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Made in gb
Wise Ethereal with Bodyguard







For her left foot, is it not just that the photo editor has cut off the heel? Looks like a suspiciously blank space where it should be.

Please excuse any spelling errors. I use a tablet frequently and software keyboards are a pain!

Terranwing - w3;d1;l1
51st Dunedinw2;d0;l0
Cadre Coronal Afterglow w1;d0;l0 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka






Lancaster PA

I'd believe that too, then it would just be poo proportions. It is a delicious "WTF happened here?!" mystery


Woad to WAR... on Celts blog, which is mostly Circle Orboros
"I'm sick of auto-penetrating attacks against my behind!" - Kungfuhustler 
   
Made in us
Three Color Minimum





Tangentville, New Jersey

We're definitely in need of a 360 view of her.


 
   
Made in no
[DCM]
Necron of Munda





The Hive War box comes with a commercial paper showing other stuff to buy, including N18 Rulebook and Gangs book. This would indicate no previous book is replaced by this. Hopefully the N21 rulebook will include some interesting rules clarifications or updates, or at minimum not have gross errors.

"...this rulebook is designed to give new players an introduction to the game of Necromunda, it does not focus upon the campaign rules, instead allowing new players to learn the core mechanics of the game without having to trouble themselves with the bookkeeping."

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/05/15 12:45:26


 
   
Made in vn
Longtime Dakkanaut







Seem like a scuffed and wrong version of the actual game. No choice of juve, the "skill" are a bunch of handpicked skills from different type, even from the types that aren't primary or secondary for the gang. Like shooting skill for Escher.

And the mat is just a piece of paper folded, the cheaper Underhive box have door and cardboard tiles. Might as well get that one instead. Since the rulebook from both box are not actual presentation of the game anyway.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2021/05/15 12:46:01


 
   
Made in no
[DCM]
Necron of Munda





This is a different game indeed. A hybrid having new N20+ rules changes (like moving Cool tests for Fleeing the Battlefield to the end phase) and at the same time reverting house gangs back to N18 with different costs, stats and starting equipment (armour). It's a weird mix, for example Van Saar laspistol/meltagun (combi) costs 120 (N18) instead of 130 (N20), but is laspistol (N20) instead of lasgun (N18).

So it seems like it is the "latest updates" mixed with reverting back to a state of the game 3 years ago.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/05/15 13:26:57


 
   
Made in gb
Growlin' Guntrukk Driver with Killacannon





Scotland, but nowhere near my rulebook

Consistency!


Yaaaaaay!
   
Made in vn
Longtime Dakkanaut




If they really hell bent on people getting their books, just sell bundle models at discount price instead of wasting time and money printing garbage like this.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/05/15 14:02:48


 
   
Made in si
Ravenous Beast Form







So another case of an intern randomly hitting their head on Ctrl-C and Ctrl-V while having 4 tabs open

Posters on ignore list: 34

40k Potica Edition - 40k patch with reactions, suppression and all that good stuff. Feedback thread here.

Gangs of Nu Ork - Necromunda / Gorkamorka expansion supporting all faction. Feedback thread here
   
Made in no
[DCM]
Necron of Munda





Yeah this is not the book you want to use outside demo skirmish games. Scenario special rules like "Pitch Black" and "Reinforcements" are optional in this book and something you can add "if both players agree", and Reinforcements basically say that if your gang is larger than the crew size for the scenario, D3 remaining fighters (not included in the starting crew) arrive every turn, starting on turn 2.

Not strictly comparable, but it feels a little bit like what "Sevens" is for Blood Bowl.

The scenarios are all tied to the box content (similar to N17 box) and without any campaign rewards, so should house rule rewards if you want to use them in a campaign.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/05/15 14:11:41


 
   
Made in vn
Longtime Dakkanaut




"Seven" is an official alternate play mode for Blood Bowl, while this looks more like someone houserule version of Necromunda made it into production, and GW was never clear about this.
   
Made in us
Using Object Source Lighting





Portland

Wow, honestly I had been tempted to finally take the leap into necro for the first time since the edition around 2000, but seriously what a poor show for rules. I've never understood a boxed set that isn't fully compatible with the current game.


My painted armies (40k, WM/H, Malifaux, Infinity...) 
   
