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bigtmac68 wrote:Ive never understood how having inquisitors in an imperial army could be considered cheesy, thats central to the fluff from way back in the rogue Trader days.

And with respect, I do not see scouts as a reliable anti Valkyrie weapon. One missle shot that Pens 33% of the time and kills 33% of that? Sniper rifles rending against AV12 is not going to happen to often.

And they only get that 2+ coversave in conjuction with a Tech marine and in ruins, those are an just far to many conditions for something to be considered a valid counter.

Besides, theres no reason to bother, if you want to counter Mystics marines have plenty of other shooting to do so.

Okay, mystics in valkyries are quite unkillable (by scouts). I was thinking either on foot or in chimeras. If they are in valkyries, well, im kinda happy as its not scouting/outflanking.

Pathfinder scouts get 2+ saves if your stick some guardains infront (or hide them in cover, vs barrage weps). But obviously SM scouts have those loverly rocket launchers.

Inquisitors lead, not serve. Bastardising the fluff to use older edition rules is chessy.

Razerous wrote:TThe manticore has a 24" minimum range. I dont like this, I think its quite restrictive.

You dont need to fire it as an Ordinance Barrage. You could just fire it as Ordinance and bypass the minimum range.

It seems lik people are under the impression that a Medusa with Bastion Breacher Shells can fire either the BBS or its normal big blast... this is not true. It explicitly states in the description for Bastion Breacher Shells that a Medusa armed with them will ALWAYS fire them.

I have a Medusa in my current list (which will get tested next week, I wish I could sooner but I don't have time until next week... I'll be taking notes and writing battle reports of all my testing from here on out as well) and I'm VERY skeptical of its performance because it is unable to switch back and forth between munitions during a game. It makes the thing very subpar against any target that is not a tank, to the point where I question the point cost. If it came to it I think I'd rather have a Paskquisher than a BBS Medusa (weird I know since the Paskquisher is 80 more points but at least it has crack shot against things like Nob Bikes), but I'm going to test them both before I make a more concrete decision.

Hey guys, I like the way this discussion is going, and I hope people will provide more examples of their actual experiences with regards to playtesting. Since my gut says a lot stuff won't fly (no I won't give examples it's counter-productive)!

On a side note, has anyone tried playing against 3 separate Attack Bikes, each with a Multi-melta turbo-boosting on the first turn? I've found the 3+ cover save to be resilient, often making me waste my battle-cannon shots and lascannon shots if I'm unlucky. There's only so much fire-power I can pour out against three measly, annoying units versus the rest of my opponent's army.

Caffran9 wrote:It seems lik people are under the impression that a Medusa with Bastion Breacher Shells can fire either the BBS or its normal big blast... this is not true. It explicitly states in the description for Bastion Breacher Shells that a Medusa armed with them will ALWAYS fire them.

THis is list changing.

If you're going to go the Medusa route take at least 2 and equip them with Bastion Breachers.

I fully realize that this is 280 points of fairly limited application, but the reality is that they excel at killing armor, especially assault transports, before they can get into range to drop off guys. That's the whole role of the Medusa, and it does it really well.

Lists that take advantage of Vendettas and Psychic Choirs backed up with Griffons wil rule the day. Put some Veterans with Demolition experts and melta guns to top it all off.

Liquidwulfe wrote:

Razerous wrote:TThe manticore has a 24" minimum range. I dont like this, I think its quite restrictive.

You dont need to fire it as an Ordinance Barrage. You could just fire it as Ordinance and bypass the minimum range.

Ahhhh!

sourclams wrote:If you're going to go the Medusa route take at least 2 and equip them with Bastion Breachers.

I fully realize that this is 280 points of fairly limited application, but the reality is that they excel at killing armor, especially assault transports, before they can get into range to drop off guys. That's the whole role of the Medusa, and it does it really well.

How about this; You loose some offensive with the scale up but you do again a big increase in the anti-infantry slaying power. One with bastion breachers & one with standard shells. Yes the range is dissimiliar & the bastions will hurt tanks more but hit less troops.. but thier both still str10 weapons & the standard armement has its own benifits vs armor with the ordence profile.

I don't see any point to doing that, honestly. No matter what you shoot at, you won't be using your points effectively.

Just a quick side question...what are peoples' opinion on vendettas/valks after using them for a while now?

Personally I've used 1 in my mech force for about 10 games now, and while its been decent..it dies every freaking game nearly and so does the vet squad inside.

This isn't a problem on most missions but on KP can be really frustrating. Fact is, the vet squad has to jump out to shoot which inevitably means they get toasted the following turn, and normally the vendetta too since its so close. It is also very fricking difficult to fit on the board when it comes on from outflanking, you give up 2 lascannon shots for 2 turns at least if it does outflank, if it doesnt then it is very vunerable since it can't hide behind anything. I also generally like to keep it quite mobile and to get the vets into action asap which means I lose alot of the firepower im paying for.

Maybe I've been using it wrong or I need more of them? Melta squads/command squads in chimeras have been very effective for me so far, and I use a medusa with 2 hydras, devil dog, 2 russes and 2 autocannon wielding infantry squads (or tons of vets with meltas, depends on the list im using) in chimera so anti tank hasnt proved too difficult (however lascannons are awesome vs MC I admit.)

My options are to get another I guess, which would mean dropping a tank most likely or dropping the one ive got for a chimera mount and another tank/squad.

Vendettas/Valkyries are outstanding. I'm playing 3 in my current list. I generally outflank them all unless my opponent is playing something with lots of deepstrikers, then I leave one on the table to start (with an IQ/Mystics inside). I always hav vets inside of them so they're scoring. They're great for late objective grabs and hunting the side armor of enemy armor. Lascannons have 48" range too so you can afford to sit back a bit with them depending on the table edge they come from (assuming you outflank).

I run 3 Vendettas like Caffran and they perform excellently. They're big targets, but honestly it takes an average of about 6 BS4 lascannon shots to destroy a single Vendetta. Meanwhile they're an amazing gun platform with a lot of advantages for transporting/scoring/contesting/outflanking.

I have been having great luck with them as well. I run a single RocketPod Valkyrie and a pair of Vendettas. The inquisitor rides in the PodValk and Im going to try running a pair of 5 man Inqisitorial Storm Trooper squads with Meltas in them to make them scoring and provide a little extra melta love if I need it. I think this makes the Valkyries a little more thematic as the whole air cav contingent represents an Independant Inquisitorial Unit. I will probably buy and paint another three to five of them in the next few months to have a fun little full air cav army as well.

I think valks are one of those things that go up geometrically in effeciveness. One is ok, two are twice as good as one, but three is twice as good as two as you have now reached the point where the enemy has too much to deal with.

Running this in a list filled with AV12 chims filled with scary melta and plasma vets does not give the enemy any good choices.

The only game I ever lost all three Valks in I was able to annihilate my opponent ( a fairly solid Mech Lash List ) because that allowed my Chimera Phalanx to reach his lines almost unscathed.

So worth it in numbers, but as a one off you might not get your points out of it.