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Hello,

I am in the middle of converting my own Dragon Ogre models, and am refining my 2k lists.

My question, is what is the ideal unit size for dragon ogres. I orginally planned on a unit of 4 with Great Weapons. I have seen at least 2 people propose that a unit of 3 is just as powerful. So my question is, do you all agree? Is it worth saving the 77 points by doing 3 rather than 4?

I want this unit to be a hammer. The enemies demise should be a certainty if they should dance with this unit.

I don't know if it makes a difference, but I plan on running one unit of knights and a dragon as well.

If you want a hammer, take 4 with great weapons. Allows for 1 to die (likely by your turn 2 charge) and still hit like a hammer.

I've found the key to them is taking multiple threat units- so at 2000 I'd go 4 DOs, 5-6 Knights with warbanner, 2 chariots and a Slaanesh Giant.

5 hammer units, the enemy can kill/lessen effectiveness of 2-3, but the others will get through.

I personally would just run them 3-4 with regular weapons. S5 is going to wound most things on 2+ or 3+, the GW bonus isn't really needed unless you are planning on running them into hydras or dragons (good luck catching a dragon) If I gave them GW, I would just run 3, chaos already has issues with model count, these things don't really help with that being much more expensive than even knights. (whom get more attacks per point at higher WS)

As for you plan with them: Ogre units tend not to make very effective hammers, they tend to not have enough attacks to reliably break in the front a SCR block. Certainly damage it severely, but even losing by one could be a nasty turn around. Having your 300 point unit run down by a 150ish point unit of human or elf stated guys sucks if you whiff. A unit of 4 GW Dragon ogres against WS 4 empire swordmen or elf stat guys: 12 attacks, 6 hits, 5 wounds. So you only tie SCR, they have music, you take a break test at -1. A unit of 4 without: 9 attacks, 4-5 hits, about 4 wounds. Your taking the same break test. Take away the GW and the numbers don't really change much, because at S5, the typical foot model is taking either no save, or a 6+.

Compare Dragon ogres to Chaos knights now: 200 points gets you 5 knights with no upgrades, those knights have 2 S5, and 1 s4 each. So against the typical empire swordman they hit 7 times with S5, 3 times with s4, wound about 6 with S5, and 2 with S4. They take about 5-7 wounds in that situation. If its only 5 wounds, sucks, because it is a tie. But if its higher (which is more likely) then you win. Add in the fact that knights are the same toughness, but much better save... There is a reason why people tend to just spam knights.

I don't want to discourage you from running them, but from a efficiency stand point they really aren't the best. So I would say run them how you like, since it it isn't an fully optimized list, just have fun with it.

Dragon Ogres I use for targets knight are less optimal against. With Great Weapons, they bust armour much more easily, so they're reducing a 1+ save to a 5+ and wounding up to T5 on a 2. Enemy Knights and some monsters seem like ideal targets, though things like GD or Dragons are still not easy targets (and not for Knights either).