Made in no
[DCM]
Necron of Munda





 lord_blackfang wrote:
So another case of an intern randomly hitting their head on Ctrl-C and Ctrl-V while having 4 tabs open

Oh hell yeah, it's all copy-paste here. The old classic Stiletto knife with Str S is back. Having Strength characteristic on Toxin weapon makes absolutely no sense. Another incorrect Stiletto knife profile is also given with +1 hit modifier. GW can never get rid of this one. Rulebook updated with all the latest fixes, and also some of the old classic mistakes haha.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/05/16 12:54:04


 
   
Made in us
Three Color Minimum





Tangentville, New Jersey

If I bought this, it'd strictly be for the plastic; I'm sorely tempted. The book would just make for interesting reading since I haven't played Necromunda in over 15 years.


 
   
Made in gb
Wise Ethereal with Bodyguard







 spiralingcadaver wrote:
Wow, honestly I had been tempted to finally take the leap into necro for the first time since the edition around 2000, but seriously what a poor show for rules. I've never understood a boxed set that isn't fully compatible with the current game.


Everything in the box is “compatible” with the rest of the game. You just need to choose which particular version of the rules you want to use

Please excuse any spelling errors. I use a tablet frequently and software keyboards are a pain!

Terranwing - w3;d1;l1
51st Dunedinw2;d0;l0
Cadre Coronal Afterglow w1;d0;l0 
   
Made in us
Been Around the Block





Oh good, the trolls are here dissuading people from trying the game because this intro product doesn't appeal to them.

FFS people it's a fine way to start playing. When you learn to swim you don't dive into the Mariana Trench first.
   
Made in no
[DCM]
Necron of Munda





It's relevant for fresh players who want the easiest way to play. But it's not going to last long for any players that want to move on further to the full game. This is a different version to both old and new books.
   
Made in si
Ravenous Beast Form







 ohreally wrote:
Oh good, the trolls are here dissuading people from trying the game because this intro product doesn't appeal to them.

FFS people it's a fine way to start playing. When you learn to swim you don't dive into the Mariana Trench first.


But generally you learn in water, not a pool of some random other liquid.

Posters on ignore list: 34

40k Potica Edition - 40k patch with reactions, suppression and all that good stuff. Feedback thread here.

Gangs of Nu Ork - Necromunda / Gorkamorka expansion supporting all faction. Feedback thread here
   
Made in us
Been Around the Block





 lord_blackfang wrote:


But generally you learn in water, not a pool of some random other liquid.


That's not what this is despite all the hyperbole and vitriol.

It's the exact same core rules. It's the basic gang rules for what's included with the plastic kits. It has guidance for expanding to campaign play.

It's an introductory product. It introduces people to the game and how to play it. It's not for people that already have a thriving Necromunda community that is running multi month long campaigns.
   
Made in si
Ravenous Beast Form







 ohreally wrote:
 lord_blackfang wrote:


But generally you learn in water, not a pool of some random other liquid.


That's not what this is despite all the hyperbole and vitriol.

It's the exact same core rules. It's the basic gang rules for what's included with the plastic kits. It has guidance for expanding to campaign play.

It's an introductory product. It introduces people to the game and how to play it. It's not for people that already have a thriving Necromunda community that is running multi month long campaigns.


An introductory product that needs to be unlearned when you want to play the real thing is a bad introductory product.

Posters on ignore list: 34

40k Potica Edition - 40k patch with reactions, suppression and all that good stuff. Feedback thread here.

Gangs of Nu Ork - Necromunda / Gorkamorka expansion supporting all faction. Feedback thread here
   
Made in no
[DCM]
Necron of Munda





 ohreally wrote:

It's the exact same core rules.

Nah, it's not identical with any other core rules. Basically it's a different version of the game.
   
Made in us
Been Around the Block





 lord_blackfang wrote:


An introductory product that needs to be unlearned when you want to play the real thing is a bad introductory product.


What do you have to unlearn exactly? The price of a few fighters?

Looks to me like you don't have to unlearn anything to keep playing, you just need to learn more. Which is exactly how an intro product should work.

There are legitimate criticisms about this box but it's not whatever you're on about.

So go ahead and keep deriding it if you want, I'm going to go ahead and keep recommending it to new players that don't already have anything and want either gang included.
   
