpants equal new stuff despite being major players in the fluff - see Guard and Sisters.

In terms of winning - Shield of Baal was interesting in that its arguably that anyone (other than maybe Necrons and I am not convinced) won

Imperial forces - the entire Shield was destroyed including huge amounts of premium warriors - Astartes, Sororitas, Stormtroopers, lots of navy assets were also lost and the only achievement was to gain some breathing space to try and save Baal itself.
Tyranids - huge amounts of biological resources were lost to them - the only thing they are likely to measure victory or defeat by - but the fleet is already beginning to rebuild.
Necrons - the Tomb World is apparently safe for now but the Tryanids are rebuilding using anyhting that they can get insystem and so war may well come to them again - this time without any allies.

So it could be that again - all sides lose which would be keeping with the Dark Millennium of War

Not all of them survive?!

2 characters I hate, 1 characters I like...
Bring it GW. You can have both Shadowsun and Aun'Va if you want.

EDIT: More seriously, I expect Aun'va to die and be suceeded by another Ethereal, so nothing really changes.

HA! Cooperation > Civil War. I'm really liking this book.

 Verviedi wrote:
Not all of them survive?!

2 characters I hate, 1 characters I like...
Bring it GW. You can have both Shadowsun and Aun'Va if you want.

EDIT: More seriously, I expect Aun'va to die and be suceeded by another Ethereal, so nothing really changes.

Maybe that part was about the Assassins? Aun'Va and Shadowsun already got rules in the codex. Not much sense killing them.

Thanks for the WD images, Samurai. I guess it could be fun to play this campaign at a club or a regular gaming group.

 Vector Strike wrote:
HA! Cooperation > Civil War. I'm really liking this book.

 Verviedi wrote:
Not all of them survive?!

2 characters I hate, 1 characters I like...
Bring it GW. You can have both Shadowsun and Aun'Va if you want.

EDIT: More seriously, I expect Aun'va to die and be suceeded by another Ethereal, so nothing really changes.

Maybe that part was about the Assassins? Aun'Va and Shadowsun already got rules in the codex. Not much sense killing them.

Most likely, it will be members of The Eight.

I hope Shadowsun gets beaten so hard that she can't live outside a Ghostkeel anymore. They could even make rules for the Shadowsun Ghostkeel.

Verviedi wrote:Not all of them survive?!

2 characters I hate, 1 characters I like...
Bring it GW. You can have both Shadowsun and Aun'Va if you want.

EDIT: More seriously, I expect Aun'va to die and be suceeded by another Ethereal, so nothing really changes.

Or the forbidden love between Farsight and Shadowsun is developed, and then Shadowsun is killed. Aun'Va blames her death on Farsight to tighten his grip on the Empire and pull his peoples' loyalties back away from Farsight. Shadowsun is then replaced by Puretide's third student, Kais. Shadowsun continues to be available as a legal army choice for the same reason Farsight is legal in a Tau army. "In case you want to play as a Tau force from before X died."

Or Farsight "dies" and is revived by the Dawnblade, satisfying the condition that someone is killed and at the same time being a complete cop out.

Kanluwen wrote:

 Vector Strike wrote:
HA! Cooperation > Civil War. I'm really liking this book.

 Verviedi wrote:
Not all of them survive?!

2 characters I hate, 1 characters I like...
Bring it GW. You can have both Shadowsun and Aun'Va if you want.

EDIT: More seriously, I expect Aun'va to die and be suceeded by another Ethereal, so nothing really changes.

Maybe that part was about the Assassins? Aun'Va and Shadowsun already got rules in the codex. Not much sense killing them.

Most likely, it will be members of The Eight.

White Dwarf specifically mentions that the targets are Farsight, Shadowsun, and Aun'Va, and that at least one of them will not survive.

 casvalremdeikun wrote:
I hope Shadowsun gets beaten so hard that she can't live outside a Ghostkeel anymore. They could even make rules for the Shadowsun Ghostkeel.

I like her - especially since she is one of the very few remaining female characters that GW have not culled (*). Rather see Farsight launch into a civil war but that looks unlikely also the White Scars Warlord seems a bit of dick so quite happy to see him go.

(*) it was nice to see female tau noted in the pics of various Sept colour schemes

...Forbidden love betwe-

You wot m8?

The Farsight book that just came out a few weeks ago did hint at a romantic encounter between Farsight and Shadowsun on one of their training missions with Puretide so that is a possible theory. I think its more likely to have Anu'va die and to cover up the defeat they have a stand in take his place. That way rules stay the same and it would fit with the overall Tau fluff.

 Verviedi wrote:
...Forbidden love betwe-

You wot m8?

Pretty sure there's no such thing.

You got wotm8ed.

Edit: Well, I'll be damned, it really is a thing.


As an aside, what was the last time IoM have actually won something? And I don't mean those pyrrhic victories that push Armageddon back by an inch at the cost of an arm, I mean them taking back space and HOLDING IT or successfully eliminating a threat to mankind without gutting themselves in the process?

 SinisterSamurai wrote:

Verviedi wrote:Not all of them survive?!

2 characters I hate, 1 characters I like...
Bring it GW. You can have both Shadowsun and Aun'Va if you want.

EDIT: More seriously, I expect Aun'va to die and be suceeded by another Ethereal, so nothing really changes.

Or the forbidden love between Farsight and Shadowsun is developed, and then Shadowsun is killed. Aun'Va blames her death on Farsight to tighten his grip on the Empire and pull his peoples' loyalties back away from Farsight. Shadowsun is then replaced by Puretide's third student, Kais. Shadowsun continues to be available as a legal army choice for the same reason Farsight is legal in a Tau army. "In case you want to play as a Tau force from before X died."

Or Farsight "dies" and is revived by the Dawnblade, satisfying the condition that someone is killed and at the same time being a complete cop out.

Kanluwen wrote:

 Vector Strike wrote:
HA! Cooperation > Civil War. I'm really liking this book.

 Verviedi wrote:
Not all of them survive?!

2 characters I hate, 1 characters I like...
Bring it GW. You can have both Shadowsun and Aun'Va if you want.

EDIT: More seriously, I expect Aun'va to die and be suceeded by another Ethereal, so nothing really changes.

Maybe that part was about the Assassins? Aun'Va and Shadowsun already got rules in the codex. Not much sense killing them.

Most likely, it will be members of The Eight.

White Dwarf specifically mentions that the targets are Farsight, Shadowsun, and Aun'Va, and that at least one of them will not survive.

My best guess is that Aun'Va is toast. He's resin, doesn't sell well and his two bodyguard dudes don't really match the majority of the rest of the recent Tau aesthetic. The Aun'Va model isn't bad, but I could easily see GW killing him off so that it'll be easier to scrap the model. Shadowsun and Farsight are both battlesuits and would both probably sell like hotcakes if moved to plastic. Aun'Va rarely sees play, and so wouldn't sell as well.