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derek wrote:

Strimen wrote:I belive honour gaurd and command squads fall into the same boat as servitors. All of which do not take up an extra HQ or Elite slot.

The difference being that Honor Guard and Command Squads actually have rules to back that up and servitors don't.

So by that definition... If I take three Techmarines and two MoTF. I cannot get any servitor squads because my elite slots are full, regardless of the fact the servitor entry says I CAN take them.

I say no I DO get the five servitor squads. Also if I take the cannon, the description specifically refers you to pg71 for the techmarine. It does say that you lose the blessing and the IC status outside of that he’s a Techmarine, therefore able to take a servitor squad.

You may and can disagree, but that how my group has interpreted this issue

I think you can take a servitor squad if you have a techmarine manning a thunderfire cannon.

The problem is that this servitor squad doesn't automatically join the techmarine - even for a regular techmarine or MoTF, the servitors aren't a retinue and aren't automatically joined; sort of like the techmarine's honorguard. They're a squad that you'd stick the IC techmarine and MoTF on. And while the artillery model is around, the techmarine isn't an IC so can't join the squad.

A servitor squad bought this way will be subject to mindlock until the techmarine can join them.

The Servitor entry indicates that one unit of Servitors may be taken for each 'Techmarine' or 'Master of the Forge' unit in the army.

This list of units does not include 'Thunderfire Cannon' units.

Therefore, taking a Thunderfire Cannon unit does not entitle a player to select a unit of Servitors.

I again fall back on the "shame on GW for thinking we're smart enough to see the correlations between the big grey shaded box and make the logical adjustment on our own" position.

By the way, the statline says Techmarine. In the unit description, it says he is a techmarine who loses Blessing of the Omnissiah, and IC rules until and unless the gun is destroyed... as the entry never says he has them in the first place- or any other techmarine special rule-
in fact the description says in italics Each TF Gun is crewed by a single techmarine. Not a techmarine gunner. The statline in both places say Techmarine. Thus if a Techmarine is a techmarine, and an apothecary is not a veteran...

Edit: And where does it say an upgrade doesn't take up another FoC choice? Chronus may be bought as an upgrade to a tank, but he's still a seperate unit. If he passes an armor save, he'll be running around on his own around the battlefield.

Breton wrote:

Edit: And where does it say an upgrade doesn't take up another FoC choice? Chronus may be bought as an upgrade to a tank, but he's still a seperate unit. If he passes an armor save, he'll be running around on his own around the battlefield.

Do you really want to argue this, because your line of logic is going to have veteran sergeants and the like taking extra spots on the FoC chart.

Such a 'line of logic' is only going to have unit upgrades like Chronus take up a slot on the Force Organization Chart if it is true. Since it is false, making such an argument will not also make the argument true. In fact, by making such an argument we can provide a publicly show it to be false, and thus clarify rules that would otherwise be obscured by rules lawyers.

Back up is always good.

G

derek wrote:This was discussed in another thread already, the rules for him specifically say "Chronus is always bought as an upgrade." It's on page 89 of the codex.

I don't know how much more black and white the rules can be in regards to him being an upgrade than to say it outright.

Nurglitch wrote:The Servitor entry indicates that one unit of Servitors may be taken for each 'Techmarine' or 'Master of the Forge' unit in the army.

This list of units does not include 'Thunderfire Cannon' units.

Therefore, taking a Thunderfire Cannon unit does not entitle a player to select a unit of Servitors.

Nowhere does it use the word "Unit" for Techmarine OR Master of the forge.

But it does use the word "every". And the Thunderfire is crewed by a "Techmarine" hence a serivtor "unit" is available.

And so you take that to be your conclusive evidence that the text in question does not refer to units?

can the techmarine leave the thunderfire?

not tell it is destroyed

what about this one?



does this mean you can have servitor(s) with your cannon?

Oh god, the necromancy, it burns my very Soul!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Read here, please.