Made in no
[DCM]
Necron of Munda





Costs, stats, skill sets and scenario special rules (reinforcements at least). One question I see *every day* from new players is "which book are rules for X in". Can't remember anyone asking for a simpler demo version of the game.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/05/15 16:41:14


 
   
Made in vn
Longtime Dakkanaut




So why can't they just include the correct skill table again? Why are they wasting money printing these homebrew rule and why people had to pay to play someone's homebrew version of the game instead of the actual version of it? Is GW and SG 3rd party now?

If you want a starter for the game get the old Underhive box, cheaper, come with cardboard tiles, and have door, which can actually affect gameplay, unlike.... walls and columns. And then buy the actual rulebook to play the game.

GW defense squad never cease to amaze me.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/05/15 17:09:30


 
   
Made in ca
Dakka Veteran





 ohreally wrote:

So go ahead and keep deriding it if you want, I'm going to go ahead and keep recommending it to new players that don't already have anything and want either gang included.

That seems like a pretty hostile introduction to me. Unless the starting position of the potential player is "I will 100% be choosing to play Escher AND Delaque and I want to collect terrain, too" and the box offers savings on the models (I haven't done the math) that advice will be costing them money and sticking them with a book that they have to ultimately replace.

You should be telling them to get the real rulebook. Or, if the expense is a concern*, to get rules online, not to waste time on a half-measure product that nobody wanted or needed and doesn't present the format of gameplay that almost all Necromunda players prefer.


* this hypothetical concern seems pretty faked to me. We appear to be talking about players who are reluctant to buy a rulebook, because they don't know if they'll stick with the game, but are somehow willing to buy a starter set that is several time more expensive than the rulebook and includes an extra gang and terrain that they might not need? That's a made up type of person.
.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/05/15 18:46:41


 
   
Made in gb
Battle-tested Knight Castellan Pilot





A large proportion of people in this hobby are in it for the miniatures alone. I heard it said that most people don't play any of the games, so looking at it from that perspective, it's mostly the paper component of starter sets that are dead weight, not the plastic.
   
Made in no
[DCM]
Necron of Munda





Strange to have 18 books for a game where people don't care about paper?
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Baxx wrote:
Strange to have 18 books for a game where people don't care about paper?


Horrible that there needs to be that many books just to play a game. The house books really disturbed me the most as I like the look of the models but I will be darned if I am buying a book just to support a box of models.... That is pretty absurd. Especially when several other companies offer everything you need with the unit box so it is all inclusive and if there is an update to the rules they put out a free PDF.

I preordered the box set as it will be a way to atleast play the game. It gives you a little bit of terrain, and two gangs, one of which I don't believe was in the gang book. I had to stay clear of Dark Uprising because of the cost. Instead I got a 3d printer and now can print all the terrain I want.
   
Made in ca
Terrifying Wraith





Canada

JWBS wrote:
A large proportion of people in this hobby are in it for the miniatures alone. I heard it said that most people don't play any of the games, so looking at it from that perspective, it's mostly the paper component of starter sets that are dead weight, not the plastic.


I played with two different groups and one is all about the game and the other is all about converting models and building scenery

 
   
Made in gb
Wise Ethereal with Bodyguard







angel of death 007 wrote:
Baxx wrote:
Strange to have 18 books for a game where people don't care about paper?


Horrible that there needs to be that many books just to play a game. The house books really disturbed me the most as I like the look of the models but I will be darned if I am buying a book just to support a box of models.... That is pretty absurd. Especially when several other companies offer everything you need with the unit box so it is all inclusive and if there is an update to the rules they put out a free PDF.

I preordered the box set as it will be a way to atleast play the game. It gives you a little bit of terrain, and two gangs, one of which I don't believe was in the gang book. I had to stay clear of Dark Uprising because of the cost. Instead I got a 3d printer and now can print all the terrain I want.


But you don’t need to get all the books to play the game. You need the core rule book, and one further book to give you the rules for your gang and a campaign mode. For those who are interested there are them a range of further source books providing further options and flavour, but you don’t need them to play the game.

I really like my House of Artifice book. It expands the lore (even if some of that expansion is a bit dumb) and provides some house specific goodies. But it’s not necessary to play the game.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/05/16 08:25:37


Please excuse any spelling errors. I use a tablet frequently and software keyboards are a pain!

Terranwing - w3;d1;l1
51st Dunedinw2;d0;l0
Cadre Coronal Afterglow w1;d0;l0 
   
 
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